We may have to stay put. We're in North Miami, but my wife works for the county and has to work at one of the shelters tomorrow night into Saturday morning. The problem is, for the moment, Miami-Dade County has only opened up one shelter to take animals and that filled up quickly. Our apartment is on the 3rd floor and we have large condo buildings that act as wind breakers to the East of us. We'll make the final decision early Saturday morning, but we are NOT leaving our animals behind. If we stay, we know the risks and may have to deal with them. But for now, the county is making it difficult for us to go. All of the hotels in Florida are booked too. Either way, we have plans for both scenarios. We can either shelter in place in the bathroom, which is the inner-most room of the apartment and no windows. Or we'll already have our stuff packed and we can take off within about 30 minutes. For after the storm, we have flashlights, lanterns, plenty of water and non-perishable food.
If you have to leave and we are still operational here, please know that we are very pet friendly and will welcome you all.
My brother in law is busy in the Charlotte County emergency operations center right now, (he manages EMT ops). The EOC asked all of its folks to send their families north as far as possible so that they won't have to worry about them and be distracted from their duties this weekend.
Honestly, the thing I hate most about these hurricanes and tropical storms is having the electric power out for days and the house gets really hot and humid after awhile. It takes so long to dry things out again. Other than that, we can get by fairly well no problems.
If we could just have these storms in January or February when the temps are nice it would be a lot better.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-07-2017).]
Get you one of those new quiet Harbor Freight 3500 generators or the more expensive Honda/Yamaha versions and you would be set. Put it on the 3rd floor balcony outside and you could run the fridge, a couple lights, TV, router etc.
Edit: was replying to whadeduck. Randye: get you a wholehouse generator that runs on natural gas?
[This message has been edited by Hudini (edited 09-08-2017).]
Get you one of those new quiet Harbor Freight 3500 generators or the more expensive Honda/Yamaha versions and you would be set. Put it on the 3rd floor balcony outside and you could run the fridge, a couple lights, TV, router etc.
Edit: was replying to whadeduck. Randeye: get you a wholehouse generator that runs on natural gas?
I was looking at the nuclear power plants that seem to be right in the path of Irma. I think they have made a mistake in running them right up to today. The reason I say that is that it takes several days to cool down the reactors so that the residual heat is minimal. Otherwise, you need to maintain coolant flow and some way to get cooling. That means that you need to have the diesel generators running full time. With at least two of these plants in South Florida right on the Atlantic coast, they could get a storm surge that would take out the generators just like what happened in Japan. If that happens we will be talking about the nuclear part of the disaster for many years into the future.
Randeye: get you a wholehouse generator that runs on natural gas?
WOW. Your intel on me and my family is REALLY good.
My younger brother also owns one of the largest natural gas transportation companies in the U.S., so the big Generac unit at his place is setup to run on CNG from his trailers:
If the roof is still on it will be almost like nothing has happened at his place and he is only 8-10 minutes from my door.
I only have 2 of the 7Kw gasoline powered gen-sets here for my shack.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-07-2017).]
I was looking at the nuclear power plants that seem to be right in the path of Irma. I think they have made a mistake in running them right up to today. The reason I say that is that it takes several days to cool down the reactors so that the residual heat is minimal. Otherwise, you need to maintain coolant flow and some way to get cooling. That means that you need to have the diesel generators running full time. With at least two of these plants in South Florida right on the Atlantic coast, they could get a storm surge that would take out the generators just like what happened in Japan. If that happens we will be talking about the nuclear part of the disaster for many years into the future.
1. Without those plants operating I believe the power to the Florida areas that they provide is OUT. Having your electricity cut by the power company 3 days ahead of a possible storm doesn't sit well with most citizens, especially when they are trying to prepare.
2. This is Florida. Hurricanes and Florida are historically kind of synonymous. We know how close to sea level and to the coastline the nuke plants are. They knew that when they were planned, approved and built. Worst case hurricane winds and water were part of the risk analysis and planning.
3. Fukushima Japan was an earthquake / tsunami event. They obviously didn't plan and provide properly for that.
I have a strong suspicion that we will be just fine on the "nuke" issue. The real problem will be the hundreds and hundreds of miles of downed power lines *after* the storm passes.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-07-2017).]
It looks like things are rapidly getting crazier down here.
Just received an email message from our U.S. Congressman, (Gus Bilirakis) this evening:
"I know some people, including my wife, have had difficulty finding gas, water and canned food throughout the Tampa Bay area in recent days. Federal and state officials are working together to address the fuel shortage. There is currently a fuel ship en route from a refinery in Mississippi to the Port of Tampa for resupply. A military escort is meeting the shipment at the port. This is in addition to a ship currently in Tampa that is unloading more than 300,000 barrels of fuel to resupply gas stations in the evacuation zones. "
The situation must be getting pretty hairy if our congress-critter is even mentioning military escorts for gasoline deliveries now.
