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85 SE 2M6 Refresh by TiredGXP
Started on: 04-22-2008 11:34 PM
Replies: 38 (2513 views)
Last post by: kendell on 08-30-2017 04:26 AM
TiredGXP
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Report this Post04-22-2008 11:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Yes, it's yet another build thread.

The vehicle: As per the title, a 1985 SE with the 2.8 and 4-speed, nearly 147,000 miles on the ODO. Here it is when it came home:




I think I prefer the looks of this nose on this to the later "Aero" nose.

Frame and cradle have some minor surface rust, nothing that a good cleaning, light sanding and a quart or two of POR15 can't take care of.

The plan: This vehicle is destined for my son. Since he'll only be turning 16 this summer, an engine swap will never be in the plan; a rebuild with some performance parts (2030 cam, 1.6 roller tip rockers and new valve springs) and porting of manifolds and heads will provide plenty of power for a new driver. The priorities are to deal with safety and reliability issues first:

1. New brake system including new master cylinder, all new brake lines, Grand Am upgrade on the front brakes, just a caliper rebuild on the rear brakes for now.

2. New engine sensors (MAP, IAT, ECT, OPSU, TPS) and electronics (IAC, Ignition control module) and eventually the 7730 ECM with a knock sensor.

3. Upgraded fuel system components (fuel pump, stainless fuel lines)

4. Vacuum lines are getting old and brittle - snapped one of the hard lines during disassembly, so they will all be replaced.

5. Not much happening to the suspension for now, just new poly bushings all round and for the engine cradle, rebuilt driveshafts - some issues with at least one of the CV joints, so we'll replace all of them and get it over with. I'm trying to get my son interested in autocross (better to race under controlled conditions than on the street), so if that works, we'll look at a rear swaybar, coilovers, and a bumpsteer elimination kit in a year or two (please, no flame wars about 88 vs earlier suspensions, we already have threads about that).

6. Steering feels pretty tight, not sure what may need to be done there yet.

7. Covers for the wiring harness are old and crumbling, looks like some repair will be required. There's a few hacks from a PO that need to be fixed. Needs new ground straps.


Body wise, there's a couple of minor issues that need to be taken care of (localized minor damage to a rear fender flare and by the sunroof). We'll probably vent the hood to help reduce lift, and are looking at some options to modify the body lines in the notch to round things off a bit.

Interior basically needs a steam clean and a small repair to the vinyl on the console. (And a decent radio with a CD player/MP3 input.). No money in the budget this year for Mr. Mike's seat covers.

Anyway, here's a couple of pics of the engine compartment - yeah, it's filthy and it's been leaking oil from the valve covers.




Since we'll be doing all the engine work ourselves (well, except if the cylinders need to be rebored), I'm planning on documenting the process, so if there's any interest I'll post things up as we go along.

Cheers

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ktthecarguy
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Report this Post04-24-2008 05:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ktthecarguyClick Here to visit ktthecarguy's HomePageSend a Private Message to ktthecarguyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Yes, please. I like watching how these projects progress. Gives me motivation to keep going on mine.

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post05-05-2008 02:09 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Well, It's time for an update

So far the cradle has been dropped and the engine is undergoing disassembly.

Here's a shot of the home-made lift. Built primarilly out of presssure treated 4x4's put together with mortice and tennon joints with some OSB triangles to help keep things square and a 2x6 added to the top beam for extra support. It's ugly, but lifted the car off the cradle without a groan.


Here's the cradle out, upper and mid intake and wiring harness removed. Man, I need to clear some stuff out of the garage to create some working space.


Here's one of my helpers


A few random shots of all the bloody brackets so I'll remember how all these things fit back together:





So the heads are off and we got our first look at the cylinders. Not surprising given the mileage, there is virtually no crosshatching left, and what looks like some scoring of the cylinder walls (can't actually feel anything, but looks like a rebore might be in order - Once things are measured up, we'll see if a re-hone will be sufficient).


I guess that's about it for now.

