I've had more than a few people tell me they endorse the government sending active duty US military to kill protestors. In the case of looters they are criminals so prosecute them. What happened to arresting them and giving them a fair trial and if convicted send them to be incarcerated. Kind of like the Constitution guarantees. Just because you don't agree with someone's political views or actions doesn't mean you can kill them. Tiananmen Square in China ring a bell?
I've had more than a few people tell me they endorse the government sending active duty US military to kill protestors. In the case of looters they are criminals so prosecute them. What happened to arresting them and giving them a fair trial and if convicted send them to be incarcerated. Kind of like the Constitution guarantees. Just because you don't agree with someone's political views or actions doesn't mean you can kill them. Tiananmen Square in China ring a bell?
I fully agree with one exception. Should the looter/rioter fire at one of our "Peace Keepers", then they just sacrificed the opportunity for a fair trial. Hopefully, there will be a few body cameras to ensure there is no use of force that is not necessary.
Rams
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 06-01-2020).]
Antifa wanted to raise the bar. Looks to me like they got their wish.
But it's kind of subjective. Trial or no trial, if I feel like I'm in danger of bodily harm, or worse, whoever it is, is done. Period.
Shooting them on sight might be a bit much. But it might not. It depends. Prosecute them? Sure. Absolutely. But don't just lock them up for little bullshit "local" charges. Charge them with domestic terrorism and/or sedition. Keep their azzes there. Don't let them bond out for a few hundred or even a few thousand dollars. I think they probably have a pretty good idea of "who is who" in that community - or will, in very short order. I'm in favor of them not setting bail at all for the serious players.
[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 06-01-2020).]
I've had more than a few people tell me they endorse the government sending active duty US military to kill protestors. In the case of looters they are criminals so prosecute them. What happened to arresting them and giving them a fair trial and if convicted send them to be incarcerated. Kind of like the Constitution guarantees. Just because you don't agree with someone's political views or actions doesn't mean you can kill them. Tiananmen Square in China ring a bell?
You have 8 posts ... and you've been registered since 2013? Wild...
I don't know anyone that's saying we should send in active duty military and start killing protestors. I have heard several people say that if looters start attacking their business and start looting their store, they're going to defend themselves while defending their store ... and I think that's totally justified. If you come running at someone with a gun, expect to get shot.
Antifa has been declared a terrorist organization. At this point, participating in the rioting makes them enemy combatants.
We don't have a domestic terrorist law. Trump saying they are, holds no weight according to even the FOX news attorneys. According to the "expert" they aren't an organization with any leadership, membership, etc. It would be impossible to prove they are member of an organization that doesn't exist. Which I did not know.
I always worry about opening Pandora's Box. What If 20 years from now they declare church attendance to be terroristic? Or any other thing we take for granted.
We don't have a domestic terrorist law. Trump saying they are, holds no weight according to even the FOX news attorneys. According to the "expert" they aren't an organization with any leadership, membership, etc. It would be impossible to prove they are member of an organization that doesn't exist. Which I did not know.
I always worry about opening Pandora's Box. What If 20 years from now they declare church attendance to be terroristic? Or any other thing we take for granted.
Nonsense. They have every ability to do so... it's supported under the Patriot Act, and grants sweeping arrest and investigatory powers. It does not somehow grant authority to just start shooting people. It's a means for creating a funding line and tasking to DHS and FBI. We have something like 12 different terrorist organizations in the US, they're all either ECO, anti-religious, left-wing crazy, white supremacy, or anti-abortion.
Incidentally, if you go to Wikipedia, the pages are totally crazy... and obviously updated by only left-leaning liberals (again propaganda). They literally list everything done against blacks from 1776 to the 1950s as all being Republican and "right-wing." Which is complete nonsense. So take that stuff with a grain of salt.
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: You have 8 posts ... and you've been registered since 2013? Wild...
I don't know anyone that's saying we should send in active duty military and start killing protestors. I have heard several people say that if looters start attacking their business and start looting their store, they're going to defend themselves while defending their store ... and I think that's totally justified. If you come running at someone with a gun, expect to get shot.
I always believed that too about protecting your business. Another story says those laws apply to defending your home not your business. Didn't the pawn shop owner in Minneapolis go to jail after shooting the looter Thursday or Friday night?
