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f40 swap ........axles? by organik
Started on: 08-08-2012 05:23 PM
Replies: 15 (911 views)
Last post by: Will on 02-11-2014 11:49 AM
organik
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Report this Post08-08-2012 05:23 PM Click Here to See the Profile for organikClick Here to Email organikSend a Private Message to organikEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
well im going with a series 2 3.8 sc and an f40 tranny from a g6gt 07' or newer so its a 5+1 not a 4+2, anywho what axels should i use? and will they work with the stock fiero hubs? ive heard axles out of a cobalt ss fit but i have no idea
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Report this Post02-09-2014 03:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mitchjl22Click Here to Email mitchjl22Send a Private Message to mitchjl22Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
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FIEROFLYER
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Report this Post02-09-2014 04:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FIEROFLYERSend a Private Message to FIEROFLYEREdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Jack shaft from a Saab 9-3 or 9-5 and axles from an 06 Cobalt SS the SC car with the F23 MU3 tranny will work but you need to shift the drive train about an inch to the pass side to keep axles even on both sides. Done this three times now and worked out fine each time. Dan

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organik
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Report this Post02-09-2014 10:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for organikClick Here to Email organikSend a Private Message to organikEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Actually I went with an ls4 motor built with high compression should be 500 HP ish will this set up still take that power? And still work with the f40 application?
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organik
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Report this Post02-09-2014 10:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for organikClick Here to Email organikSend a Private Message to organikEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

organik

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Thanks for the bump Mitch
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Joseph Upson
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Report this Post02-10-2014 12:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Joseph UpsonClick Here to Email Joseph UpsonSend a Private Message to Joseph UpsonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by FIEROFLYER:

Jack shaft from a Saab 9-3 or 9-5 and axles from an 06 Cobalt SS the SC car with the F23 MU3 tranny will work but you need to shift the drive train about an inch to the pass side to keep axles even on both sides. Done this three times now and worked out fine each time. Dan



For an HO LS4 you better look at stronger axles the 06 cobalt axles I believe have a taper going into the joint that results in frequent failures under high loads. The turbo models got the stronger axles, otherwise you may want to try to find a G6 passenger side assembly which has a stronger axle and have a custom driver side made.

[This message has been edited by Joseph Upson (edited 02-10-2014).]

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Report this Post02-10-2014 03:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by organik:

Actually I went with an ls4 motor built with high compression should be 500 HP ish will this set up still take that power? And still work with the f40 application?


Do you have a lot of spare time and the appropriate tools, or a lot of money to pay someone else to do the work for you?

The LS4 is nice, but getting 500 HP out of it isn't happening with just a bit of a compression increase or cam swap. And getting one running properly and mated to a manual transmission is a huge amount of work, as they never came from the factory with a manual trans.
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fieroguru
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Report this Post02-10-2014 03:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by organik:

Actually I went with an ls4 motor built with high compression should be 500 HP ish will this set up still take that power? And still work with the f40 application?


Then you can't use the cobalt SS axles.

The only reason they work with the 3800 is there is room to move the engine over to the passenger side. No room for such a move with the LS4 as the DS one is nearly 2" too long and the other one is still way too short. I made a custom tripod housing so I could use a stock 96 corsica axle on the DS, then modified the saab intermediate shaft to be about 1 3/8" longer so I could use the stock G6 F40 DS axle on the PS.
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Report this Post02-10-2014 03:33 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

fieroguru

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quote
Originally posted by dobey:


Do you have a lot of spare time and the appropriate tools, or a lot of money to pay someone else to do the work for you?

The LS4 is nice, but getting 500 HP out of it isn't happening with just a bit of a compression increase or cam swap. And getting one running properly and mated to a manual transmission is a huge amount of work, as they never came from the factory with a manual trans.


500 fwhp is possible (L33's have dynod 505 hp on an engine dyno). But it will require MAF, TB, Intake, DOD delete, pretty large camshaft, significant head work, and some very good headers.

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[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 02-10-2014).]

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Report this Post02-10-2014 04:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fieroguru:
500 fwhp is possible (L33's have dynod 505 hp on an engine dyno). But it will require MAF, TB, Intake, DOD delete, pretty large camshaft, significant head work, and some very good headers.