Oh yeah, soaking the exhaust manifold bolts with penetrating oil for a few days in advance of the tear-down really helped - all bolts came out with no difficulty. I'll have to grab a few pics, but wow, what shoddy work on assembling the manifolds, I can see how porting will really help airflow. One port actually has some scrap of metal welded in that extends across the runner.

Cheers

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Macs86GT
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Report this Post05-05-2008 06:58 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Macs86GTSend a Private Message to Macs86GTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Looking good. Its always nice to see a fiero get some loving. I tend to prefer the aero nose but the bumper pad nose is a very close second. I realy like that nose with a chin spoiler.

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post05-11-2008 05:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Update time again.

Engine is disassembled, except for removal of the crank. It's become obvious that someone else has been in the engine, and really "bodged" things together. Someone had put new rings and bearings in, but really didn't pay attention to what they were doing.

Here's a shot of a cylinder after reaming the ridge in preparation for piston removal. There was a failry substantial ridge. The scoring seems to be fairly mild, I haven't been able to catch a fingernail on any of the score marks.


Given how substantial the ridge was, and that the top compression rings on cylinders 4 and 5 were broken, I suspect that the last time someone was in the engine they didn't bother reaming the ridge.

I got the snap gauges and micrometers out, and the block needs to be rebored. All cylinders have excessive wear just below the ridge, all have excessive taper, and two are out of round.

When I was getting ready to measure the rod journals and existing rod clearances, I noticed this on #5


Sure enough, there was some damage on the #5 rod journal (bad pic due to flash, but it looks like this journal fell onto a bolt on a prior disassembly, there's an impression of about 5 threads on this journal that have been biting into the bearing.


All rod journals are scored to the point that you can catch a fingernail on them, so given the problem with #5, I'll have to have the crank reground and polished. I expect that the main journals are in similar shape.

As mentioned in a previous post, the engine/trans/subframe was severely oil coated and dirty, so I got the pressure washer out yesterday and started cleaning things up a bit. Must have taken a couple of pounds of dirt, oil, and gravel out of the nooks and crannies of the engine cradle. Here it is after cleaning. Just a bit of surface rust to take care of and then POR15.


A couple of "before" shots of the transmission. How do you get that much oil inside the bellhousing? Transmission input shaft seal?



And after about a half hour with degreaser and the pressure washer (yes, I did plug the holes in the differential prior to spraying)



Now that the transmission is clean, I noticed some odd silicone sealant on the case. Looks like semi-transparant kitchen and bath sylicone . Since I know nothing about manual transmissions, I'm not sure if I should open it up myself. Probably take it to a transmission shop to have it checked out.


Took a few measurements of the cam that was in there. It's some sort of aftermarket cam, but I can't find any markings on it. It's destined for the trash bin anyway, there was atleast .010 difference in lobe lift between the two cylinders I bothered to check, significant uneven wear.

I guess that's it for today, need to order some new pistons, bearings and find a shop to bore/hone the cylinders and regrind the crank. While the block and crank are out we'll tackle the porting of heads and intake/exhaust manifolds.

Cheers

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Raydar
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Report this Post05-11-2008 05:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RaydarClick Here to Email RaydarSend a Private Message to RaydarEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Good luck with your project.
I've always liked the 85 2M6. Hope to buy one some day, when I have the space/time/funds. (Preferably all three.)

 
quote
Originally posted by TiredGXP:
...I noticed some odd silicone sealant on the case. Looks like semi-transparant kitchen and bath sylicone...


Might be Permatex Ultra. It looks a lot like that.

------------------
Raydar
88 4.9 Formula IMSA Fasback..........................88 3.4 coupe -soon to be something other than red

Read Nealz Nuze! Praise the Lowered!

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post05-17-2008 11:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Waiting for parts (pistons, e-brake cables, head porting kit...) so I figured now was a good time to do some odds and ends.

Heads are disassembled, so got a good look at the ports and runners, lots of carbon built up in there. Took forever to clean bits of the old head gasket off the head surface


Didn't put the intake gasket on for comparison, but there's lots of work here to match the ports


Exhaust gasket really seems oversized compared to the exhaust port - I can't see removing that much metal, although it looks like the floor of the port needs to be moved down a bit to be concentric with the gasket.