I took a course a few months back about self defense laws. The instructor was a cop and then had gone to law school. One of the first things he said was that 7 out of 10 people will be charged when shooting someone in a location other than their home property. I was stunned. After doing research I found him to be correct. So let all be careful about than and enjoy our cars....
Nonsense. They have every ability to do so... it's supported under the Patriot Act, and grants sweeping arrest and investigatory powers. It does not somehow grant authority to just start shooting people. It's a means for creating a funding line and tasking to DHS and FBI. We have something like 12 different terrorist organizations in the US, they're all either ECO, anti-religious, left-wing crazy, white supremacy, or anti-abortion.
Incidentally, if you go to Wikipedia, the pages are totally crazy... and obviously updated by only left-leaning liberals (again propaganda). They literally list everything done against blacks from 1776 to the 1950s as all being Republican and "right-wing." Which is complete nonsense. So take that stuff with a grain of salt.
There isn't a law to charge someone with "Domestic Terrorism".
We don't have a domestic terrorist law. Trump saying they are, holds no weight......
18 U.S. Code § 2331.
The "Antifa" organization was created at the Soviet Union’s Communist International (Comintern) during the Third World Congress in Moscow in June and July 1921.
We have been over this a few times before on this forum.
Apparently you were absent from class.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 06-01-2020).]
I always believed that too about protecting your business. Another story says those laws apply to defending your home not your business. Didn't the pawn shop owner in Minneapolis go to jail after shooting the looter Thursday or Friday night?
I took a course a few months back about self defense laws. The instructor was a cop and then had gone to law school. One of the first things he said was that 7 out of 10 people will be charged when shooting someone in a location other than their home property. I was stunned. After doing research I found him to be correct. So let all be careful about than and enjoy our cars....
I don't know any state that will allow the use of deadly force to protect PROPERTY. I think some people get this mixed up with what's commonly called Castle Law (your home is your castle). In states with the Castle Law (whatever a particular state calls it), you can defend your home (with you in it) with deadly force. You can't use deadly force to protect your business, your car or your Matchbox collection (well...maybe that depends on which Matchbox cars you have). When you defend your home, you WILL be detained and maybe arrested and you WILL be sued by the deceased family. That's why I carry Personal Protection insurance.
I don't know any state that will allow the use of deadly force to protect PROPERTY. I think some people get this mixed up with what's commonly called Castle Law (your home is your castle). In states with the Castle Law (whatever a particular state calls it), you can defend your home (with you in it) with deadly force. You can't use deadly force to protect your business, your car or your Matchbox collection (well...maybe that depends on which Matchbox cars you have). When you defend your home, you WILL be detained and maybe arrested and you WILL be sued by the deceased family. That's why I carry Personal Protection insurance.
32 states have "Stand Your Ground" laws.
That means that a legally armed citizen has NO DUTY TO RETREAT AND MAY USE LETHAL FORCE IF NECESSARY, no matter if they are in their own home or in their own business, in their car......or anywhere else they have a legal right to be.
"North Carolina stand your ground law is addressed in NCGS § 14-51.2 and § 14-51.3 and are summarized below:
A person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat in any place he or she has the lawful right to be if either of the following applies: 1.You reasonably believe that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another; or 2.You are in your home, vehicle or workplace and that the person against whom the defensive force was used was an unlawful intruder or was attempting to forcibly and unlawfully enter one of the above.
I don't know any state that will allow the use of deadly force to protect PROPERTY. I think some people get this mixed up with what's commonly called Castle Law (your home is your castle). In states with the Castle Law (whatever a particular state calls it), you can defend your home (with you in it) with deadly force. You can't use deadly force to protect your business, your car or your Matchbox collection (well...maybe that depends on which Matchbox cars you have). When you defend your home, you WILL be detained and maybe arrested and you WILL be sued by the deceased family. That's why I carry Personal Protection insurance.
Tennessee certainly does have such a law.
Edit to clarify: You can only use the minimum necessary force. Deadly force is only justified if the person is threatened by the looter. Maybe if someone chucks a Molotov at the building with the owner inside? Definitely a bad situation.
[This message has been edited by Hudini (edited 06-01-2020).]
Every social movement in the history of the United States has used rioting and violence to get rights.
