Pennock's Fiero Forum
  Totally O/T
  Virus probe-palooza. 15-minute 'read' but exact origin of virus may never be known.

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Email This Page to Someone! | Printable Version


next newest topic | next oldest topic
Virus probe-palooza. 15-minute 'read' but exact origin of virus may never be known. by rinselberg
Started on: 04-19-2020 03:25 PM
Replies: 19 (338 views)
Last post by: Patrick on 06-03-2020 03:25 PM
rinselberg
Member
Posts: 16118
From: Sunnyvale, CA (USA)
Registered: Mar 2010


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 147
Rate this member

Report this Post04-19-2020 03:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The SARS-CoV-2 virus could have been created in a virus research lab--and not because anyone wanted to make a new bio-weapon.
 
quote
Bat coronaviruses can be cultured in lab dishes with cells that have the human ACE2 receptor; over time, the virus will gain adaptations that let it efficiently bind to those receptors.

 
quote
The SARS-CoV-2 virus is most closely related to coronaviruses in certain populations of horseshoe bats that live about 1,000 miles [distant from Wuhan] in [China's] Yunnan province.

"Wuhan lab says there's no way coronavirus originated there. Here's the science."
Jeanna Bryner for Live Science; April 18, 2020.
https://www.livescience.com...licated-origins.html

Estimated reading time: 15 minutes to read it like you're going to be quizzed on it. It's longer than most of the reports that I provide links for.

This forum topic self-identifies as "Politics" because of China.

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 04-19-2020).]

IP: Logged
PFF
System Bot
D B Cooper
Member
Posts: 3141
From: East Detroit, MI
Registered: Jul 2005


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 55
Rate this member

Report this Post04-19-2020 04:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for D B CooperSend a Private Message to D B CooperEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I still think the simplest explanation is that one way or another, it came out of the lab in Wuhan.

The story they're pushing is that somehow it popped up in the meat market, even though we don't have any real evidence anyone even sold bats at the market. Okay maybe a bat infected some other intermediate animal. How many animals sold there would have been coming from 1000 miles away ? And the authorities didn't exhaust every means to identify and track the source of the virus in the market; they simply destroyed everything and sterilized the whole place ? Add the fact that many of the early victims had no connection to the market, and it doesn't really look like a smoking gun, as much as a convenient explanation.

As far as the lab, we're to believe that it was entirely coincidental that the lab was located close to where the new disease popped up. And it's entirely coincidental that the virologists there had been collecting bats from 1000 miles away, looking specifically for bat sars virus strains to study.

Absent some probable mechanism whereby some animal picks up that most similar bat sars virus, and transports it 1000 miles to Wuhan, and ends up in the meat market, the lab is by FAR the simpler scenario. Occum's Razor applies.
IP: Logged
MidEngineManiac
Member
Posts: 29566
From: Some unacceptable view
Registered: Feb 2007


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 297
User Banned

Report this Post04-19-2020 06:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MidEngineManiacSend a Private Message to MidEngineManiacEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It was China.

Nuke them. Nuke them all.
IP: Logged
randye
Member
Posts: 13768
From: Florida
Registered: Mar 2006


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 216
Rate this member

Report this Post04-19-2020 07:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for randyeClick Here to visit randye's HomePageSend a Private Message to randyeEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

"Wuhan lab says there's no way coronavirus originated there. Here's the science."
Jeanna Bryner for Live Science; April 18, 2020.
https://www.livescience.com...licated-origins.html




From the article:

"Just today (April 18), the vice director of WIV Zhiming Yuan CGTN, the Chinese state broadcaster, said "there is no way this virus came from us,"



Your string of BS propaganda, going all the way back to your muslim obsession, remains unbroken Ronald.

Now you're merrily spewing CHICOM propaganda.

Go sit down with the other California mental patients waiting to GET HELP.

...............................

By the way, the ad that popped up after your post couldn't be more appropriate:

[This message has been edited by randye (edited 04-19-2020).]

IP: Logged
rinselberg
Member
Posts: 16118
From: Sunnyvale, CA (USA)
Registered: Mar 2010


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 147
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2020 10:51 AM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
New research describes the SARS-CoV-2 or "Covid-19" virus as a result of a coronavirus from bats that picked up a "spike protein" from a virus that is carried by pangolins.