There were a few chips in the paint on the upper intake, so I decided it was time to strip paint from the Intake, rocker covers and oil pan. During this process, I discovered that the paint and varnish remover did a great job of removing the crud built up inside the rocker covers and oil pan.



Working on the upper intake. About this time I figured out that the scraper was not working, and brought out the pressure washer (this is becoming one of my favourite tools )
Here's the intake in the middle of stripping


and after. The stripping process worked so good, I'm liking the look of just aluminum, and am debating polishing this up (how many hours did you say it would take! ) and just going with a high temp clear coar. Anyone running an unpainted intake?


Rocker covers are degreased, masked and ready for painting.


That's about it for now, Need to get over to Princess Auto and pick up a spring compressor so the struts can be taken apart (thiking about a coilover conversion). When cleaning things up, I noticed that the dust boots on the rear ball joints were torn, so likely excessive wear on the joints. Guess the whole rear suspension needs to be taken apart.

Cheers

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post05-20-2008 01:03 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Spent a fair bit of time removing the casting flash and other casting imperfections from the upper intake. Looking good, but forgot to snap a picture. No way will I be attempting to polish the intake, I don't have a hundred + hours to devote to such a task.

Removed the struts from the rear control arms today and pulled the rest of the hardware off the control arms. Even after soaking the bolts holding the strut to the knuckle in penetrating oil for several weeks, the impact wrench could barely move the lock nuts - must have hammered on a couple of those for 5 minutes before breaking the nut free.

Removing the hub and knuckle was considerably easier.

I've just about worn out a rotary brush in the last week scrubbing rust and other crud off parts. Here's the passenger side knuckle, dust shield and control arm after some clean-up. the dust shield came out quite well, just heavily pitted. Knuckle is down to just surface rust now, control arm need a fair bit of work:

Just about time to get out the torch and burn out a few bushings.

Dust boots on both rear ball joints are torn, so new ball joint time (added to the current Fiero Store order).


Cheers

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ktthecarguy
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Report this Post05-20-2008 03:14 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ktthecarguyClick Here to visit ktthecarguy's HomePageSend a Private Message to ktthecarguyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

That's quite a lot of work already. BTW the paint on the car looks pretty good in the pics; does it look that good in person?

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post05-20-2008 07:30 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Paint is generally good on the front fascia and hood, however it's cracked and chipping in a line along the driver's side of the sunroof, some scrapes on the rear bumper, and some deep scratches on the deck lid. We'll need to do some repairs to the rear clip on the trailing edge of the notch. We'll be venting the hood too, just need to figure out what vent style to go with.

By the time all that is dealt with, it'll definitely need new paint!

[This message has been edited by TiredGXP (edited 05-20-2008).]

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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post05-20-2008 02:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by TiredGXP:

Well, It's time for an update

So far the cradle has been dropped and the engine is undergoing disassembly.

Here's a shot of the home-made lift. Built primarilly out of presssure treated 4x4's put together with mortice and tennon joints with some OSB triangles to help keep things square and a 2x6 added to the top beam for extra support. It's ugly, but lifted the car off the cradle without a groan.

Cheers


Looks like the first engine hoist that I made as a young guy. . It was composed of regular 2 x 4s and was bolted together with lag bolts, but I used additional angeled 2 x 4's in the corners and added extra angled supports to hold the center posts rigid. The posts were achored on a floor stand made of 2 x 4's
I used that thing to pull about 5 engines with a come-along and while it creaked when as the lift was made it did hold up in all cases. However, when I finally had the bucks I purchased an engine hoist. Lifting with wood can be done but IMO its never the best idea.

------------------
87GT - with 3800SC Series III engine, 4T65eHD
87GT - 3.4L Turbocharged engine, modified TH125H
" I'M ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post05-20-2008 09:33 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua:


Looks like the first engine hoist that I made as a young guy. . It was composed of regular 2 x 4s and was bolted together with lag bolts, but I used additional angeled 2 x 4's in the corners and added extra angled supports to hold the center posts rigid. The posts were achored on a floor stand made of 2 x 4's
I used that thing to pull about 5 engines with a come-along and while it creaked when as the lift was made it did hold up in all cases. However, when I finally had the bucks I purchased an engine hoist. Lifting with wood can be done but IMO its never the best idea.



