The idea is to draw heat out of the magma chambers at the base of the Yellowstone volcanic formation, to stop the "super eruption" that scientists have speculated lies in the not so distant future: A volcanic eruption that would wreak havoc across most of the continental United States and much of Canada.
This is the tail end of the relatively brief news report:
quote
Such a project could cost in excess of $3.5 billion. But it’s nothing like the reconstruction cost of digging two thirds of the continental United States out from under mountains of volcanic ash.
And it could even help pay for itself.
Steam from the superheated water could be used to drive power turbines.
“You would pay back your initial investment, and get electricity which can power the surrounding area for a period of potentially tens of thousands of years,” NASA’s Brian Wilcox says.
The idea is to drill down deep, but not directly into any of the magma chambers. That sets up the "cooling off mechanism". The next step, which would not be initiated unless there were some indications that a serious eruption was imminent, would be to use this already existing deep borehole to inject cold water from the surface, deep underground. Literally "throwing cold water" onto the natural formation that is already draining away much of the heat from the magma chambers below the surface.
quote
To achieve this, the Jet Propulsion Labs team calculated a super volcano on the brink of eruption would have to be cooled some 35 per cent.
They propose to do this (remove heat from the volcano) by pricking the supervolcano’s surface, to let off steam.
But this in itself poses risks.
Drill too deep, and the vent could cause an explosive depressurization that may set off the exact kind of eruption the scientists were trying to avoid.
Instead, the NASA scientists propose, a 10km deep hole into the hydrothermal water below and to the sides of the magma chamber. These fluids, which form Yellowstone’s famous heat pools and geysers, already drain some 60-70 per cent of the heat from the magma chamber below.
NASA proposes that, in an emergency, this enormous body of heated water can be injected with cooler water, extracting yet more heat.
That last remark sounds like some sort of carping about environmental regulations on the oil and gas industry that are applied when fracking is used.
I say "Let 'em go all out with the fracking. Knock yourselves out, boys. Whatever solvents or other additives they want to inject underground as part of the fracking fluid. Do anything they want with the fracking waste, which can be a source of more than just background radioactivity. Don't check if the fracking fluid happens to be lubricating some seismic faults and so, becoming kind of an earthquake maker. Don't even think about the fact that smaller seismic faults can transmit earthquake-generating forces into larger seismic faults nearby. Because at the end of the day, who really needs North Dakota--or anything having to do with the EPA?"
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 09-06-2017).]
The question is, why does magma come to the surface in the first place? Does it need someplace to go because there is a massive buildup? Removing heat from it is essentially blocking this path and then if there would be even a greater build up of magma/pressure below, so are they simply making the problem into an even bigger problem?
I'm thinking (absolutely no qualifications) that we need to treat it like a pimple, squeeze it and pop the core out then, see what happens. Does Sister Mary cover acne?
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun.... Open your frigg'n minds, think about all the other tools that can be made into WMDs.
I sincerely hope that life is never discovered on another planet because, sure as hell Progressives and Socialists will want to send them money.
I'm thinking (absolutely no qualifications) that we need to treat it like a pimple, squeeze it and pop the core out then, see what happens. Does Sister Mary cover acne?
The idea is to draw heat out of the magma chambers at the base of the Yellowstone volcanic formation, to stop the "super eruption" that scientists have speculated lies in the not so distant future: A volcanic eruption that would wreak havoc across most of the continental United States and much of Canada.
This is the tail end of the relatively brief news report: [QUOTE]Such a project could cost in excess of $3.5 billion. But it’s nothing like the reconstruction cost of digging two thirds of the continental United States out from under mountains of volcanic ash.
And it could even help pay for itself.
Steam from the superheated water could be used to drive power turbines.
“You would pay back your initial investment, and get electricity which can power the surrounding area for a period of potentially tens of thousands of years,” NASA’s Brian Wilcox says.
[/QUOTE]
I'd LOVE to know... (in advance) if they think this could potentially cause a volcanic eruption... (unintended)
This is some copy and paste from the BBC's report:
quote
But drilling into a supervolcano does not come without certain risks. Namely triggering the eruption you’re intending to prevent.
“The most important thing with this is to do no harm,” Wilcox says. “If you drill into the top of the magma chamber and try and cool it from there, this would be very risky. This could make the cap over the magma chamber more brittle and prone to fracture. And you might trigger the release of harmful volatile gases in the magma at the top of the chamber which would otherwise not be released.”
Instead, the idea is to drill in from the supervolcano from the lower sides, starting outside the boundaries of Yellowstone National Park, and extracting the heat from the underside of the magma chamber. “This way you’re preventing the heat coming up from below from ever reaching the top of the chamber which is where the real threat arises,” Wilcox says.
Such a plan could be potentially applied to every active supervolcano on the planet, and NASA’s scientists are hoping that their blueprints will encourage more practical scientific discussion and debate for tackling the threat.
