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F23 Taller Gear Ratio Options by T4Turtle
Started on: 11-20-2019 01:41 PM
Replies: 16 (272 views)
Last post by: fieroguru on 12-03-2019 01:29 PM
T4Turtle
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Report this Post11-20-2019 01:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for T4TurtleClick Here to Email T4TurtleSend a Private Message to T4TurtleReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I can find all of the gearing options for US sold vehicles with F23 and see that 3.84 is the tallest. Are gear sets interchangeable from other vehicles sold outside US/Canada that are any taller?

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Will
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Report this Post11-20-2019 03:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for WillClick Here to Email WillSend a Private Message to WillReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Check out the Cobalt XFE model. That had first 3.72 then 3.63 FD's.
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T4Turtle
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Report this Post11-20-2019 05:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for T4TurtleClick Here to Email T4TurtleSend a Private Message to T4TurtleReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks Will! Much better, do you know the rest of the gear ratios? I see this RPO FY1 now searching but just states final drive. Also can I just run the metric 60 degree bellhousing on this transmission?
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msweldon
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Report this Post11-20-2019 10:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for msweldonClick Here to Email msweldonSend a Private Message to msweldonReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by T4Turtle:

Thanks Will! Much better, do you know the rest of the gear ratios? I see this RPO FY1 now searching but just states final drive. Also can I just run the metric 60 degree bellhousing on this transmission?


No, the cobalt 3.63/3.72 FDs only came with a ecotec housing. You will have to purchase a 60deg F23 and swap bellhousings or swap the guts... You can get F23 rebuild and shim selector tools on ebay for great prices....
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T4Turtle
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Report this Post11-21-2019 07:44 AM Click Here to See the Profile for T4TurtleClick Here to Email T4TurtleSend a Private Message to T4TurtleReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
That’s what I was thinking. So get an F23 bell housing or complete out of a 2000-2002 Cavalier/Sunfire and use this bell housing on the Ecotec version F23 or put gear set from Ecotec in non Ecotec case. Is there an advantage doing one way over the other?
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msweldon
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Report this Post11-21-2019 09:55 AM Click Here to See the Profile for msweldonClick Here to Email msweldonSend a Private Message to msweldonReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by T4Turtle:

That’s what I was thinking. So get an F23 bell housing or complete out of a 2000-2002 Cavalier/Sunfire and use this bell housing on the Ecotec version F23 or put gear set from Ecotec in non Ecotec case. Is there an advantage doing one way over the other?


The ecotec case is a bit harder to fabricate mounts due to the location of the mounting bosses on the cobalt trans case with the cavalier being more easily adaptable with mounts made by thelin.. then again swapping the guts is a measure more involved over swapping just the bellhousing. If you swap the guts do try to obtain the shaft holder tray(sp?) that holds all the shafts together when you remove the casing. you can purchase a DVD or search youtube for a step by step guide to disassembling and reassembling the F23.

See JustinBart's thread on installing a 3.63 bellhousing swap F23 onto his turbo 3800

I have enough respect for the power holding ability of the F23 I have one in storage in case I can't get the F40 to hold behind my LF3/LF4 swap as Justin ran ~780hp through his with a quaife and OEM axles....granted no version of the F23 bolts up to any HFV6, mender has adapted it to an LFX with a quad 4 bellhousing and custom trans to block brackets.
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Will
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Report this Post11-21-2019 11:43 AM Click Here to See the Profile for WillClick Here to Email WillSend a Private Message to WillReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by msweldon:

The ecotec case is a bit harder to fabricate mounts due to the location of the mounting bosses on the cobalt trans case with the cavalier being more easily adaptable with mounts made by thelin.. then again swapping the guts is a measure more involved over swapping just the bellhousing. If you swap the guts do try to obtain the shaft holder tray(sp?) that holds all the shafts together when you remove the casing. you can purchase a DVD or search youtube for a step by step guide to disassembling and reassembling the F23.

See JustinBart's thread on installing a 3.63 bellhousing swap F23 onto his turbo 3800

I have enough respect for the power holding ability of the F23 I have one in storage in case I can't get the F40 to hold behind my LF3/LF4 swap as Justin ran ~780hp through his with a quaife and OEM axles....granted no version of the F23 bolts up to any HFV6, mender has adapted it to an LFX with a quad 4 bellhousing and custom trans to block brackets.