No lag bolts were harmed in the making of this frame , all the timbers were assembled using mortice and tennon joinery, that way I didn't have to worry about bolts bending, breaking or tearing out under load.

I guess it's kind of hard to tell from the picture, but the corner gussets are hiding 4x4 braces morticed into the beam and support posts. The gussets are just there to add some stiffness, but the loads are carried by timbers. I probably should have made the triangulating braces a bit longer and shortened the centre span, so you're right, this is not the optimal solution, but it only has to work one more time before being recycled into posts for some new deck railings.

You can't see the bottom of the supporting posts in the picture, but there are two more braces on each side moticed into both the base plates and the support posts (also with gussets to improve rigidity).

Since there wern't any creaks, groans or other complaints during the first use, it should work one more time.

The other thread about the garage lifts has me researching 2 and 4 post lifts. Since my wife is talking about moving closer to town, I may just have to have the next garage built to accommodate a couple of lifts (we're a 4 car family at the moment, 5 if I start a Fiero project for myself in the next year or so).

Cheers

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post05-24-2008 10:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Time for a quick update.

Work's been nuts for the last week, and will be nuts for the next three weeks too, so there won't be too much progress for the next while.

Nothing's happened that really warrants extra pictures, just removed the bushings from the engine cradle and the rear control arms. Spent about two hours with a wire wheel on the drill removing rust, dirt and loose paint from the engine cradle.

Block and crank are still sitting in the garage, I figured I'd wait for the new pistons to arrive (back ordered until June 1) and have the machine shop install the pistons on the rods at the same time that the crank gets reground and the block gets bored.

I'm having a bit of a problem finding .020 over plasma rings on the web, anyone have a good source for 2.8 piston rings?

The latest Fierostore order shipped this week, so the new rear ball joints, tie rods and parking brake cables should be in next week, as should the POR-15. So hopefully I can get a few suspension parts painted and at least start reassembling things next weekend.

I thought I'd try the POR-20 high temperature paint on the exhaust manifolds, crossover pipe and the heat shields. Can anyone comment on the longevity of POR-20 compared to other coatings?

Cheers

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post06-07-2008 07:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

While I'm waiting for parts to arrive, I figured it was time to start tackling some engine bay clean-up,

Since I also wanted to do a good clean-up on the frame rails and have some rear clip damage, I figured I'd pull the rear clip off first. So when the rear valence was removed, I find this:


Looks like the rear was smacked pretty good, based on the damage. Nothing on the valence though.

This vehicle is starting to reveal it's true character. I have the expected trunk rust. When I first removed the carpet, things looked pretty good, then I noticed the first paint blister. By the time I finished poking around with a screwdriver, I found this on the driver's side:


Figured I'd better pull the fan and check the passenger side. Good thing I did, It's in about the same shape.

After pulling out the wheel wells and splash guards, found some major frame rot on the passenger side:


Then there's the ever popular rust by the battery tray (top and bottom views):



Oh well, another reason to stop by Princess Auto and pick up a few tools (air powered metal sheers) and the local Metal Supermarket for some sheet steel to start the patching process.

But everything isn't doom and gloom. The cradle, control arms and knuckles have been cleaned up and painted. Here's a shot of one control arm with the knuckle just sitting on it (no dust boot on the new ball joint yet):


The result of cleaning up casting flash and other casting flaws on the upper intake (and a comparison to the original:



That's about it for now, time to get back to removing the rear clip and tackling the rust.

Cheers

[This message has been edited by TiredGXP (edited 06-07-2008).]

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atleastitruns
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Report this Post06-08-2008 01:18 AM Click Here to See the Profile for atleastitrunsSend a Private Message to atleastitrunsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by TiredGXP:


Here's one of my helpers

Cheers


It's a Samoyed!

Aww, makes me miss my pups back home.

What's his name?

