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Ecotech Swap by Pyrthian
Started on: 07-24-2013 02:06 PM
Replies: 9 (444 views)
Last post by: akademikjeanius on 07-26-2013 10:27 AM
Pyrthian
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Report this Post07-24-2013 02:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PyrthianClick Here to Email PyrthianSend a Private Message to PyrthianEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have a built up 3.1, with 7730, DIS, headers, 4 speed manual, ported heads & intakes, etc
it may be time to drop the cradle again, may have a piston with broken ring, and I am thinking, maybe swapping to a Ecotech + Turbo
while the 3.1 was fun - it really is lacking compared to modern motors.
looking for a broad overview of what I'll be in for. Have not looked into Ecotechs at all.
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lateFormula
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Report this Post07-24-2013 05:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for lateFormulaSend a Private Message to lateFormulaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Start with the 2.4 liter LE5 motor. Add one of these turbo kits: http://www.turbo-kits.com/solstice_turbo_kits.html . Mate it to an F35 5 speed transmission. Smile.

Like any other engine transplant, you'll have to fabricate engine and transmission mounts, and of course fab up an exhaust. What area of Detroit are you located? I'm in one of the SE Oakland county suburbs and if you seriously start this, I'd like to pay you a visit and see how it all comes together. Personally I think a boosted Ecotec is a good build option because the engine is fairly compact and could make good power. I've seen a couple Ecotec swaps started on this forum, but have not seen a completed one with all the details as to engine mounts, exhaust, etc.
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thesameguy
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Report this Post07-24-2013 06:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for thesameguyClick Here to Email thesameguySend a Private Message to thesameguyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Out of curiosity, why do you recommend starting with the 2.4 instead of, say, just pulling an entire drivetrain out of a Saab 9-3 and plopping it in a Fiero?

[This message has been edited by thesameguy (edited 07-24-2013).]

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Scottzilla79
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Report this Post07-24-2013 09:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Scottzilla79Send a Private Message to Scottzilla79Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I think the LE5 is recommended because the electronics are simpler to work with than the newer ones.
A few members have completed ecotec swaps. Search will pull up a plenty of threads. try ecotec and ecotech.
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lateFormula
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Report this Post07-24-2013 09:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for lateFormulaSend a Private Message to lateFormulaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My suggestions were biased for what I would do. I would choose the 2.4L Ecotec for a few reasons over the 2.0 turbo in the Saabs or the Cobalt or HHR SS models. Yes the 2.0 LNF engine is a stout performer, but it is limited by the direct injection. I would choose the 2.4 LE5 just because there are so many of them out there, I'm sure they can be gotten cheaply from a wrecking yard. Most of the LE5 engines had port injection on the intake manifold. So if you add boost to the engine, you won't be limited in your ability to increase the injector size to match the amount of air you are pumping into the engine. Plus the LE5 has a larger displacement. The 2.0 LNF makes 130HP per liter of displacement, so if you can produce the same power level in a 2.4 liter engine, that engine will give you 312HP, 50HP more than the LNF.

That is why I would choose the LE5. Your mileage may vary...
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Pyrthian
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Report this Post07-25-2013 10:42 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PyrthianClick Here to Email PyrthianSend a Private Message to PyrthianEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by lateFormula:
Start with the 2.4 liter LE5 motor. Add one of these turbo kits: http://www.turbo-kits.com/solstice_turbo_kits.html . Mate it to an F35 5 speed transmission. Smile.

Like any other engine transplant, you'll have to fabricate engine and transmission mounts, and of course fab up an exhaust. What area of Detroit are you located? I'm in one of the SE Oakland county suburbs and if you seriously start this, I'd like to pay you a visit and see how it all comes together. Personally I think a boosted Ecotec is a good build option because the engine is fairly compact and could make good power. I've seen a couple Ecotec swaps started on this forum, but have not seen a completed one with all the details as to engine mounts, exhaust, etc.


this sounds like where I want to go.
I am not familear with the motor families - what would I find a LE5 in?

the turbo that I have to use is from the old ford mustang/thunderbird 2.3 turbos.