What they're describing would be an example of genetic Recombination.

Did a bat get a virus from a pangolin? Or vice-versa? Or did it happen in some other animal that was infected by viruses from bats and pangolins? Was that other animal a human? At this point... whobody knows?

"SARS-CoV-2 looks like a hybrid of viruses from two different species"
John Timmer for Ars Technica; June 1, 2020.
https://arstechnica.com/sci...o-different-species/

The research report itself:
"Emergence of SARS-CoV-2 through recombination and strong purifying selection"
Xiaojun Li et al; Science Advances; May 29, 2020.
https://advances.sciencemag...05/28/sciadv.abb9153
IP: Logged
82-T/A [At Work]
Member
Posts: 22523
From: Florida USA
Registered: Aug 2002


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 198
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2020 11:43 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 82-T/A [At Work]Send a Private Message to 82-T/A [At Work]Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

The SARS-CoV-2 virus could have been created in a virus research lab--and not because anyone wanted to make a new bio-weapon.
"Wuhan lab says there's no way coronavirus originated there. Here's the science."
Jeanna Bryner for Live Science; April 18, 2020.
https://www.livescience.com...licated-origins.html

Estimated reading time: 15 minutes to read it like you're going to be quizzed on it. It's longer than most of the reports that I provide links for.

This forum topic self-identifies as "Politics" because of China.




Rinse, this is absurd nonsense. It is common knowledge that Wuhan was working on Bat SARS. As a matter of fact, the US even provided funding to study it (for some stupid reason).

https://www.nationofchange....stitute-of-virology/

So, your link is nonsense...

IP: Logged
olejoedad
Member
Posts: 17903
From: Clarendon Twp., MI
Registered: May 2004


Feedback score: (5)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 205
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2020 12:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
98 views, 6 responses - 2 from the O/P.

Whobody cares?
IP: Logged
rinselberg
Member
Posts: 16118
From: Sunnyvale, CA (USA)
Registered: Mar 2010


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 147
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2020 01:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have "glommed" onto two reports in the Science For General Audience media. One at the start of this thread--that was a few weeks ago--and the second such report, earlier today.

Neither report excludes the possibility that the oft-referenced Wuhan University virus lab was part of the path of infection for the pandemic. Nor is either report in any way a confirmation that the pandemic went through that particular lab. The reports neither line up directly nor do they directly conflict with the idea that there was a path of infection involving the Wuhan research facility. The reports leave that open, and so, if you hypothesize that the Wuhan facility was involved, you would not have (from these reports) any evidence that the virus was purposely created in the lab. It could have been created in the lab as an unintended byproduct of the research that was being conducted.

There are other ways that the virus could have arrived in Wuhan. That's described in the first of the two reports.

The Chinese equivalent of the (US) CDC has another research lab in Wuhan that is actually closer to the "wet market" than the lab that is associated with Wuhan University. That "Chinese CDC" lab is only yards away from the wet market area.
IP: Logged
rinselberg
Member
Posts: 16118
From: Sunnyvale, CA (USA)
Registered: Mar 2010


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 147
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2020 01:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

rinselberg

16118 posts
Member since Mar 2010
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:

98 views, 6 responses - 2 from the O/P.

Whobody cares?

Possibly as many as three other forum members. Not counting the spam from the malfunctioning user account that somehow never gets fixed. Not sure whether you, olejoedad, counted yourself in that enumeration. But some number of other forum members at three different moments.

Do you like logging in here to confirm that there have not been any new messages or topics since the last time that you logged in?

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 06-02-2020).]

IP: Logged
olejoedad
Member
Posts: 17903
From: Clarendon Twp., MI
Registered: May 2004


Feedback score: (5)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 205
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2020 04:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
No, I log in here to help people in the Tech section.
It is a car forum, after all.

But I do have to check on you babbling occasionally.
Just for the inane nonsense you spout.

Are you representative of the people in your area, or are you an outlier?

IP: Logged
rinselberg
Member
Posts: 16118
From: Sunnyvale, CA (USA)
Registered: Mar 2010


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 147
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2020 06:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
re: olejoedad

These two reports that I have posted here, about scientific research into the origins of the virus, are not any "big deal", as far as I'm concerned.