Yes. But it's not a simple milling of 0.030 off the heads and throwing a cam in, like it is on the more powerful LS engines. It's a significant undertaking. I don't want the OP to think he's going to make 500 HP because he got an LS4 that is "high compression" (whatever that means, since it's already like 10.2:1 stock).
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Bill Boettinger
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Report this Post02-11-2014 12:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Bill BoettingerSend a Private Message to Bill BoettingerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have read most of the threads on here regarding swapping the F40 into the Fiero. I've had my 3.4 DOHC swapped into my Fiero since 1997 and it is mounted in the same mounts as the 2.8 that it replaced (it has a 4T60E transaxle currently). I have purchased the right-side half-shaft and jackshaft from a 2005 9-5 manual Saab. Could someone tell me the following:

1) What is the compressed half shaft distance for the driver's (left) axle shaft while still allowing "mid-tripod" travel with the car sitting level.
2) What would be the same distance for the passenger's side (right) with the use of the above mentioned jack shaft with the same boundary condition listed above.

I know that several people on here have done extensive research in this area and that several of them have replied to this thread, so I would just like to be able to calculate before I hack (machine).

One last thing, has anyone tried using a Firebird 3.4 flywheel with the ring gear register machined off and using a neutral balance flexplate between the crank and flywheel for the starter? I know that the flywheel would need an extra 0.105" off the clutch face, but has this been tried?
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Report this Post02-11-2014 07:22 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Joseph UpsonClick Here to Email Joseph UpsonSend a Private Message to Joseph UpsonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Bill Boettinger:

I have read most of the threads on here regarding swapping the F40 into the Fiero. I've had my 3.4 DOHC swapped into my Fiero since 1997 and it is mounted in the same mounts as the 2.8 that it replaced (it has a 4T60E transaxle currently). I have purchased the right-side half-shaft and jackshaft from a 2005 9-5 manual Saab. Could someone tell me the following:

1) What is the compressed half shaft distance for the driver's (left) axle shaft while still allowing "mid-tripod" travel with the car sitting level.
2) What would be the same distance for the passenger's side (right) with the use of the above mentioned jack shaft with the same boundary condition listed above.

I know that several people on here have done extensive research in this area and that several of them have replied to this thread, so I would just like to be able to calculate before I hack (machine).

One last thing, has anyone tried using a Firebird 3.4 flywheel with the ring gear register machined off and using a neutral balance flexplate between the crank and flywheel for the starter? I know that the flywheel would need an extra 0.105" off the clutch face, but has this been tried?


Check your pm
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organik
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Report this Post02-11-2014 08:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for organikClick Here to Email organikSend a Private Message to organikEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I've had the head port matched an polished will soon be ordering a very aggressive cam, roller valve train, and all custom made forged internals I should be right around 12.5-1 comp ratio, I can't say for sure I'm gonna hit my 500hp goal but I'm sure as hell gonna try, and the day she gets tuned I'll post the dyno print out, my friend helping with this project is a machinist so any thing we need he can make like a custom fly wheel and solid motor mounts alternator recolatikn bracket ect......
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Report this Post02-11-2014 09:46 AM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by organik:
I've had the head port matched an polished will soon be ordering a very aggressive cam, roller valve train, and all custom made forged internals I should be right around 12.5-1 comp ratio


Oh. Are you planning on running on E85 or race gas too? On pump 93 you're probably going to have to pull the timing.
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organik
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Report this Post02-11-2014 09:48 AM Click Here to See the Profile for organikClick Here to Email organikSend a Private Message to organikEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yeah e85
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Will
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Report this Post02-11-2014 11:49 AM Click Here to See the Profile for WillClick Here to Email WillSend a Private Message to WillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by organik:

I've had the head port matched an polished will soon be ordering a very aggressive cam, roller valve train, and all custom made forged internals I should be right around 12.5-1 comp ratio, I can't say for sure I'm gonna hit my 500hp goal but I'm sure as hell gonna try, and the day she gets tuned I'll post the dyno print out, my friend helping with this project is a machinist so any thing we need he can make like a custom fly wheel and solid motor mounts alternator recolatikn bracket ect......


I don't think you're going to get to 500 with the stock intake and exhaust manifolds either.
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