I figured that this thread would take off. Guess I was wrong, so I'll bump this and see where it goes. I am more interested in what comes after than the panic and the immediate response.
So, looking down the road, a few weeks or months...
One interest is in how the average American citizen is going to feel about our dependency on offshore based supply chains....... Will we notice? Will we change our buying decisions? Will we boycott Chinese made products? Will this piss of the American consumer?
I would think others here may also have some post-apocolyptic questions or theories to share. Jump right in.
I figured that this thread would take off. Guess I was wrong, so I'll bump this and see where it goes. I am more interested in what comes after than the panic and the immediate response.
I think it's too soon for much of a discussion about "after". We've barely seen the start. We have no real idea yet how bad this is going to get.
I think it's too soon for much of a discussion about "after". We've barely seen the start. We have no real idea yet how bad this is going to get.
I agree. So much will depend on how quickly society and the economy recover. The outcome of the US election will hinge on our resilience. If we don't bounce back quickly enough, and high enough; the left will seize power, then all bets are off. We will be in for a long downward spiral. Government will take control of all aspects of our lives because they will have shown that we are not capable of taking care of ourselves.
This is the ultimate "crisis" as defined by Rahm Emanuel. Government will ration everything from health care to toilet paper because they will argue that the free market has failed.
[This message has been edited by williegoat (edited 03-17-2020).]
There will be no Kentucky Derby this spring, no Isle of Man TT. Will we be able to see how the new Corvette stacks up against Europe's best at Le Mans in June? Will Americans gather together on July 4th to watch fireworks?
[This message has been edited by williegoat (edited 03-17-2020).]
I see this as a big experiment in where things may be heading. People actively telecommuting, working from home, school children taking classes via the internet, even more ordering online, restaurants only able to do take out and delivery, basements dwellers uniting under the flag of normalcy knowing that they never have to leave their parents basement. An example 388 thousand people watched a "simulation" race of the canceled Australian Grand Prix, we are moving towards a complete "social isolation" where no one ever needs to leave their domicile.
I hope I am wrong with this and things will return to normal.
It dawned on me reading a few articles this morning that all of these new restrictions being put in place are likely to become the "new normal"
Governments have a very nasty habit of imposing emergency measures, dragging them out for a while once a crisis is over then leaving them in place permanently. We are still dealing with the restrictions from 9-11 in many ways. It's become just the way things are.
I think this portends a major shift. Already with the election of Donald Trump, America was moving away from globalization and trying to bring manufacturing back to American shores. I think this virus and its economic devastation will make that more prevalent. Many of the needs, both medical and manufacturing are now supplied by China and others across the globe. It is reasonable to decide to bring that back home to US shores.
Another thing that might change is the "Just in Time" inventory system. It worked fine as long as there were no glitches in the supply chain. But, this is/was a major glitch and it is having a huge impact. So the reasonable companies might think to change this to maybe a hybrid of the old ideas of keeping inventory in stock and the Just In Time ideology.
Energy prices are taking a huge hit right now. I just saw gas in my little area of Michigan for as cheap as $1.64/gallon. This is almost 1/2 price from where it was a month ago. The initial drop was due to China's drop in use, which dropped global use by as much as 20%. This foreshadowed a bigger drop in energy use across the globe as countries across the globe start to impose quarantines and self isolation. Many of the new sources of energy in the US are higher cost to get out of the ground. So I think many of these will shut down to try to match demand. Hopefully, these more expensive sources will be able to come back on line when needed. In the mean time congress and the President are trying to find a way to keep everyone solvent. Maybe that will work and maybe it won't.
There may be some political upheavals too. Maybe Iran, North Korea, China and a few others will end up going the way of the dodo bird.
Energy prices are taking a huge hit right now. I just saw gas in my little area of Michigan for as cheap as $1.64/gallon. This is almost 1/2 price from where it was a month ago. The initial drop was due to China's drop in use, which dropped global use by as much as 20%. This foreshadowed a bigger drop in energy use across the globe as countries across the globe start to impose quarantines and self isolation. Many of the new sources of energy in the US are higher cost to get out of the ground. So I think many of these will shut down to try to match demand. Hopefully, these more expensive sources will be able to come back on line when needed.
The energy cost drop happened when Saudi and Russia got into a disagreement about how much to "pump". Russia wanted to increase production while Saudi wanted to cut production, as they have been doing in the past to keep a floor under global crude prices. Russia, upset that they had lost ground (market share) to US shale oil is focused on flooding the global market, thus driving up supply and price/bbl down, which of course also drives down gasoline prices at the pump. Russia is determined to drive shale oil producers out of business, or to make shale oil so expensive in comparison to OPEC oil that it isn't marketable.
The energy cost drop happened when Saudi and Russia got into a disagreement about how much to "pump". Russia wanted to increase production while Saudi wanted to cut production, as they have been doing in the past to keep a floor under global crude prices. Russia, upset that they had lost ground (market share) to US shale oil is focused on flooding the global market, thus driving up supply and price/bbl down, which of course also drives down gasoline prices at the pump. Russia is determined to drive shale oil producers out of business, or to make shale oil so expensive in comparison to OPEC oil that it isn't marketable.
That is a part of it. But, the drop in use of energy by China preceded Russia & Saudi's little war. They would not have even started that except for China's decrease in use. It gave both of them the opportunity to try this little game.
Energy prices are taking a huge hit right now. I just saw gas in my little area of Michigan for as cheap as $1.64/gallon. This is almost 1/2 price from where it was a month ago.
