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Bleeding the brakes by RilesOfSmiles
Started on: 09-02-2013 12:29 AM
Replies: 20 (1141 views)
Last post by: jaskispyder on 09-06-2013 08:46 AM
RilesOfSmiles
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Report this Post09-02-2013 12:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for RilesOfSmilesClick Here to Email RilesOfSmilesSend a Private Message to RilesOfSmilesEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
So I decided it was time to change my rear brake calipers because they are partially seized. So I crimped the brake line with some vice grips with some tubing covering the ends so I didn't damage the line. I then took the old caliper off and put the new one on with new pads. I reconnected the brake line. I put some tubing on the bleeder screw that led to a jar partially filled with brake fluid with the other end of the tubing submerged in it. I cracked the bleeder screw and took the vice grips of the brake line. After an epic bleeding saga I still have no brakes. I hooked up a vacuum bleeder and I'm pulling a lot of air from the lines. What did I do wrong? And where should I go from here? This is the left rear caliper and the car is an 86 GT.
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trotterlg
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Report this Post09-02-2013 01:17 AM Click Here to See the Profile for trotterlgClick Here to Email trotterlgSend a Private Message to trotterlgEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Don't open the bleed too far or it will suck air around the threads. Open it just enough to let air out (which isn't much). I just did the rear of an 86 and it was dead easy. If you open one side you need to blead both sides. Larry

[This message has been edited by trotterlg (edited 09-02-2013).]

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85 SE VIN 9
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Report this Post09-02-2013 06:40 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 85 SE VIN 9Click Here to Email 85 SE VIN 9Send a Private Message to 85 SE VIN 9Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Do you have fluid in the master cylinder reservoir? It sounds like you may have bled it all out. It doesn't take very long for that to happen. You probably need to fill the back half of the reservoir with new fluid.
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Dotrenrew
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Report this Post09-02-2013 10:09 AM Click Here to See the Profile for DotrenrewClick Here to visit Dotrenrew's HomePageClick Here to Email DotrenrewSend a Private Message to DotrenrewEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I "globbed" a bunch of gear grease around the threads of my bleeder screws to prevent air from getting sucked in. It worked like a charm.

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Report this Post09-02-2013 10:20 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jimbolayaClick Here to Email jimbolayaSend a Private Message to jimbolayaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 85 SE VIN 9:

Do you have fluid in the master cylinder reservoir? It sounds like you may have bled it all out. It doesn't take very long for that to happen. You probably need to fill the back half of the reservoir with new fluid.


This was my first thought. Are you filling the reservoir of the master cylinder, as you bleed? If not, you're just sucking in more air. I've done it, just because I plain old forgot. It's easy to do, forget that is.

Jim

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RilesOfSmiles
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Report this Post09-02-2013 03:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RilesOfSmilesClick Here to Email RilesOfSmilesSend a Private Message to RilesOfSmilesEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
So I got the caliper working and I hopped in to start it up. I put my foot on the brake and it went right to the floor. The brakes work but I have to pump them to stop. I'm guessing I have to bleed all four wheels but I don't really know how. I know the order is LR, RR, RF, LF but I'm not completely sure on the bleeding procedure. Anyone know how to do it or have a link to a page that explains it in detail?
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Report this Post09-02-2013 05:23 PM Click Here to See the Profile for theogreClick Here to visit theogre's HomePageSend a Private Message to theogreEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Repair on rear then bleed rear only should work.

You likely:
Air in rear.
Air in MC. You can try jacking rear so MC is level but many time bench bleed is needed.
Damage the MC. Pedal bleed can wreck a corroded MC.

Start at See my Cave, Brake Service etc.

 
quote
Originally posted by Dotrenrew:
I "globbed" a bunch of gear grease around the threads of my bleeder screws to prevent air from getting sucked in. It worked like a charm.

Brake grease, OK.
Normal grease can be problems. Never use oil/grease that gets on brake rubber parts.

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RilesOfSmiles
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Report this Post09-02-2013 08:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RilesOfSmilesClick Here to Email RilesOfSmilesSend a Private Message to RilesOfSmilesEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I bled all four wheels and it didn't work. In fact its even worse now. And the new caliper is clunking. I don't know what to do I'm so exhausted. They still work if I pump them but if I just press on the brake once it goes right to the floor and doesn't stop the car in first gear. I don't get it I put on the new caliper and bled that wheel. It didn't work. So I bled the other side too and it seemed to work but when I started it up I had almost no brakes.
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jimmo
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Report this Post09-02-2013 08:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jimmoClick Here to Email jimmoSend a Private Message to jimmoEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Are you still extracting mostly air, as you stated in the original post, or are ya getting plenty of brake fluid out when ya bleed it?
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RilesOfSmiles
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Report this Post09-02-2013 10:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RilesOfSmilesClick Here to Email RilesOfSmilesSend a Private Message to RilesOfSmilesEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'm getting plenty of brake fluid on all 4 wheels. In fact it looked like it was just straight fluid thats why I thought it was bled. Until I put the car down and had no brakes. I also noticed the new caliper isn't pressing the pad against the rotor. Like there is no fluid in it but when I press the brake pedal it pushes the piston out and I get straight fluid from the bleeder. Then when I let the brake pedal out the piston completely retracts and pulls the brake pad away from the rotor.