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 09-07-2017).]
Wilcox says. “If you drill into the top of the magma chamber and try and cool it from there, this would be very risky. This could make the cap over the magma chamber more brittle and prone to fracture. And you might trigger the release of harmful volatile gases in the magma at the top of the chamber which would otherwise not be released.”
Instead, the idea is to drill in from the supervolcano from the lower sides, starting outside the boundaries of Yellowstone National Park, and extracting the heat from the underside of the magma chamber. “This way you’re preventing the heat coming up from below from ever reaching the top of the chamber which is where the real threat arises,” Wilcox says.
The larger question is why anyone is taking Brian Wilcox as any kind of authority on Volcanology.
He is an ELECTRICAL ENGINEER whose professional work experience is in robotics.
The reports that I have put up here seem to focus on Brian Wilcox as the spokesperson or the point of contact between the reporters of the BBC and the NASA-JPL group that are being credited with putting out this idea.
Do you think that this is just a one-man show? Or is Brian Wilcox part of a team that includes expert vulcanologists?
I was thinking it was a team.
Have you picked up on anyone who is reacting negatively or with tough criticism about this concept that has been "run up the proverbial flagpole" by the publicists or media flacks for this NASA-JPL think tank or whatever you might want to call it?
“I was a member of the NASA Advisory Council on Planetary Defense which studied ways for NASA to defend the planet from asteroids and comets,” Brian Wilcox of NASA’s Jet Propulsion Laboratory (JPL) told the BBC.
“I came to the conclusion during that study that the super volcano threat is substantially greater than the asteroid or comet threat.”
An electrical engineer working in robotics at JPL has performed his own "planetary risk analysis" and decided that pissing water into a volcanic caldera more than 1,500 SQUARE MILES in area will alleviate the "planetary threat" he has identified.
We sure as hell don't see any other names but Brian Wilcox in these articles.
quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:
Have you picked up on anyone who is reacting negatively or with tough criticism
Not unless you count the United States Geological Survey and the Yellowstone Volcano Observatory who employ actual GEOLOGISTS and VOLCANOLOGISTS and say that all is normal and that activity is actually below previous earthquake swarms going back 15 years and that the chances of any eruption are 1 in 730,000
Maybe you would like to try to initiate an email exchange with Brian Wilcox? See what he has to say about your concerns in this matter?
Since you (randye) have raised these concerns about the credibility of his statements and ideas, I think it puts you first in line for opening any kind of direct conversation with him.
But before that, perhaps someone may be able to locate a full copy or unabridged publication from this NASA-JPL research project online(?) I haven't tried that yet. Maybe later, but if someone else were to beat me to it, all the better.
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 09-07-2017).]
Maybe you would like to try to initiate an email exchange with Brian Wilcox? See what he has to say about your concerns in this matter?
I don't have any "concerns" Shadeball.
YOU DO
I leave the "concerns" to you lefties that perpetually hand wring and endlessly worry over any potential or imagined "disaster" that you perceive from water evaporating from your local treatment pond, to "climate change", to President Trump and every member of his family and administration, to "super volcanoes" that haven't erupted for over 3,500 years.
Maybe you should contact Brian Wilcox and the two of you can share "concerns", although my suspicion is that you will discover that Mr. Wilcox's primary "concern" is obtaining government funding to pursue his project and maintain his raison d'être and live off taxpayer money.
I also suppose it never occurred to that chucklehead, or you, that he is proposing putting commercial electric generating plants inside Yellowstone National Park.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-07-2017).]
You know, at some point "scientists" need to realize how little of an effect we have on the things that happen in nature....
But hey, they will make money off of it right?
Brad
Other than the fact that Mr. Wilcox is not a "scientist" any more than "Bill Nye, the Science Guy Lie" is, (Nye only has an undergrad degree in mechanical engineering), it would also be a nice idea for agencies like NASA to stick to the *Aeronautics" and "Space" part of their title.
I believe that a good portion of this current "extracurricular" nonsense from national labs like JPL really started when they came under management by California universities, (i.e. Caltech has a big management role now in JPL and UC Berkley had a major role in managing Los Alamos)
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-08-2017).]
Here's another one that's sure to be a crowd pleaser here:
Could 'Re-Engineering' Earth Help Ease the Hurricane Threat? Scientists say seeding the stratosphere with tiny particles could reduce the number of hurricanes by 50 percent.
As hurricanes continue to increase in frequency and intensity, a $10-billion-a-year project proposes injecting sulfate into the atmosphere to cool down the Earth and reduce the number of hurricanes by 50% for a staggering 50 years. . . .
For example, a team led by John Moore, who is the head of China’s geoengineering research program, is studying how shading sulfate aerosols that are dispersed into the stratosphere could help cool the planet and reduce the number of hurricane occurrences. In an interview with Popular Mechanics, outlining how the plan works, Moore asserts, “We’re basically mimicking a volcano and saying we’re going to put 5 billion tons of sulfates a year into the atmosphere 20 kilometers high, and we’ll do that for 50 years.” . . .