It looks like things are rapidly getting crazier down here.
Just received an email message from our U.S. Congressman, (Gus Bilirakis) this evening:
"I know some people, including my wife, have had difficulty finding gas, water and canned food throughout the Tampa Bay area in recent days. Federal and state officials are working together to address the fuel shortage. There is currently a fuel ship en route from a refinery in Mississippi to the Port of Tampa for resupply. A military escort is meeting the shipment at the port. This is in addition to a ship currently in Tampa that is unloading more than 300,000 barrels of fuel to resupply gas stations in the evacuation zones. "
The situation must be getting pretty hairy if our congress-critter is even mentioning military escorts for gasoline deliveries now.
(Yes I verified the message. It is genuine)
Personally, I'd say your congressman is simply ensuring his voting base knows he shares their pain and is monitoring the situation. That gas he's talking about isn't going to get to many consumers before the storm hits. Not gonna let the opposition in the next election get ahead on this one. I could be wrong but, I don't trust many of our elected officials.
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun.... Open your frigg'n minds, think about all the other tools that can be made into WMDs.
I sincerely hope that life is never discovered on another planet because, sure as hell Progressives and Socialists will want to send them money.
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 09-08-2017).]
WOW. Your intel on me and my family is REALLY good. I only have 2 of the 7Kw gasoline powered gen-sets here for my shack.
Randye....which ones are you using? Is it Generac's? I have a 7.5kw that I have used quite a bit recently, and it works well..fairly efficient at 1/2 load. Probably got 150 hrs on it, with three continuous 24 hr days running last week. BUT, this sucker is noisy as hades.
Randye....which ones are you using? Is it Generac's? I have a 7.5kw that I have used quite a bit recently, and it works well..fairly efficient at 1/2 load. Probably got 150 hrs on it, with three continuous 24 hr days running last week. BUT, this sucker is noisy as hades.
I have 2 of the Honda EU7000is models. They aren't too noisy, just an annoying sort of "buzz" to them.
My brother has the Generac whole house "monster". It's bolted to a concrete pad outside the house and is set up to connect to CNG to power it. He has a 3 story, 5 bedroom house with an elevator in it and the generator apparently runs the entire house, including the swimming pool pumps and his electric boat and jet ski lifts on the dock. I don't know how long it will run off one of his CNG tube trailers but I'm guessing plenty long, perhaps a week or more.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-08-2017).]
I have a 20 year old Generac that works great but it was very noisy.
I removed the pathetic little muffler, replaced it with a very small Thrush muffler and then ran a pipe straight from the muffler about 18" to a 90 degree downward bend with another piece of pipe about 12" long.
I then put the down pipe in a 5 gallon bucket of water.
Last night they were reporting that the fuel trucks were being escorted by the Florida State Police. Not to prevent hijacking or anything, but to open up the traffic so the trucks could get through to the stations along the evacuation routes. They said nothing about the National Guard escorting them.
We were setting up to install the Generac 7KW whole house generator for my wife's medical needs, in case of a major storm taking out the power for any extended time. The calculations that I made from the workup chart showed that it wouldn't run everything in a 2000 sq. ft. home with central heat and air and heat pump. But it would power the necessary medical equipment, refrigeration and the heating and air, plus judicious use of major appliances like the stove. We were setting up to run from a 250 gallon LP tank, then the power company said they don't authorize the automatic transfer switch unit from Generac to be used on their meters.
Generac was ready to sell and install, so don't be so quick to accept what the seller is telling you. If you're installing a disconnect, and you really need to to prevent grid feedback, check with your power company.
Last night they were reporting from Miami and voicing concerns about the high-rise structures and questioning their ability to withstand the possible category 4 or 5 winds. For anyone not evacuating, looks like a 5 or 6 story building would be the safest places to be, especially near the coast where the combination of storm surge and waves on top of the surge might reach 30 feet.
Looks like Irma is now forecast to come right up the center of Florida and Georgia, passing through Atlanta. They're saying to the east of the track, 60 MPH winds and spin-up tornadoes. To the west side of the track, milder winds and rain.
1. Without those plants operating I believe the power to the Florida areas that they provide is OUT. Having your electricity cut by the power company 3 days ahead of a possible storm doesn't sit well with most citizens, especially when they are trying to prepare.
2. This is Florida. Hurricanes and Florida are historically kind of synonymous. We know how close to sea level and to the coastline the nuke plants are. They knew that when they were planned, approved and built. Worst case hurricane winds and water were part of the risk analysis and planning.
