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The COVID Pandemic and Schools Reopening by blackrams
Started on: 02-05-2021 08:57 AM
Replies: 40 (397 views)
Last post by: williegoat on 03-01-2021 01:35 PM
blackrams
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Report this Post02-05-2021 08:57 AM Click Here to See the Profile for blackramsClick Here to Email blackramsSend a Private Message to blackramsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Interested in your opinions.

Personally, I've looked at as many of the different factors as I can find and how kids not being in an actual school with everything that offers.
I've also been reading and hearing about some teacher unions that won't come back and do their jobs due to concerns for their own safety.

IMHO, kids need to be back in school, parents need their kids in school for many different reasons. Some school districts are considering extending the school year into the summer to make up for what kids have lost out on.

Life is a risk and we've all chosen our different paths. If you don't like the path you're on, then take the Y in the road and take a different path.
Teachers, get your asses back in the class room or find something else to do.

Public employees do not (IMO), have the right to strike. LEOs, FIre Fighters, DOT, ATC, the military and all the others, they chose their paths, teachers are included. Do your fricking Jobs.

Rams
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Report this Post02-05-2021 09:14 AM Click Here to See the Profile for maryjaneSend a Private Message to maryjaneEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by blackrams:

Interested in your opinions.

Personally, I've looked at as many of the different factors as I can find and how kids not being in an actual school with everything that offers.
I've also been reading and hearing about some teacher unions that won't come back and do their jobs due to concerns for their own safety.

IMHO, kids need to be back in school, parents need their kids in school for many different reasons. Some school districts are considering extending the school year into the summer to make up for what kids have lost out on.

Life is a risk and we've all chosen our different paths. If you don't like the path you're on, then take the Y in the road and take a different path.
Teachers, get your asses back in the class room or find something else to do.

Public employees do not (IMO), have the right to strike. LEOs, FIre Fighters, DOT, ATC, the military and all the others, they chose their paths, teachers are included. Do your fricking Jobs.

Rams

I'm sure governors and legislators who have supported and enacted various state laws to the contrary will give your opinion all the consideration that is warranted and shall act accordingly with their legislatures posthaste. Yep, I'm sure of it.

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 02-05-2021).]

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blackrams
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Report this Post02-05-2021 10:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for blackramsClick Here to Email blackramsSend a Private Message to blackramsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by maryjane:

I'm sure governors and legislators who have supported and enacted various state laws to the contrary will give your opinion all the consideration that is warranted and shall act accordingly with their legislatures posthaste. Yep, I'm sure of it.



Just as it is with everything else posted on this forum.
No doubt on their consideration but, they work for us and should know what we think.
Obviously, they probably don't read this forum but, we all should let them know what we think.
Would you agree?

Rams

[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 02-05-2021).]

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Report this Post02-05-2021 10:39 AM Click Here to See the Profile for maryjaneSend a Private Message to maryjaneEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'm not in favor of FORCING anyone to place their lives or the lives of their own family in danger.
I signed on and rode for the brand and I live with what that 50 yr old endeavor caused but doesn't mean it should be mandatory for everyone.
Dead teachers won't educate a single student and dead parents won't raise a single offspring.

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 02-05-2021).]

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blackrams
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Report this Post02-05-2021 11:01 AM Click Here to See the Profile for blackramsClick Here to Email blackramsSend a Private Message to blackramsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I see this as a viable option.

From a friend of mine who lives in Rowlette, TX:

 
quote
It's good to be in a semi-sane state... Our kids have been back in the classroom since September.

The district gives parents a choice, remote or in person. It seems to be about 50/50 but more and more are showing up in person as time goes on.

Having and keeping the systems in place for remote also makes it easier if a family truly needs to quarantine, they can continue keeping up with classes during that period before they return to in class learning.


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blackrams
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Report this Post02-05-2021 11:07 AM Click Here to See the Profile for blackramsClick Here to Email blackramsSend a Private Message to blackramsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by maryjane:

I'm not in favor of FORCING anyone to place their lives or the lives of their own family in danger.
I signed on and rode for the brand and I live with what that 50 yr old endeavor caused but doesn't mean it should be mandatory for everyone.
Dead teachers won't educate a single student and dead parents won't raise a single offspring.



You do bring up some valid points, won't even try to debate what dead people can do.

But, I apply the same standard to teachers that are applicable to all those other public employees, LEOs, Fire Fighters and all the others that have chosen to serve their communities.