Keeping in mind that Vancouver BC usually has the most expensive gasoline prices in all of North America, this little tiff between Russia and Saudi Arabia has resulted in huge (temporary) savings. Great time to go on a driving trip and see all the sights! Oh wait... ...on second thought, that's probably not such a great idea. Damn.
Keeping in mind that Vancouver BC usually has the most expensive gasoline prices in all of North America, this little tiff between Russia and Saudi Arabia has resulted in huge (temporary) savings. Great time to go on a driving trip and see all the sights! Oh wait... ...on second thought, that's probably not such a great idea. Damn.
Dammed if you do. And dammed if you don't. No winners here.
Yep... gas is now cheap, but there's no place to go.
There is always places to go here in Michigan. As long as they don't put us under Martial Law we can still move around. Here we can take day trips to just about anywhere. Probably won't find a motel/hotel or a restaurant. But, we could just go for a drive. Just don't stop and gather. Might have to do that within a week. I am getting a bit antsy already and it has only been a week or so of restrictions.
Unless the patients have developed the specific antibodies in the bloodstream to fend off this virus, either by surviving the infection or by vaccination, they can be re-infected.
Additionally, azithromycin is an antibiotic that it used for bacterial infections. It has never been demonstrated to be useful for VIRAL infections.
hydroxychloroquine (HCL) or hydroxychloroquine sulfate is marketed under the trade names Plaquenil, and Quineprox.
It is principally prescribed for Malaria.
Malaria is microbial parasitic infection, not a virus.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 03-18-2020).]
My guesstimation is that the unemployment and poverty caused by the various closures and distancing measures is going to be way worse than direct deaths from the virus.
Poverty causes deaths too... no money -> eat junk -> get diabetes -> die an untimely death.
I'm thinking it may be less harmful to humanity to allow uncontrolled spread of SARS-CoV-2 and continue business as usual.
[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 03-18-2020).]
It will be really interesting to see China's reaction if Trump backcharges China for our economic costs due to this flu. "Sorry Xi, we just erased our debt to you. Whatcha gonna do about it?"
It will be really interesting to see China's reaction if Trump backcharges China for our economic costs due to this flu. "Sorry Xi, we just erased our debt to you. Whatcha gonna do about it?"
hydroxychloroquine (HCL) or hydroxychloroquine sulfate is marketed under the trade names Plaquenil, and Quineprox.
It is principally prescribed for Malaria.
Originally being an anti-malaria drug, it's now mostly prescribed for treatment of auto-immune diseases. I take this drug too (due to my SLE). Or actually I stopped taking this drug a few months ago since long-term use (longer than a year) can cause eye damage. And I had been taking it for almost 10 years (and am indeed experiencing eyesight problems). But perhaps this would be a good time to start taking it again (since I still have a few months worth of pills left).
Originally being an anti-malaria drug, it's now mostly prescribed for treatment of auto-immune diseases. I take this drug too (due to my SLE). Or actually I stopped taking this drug a few months ago since long-term use (longer than a year) can cause eye damage. And I had been taking it for almost 10 years (and am indeed experiencing eyesight problems). But perhaps this would be a good time to start taking it again (since I still have a few months worth of pills left).
Be careful Cliff. I would imagine you immune system is compromised if you have SLE.
Originally being an anti-malaria drug, it's now mostly prescribed for treatment of auto-immune diseases. I take this drug too (due to my SLE). Or actually I stopped taking this drug a few months ago since long-term use (longer than a year) can cause eye damage. And I had been taking it for almost 10 years (and am indeed experiencing eyesight problems). But perhaps this would be a good time to start taking it again (since I still have a few months worth of pills left).
It stands to reason that you are particularly at risk so you should take serious precautions.
Resuming taking that medication might not be in your best interests but you should CONSULT YOUR DOCTOR FIRST.
(Here in the U.S. corticosteroids are generally more prescribed for Lupus symptoms)
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 03-19-2020).]
They are also testing Losartan to see if it has an effect on the virus.
quote
Researchers believe losartan, which is used to treat hypertension and protect kidneys from damage due to diabetes, may be able to block an enzyme used by COVID-19 to bind to cells.
There were a lot of recalls for Losartan last year due to contamination. I was on Losartan for a few months after my heart implant till the cardio girls put me on something else...still got some in my desk.
Hopefully, The virus does pass, doesn't come back. You can't recatch it very soon... There is enough older voter base remaining to keep conservatism competitive.
What will Forced quarantine look like?
As I mentioned in another thread, how will we even vote if this is still in full swing in nov?
Food chain supply and distribution Supply chains for everything else.
There is always places to go here in Michigan. As long as they don't put us under Martial Law we can still move around. Here we can take day trips to just about anywhere. Probably won't find a motel/hotel or a restaurant. But, we could just go for a drive. Just don't stop and gather. Might have to do that within a week. I am getting a bit antsy already and it has only been a week or so of restrictions.
Hopefully, The virus does pass, doesn't come back. You can't recatch it very soon... There is enough older voter base remaining to keep conservatism competitive.
What will Forced quarantine look like?
As I mentioned in another thread, how will we even vote if this is still in full swing in nov?
Food chain supply and distribution Supply chains for everything else.
Utilities
Employment
Socialism, Communism
Farmers and produce processors are having a hard time finding outlets for their produce in and from South Texas, Southern Calif and much of Florida because of the restaurants being shut down. Food banks are full or don't have a way to keep fresh produce for more than a day or 2. Farmers are going to be plowing a lot of their now ready produce under. The piles in the background are other produce that has no market right now. People are buuying LOTS of longshelf life food, but much less perishable food like produce.
...on second thought, that's probably not such a great idea. Damn.