Just two of the general (not science professional) media reports that I have read on the topic, and purely out of curiosity.

I like the earlier report because it posits that the virus could have been created in a lab--perhaps the Wuhan University lab that has been talked about so much--but created by chance or circumstance, and not as the end product of any purposeful plan by the researchers in the lab. That's briefly described at or near the top of the report. But it posits alternative theories for the outbreak of Covid-19 that wreaked havoc on the mega-sized Chinese city of Wuhan. Theories that do not involve any research lab(s).

I like the report that I added today because it posits that the SARS-CoV-2 virus has been created, possibly without any purposeful human hand, when a coronavirus species common to bats interacted with another virus species common to pangolins in a process called "genetic Recombination." That may be part of the larger story.

This forum topic has elicited civilized Reply messages from D B Cooper and 82-T/A, who both expressed some interest in the topic. Interest enough that they were motivated to create civilized Reply messages.

I don't regret the relatively small amount of time that I have wasted in setting up this forum topic and subsequently participating in it via the Reply message motif. I categorize it as Social Media Interaction Time, even if the Interaction part is not at all extensive.

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 06-02-2020).]

IP: Logged
PFF
System Bot
williegoat
Member
Posts: 19334
From: Glendale, AZ
Registered: Mar 2009


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 103
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2020 06:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for williegoatClick Here to visit williegoat's HomePageSend a Private Message to williegoatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

Testing... not sure my browser is allowing me to post.

It's for your own good.
IP: Logged
Patrick
Member
Posts: 36239
From: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Registered: Apr 99


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 458
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2020 06:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by williegoat:

It's for your own good.


Okay, that was funny... but so much of the flack that rinselberg receives isn't.

I don't understand why it's so necessary for everyone to hum the same tune here in O/T. Is that what you guys all want? No one's allowed to be different?

I enjoy kidding around with some of you... but damn, it makes it difficult to continue doing so when I see someone being picked on continuously by a number of you for no valid reason.
IP: Logged
cvxjet
Member
Posts: 3625
From: ca, usa
Registered: May 2010


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2020 06:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for cvxjetSend a Private Message to cvxjetEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Ok.....Lets look at some odd facts about this covid virus; It is almost perfect as a (Indescriminate) bio-weapon...Long incubation time, no symptoms in a large percentage of population, and apparently it changes and even does some semi-permanent damage....

Also, cruise ships are a perfect way to spread the virus, with people from all over the world (but especially America and western Europe) coming into tight quarters, then going home (With the virus)......The cruise ships in the western Pacific that had stopped in China obviously would be exposed and have outbreaks....But they had several cruise ships in the Caribbean that had outbreaks and were isolated....That seems...........ODD.........

Italy was hit especially hard....Why? In 2019, the Italian legislature caught one of their members trying to "Game the system" to make himself PM......They came together and banished him from the legislature- and then went hard against that man's best bud and supporter....a guy named Vlad.....

Russia has very poor reporting of what is happening with the outbreak- and the info we do receive is controlled by good ole Vlad....also, they are reporting an extremely low death rate....Why?

Although certain people LOVE Russia and the "Greatest Christian" Vlad, ole Putin wants to destroy the US and reassemble the USSR- he has stated this numerous times and stated that he would stop at NOTHING to reach this goal.....He wants to start a Civil war that will destroy America.....He is very successful in his quest.....we are close.....
IP: Logged
rinselberg
Member
Posts: 16118
From: Sunnyvale, CA (USA)
Registered: Mar 2010


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 147
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2020 07:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by D B Cooper:

I still think the simplest explanation is that one way or another, it came out of the lab in Wuhan.

The story they're pushing is that somehow it popped up in the meat market, even though we don't have any real evidence anyone even sold bats at the market. Okay maybe a bat infected some other intermediate animal. How many animals sold there would have been coming from 1000 miles away ? And the authorities didn't exhaust every means to identify and track the source of the virus in the market; they simply destroyed everything and sterilized the whole place ? Add the fact that many of the early victims had no connection to the market, and it doesn't really look like a smoking gun, as much as a convenient explanation.

