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Need a quick easy engine swap for 1984 4 pot in England (Old England not New England) by Noiseman
Started on: 06-28-2015 04:43 PM
Replies: 18 (441 views)
Last post by: Iain on 07-09-2015 09:04 AM
Noiseman
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Report this Post06-28-2015 04:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for NoisemanClick Here to Email NoisemanSend a Private Message to NoisemanEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hi all!
First post here, been lurking for about year now.

I recently managed to blow my (not so) Iron Duke while trying to drive my ´84 from England to Sweden.
Started with a tapping that quickly devoleped into a knocking / clanking / banging then dead!!!!

Here's the question - whats the quickest / easiest / cheapest swap to get this car up and running and on the way to Sweden using bits I can source in the UK?
(It's a 4 speed manual)

I've seen a '92 3800 V6 transsport on ebay

Any help appriciated!!!
Thanks,
Chris
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Doug85GT
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Report this Post06-28-2015 05:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Doug85GTSend a Private Message to Doug85GTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The quickest and cheapest way to get your car back on the road is to put another Duke in there.

If you are talking about a completely different engine swap, you are going to get a lot of opinions. A lot will depend on what skills you have. Can you weld, run electrical wires, do in-depth engine/transmission work, fabricate parts, etc.?
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Gall757
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Report this Post06-28-2015 05:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Gall757Send a Private Message to Gall757Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Welcome to the Forum!

Do you know any more about what happened to your motor?
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Neils88
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Report this Post06-28-2015 06:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Neils88Click Here to Email Neils88Send a Private Message to Neils88Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Noiseman:

I recently managed to blow my (not so) Iron Duke...




 
quote
Originally posted by Noiseman:

Here's the question - whats the quickest / easiest / cheapest swap to get this car up and running and on the way to Sweden using bits I can source in the UK?



Sounds like you want to do the swap on the side of the road... Are you stuck somewhere until it gets fixed?

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Gandalf
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Report this Post06-29-2015 06:36 AM Click Here to See the Profile for GandalfSend a Private Message to GandalfEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I've never managed to get a definitive answer on whether this would work, but some of the Vauxhall/Opel OHC engines were used in the US - specifically the Sunfire Turbo engine. If the bellhousing is the same bolt pattern you should be able to find a 2 litre 8 valve engine from an Astra/Cavalier in the UK which would bolt up to the trans. You'd then need to have engine mounts fabbed and sort out the wiring, but the FI on those engines is quite simple, and certainly on older Astras entirely within the engine compartment.

If the bellhousing is different, then this won't help much!
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Gall757
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Report this Post06-29-2015 09:48 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Gall757Send a Private Message to Gall757Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Gandalf:

I've never managed to get a definitive answer on whether this would work, but some of the Vauxhall/Opel OHC engines were used in the US - specifically the Sunfire Turbo engine. If the bellhousing is the same bolt pattern you should be able to find a 2 litre 8 valve engine from an Astra/Cavalier in the UK which would bolt up to the trans. You'd then need to have engine mounts fabbed and sort out the wiring, but the FI on those engines is quite simple, and certainly on older Astras entirely within the engine compartment.

If the bellhousing is different, then this won't help much!


This graphic says it's different.....but I cannot confirm it's accuracy.

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84fiero123
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Report this Post06-29-2015 10:00 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 84fiero123Click Here to Email 84fiero123Send a Private Message to 84fiero123Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Just drop another duke in there, that is the quickest / easiest / cheapest swap you can do to a car that has the duke in it, or any other engine for that mater nowadays. remember if you change a motor to a different one it is going to need to have its old computer from whatever car it came out of as well as what others have said. Many things are different in an engine swap in any newer cars and believe it or not in my eyes anyway the Fiero engines are the first of the newer engines. That require computer control and there are other things that you will need to do or know when you swap it out with a newer engine or one of a different size anyway.

It ain't like the old days, 60s and 70s when we would just take a 454 out of something and drop it into whatever we wanted, those cars had carburetors and for the most part didn't have any computer controlled engine systems.

Steve

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Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

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Noiseman
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Report this Post06-30-2015 05:43 AM Click Here to See the Profile for NoisemanClick Here to Email NoisemanSend a Private Message to NoisemanEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'm waiting on a reply about geting another duke (whole doner fiero maybe)
Fingers crossed

Interesting about the opel / vauxhaul idea, those cars are really easy to come by over here

About the problem / death of the engine, the car was alternating betwen these two states:-
Engine light on / ticking noise / normal power
Engine light goes off / ticking stops / engine runs rough with low power
Car had new plugs / leads / cap / rotor, oil and coolant levels checked 30 miles previous when refuelling

I didnt have a look under the car close enough to see any damage but there was oil leaking from the firewall side of the engine.
The car was recovered back to my dads place and I hitch hiked to Belgium to work at a festival then booked a flight back to Sweden ( was one hell of a day!!!!)
I'm now looking at flying back to England, fixing the car in the street then driving it to Sweden (where I have space / time / welding gear etc. to swap in a N* / SAAB etc.)

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Gandalf
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Report this Post06-30-2015 06:08 AM Click Here to See the Profile for GandalfSend a Private Message to GandalfEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Where in the country is the car?

