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Cheaper to build/turbo a 3.4pr or just swap a 3800sc? by chriswf
Started on: 10-22-2013 09:43 PM
Replies: 15 (451 views)
Last post by: BillS on 10-28-2013 04:40 PM
chriswf
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Report this Post10-22-2013 09:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for chriswfClick Here to Email chriswfSend a Private Message to chriswfEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hey guys, it's been a while since I've actively got to participate on the forums... Mostly because talking about Fieros made me sad since I couldn't get one during my divorce.

Now I'm about to swap careers, so I'm getting rid of my Yaris (it was my work car).

Figured I could get a fiero and put some money into it.

I was thinking ~300-350 HP would be ideal.

I can get the 3.4 Pushrod engine for 100-200$, some that are returnable (with a restocking fee) if they don't work.


Would it be cheaper to get a used VGT turbo and build the 3.4 PR engine or just swap it with a 3800sc and do some minor mods?
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darkhorizon
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Report this Post10-22-2013 10:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
the 3.4 will be just as much work.. but if you leave the motor stock and put a crappy turbo setup on... sure it might be cheaper by a few dollars.. but worlds more unreliable.
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nosrac
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Report this Post10-22-2013 10:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
3800SC all the way. Relatively easy swap as you can buy all the swap parts and there are even a few guys in the DFW area that can lend a hand or two.
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JCircs
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Report this Post10-22-2013 10:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Build the 3800sc. It's easier.

------------------

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/087461.html

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RotrexFiero
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Report this Post10-22-2013 11:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RotrexFieroClick Here to visit RotrexFiero's HomePageSend a Private Message to RotrexFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
3800 SC hands down. I did the 3.4 turbo and tuning it was a nightmare. You will spend more time chasing bugs and such. The 3800 is fool proof. Reliable as a brick too.
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Blacktree
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Report this Post10-23-2013 10:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BlacktreeClick Here to visit Blacktree's HomePageClick Here to Email BlacktreeSend a Private Message to BlacktreeEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Personally, I wouldn't do either of those two. But a turbo 3400 / 3500 would interest me.
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hnthomps
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Report this Post10-23-2013 11:14 AM Click Here to See the Profile for hnthompsClick Here to Email hnthompsSend a Private Message to hnthompsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have both engines in my cars and I would recommend the 3800 SC Series II or III engine over the turbo 3.4 push rod engine swap. You will not get anywhere near the desired 300 HP plus range with the turbo 3.4 unless there is a extreme build. With a 3800 SC engine the 300 HP plus range is rather easily achieved with what I believe is a lower cost per HP.

Nelson
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chriswf
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Report this Post10-23-2013 02:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for chriswfClick Here to Email chriswfSend a Private Message to chriswfEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Blacktree:

Personally, I wouldn't do either of those two. But a turbo 3400 / 3500 would interest me.


What exactly would you do then?
By 'interest' did you mean you would swap a 3400/3500?

I saw that guy who hates Archie, cletussux or whatever his name is). He did a 3.4 Hybrid block and it was VERY VERY fast. His dyno numbers were quite impressive for factory internal.

Any specific reason why you wouldn't either the 3800 or 3.4PR?
The 3800 swap would yield TONs of immediate help with how common it is... and its strong on factory internals.

Let me know, that was a very short comment.

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MstangsBware
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Report this Post10-23-2013 07:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MstangsBwareClick Here to Email MstangsBwareSend a Private Message to MstangsBwareEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
3800SC and thats a wrap.....If u want to go outside the box then the 3500 is an interesting swap. Motors r plentyful an cheap...

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Blacktree
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Report this Post10-24-2013 10:50 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BlacktreeClick Here to visit Blacktree's HomePageClick Here to Email BlacktreeSend a Private Message to BlacktreeEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by chriswf:

What exactly would you do then?
By 'interest' did you mean you would swap a 3400/3500?

I have to admit, I'm biased. I prefer the 60-degree V6 over the 90-degree V6. I guess you can chalk that up to personality quirk.

Plus, when building a boosted 60-degree V6, the 3400 or 3500 is a better starting point than the 2.8 or 3.4. The bottom end is stronger. It has a roller camshaft. And the aluminum heads flow better (and can handle more boost without detonation).

That said, both the 60-degree and 90-degree swaps are going to take a lot of work. The 60-degree will bolt in pretty easy, but will require a lot of tweaking and tuning to get that turbo running right. The 3800SC will take a bunch of work to install, but won't need much tuning. So it's basically six one way, half a dozen the other.

[This message has been edited by Blacktree (edited 10-24-2013).]

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Slowbuild
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Report this Post10-24-2013 12:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SlowbuildSend a Private Message to SlowbuildEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have a 3.4T and it was a lot of work to build. It was my first, so I learned a lot. It requires learning about turbo sizing, tuning, etc etc.

I suspect the 3800SC would be a lot easier from a learning perspective, given a stock ecm will work. No modifications to the base engine are required, etc. I have to believe if you find a complete car it will be cheaper as well.


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iluvsd619
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Report this Post10-25-2013 02:37 AM Click Here to See the Profile for iluvsd619Click Here to Email iluvsd619Send a Private Message to iluvsd619Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
3800sc first. Then remove the supercharger and put a turbo later on if you really wanna get crazy with it!
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NetCam
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Report this Post10-25-2013 09:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for NetCamClick Here to visit NetCam's HomePageSend a Private Message to NetCamEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
3800sc all the way!
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chriswf
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Report this Post10-25-2013 09:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for chriswfClick Here to Email chriswfSend a Private Message to chriswfEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yeah, Ive heard you can (maybe unreliably) push that 3.8 to 500hp.
We'll see. I might have wait on a swap - but I can get some kind of Fiero now at least. The fiero would become my DD for a while.
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VF1Skullangel
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Report this Post10-26-2013 05:41 AM Click Here to See the Profile for VF1SkullangelClick Here to visit VF1Skullangel's HomePageClick Here to Email VF1SkullangelSend a Private Message to VF1SkullangelEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It would depend on what 3.4 your going with. The Camaro engine is a very up front swap. But if your going with the DOHC that's a little more expensive to do and more difficult.

The 3800 is going to be the best bet. Might be more expensive but worth it.
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BillS
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Report this Post10-28-2013 04:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BillSClick Here to Email BillSSend a Private Message to BillSEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
These guys are speaking the truth. The 3.8 is an easy project.

Turboing the 3.4 on the cheap is like shooting yourself in the foot - it won't last and it probably won't run properly without a lot of fussing about. Doing it right will be expensive.
I turboed my 88 GT back in 1991 and I did it so that it would be dead reliable while pumping 10--12 psi. It's been going strong for the last 22 years. But I spent close to $3K on the turbo stuff and another $4K on engine parts and suspension upgrades - special forged pistons, custom camshaft, roller rockers...a long list.

The 'turbo on the cheap' crowd amazes me. They either get poor results or blow the engine up or both.

Do it right and the result is great - about 300 BHP on mine and probably a bit more on a 3.4, but unless you are a purist, go the cheaper way and stick a Buick in.
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