As far as the lab, we're to believe that it was entirely coincidental that the lab was located close to where the new disease popped up. And it's entirely coincidental that the virologists there had been collecting bats from 1000 miles away, looking specifically for bat sars virus strains to study.

Absent some probable mechanism whereby some animal picks up that most similar bat sars virus, and transports it 1000 miles to Wuhan, and ends up in the meat market, the lab is by FAR the simpler scenario. Occum's Razor applies.

I can think of some reasonably straightforward ways for that to have happened. I am reading "between the lines" of that first report.

Hypothesis #1: Someone or some group affiliated with any of the pathogen research labs in or around the mega metropolis of Wuhan (at least three such labs, I think) had travelled the 100s of kilometers away from Wuhan to where most of the bats live. They went into the Batcave(s) to collect blood or excrement or other kinds of samples from the bat colonies that would contain the viruses that live and replicate using the bats as hosts. They could have become infected with the Covid-19 virus while they were doing that, and carried the virus back to the Wuhan area--not in the intended way, as part of a specimen collection--but accidentally, within their own bloodstream. They took the virus "home" with them, in the most literal sense.

Hypothesis #2: It could have been a farmer or farm worker that cultivated the land, 100s of kilometers away from Wuhan--where the bats are--and then had reason to travel themselves to Wuhan. The bat excrement or guano has been known to be of interest to famers for collecting and using as a crop fertilizer. There are other, more coincidental ways that a person living in that area could get any of the bat-infesting viruses into their own bloodstream, even short of actually having been "bited on" (bitten sounds too much like "smitten") by a bat. Bats are not the most fastidious of creatures as they fly around and sometimes fly inside of human living and working spaces.

These make sense to me... as hypotheses.

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 06-02-2020).]

IP: Logged
williegoat
Member
Posts: 19334
From: Glendale, AZ
Registered: Mar 2009


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 103
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2020 07:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for williegoatClick Here to visit williegoat's HomePageSend a Private Message to williegoatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Some bats travel many hundreds of miles and are essential pollinators much like bees. I could see how this could spread a virus over a large area.



When drinking tequila, always make a toast to the bats.
IP: Logged
olejoedad
Member
Posts: 17903
From: Clarendon Twp., MI
Registered: May 2004


Feedback score: (5)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 205
Rate this member

Report this Post06-03-2020 07:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
So there is a link between Corona, bats and tequila.

Maybe tequila is the vaccine?
IP: Logged
williegoat
Member
Posts: 19334
From: Glendale, AZ
Registered: Mar 2009


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 103
Rate this member

Report this Post06-03-2020 10:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for williegoatClick Here to visit williegoat's HomePageSend a Private Message to williegoatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:

So there is a link between Corona, bats and tequila.

Maybe tequila is the vaccine?

Tequila is the answer to all of life's problems. It used to make me bulletproof, like Popeye and spinach.
IP: Logged
cliffw
Member
Posts: 35766
From: Bandera, Texas, USA
Registered: Jun 2003


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 294
Rate this member

Report this Post06-03-2020 11:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for cliffwSend a Private Message to cliffwEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:
Okay, that was funny... but so much of the flack that rinselberg receives isn't.


I give him as much flack as I can, . Yet, I have PM'ed him well wishes absent of a topic.

What is inspiring, is, he, like an underdog, can not be beat.

[This message has been edited by cliffw (edited 06-03-2020).]

IP: Logged
Patrick
Member
Posts: 36239
From: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Registered: Apr 99


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 458
Rate this member

Report this Post06-03-2020 03:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by cliffw:

What is inspiring, is, he, like an underdog, can not be beat.


What I find uninspiring, is the continual beat down here of anyone with a dissenting viewpoint. It's not just the opinion that's attacked, it's the person themself. Nothing but schoolyard bully tactics, perpetrated by supposed adults. It's no wonder people leave this forum in disgust, never to return.
IP: Logged

next newest topic | next oldest topic

All times are ET (US)

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:

Contact Us | Back To Main Page

Advertizing on PFF | Fiero Parts Vendors
PFF Merchandise | Fiero Gallery | Ogre's Cave
Real-Time Chat | Fiero Related Auctions on eBay



Copyright (c) 1999, C. Pennock