Rams
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Report this Post02-05-2021 11:18 AM Click Here to See the Profile for maryjaneSend a Private Message to maryjaneEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
All those others, (maybe school cops excepted) are NOT sequestered 8 hours a day, 5 days a week in a single room with 30 or more kids that will return home every day and in the case of jr high and high school, a different group of the same number of kids every hour which means they will be in close proximity to hundreds of kids each day.
Adults out in society and in the greater public domain, tend to be pretty cognizant of following good protocols for the most part. Kids.not nearly so much.

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 02-05-2021).]

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Report this Post02-05-2021 11:24 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Hank is HereClick Here to Email Hank is HereSend a Private Message to Hank is HereEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My kids shchool is "hybrid" but different than most hypbrids. There are two different models in my district.

Elementary school kids go 1/2 daysm five days a week. Last names A to K go in the morning; L to Z go in the afternoon. Doing this essentially cuts the class loads and bus capacity in half and removes risk points such as the need for lunch time were kids would need to remove their masks to eat. In addition to the in school classes there are classes they do at home. Hey it cuts everthing in half but still allows kids to be in class.
For middle/high school kids they go full days in person but alternate Monday/Wednesday or Tuesday/Thursday with Friday being fully online/virtual for all.

Overall these balance kids needs to be in person well, it isn't perfect but it has worked so far. Also it is pain for choldcare but this whole pandemic has been.
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blackrams
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Report this Post02-05-2021 11:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for blackramsClick Here to Email blackramsSend a Private Message to blackramsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I actually support teachers being in one of the higher groups for getting a COVID vaccine (assuming they chose to do so).

Although, I've already been vaccinated, had I not, I would even support them going ahead of my group myself just like all the other Public Service folks out there that we need to facilitate our society. After thinking about this, it would not be fair for me to volunteer anyone else's position in line for another so, I'll just say that I would let someone take my place in line. But, that doesn't mean I accept such excuses as are being presented to not do their jobs. If they can't get it done, find another employment opportunity with less risk than the one they chose.
Obviously, not everyone agrees and that's alright but, letting those school districts and other elected officials know what we want is up to us. I encourage all to do so. They do work for us ya know.

Edited: See bolded type.

Rams

[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 02-06-2021).]

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Report this Post02-05-2021 11:47 AM Click Here to See the Profile for WichitaClick Here to Email WichitaSend a Private Message to WichitaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It's just teachers unions who keep on moving the "safety" goal post forward no matter how much money, time and effort is spent.

The science is clear that schools and kids are not much of a spreader of Covid-19. But the anit-science left and the teacher unions say otherwise.

What they really want is money and less time for work. Many of these teachers are not even working but still are getting paid, known as "digital dropouts" that first started with students and now have resulted in teachers not even teaching their own online classes, as they said that no students are showing up.

This school closures, mostly in Democratic States, which are still closes as been an utter disaster for kids. It's the saddest case of snuggery and selfishness that has ever been done. But it isn't surprising. Same teachers who refuse to teach kids are the same people who don't put grocery carts back in the parking lot corrals. These so called teachers just want welfare, to be paid without work.

What we need is a mass firing of Union teachers and replacing them with non-union teaching force. Must like Reagan did with the Air Traffic Controllers back in the 80's., for that union tried to hijack the skies and it failed.

Biden has no balls and is beholden to the Teachers Union, so he won't do anything like that. He will leave them be and let the kids suffer. Why should he even care? He is too old to care.

Biden doesn't even want Americans to go out to space, let alone having children go to school.

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Report this Post02-05-2021 02:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Lambo nutSend a Private Message to Lambo nutEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
School is bussiness as usual in our district. We get an email report when there is a positive case and life goes on.
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Report this Post02-05-2021 02:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for williegoatClick Here to visit williegoat's HomePageSend a Private Message to williegoatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Lambo nut:

We get an email report when there is a positive case and life goes on.

How often does that happen? How big is the group covered? In other words, how many students, teachers, staff are in the pool from which you might receive a report?
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Report this Post02-05-2021 02:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Lambo nutSend a Private Message to Lambo nutEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by williegoat:

How often does that happen? How big is the group covered? In other words, how many students, teachers, staff are in the pool from which you might receive a report?


Sometimes twice in one week. Sometimes once every two weeks of more. Has varied widely. Approx 1200 students including K thru 12th grades plus the required staff and faculty.
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Report this Post02-05-2021 02:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for williegoatClick Here to visit williegoat's HomePageSend a Private Message to williegoatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Lambo nut:


Sometimes twice in one week. Sometimes once every two weeks of more. Has varied widely. Approx 1200 students including K thru 12th grades plus the required staff and faculty.