3. Fukushima Japan was an earthquake / tsunami event. They obviously didn't plan and provide properly for that.
I have a strong suspicion that we will be just fine on the "nuke" issue. The real problem will be the hundreds and hundreds of miles of downed power lines *after* the storm passes.
Unless you are totally off of the main grid in your area of Florida, your point #1 is not applicable. The grid would and should supply you even if those plants were shut down. So Florida would not be without power before the storm hit.
I am or was a nuclear power plant operator and I know how long it takes for these things to cool down, it is a parabolic curve. It doesn't happen overnight and these plants should be planning ahead for the worst case scenario. The longer that they can cool down, the better and safer they will be if they do get swamped by the storm surge. If they lose their alternative power from their diesel generators these cores could melt down just like Fukushima did. That is in no one's best interest. Buying power off of the grid instead of generating it from your own plants is a minor concern compared to what could possibly happen. Nuclear power operations have always been operated considering the worst case scenario because of the possibility of what would happen if the core did get compromised.
I would hope that the storm avoids this area so we don't need to test which of us is right.
I would hope that the storm avoids this area so we don't need to test which of us is right.
Turkey Point Nuclear Plant, (Miami), was directly hit by Hurricane Andrew, (1992), destroying its main water tank, causing severe damage to the water treatment plant, and to a smokestack of one of the site's fossil-fueled units. The smokestack had to be demolished and rebuilt. It also suffered a loss of offsite power, requiring the onsite emergency diesel generators to start. No damage was done to the plant's containment buildings. The plant was built to withstand winds of up to 235 mph, greatly exceeding the maximum winds recorded by most category 5 hurricanes.
Lots of reviews and upgrades in the past 25 YEARS since Andrew, (including planning for flooding from storm surge and rain). I have a lot of confidence in the safety of all 5 of the nuke power plants here in FL., (which are all within the predicted path of this storm)
The bigger worry right now should be preventing fatalities during this storm and rebuilding as soon as possible afterwards.
My area was just now, (as I type this), placed on mandatory evacuation.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-08-2017).]
Last night they were reporting that the fuel trucks were being escorted by the Florida State Police. Not to prevent hijacking or anything, but to open up the traffic so the trucks could get through to the stations along the evacuation routes. They said nothing about the National Guard escorting them.
TV news last night was showing aerial views of Interstate 75 going north from well south of Sarasota to north of Hernando county, (approx. 100 miles). Traffic was / is 3 lanes bumper to bumper and barely moving. Hundreds of cars out of fuel along the interstate and pushed to the side. I have no doubt that I95 on the east coast of the state is similar and likely worse considering population density over there, (Miami, Ft. Lauderdale, Boca Raton, Palm Beach, etc.)
News here locally is that incoming gasoline supplies are going south first and then "gradually" to stations further north. It's worth remembering that Florida is a peninsula and folks can't evacuate east or west from this storm.
The air has been very busy last night and today with military helicopters going back and forth, south and north.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-08-2017).]
Just got locking fuel caps for the vehicles, so no one decide's they need the fuel more than I..
Determined thieves just punch a hole in the tank to fill their gas cans. They dont care how much it costs to replace it. Park where you can keep watch and have a weapon handy. I have battery powered motion detectors near my outside vehicles that warn me if anyone is around anything in the yard. Cheap ones at HF for less than $15.
And, what are you doing about it? Ya know, I have an extra room.
We are staying put for now.
My son's home which is approx. 4 - 5 miles East of me, TOWARD the storm path, is in a no evac. zone and will stay that way. His area also sits much lower than my place and is adjacent to a sizeable wetlands, (read: swamp)....so figure that out.
The county and state's evacuation maps and zones don't make a lot of sense geographically. They're primarily based on population and how long it might take to move that population out of a given area.
I'm in Florida, but further north (Gainesville). I'm staying put. I have enough water and food to last about a week. I parked my car in a parking garage away from the walls and on the third floor. Nothing protecting my windows... I went to buy plywood but the only stuff they had left was too big to fit in my car. So I'm hoping nothing breaks my window. If it does, I'll have to find a shelter that'll take my dog. If it doesn't, I'm fine where I am. I think the winds are only projected to be about 75mph when it hits me so I should be okay.
If anyone south of me needs a place to stay, my apartment is a shithole but it's made out of thick stone and isn't in a flooding area. Let me know via PM. I get notifications for PMs.
Looks like we're going to dodge this one so I'll mention it again.
I can house 8 guest with no difficulty, 10 in a pinch.
I'm on the very tip of the Eastern Shore of Virginia, about 45 minutes from Virginia Beach.
Hmmm...........
