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Eff. My trans has internal break. Epoxy? by sourmash
Started on: 03-26-2020 08:25 PM
Replies: 11 (123 views)
Last post by: sourmash on 03-27-2020 07:22 PM
sourmash
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Report this Post03-26-2020 08:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My 4T80 wasn't shifting into 2nd gear unless done by the shift lever. Finally I dropped the pan to replace the shift solenoids and found this damage to the housing. The valve body assembly screws to it. It's just a small area, but can anyone advise on maybe an epoxy repair?



And with the valve body still installed it looked like this. I can replace the assembly.

[This message has been edited by sourmash (edited 03-26-2020).]

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Report this Post03-26-2020 09:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierogt28Send a Private Message to fierogt28Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
No epoxy, replace assembly.

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sourmash
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Report this Post03-26-2020 09:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yeah, I already have that but that isn't the question I'm asking. The first image is the question. It's the transmission housing.

 
quote
Originally posted by sourmash:

Finally I dropped the pan to replace the shift solenoids and found this damage to the housing.
The transmission housing, which is not worth replacing. It was just installed.

[This message has been edited by sourmash (edited 03-26-2020).]

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olejoedad
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Report this Post03-26-2020 09:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadClick Here to Email olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Someone with good TIG skills could rebuild the area, the trick would be the final surfacing to get it to seal.

My question is how did the damage come about? Was the transmission housing dropped during a rebuild?
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sourmash
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Report this Post03-26-2020 09:33 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My first thought too, but no. It's a VIN 9 and harder to find. Finally found a used one, talked to the guy who sold the car for scrap, he confirmed it was good. I bought it from the j-yard. They had pierced the pan with a punch to drain the fluid for and did that damage. I didn't know it when I took it to get it installed at the trans shop. The trans shop installed it without telling me but probably didn't see it until it was already installed. Since the pan had a drain hole punched they swapped the pan from my old trans. THAT'S when the chunk would've fallen out. They decided to sweep it under the rug and have avoided telling me.

Took it back for diagnostic and they wanted to replace the shift solenoids for $300 to fix it. Decided to do it myself and, voila. Someone at that shop knew about this because they swapped pans. The aluminum chunks would've been in there. They didn't even clean out the old pan from the grenaded trans. Last year I opened that trans and found destroyed wiring, wire insulation and a chunked solenoid. Yest when I dropped the newly installed pan wiring bits and electric slag was in the trans screen...that's junk from the old trans. That's when I looked about my old trans to confirm they swapped pans...there's a big punch hole through it confirming it was swapped. So I'm stuck. They suck

But I need a quick fix without throwing the car away.

[This message has been edited by sourmash (edited 03-27-2020).]

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sourmash
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Report this Post03-26-2020 09:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

sourmash

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quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:

Someone with good TIG skills could rebuild the area, the trick would be the final surfacing to get it to seal.


That's why epoxy came to mind. If can be formed easier than sanding TIG weld.

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wgpierce
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Report this Post03-27-2020 05:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for wgpierceSend a Private Message to wgpierceEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I don't know if you can get this stuff in the US, but it works well It's sorta like JB Weld but it's better. Really I don't think you have anything to lose at this point. Would be better to get it welded but you could try


[This message has been edited by wgpierce (edited 03-27-2020).]

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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post03-27-2020 05:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The best idea may be to first find out the reason that break occurred, then plan a method to fix it. Either way that trans probably has to come down.

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Report this Post03-27-2020 06:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for qwikgtaClick Here to Email qwikgtaSend a Private Message to qwikgtaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I believe the owner stated that the trans came from a junk yard. I know at my Pick n Pull they do the same thing, they puncture the trans/oil pan's with a huge punch, putting a hole in it and then suck out all the fluid. They don't waste their time unbolting anything, punch thru the oil pan, the trans pan, suck out all the brake fluid, pop a hole in the gas tank, suck out all the gas, cut the cat converter off and then move it out onto the yard. That damage looks just like what the punch would do as they smacked it into the pan to suck out all the fluid. F**King idiots.

I've bought a few motors/trans from my Pick n Pull and the only pan they didn't punch thru was the 3800SC with the aluminum oil pan, they actually took out the plug (never put it back by the way).

That sucks i'd deff try the epoxy first, shape it, grind it, make it work.

Rob
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Report this Post03-27-2020 06:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for theogreClick Here to visit theogre's HomePageSend a Private Message to theogreEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Most Epoxies and "glues" don't work well on aluminum to start with. Add heat cycling and hydraulic pressure to force the joint to "blow out."

Worse, Top image look like have a Crack above obvious damage and "Glues" likely won't fix that. Far worse if the crack is on a stress area that will grow bigger in hours to days or more depending on how you drive etc.

Welding may help or not depending how good the welder shop is and if can reach all crack area.
May need Zyglo or Magnaflux to see how deep the crack is. W/ or w/o that likely need to drill/grind crank open to weld closed.

Trans shop should not have installed this junk unit. Any "Real" shop should have seen that pan damage and loose parts when they took that off and never tried taking car apart.
Some one basically ripped you off and did the job anyway.
Good luck getting money from them w/o going to court. If under ~ $5000 maybe Small Claims Court that doesn't allow lawyers.

Your past blaming a junk yard even if they did the damage because of Trans shop took it apart and worse replace the pan.

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Report this Post03-27-2020 06:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pmbrunelleClick Here to Email pmbrunelleSend a Private Message to pmbrunelleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:
Someone with good TIG skills could rebuild the area, the trick would be the final surfacing to get it to seal.


It would indeed be hard to make the repair area flush with the existing surface.

However, if the entire surface could be milled flat with just a bare minimum depth of cut (i.e. .003" or so), then there would be a good chance of sealing.

Not knowing anything about automatic transmissions, I don't know if the function of the trans would be impaired if this surface was cut a bit deeper.

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sourmash
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Report this Post03-27-2020 07:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I sure didn't need this, but there it is.

The yard def did that damage processing for parting---fast as they can. The shop didn't tell me, but I don't think they knew until it was already installed and HAD to see it when they changed the pan. Plus the owner was out having surgery during that time so it was play time. It should've been something I caught before taking it there, but they should've told me. I'll know next time to really go over the thing before taking it in.

Anyway, the owner said it's been forever since they rebuilt one of these and wasn't positive but it appears it'll be ok to epoxy and the back channel (outer one) looks like a no pressure exhaust passage. The inside circuit he said goes into the valve body then comes out a few inches away.

The green is what he suggested doing with epoxy, building all the way to that other back wall It WILL NOT block the flow since it has two paths, one on each end. Again he thinks the outer channel is just an exhaust. Building all the way to the next wall will prevent a blow out / working out.
To keep the plane flat how about if I use some rigid cardstock to make a clean surface that keeps the plane? That would pull off and clean off easily. What do you think about using rigid cardboard bolted up in place like it's the valve body?



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