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2.8l timing procedure? by Harold James Kie
Started on: 02-09-2014 04:41 PM
Replies: 20 (5181 views)
Last post by: BrittB on 02-25-2014 12:26 AM
Harold James Kie
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Report this Post02-09-2014 04:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Harold James KieClick Here to Email Harold James KieSend a Private Message to Harold James KieEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I know it has been covered before but I could not find in the archives the subject of proper timing and timing procedure for the 2.8l V6. I timed the engine the usual way - bring number one cylinder to TDC and align the marks on the pulley, jumper the A & B connections on the ALCL and shoot it with the timing light. I advanced it to get it to pass smog and the idle stayed at about 900 rpm. I disconnected the battery to clear any codes (there were none) and then drove the car to get the memory to get things right once again such as the idle speed. I read where it is best to time it from the coil wire, not number one plug wire, and if so what degree of advance should I settle it at and what should the idle speed be? Is it necessary to jumper the ALCL? I appreciate the input from everyone who has an educated and experienced answer and I want to say thanks well in advance.
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TopNotch
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Report this Post02-09-2014 04:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TopNotchClick Here to visit TopNotch's HomePageSend a Private Message to TopNotchEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Click here.
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fierohoho
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Report this Post02-09-2014 05:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierohohoClick Here to Email fierohohoSend a Private Message to fierohohoEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
A shortcut to what TopNotch posted would be to put the timing light pickup on the coil wire at the distributor, that way you see both 1 and 4 firing as the engine runs and adjust the timing marks by turning the distributor until they are equal on either side of the 10 degree mark.
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fierofool
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Report this Post02-09-2014 06:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierofoolClick Here to visit fierofool's HomePageClick Here to Email fierofoolSend a Private Message to fierofoolEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If you put the pickup on the coil wire, you will see all 6 cylinders. I've clamped 1 and 4 plug wires at the same time to do what you're suggesting. You may have to find a wire from another car if you don't have enough slack to pull them together.
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lateFormula
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Report this Post02-09-2014 08:33 PM Click Here to See the Profile for lateFormulaSend a Private Message to lateFormulaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
You can time all six cylinders by clipping the inductive lead of the timing light to the coil lead. Position on the coil lead is irrelevant. The harmonic balancer on the 2.8 has the timing groove cut wider than the other two grooves on the outer ring which are both 120° away from the primary timing mark. The primary timing groove on the balancer will show you the timing on cylinders 1 & 4 while the other two smaller grooves will be lit up for cylinders 2, 3, 5 & 6.
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Report this Post02-10-2014 10:09 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
"Correct timing for a V6 Fiero is 10 degrees BTDC"

Is that best timing, or can more power be had with more advanced timing?
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Patrick
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Report this Post02-10-2014 02:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 2.5:

Is that best timing, or can more power be had with more advanced timing?


It's a compromise between more power and more emissions. Obviously there's a limit to how far advanced the ignition timing can be set before "pinging" will occur, but with all my cars, I time them by ear for power (and for better fuel mileage), and then temporarily back off the timing (to stock specs) for smog testing.

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 02-10-2014).]

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Boostdreamer
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Report this Post02-10-2014 07:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BoostdreamerClick Here to Email BoostdreamerSend a Private Message to BoostdreamerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Automatics are timed in gear. Manuals are not. Find a sidewalk or street curb you can rest against.
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Report this Post02-12-2014 12:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

It's a compromise between more power and more emissions. Obviously there's a limit to how far advanced the ignition timing can be set before "pinging" will occur, but with all my cars, I time them by ear for power (and for better fuel mileage), and then temporarily back off the timing (to stock specs) for smog testing.



Would you happen to know what your degrees are for power on the 2.8 just out of curiosity?
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Patrick
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Report this Post02-12-2014 06:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 2.5:

Would you happen to know what your degrees are for power on the 2.8 just out of curiosity?


What works best for my engines won't necessarily work with anyone else's. Ambient temperature, humidity, carbon build-up in the combustion chambers, octane level of gas, EGR function, etc etc all contribute.