The civil rights movement, suffrage, the labor rights movement, stonewall, the abolition of slavery, even the American revolution. They ALL used violence because peaceful protest doesn’t work.
Additionally, black Americans tried peaceful protest, they took a knee at a football games. Funny enough that was also too much for the o/t section of this website. Plenty of threads against them just the same.
Here we now have people calling for their heads. Literal authoritarians in this thread. There is no respect for the constitution, no “all men created equal”. This section of the website has always been “minorities need to stay in their place”. This just makes it all the more apparent.
You don’t care that thousands of black and Latino Americans are killed each year just like George Floyd and it has been happening for decades. It is truly frightening that so many here would jump to these fascist, authoritarian methods of control.
Every social movement in the history of the United States has used rioting and violence to get rights.
The civil rights movement, suffrage, the labor rights movement, stonewall, the abolition of slavery, even the American revolution. They ALL used violence because peaceful protest doesn’t work.
Additionally, black Americans tried peaceful protest, they took a knee at a football games. Funny enough that was also too much for the o/t section of this website. Plenty of threads against them just the same.
Here we now have people calling for their heads. Literal authoritarians in this thread. There is no respect for the constitution, no “all men created equal”. This section of the website has always been “minorities need to stay in their place”. This just makes it all the more apparent.
You don’t care that thousands of black and Latino Americans are killed each year just like George Floyd and it has been happening for decades. It is truly frightening that so many here would jump to these fascist, authoritarian methods of control.
I guess one can justify just about anything if one tries hard enough (at least in their own mind). Edited: MLK would be proud (ya think)?
Rams
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 06-01-2020).]
"You keep doing what you always done, you keep getting what you always got."
Minneapolis, St Paul, DC, Chicago, Detroit, Atlanta, Columbus, Louisville, Houston, Denver, L.A., Seattle: all Democrat run cities. Of course the horse in Houston was not old enough to vote, so info on political affiliation is unavailable.
Systemic racism? The left is in charge of the system. Police brutality? The left is in charge of the police.
VOTE THE BASTARDS OUT! Be the change you seek.
[This message has been edited by williegoat (edited 06-02-2020).]
Every social movement in the history of the United States has used rioting and violence to get rights.
The civil rights movement, suffrage, the labor rights movement, stonewall, the abolition of slavery, even the American revolution. They ALL used violence because peaceful protest doesn’t work.
Additionally, black Americans tried peaceful protest, they took a knee at a football games. Funny enough that was also too much for the o/t section of this website. Plenty of threads against them just the same.
Here we now have people calling for their heads. Literal authoritarians in this thread. There is no respect for the constitution, no “all men created equal”. This section of the website has always been “minorities need to stay in their place”. This just makes it all the more apparent.
You don’t care that thousands of black and Latino Americans are killed each year just like George Floyd and it has been happening for decades. It is truly frightening that so many here would jump to these fascist, authoritarian methods of control.
You are making incorrect assumptions on many levels.
Getting caught on premises of a place being looted and having 'loot' in your possession is your fair trial. The old phrase if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...its a duck, applies. Time to carry out sentence in whatever means. Arrest if they freely give up...shoot for resisting or attempting to flee.
I was in jail after 911 with a guy that was arrested for "Domestic Terrorism", it's a real crime and has real consequences including no bail.
He was there for THREATENING to blow up a factory in town. The factory said he made them scared, he was arrested. These Antifa and BLM thugs are actually blowing things up.
quote
They ALL used violence because peaceful protest doesn’t work.
Getting caught on premises of a place being looted and having 'loot' in your possession is your fair trial. The old phrase if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...its a duck, applies. Time to carry out sentence in whatever means. Arrest if they freely give up...shoot for resisting or attempting to flee.
I'm 100% for the rule of law. Arrest them, give them a trial, and sentence them fairly for the things they are guilty of.
However, we don't have rule of law right now. We have people like Threedog in charge of things who believe that it's OK to burn down businesses. It's OK to drag truck drivers from their truck, and it's OK to light horses on fire.
Strange how violence is OK for the Left to use, but when we talk about responding with violence, we're doing it wrong. We should follow the law.
I'm 100% for the rule of law. Arrest them, give them a trial, and sentence them fairly for the things they are guilty of.