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post06-08-2008 08:15 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

That's Pumbaa - yes, named after the Disney character. Just about the same temperament as the warthog. Everyone he meets (which has unfortunately included skunks on three separate occasions) is a new friend that must be played with. Eats like a pig too, so he's constantly on a diet in an attempt to keep his weight below 85lb.


Cheers

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thismanyfieros
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Report this Post06-08-2008 11:35 AM Click Here to See the Profile for thismanyfierosClick Here to Email thismanyfierosSend a Private Message to thismanyfierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

duhh i just realized your in alberta... if you need any parts let me know i work in a local junkyard and we have 3 fieros...an 85gt red an 86 se gold and an 86 coupe black....both the all 3 were hit in the front...tim

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post06-08-2008 11:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Thanks, Tim.

I've got the bent piece off, looks salvageable, just need to use a BFH and dolly and it will straighten right out. Had the torch on it today in an attempt to anneal the metal I'll be banging on. Hopefully this will minimize cracks that will have to be welded up.

What I am looking for is a brake booster from a mid 90's S10 to do the $100 brake upgrade with. I'm going to be in Red Deer on the 16th, so if you have one, PM me with the directions/price and I'll pop by on my way back to Edmonton. And if you happen to have your ride there, I wouldn't mind checking it out

Cheers

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thismanyfieros
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Report this Post06-08-2008 03:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for thismanyfierosClick Here to Email thismanyfierosSend a Private Message to thismanyfierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

brake booster or the master cylinder...??? probably be able to get you both...we have a row of jimmys and S-10's i will hafta take a peek and ask the boss about pricing...then i will drop a pm with the info...i dont get off till after 6 pm and i am home by 630 pm...i hope you wont be pasing through till after that time...that way you can get a peek at my 3.8sc if you liked....tim

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post06-08-2008 04:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

It's the booster I'm looking for, I already have the big bore master cylinder and various other parts required to do the Grand Am/Beretta brake upgrade, just want to reduce the pedal effort.

I'm down there for a meeting in the morning, probably be passing by Ponoka on my way back to Edmonton around 1:30 or 2:00. Darn, looks like I'll have to check our your ride another day (when you are in Edmonton at one of the g2g's).

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Report this Post06-09-2008 08:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for thismanyfierosClick Here to Email thismanyfierosSend a Private Message to thismanyfierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

no luck with the brake booster....sorry man...tim

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post06-09-2008 09:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Thanks for trying. I'll check the yards around here or just break down and buy one from NAPA.

Cheers

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post06-21-2008 01:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Been out of town a fair bit for the last couple of weeks and haven't had a chance to do any work. The side effect of that was extra time to re-evaluate the project and come up with more ways to spend money .

Since the stock block and crank both need machining, I've been considering going with a 3.1 crank, then I realized that my father in law has a 90 Lumina with the 3.1 that's headed to the wrecker (engine runs, has about 11k fewer km than the 2.8).

I figured that there may be a few parts worth salvaging from the car and took a look at it, and realized that this used the 7727 ECU with DIS ignition. The plan now is to use the 3.1 bottom end with the 2.8 heads and intake.

Pros:
3.1 block is a direct swap
No distributor - more consistent timing and provides clearance for alternative intake options (3.4 upper intake?)
Elimination of cooling tubes and trunk fan for a cleaner look.
All the other advantages of the 7730 swap, including
Option to add digital cruise
EGR delete
No cold start injector
Eliminate fan switch
Can eliminate more vacuum lines for evap canister
Knock sensor
No more machine work than is already required

Cons (well, just extra bits of work):
More wiring required to re-pin wiring harness connectors (Guess I need the 7730 ECU, not the 7727, but at least have the 3.1 memcal, knock sensor and coil packs) and to hook up cruise and evap solenoid.
Need to find a neutrally balanced flywheel
Programming changes as necessary for other engine mods and standard vs. automatic transmission.

I figure Ryan at Sinister Performance can provide a tune that will allow me to keep it running during cam break in and provide a good starting point for refining the tune based on my particular mods.