I shouldn't be surprised with a remanufactured part. It also has the wrong piston type and a different size bleeder screw. I got it from O'Reilly auto parts and its not just a fluke, their computer shows its supposed to be like that. I had to modify the pad to make it fit correctly.
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jimmo
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Report this Post09-02-2013 10:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jimmoClick Here to Email jimmoSend a Private Message to jimmoEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yea rebuilt calipers are a crap shoot. This might be a silly question but did ya try pumping the e-brake handle to self adjust the piston? In theory the piston should have stayed out by pumping the pedal but it sounds like it may not have been rebuilt correctly.
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RilesOfSmiles
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Report this Post09-02-2013 10:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RilesOfSmilesClick Here to Email RilesOfSmilesSend a Private Message to RilesOfSmilesEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
E-brake doesn't work the cable seems to be seized so it's not connected. I did manually move the lever on the caliper though and it pushed the piston out but when I let go it retracted completely again.
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85 SE VIN 9
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Report this Post09-03-2013 07:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 85 SE VIN 9Click Here to Email 85 SE VIN 9Send a Private Message to 85 SE VIN 9Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It may be working correctly. I think you should take the e-brake lever off and turn the screw until the pads are essentially touching the rotor, then put the ebrake lever back on. The clunking is likely the caliper sliding a long way and the same for the pedal going to the floor; the pistons may be going much further than intended. Btw, most people have trouble getting new pads and rotors to fit. Are you using worn pads and/or rotors? Fiero brake repairs have a way of escalating, but if you're going to the trouble of replacing the calipers you might as well have good rotors and pads for them to act on.

Also btw, people shouldn't be so pessimistic about Fiero brakes. While Fiero owners are upgrading their brakes, other people are using Fiero brakes to upgrade other vehicles. There is a post somewhere by a Bronco owner explaining how to rebuild Fiero rear brake pistons. I wish I could find it because it doesn't sound so bad, let alone impossible.
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crashyoung
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Report this Post09-03-2013 08:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for crashyoungClick Here to Email crashyoungSend a Private Message to crashyoungEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Did you put the calipers on the correct sides?
If they are reversed, the bleeders are on the bottom,
and you will never get the air out of the system.
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jimmo
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Report this Post09-03-2013 08:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jimmoClick Here to Email jimmoSend a Private Message to jimmoEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I found the bronco link here.. http://classicbroncos.com/reardiscs.shtml

I actually rebuilt mine a while back following this and it wasnt that bad. Not that you should have to rebuild a rebuilt caliper but Im just wondering if the reman company forgot to do something in there. If in fact the ratchet action inside is stuck, it might be whats causing your issues.
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RilesOfSmiles
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Report this Post09-03-2013 10:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RilesOfSmilesClick Here to Email RilesOfSmilesSend a Private Message to RilesOfSmilesEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The caliper is on the correct side. I bought 2 new calipers to do both rears and new pads. The new caliper for the right side has the same type of piston and bleeder screw as the old caliper but the new one on the left side does not. In fact I had to grind down a little nodule on the back of the pad to make it sit correctly against the piston. I was told when I pumped the brakes the caliper would fill with fluid and the piston would stay out. There is fluid in the caliper and when I bled it I got fluid out with no bubbles but when I'm not pressing the brake pedal the piston isn't out at all. When I press the brake pedal the piston travels a good third of an inch before the pad makes contact with the rotor.

Could it be I'm not getting brake pressure be because the piston has to travel so far and there isn't enough fluid in the system to do that?
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trotterlg
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Report this Post09-03-2013 11:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for trotterlgClick Here to Email trotterlgSend a Private Message to trotterlgEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Read the part about taking off the e-break lever and truning the screw down, you are just running out of fluid from the master cylinder stroke, those pads shoul only have to move about .020 inch to work. Larry
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RilesOfSmiles
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Report this Post09-05-2013 02:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RilesOfSmilesClick Here to Email RilesOfSmilesSend a Private Message to RilesOfSmilesEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
O I took a ratchet and turned the parking brake lever a few times to pump the piston and it stayed out! My brakes work again! Thanks everybody!
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85 SE VIN 9
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Report this Post09-05-2013 07:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 85 SE VIN 9Click Here to Email 85 SE VIN 9Send a Private Message to 85 SE VIN 9Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks for telling us! It's good to know the outcome, especially for people searching. Your thread will probably be viewed many times because it has a good descriptive title.

Thanks jimmo for the Bronco post! Yes, that's the one. I already bought the kit.
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Turrent
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Report this Post09-05-2013 08:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TurrentClick Here to Email TurrentSend a Private Message to TurrentEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The absolutely neatest trick to bleeding i can offer is get a hose that is actually tight around the bleeder nipple. make sure its like a foot or so long tie a loose knot in the hose. open the bleeder a quarter turn and slowly pump the brakes. This will chase out the air. and you won't need anyone else cause due to the knot the air wont be able to chase back up the hose. . I bled all 4 calipers and the master this way. Also to note you need to to depress the brakes fully to ensure your pushing air PAST the knot.
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jaskispyder
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Report this Post09-06-2013 08:46 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jaskispyderSend a Private Message to jaskispyderEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Turrent:

The absolutely neatest trick to bleeding i can offer is get a hose that is actually tight around the bleeder nipple. make sure its like a foot or so long tie a loose knot in the hose. open the bleeder a quarter turn and slowly pump the brakes. This will chase out the air. and you won't need anyone else cause due to the knot the air wont be able to chase back up the hose. . I bled all 4 calipers and the master this way. Also to note you need to to depress the brakes fully to ensure your pushing air PAST the knot.


Yup, that works. I also just setup a bottle to collect the fluid. I use clear hose to see what is going on and look for air. But, sometimes the bleeder threads will leak and it is still best to have someone help out in those cases.


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