The problem? Such works would eat away the planet’s atmosphere. But custom-made aerosol particles that reflect sunlight, and don’t have a corrosive impact on the ozone, are a viable alternative. . . .
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 09-08-2017).]
For example, a team led by John Moore, who is the head of China’s geoengineering research program, is studying how shading sulfate aerosols that are dispersed into the stratosphere could help cool the planet and reduce the number of hurricane occurrences. In an interview with Popular Mechanics, outlining how the plan works, Moore asserts, “We’re basically mimicking a volcano and saying we’re going to put 5 billion tons of sulfates a year into the atmosphere 20 kilometers high, and we’ll do that for 50 years.” . . .
China's Geo Engineering Research Program? Oh, that's comforting.
Popular Mechanics? Oh joy, isn't that the same publication that said Mary Jane and I would have flying cars back in the eighties? An entertaining magazine, I'll admit but, hardly a scientific journal.
No, I'm not in favor of seeding the atmosphere.
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun.... Open your frigg'n minds, think about all the other tools that can be made into WMDs.
I sincerely hope that life is never discovered on another planet because, sure as hell Progressives and Socialists will want to send them money.
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 09-08-2017).]
Here's another one that's sure to be a crowd pleaser here:
Could 'Re-Engineering' Earth Help Ease the Hurricane Threat? Scientists say seeding the stratosphere with tiny particles could reduce the number of hurricanes by 50 percent.
Here's another one that's sure to be a crowd pleaser here:
Could 'Re-Engineering' Earth Help Ease the Hurricane Threat? [i]Scientists say seeding the stratosphere with tiny particles could reduce the number of hurricanes by 50 percent.
Too funny. I would say you guys can`t make this zhit up but how else can it happen ?
Cali solved another non-existent problem , sunlight causing evaporation just like its been doing for a few hundred million years, by dumping a few million black plastic pink-pong balls (called shade balls) into a resovior somewhere, and Shadeball thought it was the greatest thing since the invention sliced bread.
Hasnt Yellowstone been around for about the same length of time water has been evaporating ?
Cali solved another non-existent problem , sunlight causing evaporation just like its been doing for a few hundred million years, by dumping a few million black plastic pink-pong balls (called shade balls) into a resovior somewhere, and Shadeball thought it was the greatest thing since the invention sliced bread.
He also kept insisting that these plastic 'shade balls" were being put in a reservoir, but as it turns out it was a modest concrete water treatment pond in some Los Angeles neighborhood.
Of course that didn't stop him from endlessly blathering about it as though it was THE solution to the world's "water evaporation crisis".
Just more of rinselberg's usual leftie nutbaggery.
I like the way that so many other members here (like the incredible boorish and conversationally challenged randye) made asinine comments about the floating shadeball water retention pond surface barrier.
S**t that they made up about what a small scale disaster this was going to be. Fox News put out some thinly researched blarney about the shadeballs and said "Jump" and Pennock's members like randye said "How high?"
Last I saw, the 96 million 4-inch diameter black plastic balls are still in place and accomplishing what they were intended to accomplish, without having any problems.
I'll probably be back here later to post an up-to-date photograph of Shadeball City.
I like the way that so many other members here (like the incredible boorish and conversationally challenged randye) made asinine comments ...
...
I apologize if you found any of my comments asinine. I am not here to keep you occupied. I am here to occupy MY time. Folks forget this. Oh, I thoroughly enjoy giving out home remodeling advice, or construction thoughts, but I am really just here for myself. Do you understand this?
Have you ever spoken with Randye? I am guessing not. While you are not boorish, you are incredibly conversationally challenged. Even within this very week you have been told of this. You have been told of this since you emerged on the scene here. Please do not turn tables wrongfully. I find that distasteful, but again, this is an open forum, in a section opined for such thought.
Its fairly easy to predict when Shadeball will get his frilly little burka all in a twist.
Doesn't bother me in the least Tony.
He fanaticizes himself as some sort of "journalist" on this forum and has even called his garrulous, pointless and meandering posts on here his "product".
Unlike Saint Paul, I don't suffer fools, (or bullsh*t), gladly.
I suspect that Ronald is accustomed to the people around him accommodating his delusions, obsessions and obvious bullsh*t.
I don't have to, and I won't.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-10-2017).]
I like the way that so many other members here (like the incredible boorish and conversationally challenged randye) made asinine comments about the
floating shadeball water retention pond surface barrier.
It is fortunate that you like it, because you're going to get a lot more of it.
The fact that you can't use less than SEVEN words just to simply say *shadeball*, makes it glaringly obvious who is "conversationally challenged", "boorish" and "asinine" here.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-10-2017).]