Question
With the planned elimination of EGR and the cold start injector, I've been thinking that perhaps the IAC tube can be rerouted from the LIM to the EGR inlet on the UIM. Anyone done this? Problems?

Cheers

[This message has been edited by TiredGXP (edited 06-21-2008).]

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Report this Post06-22-2008 08:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Finally have some progress to report.

The porting kit came in the mail on Friday, so I started tackling the heads. This is my first attempt at porting, based on the results, it's a good thing I don't do this for a living. The porting was nothing radical, just a gasket match in the intake and removal of significant casting flaws.

The intake gasket match went pretty good, well, except for a couple of slips with the grinding wheel. Intake ports need a bit more time with 120 grit to smooth things out.

Based on the results of polishing the exhaust ports, it looks like I didn't spend enough time with the flap wheel to eliminate all the 120 grit marks, so I'll have to go back over those.

I'm not really happy with the bowl work on the exhaust ports, especially the middle one, so may have to go back over them.

On a couple of ports, it seems like I just can't reach everywhere, so there's still a couple of patches of rough cast finish that I need to try to deal with.

Here's a few "in progress" pictures:

Intake runners port matched and raw head



A couple of shots of partially polished exhaust ports and the raw carboned up one




A couple of shots of the bowls, and a stock comparison




Based on the number of pictures posted, I guess I should have put a 56K warning in the thread title.

Cheers

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Fiero Owner
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Report this Post06-22-2008 10:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Fiero OwnerSend a Private Message to Fiero OwnerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

My intake is mostly not painted, kind of like yours.

This images is larger than 153600 bytes. Click to view.

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post06-23-2008 10:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Haven't decided yet whether to paint it or to smooth things out a bit more and just clear coat it. I do like the look of bare aluminum, but want to keep it from oxidizing.

What all have you done to your engine? I see the aftermarked dogbone, headers, and what looks like Rodney Dickman's stainless vacuum lines, anything else?

Cheers

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Fiero Owner
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Report this Post06-24-2008 12:47 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Fiero OwnerSend a Private Message to Fiero OwnerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Darrell Morse intakes and throttle body, MSD coil, Comp cam(272 I think it was), roller tip rockers, headers, Rodeny's SS vacuum lines, aluminum flywheel, Spec stage 3 clutch, oh, and a 3.4 block. Probably more I can't remember right now but that's most of it.

Edit: Forgot to say it's being swapped out for a 3800SC now.

[This message has been edited by Fiero Owner (edited 06-24-2008).]

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post07-05-2008 08:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Finally getting some things put back together.

Poly bushings are installed in the front of the cradle and in the rear control arms. New engine and transmission mounts have been bolted to the cradle:


The knuckles are back on with the new axle seals installed:


Had a scrap of aluminum left over from a TB adapter project on the LS4, with a bit of trimming and some threaded rod, it made a good tool to drive the new axle seals in:



New hubs and cleaned-up dust shields installed:


I'm now committed to the 3.1 swap, ordered .75mm over pistons and rings from Rock Auto earlier today. I'll have the 3.1 block out of the donor car in a couple of more days - next weekend at the outside, and can then get things off to the machine shop.

For anyone who's interested, I came across a guy who bores out and ports throttle bodies http://www.maxbore.com/ Depending on whether an intake manifold mod ever happens, I may just have to have the stock one bored out to 56mm, which ought to be big enough for a 3.1.

Cheers

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post07-17-2008 07:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Been spending a bit of time fixing the cancer (rust) in the trunk and engine compartment. Having a few problems with the welding, as I keep blowing holes in the existing sheet metal even with the welder set on low heat. Then get to spend extra time trying to fill those in.

FedEx dropped off the new pistons for the 3.1 today (Sealed Power H562CP), so hopefully I can get the block, crank and rods off to the machine shop in the next couple of days.

Since I'm going with a DIS system, and not too set on keeping a completely stock look, I thought I'd look at other upper intake manifold options.

The 3.4 SFI upper from a F-body looks interesting, even though there appears to be a clearance issue with the thermostat housing:


(picture courtesy of Sardonyx247)

Can anyone comment on how this flows compared to the stock Fiero upper?