I use regular gas in all my Fieros and the EGR is functional on all of them.

My '84 duke 5-spd has the most power with the timing set right at the top of the inscribed scale (whatever reading that is), although the idle quality suffers a bit. I think my '86 GT automatic is timed pretty high as well, but I honestly forget where it is. However, I notice if I try to time my '88 Formula 5-spd more than an extra 4° above factory timing, it sort of surges if I'm in gear with low revs. I haven't worked all the bugs out of this Formula yet, so I'm hoping I can eventually advance the timing more with no surging (and well before it starts pinging).

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 02-12-2014).]

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Report this Post02-13-2014 10:00 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

What works best for my engines won't necessarily work with anyone else's. Ambient temperature, humidity, carbon build-up in the combustion chambers, octane level of gas, EGR function, etc etc all contribute.

I use regular gas in all my Fieros and the EGR is functional on all of them.

My '84 duke 5-spd has the most power with the timing set right at the top of the inscribed scale (whatever reading that is), although the idle quality suffers a bit. I think my '86 GT automatic is timed pretty high as well, but I honestly forget where it is. However, I notice if I try to time my '88 Formula 5-spd more than an extra 4° above factory timing, it sort of surges if I'm in gear with low revs. I haven't worked all the bugs out of this Formula yet, so I'm hoping I can eventually advance the timing more with no surging (and well before it starts pinging).



I should see if 13 degrees helps my Formula.
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BrittB
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Report this Post02-20-2014 10:34 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BrittBSend a Private Message to BrittBEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
You need to set timing with the automatic in gear? Never heard that before but I'll give it a try. You still need to jump the connectors using all the methods described above correct?
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Gall757
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Report this Post02-20-2014 10:57 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Gall757Send a Private Message to Gall757Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by BrittB:

You need to set timing with the automatic in gear? Never heard that before but I'll give it a try. You still need to jump the connectors using all the methods described above correct?


Never heard that before either. like they say at Wikipedia.....(needs citation).
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css9450
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Report this Post02-20-2014 03:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for css9450Click Here to Email css9450Send a Private Message to css9450Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by BrittB:

You need to set timing with the automatic in gear? Never heard that before but I'll give it a try.


That's what it says on the emissions sticker. Automatic transmission in "D", stick shift in "M". Set brake and block wheels as necessary for safety.

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Gall757
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Report this Post02-20-2014 06:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Gall757Send a Private Message to Gall757Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
So it does......well there is the citation.

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Patrick
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Report this Post02-20-2014 06:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by css9450:

That's what it says on the emissions sticker.


It appears that no one looks at the underside of their decklids.
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BrittB
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Report this Post02-20-2014 09:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BrittBSend a Private Message to BrittBEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Now I've got to go look at mine!
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Report this Post02-21-2014 11:16 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BoostdreamerClick Here to Email BoostdreamerSend a Private Message to BoostdreamerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

It appears that no one looks at the underside of their decklids.


I may have originally gotten that info from my Haynes or more probably right here on the forum. I followed that advice and mine runs well. Yes, you still jump the pins in the ALDL. I also used the Coil wire instead of the individual cylinder wires. Works just fine.

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BrittB
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Report this Post02-21-2014 07:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BrittBSend a Private Message to BrittBEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Dang, I've looked at it and read it a few times but I must have thought not to worry about it. I'll try it out this weekend as I'll have a helper man the wheel/ brake/ trans/ you get the idea!
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BrittB
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Report this Post02-22-2014 08:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BrittBSend a Private Message to BrittBEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Well I did it and the car seems to run really good but it wasn't running that bad to begin with but it was off. Got it set and distributor clamped down so now I start seeing if I notice any difference driving it during the week. I'll also check fuel economy and see if that improves as well.
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BrittB
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Report this Post02-25-2014 12:26 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BrittBSend a Private Message to BrittBEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Drove the car to work today and man it runs WAY better, Imagine that! I always figured that it was just a clapped out doggie V-6 but that little bit of fine tuning shows just how important that extra little bit of fine tuning really is plus it seems to run just a little smoother as well. I should have MPG numbers in a couple days.
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