It's actually the other way around with regard to bellhousings and mounts. Thelin's mounts are designed for the Ecotec transmissions. Thelin's rear mount looks like it will be ok with the 2.2 transmission, but the "metric" bellhousing lacks the bosses that the forward mount bolts to on the Ecotec housing.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/140904.html

Also, the Ecotec bellhousing is 3/8" deeper than the metric bellhousing, and the accompanying input shaft is 3/8" longer. Justin Bart's thread shows that he had to modify the longer Ecotec input shaft to clear the 3800 crank pilot when used with the metric bellhousing.

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 12-02-2019).]

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Will
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Report this Post11-21-2019 11:44 AM Click Here to See the Profile for WillClick Here to Email WillSend a Private Message to WillReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Will

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quote
Originally posted by T4Turtle:

Thanks Will! Much better, do you know the rest of the gear ratios? I see this RPO FY1 now searching but just states final drive. Also can I just run the metric 60 degree bellhousing on this transmission?


All the F23's have the same shifted gears EXCEPT the Saturn Vue transmissions, which have a shorter 5th (as well as 4.40 FD).
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msweldon
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Report this Post11-21-2019 05:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for msweldonClick Here to Email msweldonSend a Private Message to msweldonReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Will:


It's actually the other way around with regard to bellhousings and mounts. Thelin's mounts are designed for the Ecotec transmissions. The rear mount looks like it will be ok with the 2.2 transmission, but the "metric" bellhousing lacks the bosses that the forward mount bolts to on the Ecotec housing.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/140904.html


Yes indeed Will, thanks for the correction... been in the F40 world too long... and don't want to send the OP off in the wrong direction....

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T4Turtle
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Report this Post11-21-2019 07:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for T4TurtleClick Here to Email T4TurtleSend a Private Message to T4TurtleReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Will:


All the F23's have the same shifted gears EXCEPT the Saturn Vue transmissions, which have a shorter 5th (as well as 4.40 FD).


Got it, thanks. When you said first i was thinking first gear not first version.
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T4Turtle
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Report this Post11-22-2019 10:25 AM Click Here to See the Profile for T4TurtleClick Here to Email T4TurtleSend a Private Message to T4TurtleReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It sounds like fabricating a proper front mount might be difficult if swapping bell housings. Also is appears either way the input shaft will need to be turned down as well. So swapping all internals then just getting mounts from WCF for the F23 should be it for mounting the F23. Then cables/brackets/shifter parts all appear to be available.

Thanks for the help!
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Will
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Report this Post11-22-2019 09:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for WillClick Here to Email WillSend a Private Message to WillReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Can you rephrase that? Not clear what you're aiming to do.

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 11-22-2019).]

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T4Turtle
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Report this Post11-27-2019 08:03 AM Click Here to See the Profile for T4TurtleClick Here to Email T4TurtleSend a Private Message to T4TurtleReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
For mounting and getting taller gears best to swap the internals as you can buy mounts for the early F23 and a sbc vs trying to mount the Ecotec version.

[This message has been edited by T4Turtle (edited 11-27-2019).]

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Will
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Report this Post12-02-2019 08:48 AM Click Here to See the Profile for WillClick Here to Email WillSend a Private Message to WillReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by T4Turtle:

For mounting and getting taller gears best to swap the internals as you can buy mounts for the early F23 and a sbc vs trying to mount the Ecotec version.



 
quote
Originally posted by Will:

It's actually the other way around with regard to bellhousings and mounts. Thelin's mounts are designed for the Ecotec transmissions. The [Thelin's] rear mount looks like it will be ok with the 2.2 transmission, but the "metric" bellhousing lacks the bosses that the forward mount bolts to on the Ecotec housing.



Is there a WCF offering for F23 mount brackets?
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Report this Post12-02-2019 06:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for stickponyClick Here to visit stickpony's HomePageSend a Private Message to stickponyReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
FieroGuru has added the 3.05:1 final drive gear to an F40 transmission, i believe its available in Opels and sabbs in europe. Would doing the F40 6 speed be a viable option for you?
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Will
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Report this Post12-03-2019 07:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for WillClick Here to Email WillSend a Private Message to WillReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The Pontiac G6 F40's had a 3.55 final... no need to even open the transmission.
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fieroguru
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Report this Post12-03-2019 01:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Will:

The Pontiac G6 F40's had a 3.55 final... no need to even open the transmission.


Unless you "want" a 3.09 final drive for a larger higher torque engine.
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