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Car seems to want the timing retarded in order to run smooth? by Liam45
Started on: 01-09-2019 06:05 PM
Replies: 18 (281 views)
Last post by: anaverin on 01-25-2019 03:06 AM
Liam45
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Report this Post01-09-2019 06:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Liam45Click Here to Email Liam45Send a Private Message to Liam45Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Anyone know any reasons my car wants to be like -50 on the dizzy, at -10 it sounds like its running on 3 cyl but smoother at higher rpm at -30 its running smooth except has a miss at idle but will easily cruise down the free way. I know having it retarded is just compensating for something and i checked my fuel pressure at its at 37, and when i unplug the fpr vacuum line it spikes to 45. Ive never checked or changed the injectors out so im not exactly ruling them out on being clogged maybe cause a lean condition anyone had this issue?

[This message has been edited by Liam45 (edited 01-09-2019).]

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Liam45
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Report this Post01-09-2019 06:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Liam45Click Here to Email Liam45Send a Private Message to Liam45Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

And no the balancer has not slipped, 2.8 auto trans thanks

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Liam45
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Report this Post01-09-2019 07:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Liam45Click Here to Email Liam45Send a Private Message to Liam45Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I typed that wrong, my bad but what i meant to say car will only run well advanced -30.

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Patrick
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Report this Post01-09-2019 07:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Liam45:

And no the balancer has not slipped...


And you had the ALDL jumper installed when setting the timing?

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Liam45
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Report this Post01-09-2019 07:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Liam45Click Here to Email Liam45Send a Private Message to Liam45Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

And you had the ALDL jumper installed when setting the timing?

Yes AlDl jumped flashing 12 to verify, this problem is driving me up the wall lol...

[This message has been edited by Liam45 (edited 01-09-2019).]

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pmbrunelle
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Report this Post01-09-2019 08:23 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pmbrunelleClick Here to Email pmbrunelleSend a Private Message to pmbrunelleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

30° of timing advance at idle sounds about right; I tuned my 2.8 Fiero to idle around there. That's what gave me the highest RPM / the most vacuum.

When you set the ALDL jumper to adjust the timing, you're not setting the timing that makes the engine run smoothest; you're setting the timing to a known pre-determined value, so that when the computer applies its timing corrections, the overall resulting timing is as expected.

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Liam45
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Report this Post01-09-2019 08:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Liam45Click Here to Email Liam45Send a Private Message to Liam45Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

30° of timing advance at idle sounds about right; I tuned my 2.8 Fiero to idle around there. That's what gave me the highest RPM / the most vacuum.

When you set the ALDL jumper to adjust the timing, you're not setting the timing that makes the engine run smoothest; you're setting the timing to a known pre-determined value, so that when the computer applies its timing corrections, the overall resulting timing is as expected.

I like where we are going with this, only issue is when the jumper is removed after setting -10 and i go a for a drive the car feels as its missing do i need to drive a bit for computer to decide the advancment? when i rev it it sounds like a 3 cyl but eventually smooths on acceleration as the rpm increases?


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Liam45
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Report this Post01-09-2019 08:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Liam45Click Here to Email Liam45Send a Private Message to Liam45Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Setting to -30 with jumper installed is where its at now but seems to miss at idle / stall if engine doesnt catch its self in time. But with -30 it doesnt miss / sounds like a 3 cyl when going from a stop...

[This message has been edited by Liam45 (edited 01-09-2019).]

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Patrick
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Report this Post01-09-2019 11:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Liam45:

...sounds like a 3 cyl when going from a stop


Have you checked the two injector fuses? Maybe you are running on three cylinders!

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Liam45
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Report this Post01-10-2019 10:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Liam45Click Here to Email Liam45Send a Private Message to Liam45Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

Have you checked the two injector fuses? Maybe you are running on three cylinders!


Yeah went through all the fuses, i tried switching out the distributor to a cardone and it idled well but lost spark between 2-3k put the old one back in and it fixed the losing of spark. the cardone also worked at -10 just idk why it was losing spark. I narrowed it too the distributor , being spark coming out of the coil was nice and hot while the spark coming from the cap was not. The weird part is at -10 the throttle was snappy on the cardone at first but it would loose spark eventually, the original distributor at -10 has weak spark unless advanced to -30....

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MulletproofMonk
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Report this Post01-11-2019 10:18 AM Click Here to See the Profile for MulletproofMonkClick Here to visit MulletproofMonk's HomePageSend a Private Message to MulletproofMonkEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Are you sure it is a 2.8L motor and not a 3.4L motor with the 2.8L balancer? That would put your timing marks off. Just a thought.

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Liam45
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Report this Post01-14-2019 12:53 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Liam45Click Here to Email Liam45Send a Private Message to Liam45Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Update been driving it to hopefully have a problem surfacee and now shes throwing a code 42........lovely def something with my spark i really dont think icm but going to swap tomorrow...

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Patrick
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Report this Post01-14-2019 02:14 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Liam45:

And no the balancer has not slipped...


How did you verify that?

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Liam45
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Report this Post01-14-2019 12:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Liam45Click Here to Email Liam45Send a Private Message to Liam45Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

How did you verify that?

I thought maybe the timing chain had slipped a tooth so I replaced it, it didn’t slip but man it was extremely loose. But during this I checked the harmonic balancer.

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Report this Post01-14-2019 01:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Liam45:

But during this I checked the harmonic balancer.


How?

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Liam45
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Report this Post01-14-2019 02:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Liam45Click Here to Email Liam45Send a Private Message to Liam45Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

How?

By a picture of a new one vs mine, key location and gap.

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Report this Post01-14-2019 03:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post


Might be best to determine if TDC of #1 actually lines up with the timing mark on the balancer by sticking the proper tool (or even a plastic straw) through the spark plug hole.

And if you've changed the timing chain, make sure the valves are rocking at TDC of the exhaust stroke.

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Liam45
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Report this Post01-14-2019 06:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Liam45Click Here to Email Liam45Send a Private Message to Liam45Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:


Might be best to determine if TDC of #1 actually lines up with the timing mark on the balancer by sticking the proper tool (or even a plastic straw) through the spark plug hole.

And if you've changed the timing chain, make sure the valves are rocking at TDC of the exhaust stroke.

Oh no yeah I get ya I used a piston stop prior and it all lined up, I just ordered a new air temp sensor, tested it today and it’s reading very off on the multimeter, I dialed back to -10 today and it solved the code 42. The cars running eh but sensor comes in Wednesday and maybe that will help it out. Setting -10 does idle better no stalling but I think the IAT sensor is messing with my injectors idk just a thought.

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anaverin
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Report this Post01-25-2019 03:06 AM Click Here to See the Profile for anaverinSend a Private Message to anaverinEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Sometimes a bad coil can increase dwell time. I replaced my coil and suddenly i could time the car with the light. Rare but happens

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