I don't know about the transmission that's in it now, but the F23 has the same output splines as a 4spd muncie, if you were thinking the Saab (Ecotec) route, there are fitting kits, however you're almost certainly looking at greater expense than finding a duke and getting it shipped over...
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Noiseman
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Report this Post06-30-2015 06:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for NoisemanClick Here to Email NoisemanSend a Private Message to NoisemanEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Car is in Northwich, not far from Stockport
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Gandalf
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Report this Post06-30-2015 06:41 AM Click Here to See the Profile for GandalfSend a Private Message to GandalfEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Noiseman:

Car is in Northwich, not far from Stockport


Not far at all! When are you in the UK? If there's anything I can help with I'd be happy to!
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Hamster108
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Report this Post06-30-2015 02:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Hamster108Send a Private Message to Hamster108Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Noiseman:

I'm waiting on a reply about geting another duke (whole doner fiero maybe)
Fingers crossed

Interesting about the opel / vauxhaul idea, those cars are really easy to come by over here

About the problem / death of the engine, the car was alternating betwen these two states:-
Engine light on / ticking noise / normal power
Engine light goes off / ticking stops / engine runs rough with low power
Car had new plugs / leads / cap / rotor, oil and coolant levels checked 30 miles previous when refuelling

I didnt have a look under the car close enough to see any damage but there was oil leaking from the firewall side of the engine.
The car was recovered back to my dads place and I hitch hiked to Belgium to work at a festival then booked a flight back to Sweden ( was one hell of a day!!!!)
I'm now looking at flying back to England, fixing the car in the street then driving it to Sweden (where I have space / time / welding gear etc. to swap in a N* / SAAB etc.)


why don't you just scrap it and save yourself the airfare

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Lou6t4gto
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Report this Post06-30-2015 06:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Lou6t4gtoClick Here to Email Lou6t4gtoSend a Private Message to Lou6t4gtoEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
a 1984 ? oil was low, a ROD let go, went through the block. ( that's Common for a 1984 Fiero) Lucky it didn't catch fire. unless a 84 is worth ALOT MORE in England than it is here, I'd "Call it a day". Fix it along side the road ? Not gonna happen.
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Lou6t4gto
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Report this Post06-30-2015 07:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Lou6t4gtoClick Here to Email Lou6t4gtoSend a Private Message to Lou6t4gtoEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Do you have ay previous Experience pulling an engine ?
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Gandalf
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Report this Post07-01-2015 08:07 AM Click Here to See the Profile for GandalfSend a Private Message to GandalfEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Lou6t4gto:

a 1984 ? oil was low, a ROD let go, went through the block. ( that's Common for a 1984 Fiero) Lucky it didn't catch fire. unless a 84 is worth ALOT MORE in England than it is here, I'd "Call it a day". Fix it along side the road ? Not gonna happen.


There are so few here in the UK, there isn't really an established value.

Any fiero which runs and drives and has an MoT on it is worth £1000 I'd say.
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2.5
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Report this Post07-01-2015 11:26 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Noiseman:
Interesting about the opel / I didnt have a look under the car close enough to see any damage but there was oil leaking from the firewall side of the engine.


84...
Good thing you didnt have a fire
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Iain
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Report this Post07-06-2015 06:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for IainSend a Private Message to IainEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Noiseman:

I'm waiting on a reply about geting another duke (whole doner fiero maybe)
Fingers crossed

Interesting about the opel / vauxhaul idea, those cars are really easy to come by over here

About the problem / death of the engine, the car was alternating betwen these two states:-
Engine light on / ticking noise / normal power
Engine light goes off / ticking stops / engine runs rough with low power
Car had new plugs / leads / cap / rotor, oil and coolant levels checked 30 miles previous when refuelling

I didnt have a look under the car close enough to see any damage but there was oil leaking from the firewall side of the engine.
The car was recovered back to my dads place and I hitch hiked to Belgium to work at a festival then booked a flight back to Sweden ( was one hell of a day!!!!)
I'm now looking at flying back to England, fixing the car in the street then driving it to Sweden (where I have space / time / welding gear etc. to swap in a N* / SAAB etc.)


I take it you don't have International Recovery on your Breakdown Insurance? Just saying. Not that I'm suggesting you get it to start, overfill it with thick oil, and drive it on the M way until it dies you understand. No, I'm not suggesting that at all. If I were I'd be telling you to double check all the clauses and qualifying periods/type/ages of cars covered. RTH and not to the nearest garage. But I'm not,... not at all, at all.

The XE2.0 is only 4 wires, I think the later LET 2.0 is 7. I'm sure I have a write up somewhere. Both are 150hp easy, 165 with a decent exhaust.
From what I can gather the 'box splines are the same so an engine/box swap would be best.
Although, if you get it to Sweden, the post '91/92 Saab 2.0/2.3 uses the GM bolt pattern/spline set.
The 2.0 with the T25 will give 275hp with T5 suite. The 2.3 with the TD04 gives 325hp with T5 suite, you can get that engine to 400hp with a hybrid turbo and T5, no internal engine mods, though a head gasket change would be an idea. Biggest problem would be intercooling the thing properly. Have a look on the T5/T7 suite Forum.
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Gandalf
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Report this Post07-06-2015 07:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GandalfSend a Private Message to GandalfEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Good luck finding a C20XE in decent nick though... most have been fitted to Novas and Corsas and driven into trees by now!
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Iain
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Report this Post07-09-2015 09:04 AM Click Here to See the Profile for IainSend a Private Message to IainEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Or Mini's, then the UK Scrappage Scheme took car of most of the rest.
Sweden though, a post '92 Saab engine/box has to be the way to go. Cheap and silly power levels with just a diy ECU reflash.
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