So, if my math is right, that would work out to about 4% positive per year.

(assuming average student:teacher ratio which seems to be about 16:1 plus a few for misc. staff)

Do they tell you which category (student, teacher, other) the positive case is in?
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Report this Post02-05-2021 02:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Lambo nutSend a Private Message to Lambo nutEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by williegoat:

So, if my math is right, that would work out to about 4% positive per year.

(assuming average student:teacher ratio which seems to be about 16:1 plus a few for misc. staff)

Do they tell you which category (student, teacher, other) the positive case is in?


Now that you mention it, I only remember it being students reported, with no details of course. There were times when "close contacts" were sent home for 14 days but no reports of spreading to those quarantined.
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Report this Post02-05-2021 08:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for maryjaneSend a Private Message to maryjaneEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Same teachers who refuse to teach kids are the same people who don't put grocery carts back in the parking lot corrals.


Could you please post the data or a link to the data that indicates these teachers that "refuse to teach" also refuse to put carts in the cart corrals?
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Report this Post02-05-2021 09:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for blackramsClick Here to Email blackramsSend a Private Message to blackramsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by maryjane:


Could you please post the data or a link to the data that indicates these teachers that "refuse to teach" also refuse to put carts in the cart corrals?



Would pictures do? Can't prove they are teachers but, there's significant evidence they (some) don't put carts back in the cart corrals.

Rams
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Report this Post02-06-2021 05:24 AM Click Here to See the Profile for williegoatClick Here to visit williegoat's HomePageSend a Private Message to williegoatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by blackrams:

Would pictures do? Can't prove they are teachers but, there's significant evidence they (some) don't put carts back in the cart corrals.

Rams

Word is that Joe is preparing an executive order as we speak.
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Report this Post02-06-2021 05:51 AM Click Here to See the Profile for maryjaneSend a Private Message to maryjaneEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I take it, that the answer to my request is, that the data or link to it doesn't really exist.
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Report this Post02-06-2021 06:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for HudiniClick Here to Email HudiniSend a Private Message to HudiniEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by maryjane:

I'm not in favor of FORCING anyone to place their lives or the lives of their own family in danger.
I signed on and rode for the brand and I live with what that 50 yr old endeavor caused but doesn't mean it should be mandatory for everyone.
Dead teachers won't educate a single student and dead parents won't raise a single offspring.



I wonder if they think this way during flu season since the death rate is higher?
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Report this Post02-06-2021 07:22 AM Click Here to See the Profile for blackramsClick Here to Email blackramsSend a Private Message to blackramsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Hudini:


I wonder if they think this way during flu season since the death rate is higher?


Valid point.

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Report this Post02-06-2021 10:12 AM Click Here to See the Profile for maryjaneSend a Private Message to maryjaneEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by blackrams:


Valid point.

Rams

Is it?
You, are vaccinated, but the vast majority of the US, including children and their parents are not, so I take your opinion with a huge grain of salt.
Flu vaccine is and for years has been readily available and dirt cheap to boot, but Covid vaccine is still rare as hens' teeth.

From the very first, way too many people, including Donald Trump have tried (unsuccessfully) to equate Covid to the flu.
Thankfully, for the most part, the civilized & informed world moved past that false assumption many months ago.

30% of US teachers are over age 50. It is approx that age, that the rate of survivability decreases significantly.
https://nces.ed.gov/surveys..._2013314_t1s_002.asp


 
quote
COVID-19: There have been approximately 2,286,850 deaths reported worldwide. In the U.S, 455,875 people have died of COVID-19 between January 2020 and February 5, 2021.*

Flu: The World Health Organization estimates that 290,000 to 650,000 people die of flu-related causes every year worldwide.


https://www.hopkinsmedicine...ease-2019-vs-the-flu

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 02-06-2021).]

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Report this Post02-06-2021 12:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for williegoatClick Here to visit williegoat's HomePageSend a Private Message to williegoatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I know nothing about disease in general or covid in particular, and take with 9 yd3 of salt much of what I read regarding the pandemic. But I am left wondering if the damage done to America's future, I.E. "the children", is worse than that which the shutdowns purport to mitigate.
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Report this Post02-07-2021 11:50 AM Click Here to See the Profile for blackramsClick Here to Email blackramsSend a Private Message to blackramsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by maryjane:
Is it?
You, are vaccinated, but the vast majority of the US, including children and their parents are not, so I take your opinion with a huge grain of salt.
Flu vaccine is and for years has been readily available and dirt cheap to boot, but Covid vaccine is still rare as hens' teeth.