Giving this some thought. No, I'm not worried about Irma but, if Biscuits and Sausage Gravy is for breakfast, I'll see if I can make it. Besides that, I'd like to meet the Mrs. ------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun.... Open your frigg'n minds, think about all the other tools that can be made into WMDs.
I sincerely hope that life is never discovered on another planet because, sure as hell Progressives and Socialists will want to send them money.
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 09-08-2017).]
I realize im 1000 miles away in ohio. But I can give anyone evacimg in a motorhome or travel trailer a free place to park if necessary for up to a month or so. You can stay in it and i have free water and sewer but no electric...but you can run generators 24/7. I do have my motorhomes here that some can stay in for free temporarily. Those both do have some electric (15amp). One can sleep 5-6, other up to 8. City law cant have any tent campers though, so only trailers or motorhomes. All paved parking close to all kinds of businesses. PM me.
[This message has been edited by rogergarrison (edited 09-08-2017).]
Looks like we'll dodge the bullet this time, kinda. But pray for the people on the West coast of Florida like Naples, Fort Myers, and Tampa. Gonna gut ugly over on the left side.
Same here. Looks like things in this area shouldn't be quite as bad as we originally thought. At least we won't be having a Cat4 storm plowing right through our neighborhood. So we've decided to "bug in" instead of bugging out. We will still most likely get some hurricane force winds, and of course a lot of rain. But I shouldn't have to worry about the Fiero blowing away.
Even though it's thought to be headed up the west coast, they say that the eastern side of the storm is where all the high winds and tornadoes occur. That's what they're telling us here on the east side of Atlanta. Winds up to 71 mph on this side and just 45 mph on the west side of the track.
Even though it's thought to be headed up the west coast, they say that the eastern side of the storm is where all the high winds and tornadoes occur. That's what they're telling us here on the east side of Atlanta. Winds up to 71 mph on this side and just 45 mph on the west side of the track.
Bear in mind that the forecasters historically cannot predict very well how the winds will behave, (diminish) once the storm makes landfall.
The hurricanes all lose intensity at different rates.
As an example: Hurricane Jeanne in 2004 came ashore on the east coast of the state and went diagonally across to the northwest. Jeanne hit at 120 MPH, (Cat 3) and by the time in reached my place just north of Tampa it was down to a low Cat 1 / Tropical Storm.
They warned us it would remain a Cat 3 all the way across.
Hurricane Charley, (also in 2004), hit Punta Gorda at 145 MPH winds, (Cat 4) and was down to 85 MPH max. (Cat 2) when it reached Orlando, (in the middle of the state).
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-09-2017).]
I have done all I can to prepare for this Storm. I moved to South Florida in April, but after surviving Hurricane Sandy in New Jersey I did not take this Storm lightly. The storm shudders are locked shut, the generator is fueled up, gas cans all filled, lanterns and fans are ready, food is stocked, and I filled 100 gallons of clean drinking water in a bladder to dole out to my neighbors should they have a need for it. I wish everyone luck and hope for the best outcome possible.
Hurricanes need water to keep their speed. Has to do with the temperature changes. The gulf has warmer waters which is why they say it'll keep its speed now that it's on the west side. It's going to hit me worse than I planned for... Should've boarded my windows... But now I just have to hope. Good luck randye and any others on the west.
Hurricanes need water to keep their speed. Has to do with the temperature changes. The gulf has warmer waters which is why they say it'll keep its speed now that it's on the west side. It's going to hit me worse than I planned for... Should've boarded my windows... But now I just have to hope. Good luck randye and any others on the west.
Thanks for the good luck wishes
Same back at ya'.
As of right at this moment, 8:39pm, the storm still hasn't made the turn northward that they have been predicting for many days now. In order to track the way the NHS is showing it going right now its going to have to make a sharp 90 degree turn. In all the years I've been in Florida and watched these storms I've never seen that happen. I don't think its going to happen now either.
While I don't wish this storm on anyone, the truth is, the farther west it goes the happier I am.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-09-2017).]
I've noticed that, as well. The storm keeps pushing further west, while the predictions keep insisting that it'll do a "right face".
I also noted that NHC updated the 8pm position on their tracking graphic, but did NOT update the discussion from 5pm.
The storm continues to move west, but the NHC did begin to "hedge their bets" on the actual path in the language in their 5pm discussion
I'm waiting for the 11pm update now to see if it's different.
Meanwhile the TV media seems to be doing their level best to scare the livin' sh*t out of people. Yes I know, they have to warn people, and yes the storm is dangerous, but they need to stop with all the speculation these talking heads are doing and stick to salient, usable facts.
They just broke in awhile ago with an "on the scene update" because a single tree fell on a backroad on Captiva Island.....I kid you not.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-09-2017).]
Besides that, I'd like to meet the Mrs. 
