i'm beginning to wonder why it's so important to some posters to convince us there's no case. since they *apparently* have no stake in the issue.
They can try to "convince" me all they want. It's not that I'm like "Oh noes! Even though the law is very specific about libel suits, and says it's not necessary to proof damages as long as it's probable that through their actions pecuniary or reputational damages to me or my business may (have) result(ed), and as long as I can proof the statements made are false and I can proof intent and malice, I better drop it because some people who don't like me very much at the forum say I have no case!"
They can try to "convince" me all they want. It's not that I'm like "Oh noes! Even though the law is very specific about libel suits, and says it's not necessary to proof damages as long as it's probable that through their actions pecuniary or reputational damages to me or my business may (have) result(ed), and as long as I can proof the statements made are false and I can proof intent and malice, I better drop it because some people who don't like me very much at the forum say I have no case!"
Seriously, what the hell? I was just trying to share what I know on the topic. I'm not trying to deter you or anything. In fact, I already wished you luck before which was genuine. And like I've said before, I don't have anything against you personally. What I had to offer was a lot more contructive than the "Hey LeRoy, git dat der pickup n rope! We got us a lynchin' to do!" posts. And I beleive you asked for input on the matter. That's what I've learned in my law classes. If that's not the case, fine.
Originally posted by Unsafe At Any Speed: Seriously, we get it. PFF is the house. RFT is the sewer. And you're the guy going around telling everyone about the **** you just took.
You're right. I've been getting waaaay too pissed-off and making too much noise about this. It's time to let it go. My apologies to Cliff and the folks at PFF. I'm done with it.
You're right. I've been getting waaaay too pissed-off and making too much noise about this. It's time to let it go. My apologies to Cliff and the folks at PFF. I'm done with it.
Ok, it's been awhile since I was able to say anything, and I still can't tell you exactly what's happening behind the scenes but I can now give you an exact account of what expired on Feb 7th.
Mind you, this isn't simply speculation from my side - everything is verifiable and I have in fact been able to verify the identities of all parties involved.
In a Skype/phone conference call, Stuart, Randy and Chris were discussing Fiero related things. Aaron, Shaun and Howard joined in a little later. Howard left the conference call not long after that. After a while, Aaron mentioned to the others he had found my business site. Aaron suggested to "mess up" my business site's forum. Aaron gave the link to the others at which point Aaron registered on my business forum as "Aaron2.Hate", Randy as "WildHorsey69", Chris as "Product1620" and (an undetermined fourth person) as "pigbenus". (This last person) was the only one who used a fake email address so he was never able to activate his registration (and therefor couldn't post any messages). Aaron, Randy and Chris then started to post their messages. At this point Stuart left the conference call because he did not like where this was going. He actually tried to stop them at one point. Chris told the others that he was actually sending a few Private Messages to some of the members on the forum, although he did not mention what it was he was sending. Aaron then came up with the idea to post a link to RFT in every single topic on the whole forum. He told Randy to start from the top and he would start at the end of the topic list and they would meet somewhere in the middle. When they were done, Aaron came up with the idea to send a Private Message to all members on the forum with the following message:
"My name is Aaron, and Cliff ripped off my software. I created at least 2 programs he has here, and he took my code, removed the copyright, and is using it as his own.
The law won't let me do anything since he is in the Netherlands.
Please do not support him, or this site. He is a FRAUD!!!"
Aaron told Randy to start at "A" and he would start at "Z" and again they would meet somewhere in the middle. When they were done, they left the forum and continued the conference call. The call ended around 2:30am.
I've been able to verify some of the phone numbers of the conference call (I'll only give the last 4 digits):
Aaron: xxx-xxx-3063 Randy: xxx-xxx-0169
So there you have it.
PS: As said before, Randy has apologized to me and has shown sincere regrets of the events. And in all honesty, I respect that since it takes a big man to admit one's faults.
[Edited by Cliff Pennock: "Edits made on 3-MAR-2007"]
Originally posted by 86GT3.4DOHC: And is it just me, or was this thread gone part of last week? I came here looking for it and the Announcements was empty.
Originally posted by 86GT3.4DOHC: And is it just me, or was this thread gone part of last week? I came here looking for it and the Announcements was empty.
Ok Shaun, I did you a favor and went through my log files again.
At the time "pigbenus" registered (Thu Feb 8 07:00:10 AM 2007), there are actually two IP addresses doing something (actually, only yours but if by some fluke both happened to have a few second lag, then there are two).
One is yours. That has now been established beyond a reasonable doubt. I'll unblock your IP address and if you can explain to me in an email (without resorting to your usual name calling) what happened, I'm willing to listen.
Right. Shaun has sent me another email and explained a thing or two. He admitted browsing my business forum at the time of the "attack", but he said he did not try to sign up and participate. Did that convince me that he really wasn't the one signing up? No, but in all honesty, he did "sound" (if that's possible through email) sincere. That combined with the fact that either way he did not post a single message on my business forum made me decide to give him the benefit of the doubt. For now.
So I will remove the part from my story where I claim he tried to sign up. I will also remove all posts thereafter that implicates that he did.
You should just hurry up and initiate legal proceedings, then any attempts by them to contact you would be considered witness intimidation. I I would not be listening to any of them, we already know they are lying manipulating little bastards. Publicly expressing doubt about anything at this point is a bad idea, if you were mistaken, it would be used as a defense in court.
Just noticed this thread and it made me kinda sad. More so I will probably be unable to contribute to the "sue the ****ers" campaign due to needing to make rent. However if you would like a hand on the IT side send me an email and I'll be more than happy to lend a hand and know a few other people that could lend a hand with the site/any other IT Issue as well.