However, we don't have rule of law right now. We have people like Threedog in charge of things who believe that it's OK to burn down businesses. It's OK to drag truck drivers from their truck, and it's OK to light horses on fire.
Strange how violence is OK for the Left to use, but when we talk about responding with violence, we're doing it wrong. We should follow the law.
That means that a legally armed citizen has NO DUTY TO RETREAT AND MAY USE LETHAL FORCE IF NECESSARY, no matter if they are in their own home or in their own business, in their car......or anywhere else they have a legal right to be.
"North Carolina stand your ground law is addressed in NCGS § 14-51.2 and § 14-51.3 and are summarized below:
A person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat in any place he or she has the lawful right to be if either of the following applies: 1.You reasonably believe that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another; or 2.You are in your home, vehicle or workplace and that the person against whom the defensive force was used was an unlawful intruder or was attempting to forcibly and unlawfully enter one of the above.
This does NOT apply to property. i.e. you CANNOT use lethal force to defend PROPERTY. Period. If you're in your home, car, business and feel your life/well being is in danger, you can use lethal force. If your life is not in danger, all you can legally do is back away and call the police. If I'm standing outide my house and someone is breaking in, I CANNOT follow them in the house and shoot them. (Well, I can but I'll go to prison.) If I see someone trying to steal my car, all I can legally do is call the police (assuming I'm not in my car).
Won’t try to debate this with you because I know there are at least two sides to every story. Just because you find the accusations doesn’t prove them true or false. The vast majority of our press lean far left. So, they don’t have much credibility IMHO.
As long as the cities remain in control of the Democratic Crime Syndicate, municipal governments will continue to be corrupt. They will not answer to the citizens, but instead to the money that will keep them in power. Just as Comey, McCabe, et al. were beholden to the Clinton/Obama machine. Go ahead. Keep supporting the left and keep complaining about the same things, over and over and over.
It is easier to blame someone else, whoever you are told to blame this time, than to climb out of the hole and see the light of day. Yeah, I know, if you have been in a dark room all morning, the sunlight might hurt a bit at first, but it will be worth it. Or, just stay inside and grab another Bud Light. Dancing with the stars will be on soon.
I looked at a number of threedog's links. They are all brief clips or pictures with little or no explanation or supporting evidence. They are meaningless and useless.
I looked at a number of threedog's links. They are all brief clips or pictures with little or no explanation or supporting evidence. They are meaningless and useless.
quote
Originally posted by blackrams:
Won’t try to debate this with you because I know there are at least two sides to every story. Just because you find the accusations doesn’t prove them true or false. The vast majority of our press lean far left. So, they don’t have much credibility IMHO.
Rams
That sir was my point. As I said, there are always at least two sides to every story/accusation. If one is looking for trouble, it's easy to find. Show me convictions.
Rams
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 06-02-2020).]
I looked at a number of threedog's links. They are all brief clips or pictures with little or no explanation or supporting evidence. They are meaningless and useless.
We have been down this same dead end alley with this boy before.
He will claim that they're "facts" and we are ignoring them.
We have people like Threedog in charge of things who believe that it's OK to burn down businesses. It's OK to drag truck drivers from their truck, and it's OK to light horses on fire.
"An 'ANTIFA' Twitter account that called for looting 'white hoods' [white neighborhoods] was actually run by white nationalist group Identity Evropa" Aaron Holmes for Business Insider; June 2, 2020. https://www.businessinsider...ntifa-looting-2020-6
U.S. Army or Army National Guard UH-72 Lakota helicopter... the model that (according to MSNBC's Chris Hayes) hovered about 40 feet above a crowd that was "out and about" on the streets of Washington DC last night. The MSNBC "All In With Chris Hayes" anchor broadcast this report with what certainly like video of what could well have been such a rotary wing aircraft, visible only by its exterior underside lighting elements, hovering above an urban nighttime scene and disturbing the foliage of trees lining the street with its main rotor downdraft. Chris Hayes described this as a tactic used to create noise and rotor downdraft and consequently, snapping tree branches--twigs, or maybe just leaves?--and causing other debris to be blown about with a mind to inducing dispersal of the crowd below. In other words, the "[Trump] treatment." Or "helo hazing."