Having already been vaccinated has little to nothing to do with my opinion about schools being back in session.
Be careful with all that salt, it's not good for you. That's just another opinion.

Rams

[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 02-07-2021).]

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Report this Post02-07-2021 03:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for cliffwClick Here to Email cliffwSend a Private Message to cliffwEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by blackrams:
Public employees do not (IMO), have the right to strike. LEOs, FIre Fighters, DOT, ATC, the military and all the others, they chose their paths, teachers are included. Do your fricking Jobs.
Rams


 
quote
Originally posted by maryjane:
I'm sure governors and legislators who have supported and enacted various state laws to the contrary will give your opinion all the consideration that is warranted and shall act accordingly with their legislatures posthaste. Yep, I'm sure of it.


I am sure of it too. All those governors and legislators who get Union contributions. Dayum, I spelled bribes wrong. The only big unions now are government unions, private unions have had their wings clipped.

One should not have to join a Union to get a job, but, ... it's the law. So much for equity and "redlining" as TheBDub says.

 
quote
Originally posted by maryjane:
I'm not in favor of FORCING anyone to place their lives or the lives of their own family in danger.
I signed on and rode for the brand and I live with what that 50 yr old endeavor caused but doesn't mean it should be mandatory for everyone.
Dead teachers won't educate a single student and dead parents won't raise a single offspring.


Weak !

The Science says schools do not present a greater danger than grocery store workers. Those grocery store workers I believe face a greater threat of public transmission, from a greater influx of unknowns.

 
quote
Originally posted by maryjane:
All those others, (maybe school cops excepted) are NOT sequestered 8 hours a day, 5 days a week in a single room with 30 or more kids that will return home every day and in the case of jr high and high school, a different group of the same number of kids every hour which means they will be in close proximity to hundreds of kids each day.
Adults out in society and in the greater public domain, tend to be pretty cognizant of following good protocols for the most part. Kids.not nearly so much.


Again, weak. A sequestered cashier for five days a week, eight hours days are in close proximity to hundreds of people. Does it take eight hours to catch covid ?

Adults out in society and in the greater public domain do recognize recommended guidance but many reject it. More so than kids who can be "trained" and punished for not falling into lockstep.

I agree with blackrams. Public employees do not have the right to strike. Especially the Teacher's unions. They do not represent the students nor the parents who pay for public schooling. They represent "me, me, me". It's bad enough we agree to put up with Federal government, State government, County government, and City government. Some might desire more, Home Owners Associations and even Vocation Associations. I am tired of tyranny.

If the teachers don't want to teach, let them agree to a choice. School choice.

How many deaths have resulted in most schools being open ? Why do Teachers unions demand defunding the Police ? Why is minimum wage a demand of theirs as well as golbal warming legislation ?
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$$$$$$
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Report this Post02-07-2021 09:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for skywurzClick Here to visit skywurz's HomePageSend a Private Message to skywurzEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I don't think its a good idea. (Have not made it through the whole conversation yet but this topic is really a hot button issue for me)

You have the Gov only vaccinating Teachers. (Depending on the state and at this point they are saying that's not needed all really dumb) then placing kids together in a classroom with very limited supervision. If any of the other kids are sick your kid could(probably will) get sick and then your whole household is going to get it. If you have multiple kids then your other kid is going to get it and spread it too. Just because kids are less likely to get hospitalized when they get the virus it doesn't mean they don't get sick. There is also lack of research to show if kids get any long term affects like some adults seem to have permanently lost taste and smell. Would you want to risk your child losing their senses ? They are also not vaccinating kids there is no data for this either. We also don't know about other long ter ailments from this that perhaps you would not get until later in life. Look at shingles for example.. vaccinate the teachers the kids and the family then send them back to school. (Also vaccinating only reduces the severity of the virus by tuning your antibodies to detect it. Its still possible for vaccinated people to become contagious. Hence you don't get a free pass just because you are vaccinated. Listen i know for everyone it seems to be hard not to do things like text and drive but ffs put on a mask its simple.)
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Report this Post02-07-2021 10:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Lambo nutSend a Private Message to Lambo nutEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by skywurz:

If any of the other kids are sick your kid could(probably will) get sick and then your whole household is going to get it. If you have multiple kids then your other kid is going to get it and spread it too.