Cheers

Edit to fix picture link

[This message has been edited by TiredGXP (edited 07-17-2008).]

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Raydar
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Report this Post07-17-2008 11:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RaydarClick Here to Email RaydarSend a Private Message to RaydarEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Wow!
Lost this thread for a while. Nice work!

Most people will probably tell you that the 3.4 upper isn't worth the trouble, but that's relative to the installation of the 3.4 in the Fiero.
OTOH, if you're going to a DIS 3.1, it may very well be a different story.
Although it's kind of marginal for a modded 3.4, it ought to flow plenty for a 3.1.
And it looks really cool.
The Fiero upper has a huge restriction where the neck joins the main part of the plenum. The opening is even smaller than an un-bored Fiero TB.

As you mentioned, the thermostat housing is in the way, but someone on the Forum cut a "C" notch out of the end runner, and welded it up.
Looked like it should work really well.

While we're on the 3.1...
The FWD Lumina car has aluminum heads with much smaller chambers. It has lower compression pistons to accommodate.
You'll need the pistons for the iron head version. Think CamaroBird or 91 Lumina minivan (also with iron heads.)

Edit - Since you're already swapping ECMs and using DIS, just swap in the Lumina engine in its entirety. Its intake and heads flow much better than the Fiero's. You might be able to reuse the Fiero timing cover and accessory brackets to save yourself a bit of re-engineering. You might lose one bolt hole on the heads, though.

If you can get www.60degreev6.com/index to load, there's a wealth of information about these engines.
(You may have to hit "refresh" to get pages to load. It's kind of cranky.)

[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 07-18-2008).]

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post07-18-2008 01:21 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Raydar:

Wow!
Lost this thread for a while. Nice work!

Most people will probably tell you that the 3.4 upper isn't worth the trouble, but that's relative to the installation of the 3.4 in the Fiero.
OTOH, if you're going to a DIS 3.1, it may very well be a different story.
Although it's kind of marginal for a modded 3.4, it ought to flow plenty for a 3.1.
And it looks really cool.
The Fiero upper has a huge restriction where the neck joins the main part of the plenum. The opening is even smaller than an un-bored Fiero TB.

As you mentioned, the thermostat housing is in the way, but someone on the Forum cut a "C" notch out of the end runner, and welded it up.
Looked like it should work really well.

While we're on the 3.1...
The FWD Lumina car has aluminum heads with much smaller chambers. It has lower compression pistons to accommodate.
You'll need the pistons for the iron head version. Think CamaroBird or 91 Lumina minivan (also with iron heads.)

Edit - Since you're already swapping ECMs and using DIS, just swap in the Lumina engine in its entirety. Its intake and heads flow much better than the Fiero's. You might be able to reuse the Fiero timing cover and accessory brackets to save yourself a bit of re-engineering. You might lose one bolt hole on the heads, though.

If you can get www.60degreev6.com/index to load, there's a wealth of information about these engines.
(You may have to hit "refresh" to get pages to load. It's kind of cranky.)



Thanks for the comments.

I was hoping the stock 3.4 upper flowed better than the 2.8 upper. Now it's just the matter of finding one in a local boneyard. While I'm there I'll be loooking for a 7730 ECU and a neutrally balanced flywheel, although I expect to have to buy a new flywheel.

Since I'd already purchased complete new 2.8 valvetrain components and started porting the iron heads before deciding to go with the 3.1, I'm pretty much committed to using the 2.8 iron heads. The correct pistons an iron head 3.1 were delivered from Rock Auto via FedEx today.

Cheers

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post12-25-2008 02:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Just a bump to keep the thread alive.

I've had to free up the garage for my daughter's use during the winter, so about a month and a half ago I reinstalled the cradle, suspension and brakes and just pushed the car out to the side of the driveway for winter (under a all season cover).

The engine block's back from the machine shop, crank and pistons have been installed. It's been oiled up and bagged until things warm up a bit. (it's been -20 or below for the last week and a half )

I've just about finished porting (well, mostly just gasket matching) the lower and middle intake manifolds. Since I have a few days off over the holidays, I'll post up a few pictures of the finished pieces.