I am at 9 & Gratiot. PM if ya wanna come by & talk shop
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thesameguy
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Report this Post07-25-2013 01:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for thesameguyClick Here to Email thesameguySend a Private Message to thesameguyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by lateFormula:

My suggestions were biased for what I would do. I would choose the 2.4L Ecotec for a few reasons over the 2.0 turbo in the Saabs or the Cobalt or HHR SS models. Yes the 2.0 LNF engine is a stout performer, but it is limited by the direct injection. I would choose the 2.4 LE5 just because there are so many of them out there, I'm sure they can be gotten cheaply from a wrecking yard. Most of the LE5 engines had port injection on the intake manifold. So if you add boost to the engine, you won't be limited in your ability to increase the injector size to match the amount of air you are pumping into the engine. Plus the LE5 has a larger displacement. The 2.0 LNF makes 130HP per liter of displacement, so if you can produce the same power level in a 2.4 liter engine, that engine will give you 312HP, 50HP more than the LNF.


I agree about the DI headaches, but that's why I suggested the Saab motor... it's not an LNF. It's a port-injected 2.0l - just a bog-standard LES that's be destroked plus some head work, upgraded rotating assembly, and under-piston oil squirters. Seems like an optimal motor! Early versions used Saab's proprietary Trionic 8, but later versions (>2006 IIRC) use Motronic.

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akademikjeanius
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Report this Post07-26-2013 12:20 AM Click Here to See the Profile for akademikjeaniusSend a Private Message to akademikjeaniusEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
How is the DI a major issue considering the fact that it's limitations aren't reached until some point after achieveing "...over 450 ft lbs of torque and more than 500whp at 6000 rpms..." (per ZZP thorough testing). At that point, the entire car itself becomes the limiting factor. Furthermore, this "limitation" on the DI has been resolved via cam upgrade.

Furthermore:

LNF MATERIALS
Block: 319 Aluminum
Cylinder head: Semi-permanent-mold 356 Al cylinder head
Intake manifold: Aluminum
Exhaust manifold: Cast stainless steel
Crankshaft: forged steel
Camshaft: cast nodular iron
Connecting rods: forged steel
Additional features: DI ( direct injection )
Dual-scroll turbocharger
Dual CVCP ( continuously variable cam phasing )
Sodium-filled Iconel exhaust valves
cast pistons with oil squirters
forged connecting rods
steel crankshaft

LE5 MATERIALS
Block: cast aluminum
Cylinder head: cast aluminum
Intake manifold: composite
Exhaust manifold: high silicon molybdenum, cast nodular iron
Main bearing caps: aluminum bedplate
Crankshaft: cast nodular iron
Camshaft: cast nodular iron
Connecting rods: forged steel

Guess it comes down to what you want to do: front end (all inclusive more costly setup w/ minor out-of-pocket on upgrades to see major hp/tq increases) or back-end (cheaper to install but more costly to upgrade for big hp/tq improvements).
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Pyrthian
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Report this Post07-26-2013 09:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PyrthianClick Here to Email PyrthianSend a Private Message to PyrthianEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
while the LNF does sound good - I think its gonna be a tough find being so new, and in so few models.

I am sticking with the LE5 idea. Seems like it'll be a reasonably easy junkyard find. I am thinking finding one with attached 5 speed manual trans will be a bit tougher.

[This message has been edited by Pyrthian (edited 07-26-2013).]

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akademikjeanius
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Report this Post07-26-2013 10:27 AM Click Here to See the Profile for akademikjeaniusSend a Private Message to akademikjeaniusEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Pyrthian:

while the LNF does sound good - I think its gonna be a tough find being so new.

I am sticking with the LE5 idea. Seems like it'll be a reasonably easy junkyard find. I am thinking finding one with attached 5 speed manual trans will be a bit tougher.


Good luck.
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