I know personally through immediate and secondary family members that this is BS.
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Report this Post02-07-2021 10:12 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Lambo nutSend a Private Message to Lambo nutEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Lambo nut

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quote
Originally posted by skywurz:
but ffs put on a mask its simple.)


Even simpler not to.

Iowa has the right idea. Time to stop all this mask and restriction crap.
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Report this Post02-07-2021 10:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for skywurzClick Here to visit skywurz's HomePageSend a Private Message to skywurzEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Lambo nut:


I know personally through immediate and secondary family members that this is BS.


https://www.cdc.gov/coronav...ildren/symptoms.html

Edit

However i will agree australia paints a nice rosey picture https://www.health.gov.au/s...9-and-children_0.pdf

[This message has been edited by skywurz (edited 02-07-2021).]

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blackrams
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Report this Post02-07-2021 10:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for blackramsClick Here to Email blackramsSend a Private Message to blackramsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
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Originally posted by skywurz:

I don't think its a good idea. (Have not made it through the whole conversation yet but this topic is really a hot button issue for me)

You have the Gov only vaccinating Teachers. (Depending on the state and at this point they are saying that's not needed all really dumb) then placing kids together in a classroom with very limited supervision. If any of the other kids are sick your kid could(probably will) get sick and then your whole household is going to get it. If you have multiple kids then your other kid is going to get it and spread it too. Just because kids are less likely to get hospitalized when they get the virus it doesn't mean they don't get sick. There is also lack of research to show if kids get any long term affects like some adults seem to have permanently lost taste and smell. Would you want to risk your child losing their senses ? They are also not vaccinating kids there is no data for this either. We also don't know about other long ter ailments from this that perhaps you would not get until later in life. Look at shingles for example.. vaccinate the teachers the kids and the family then send them back to school. (Also vaccinating only reduces the severity of the virus by tuning your antibodies to detect it. Its still possible for vaccinated people to become contagious. Hence you don't get a free pass just because you are vaccinated. Listen i know for everyone it seems to be hard not to do things like text and drive but ffs put on a mask its simple.)



Most states have an "Home School Option" and/or Remote Learning as many are doing now.

IMHO, teachers should be back in the class room and if a parent chooses to not send their kid(s), then home school or remote learning are normally available.

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Report this Post02-07-2021 11:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for skywurzClick Here to visit skywurz's HomePageSend a Private Message to skywurzEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
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Originally posted by blackrams:
Most states have an "Home School Option" and/or Remote Learning as many are doing now.

IMHO, teachers should be back in the class room and if a parent chooses to not send their kid(s), then home school or remote learning are normally available.

Rams


This is true and I've been debating homeschool if they decide to try to open too soon.

My kids teacher is back in the classroom. But the kids aren't does that count?
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Report this Post02-07-2021 11:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for blackramsClick Here to Email blackramsSend a Private Message to blackramsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
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Originally posted by skywurz:


This is true and I've been debating homeschool if they decide to try to open too soon.

My kids teacher is back in the classroom. But the kids aren't does that count?


Actually, in my opinion, that does count. The kids aren't public employees.

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Report this Post02-07-2021 11:33 PM Click Here to See the Profile for skywurzClick Here to visit skywurz's HomePageSend a Private Message to skywurzEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
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Originally posted by blackrams:


Actually, in my opinion, that does count. The kids aren't public employees.

Rams


She has been in her classroom remotely teaching since the start of the school year ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Report this Post02-22-2021 11:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for gtjoeSend a Private Message to gtjoeEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
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Originally posted by maryjane:


but Covid vaccine is still rare as hens' teeth.



Could you please post the data or a link to the data that indicates that covid vaccine is as rare as hens teeth?
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Report this Post02-23-2021 09:51 AM Click Here to See the Profile for maryjaneSend a Private Message to maryjaneEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I potentially could, but I choose not to, as apparently, that is the normal/preferred/accepted way of doing things here at PFF.
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Lambo nut
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Report this Post02-25-2021 07:53 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Lambo nutSend a Private Message to Lambo nutEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
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Originally posted by williegoat:

How often does that happen? How big is the group covered? In other words, how many students, teachers, staff are in the pool from which you might receive a report?


Just for the record, there have been no emails of a positive case since this thread started on February 5th.
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Report this Post03-01-2021 01:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for cliffwClick Here to Email cliffwSend a Private Message to cliffwEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
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