Cheers

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Tony Kania
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Report this Post12-25-2008 04:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Tony KaniaSend a Private Message to Tony KaniaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Nice car. Like what you are doing with it. I pretty much just finished mine recently. Stroked her out to 3.1. I went with a new block, along with all high end internals, new heads, .388 cam, matched all the runners, hogged out manifolds (easy process, and good for about 15 hp), 1.6 rollers, and all new accessories. Also did my suspension with all new everything. Painted and detailed frame and undercarriage. Now she will not blow the doors off of a Vette, but she handles and performs with the best cars out there. Slotted and drilled rotors, braided lines, and poly throughout. I also went with Eibach springs and KYB shocks and struts. I am looking forward to spring to do a little SCCA cone racing myself. Trully enjoy what you are putting together. Out of all my handeling features that I added to her, my hands down favorite item is a rear stabilizer bar. Read in an earlier post of yours that that was one of your plans. FYI, it is a valuable piece. Until the snow, I have been driving her on our nearby mountains, and she is just a dream. Good luck with your build, and enjoy the time spent with your son. You my sir, are a good father. Great story. Just picked up on it today. Keep it alive.

------------------
Tony K

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post05-23-2009 08:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I guess this is an "I haven't done any work, but the parts have been coming in" bump.

Plans have changed a bit over the winter, and I've been accumulating some parts to proceed with turbocharging the 3.1

Yesterday the FedEx truck came by and dropped off an interesting box

Here's the T3/T04E turbo, specs are 50 trim .5A/R T04E compressor and stage 3 T3 turbine with a .63 A/R housing :


A shot of the turbine exit

And another looking through the 3" v-band "Ultimate wastegate"


So the plan is to use this Sy/Ty W2A intercooler



and this dual 48mm LT1 throttle body (same one as used on the Sy/Ty)


Finally most of the big ticket items have arrived.

Still need to finish the design parameters of the sheet metal intake that will be needed for the throttle body, and fab up both it and the exhaust system. Then, of course, it's being nickeled and dimed to death with oil and water fittings, hoses, clamps, W/G actuator, W/G solenoid, BOV.......

Cheers

[This message has been edited by TiredGXP (edited 05-23-2009).]

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NCTyphoonKid
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Report this Post05-24-2009 09:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for NCTyphoonKidClick Here to Email NCTyphoonKidSend a Private Message to NCTyphoonKidEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I like your project and my mom has a 93 Ty so them parts look familiar

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AspenGrey
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Report this Post05-28-2009 10:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AspenGreyClick Here to visit AspenGrey's HomePageClick Here to Email AspenGreySend a Private Message to AspenGreyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Is that an AIr/Water intercooler? This is exactly what I want to do to mine over the next year, so I'm watching with interest!

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post05-29-2009 12:40 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Yes, it's a water to air intercooler - picked up used on eBay.

Progress is going to be slow - I'm swamped at work for the next two months.

Looks like we'll also be moving into a new house in July, so lots of work to get our current place ready to sell and then all the landscaping that the new place will require. At least the new place will have an insulated garage, so there should be enough heat to work on it into the winter - my best guess is that this will be on the road next spring.

Cheers

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TiredGXP
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Report this Post07-22-2017 09:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TiredGXPSend a Private Message to TiredGXPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

So I see it's been over eight years since I last posted here, and really also that long since I last worked on the car. That's about to be remedied.

The wife and I are both retired now, and we're in the process of moving to Vancouver Island, the car and all the accumulated parts have been loaded into a shipping container with the rest of the shop equipment. The new place has a good sized, heated shop, so once some home redecoration/renovation projects are done, I'll have lots of time to work on the car. I'm looking forward to it.

[This message has been edited by TiredGXP (edited 07-22-2017).]

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kendell
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Report this Post08-30-2017 04:26 AM Click Here to See the Profile for kendellClick Here to Email kendellSend a Private Message to kendellEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

That looks slow yet fun project. My uncle used to have an SE 2M6, just nice to a project here.

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