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Just another 3800SC Swap by slideways
Started on: 04-30-2012 01:55 PM
Replies: 104 (3441 views)
Last post by: Lou and Blue on 05-17-2014 02:16 PM
slideways
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Report this Post04-30-2012 01:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
To start, been a fan of the site for years but I wanted to wait till I had something to contribute before I joined. Been saving up and gathering parts the last 2 years and I'm just about ready to start making some real progress and hopefully get this thing driving in the next few months.

Heres the plan:
-3800 Series II supercharged into my 86' 2M4 using the Fiero's Isuzu 5 speed with a Spec 4+ and aluminum flywheel (until I grenade the thing or find a cheap F40)

Here's a few pics of the progress:





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Report this Post04-30-2012 04:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MstangsBwareClick Here to Email MstangsBwareSend a Private Message to MstangsBwareEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Looks like you are missing some flywheel bolts unless you added after the picture was taken...Also go F-23 in the future.......No reason to waste money on the F40


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Report this Post04-30-2012 05:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Good observation, just wanted to test fit the FW. Got some new bolts on the way from WCF along with some other goodies... I will look into the F-23 while I'm at it, I know the Isuzu isn't the best option, I dont know of that many people using them or how it will hold up over time.
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Report this Post04-30-2012 08:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MstangsBwareClick Here to Email MstangsBwareSend a Private Message to MstangsBwareEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by slideways:

Good observation, just wanted to test fit the FW. Got some new bolts on the way from WCF along with some other goodies... I will look into the F-23 while I'm at it, I know the Isuzu isn't the best option, I dont know of that many people using them or how it will hold up over time.


Before ordering parts from WCF....Ask or search here for needed parts....I am 99% sure myself or others can tell you where to get them cheaper......
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Report this Post04-30-2012 08:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
...and faster.

------------------
Turbo 3800 E85 5spd spec5
11.54@132.7

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Report this Post04-30-2012 08:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Tom SlickClick Here to Email Tom SlickSend a Private Message to Tom SlickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by MstangsBware:


Before ordering parts from WCF....Ask or search here for needed parts....I am 99% sure myself or others can tell you where to get them cheaper......


really, where?

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Report this Post04-30-2012 08:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MstangsBwareClick Here to Email MstangsBwareSend a Private Message to MstangsBwareEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Tom Slick:


really, where?


I will tell u when the time is right....
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Report this Post04-30-2012 09:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Tom SlickClick Here to Email Tom SlickSend a Private Message to Tom SlickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by MstangsBware:
I will tell u when the time is right....

that time better be before blake's time...
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slideways
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Report this Post04-30-2012 10:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Good to know. The more money I save, the faster the car goes. Only ordered the basics from WCF: brackets, coils, pulleys ect. I will attempt to build/hack as much as I can but hopefully what I cant tackle myself I can find on here. Cough cough.... wiring harness and tuning.. cough.
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Report this Post04-30-2012 10:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike GonzalezClick Here to Email Mike GonzalezSend a Private Message to Mike GonzalezEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
There are several of us on here that can build your harness for you, or help you out along the way if you tackle it yourself. PM me when you're ready to get started on it !
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Report this Post04-30-2012 10:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for spartan_chazClick Here to Email spartan_chazSend a Private Message to spartan_chazEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
very cool man! I just got my 3800SC and am starting to save the money for everything. I am tearing my engine down tomorrow and hope to get a build thread started. So i will be keeping my eye on this thread for tips and trick
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Report this Post04-30-2012 11:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for cam-a-lotSend a Private Message to cam-a-lotEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
take it from a guy who just blew up his tranny.... go get an F23 so you don't have to pull the darn engine/trans again in a few months. If you are going to baby the car to avoid trans problems, then why bother putting a high HP motor into it

Good luck with the swap. I love my SC...better on gas than the 2.8 and double the power!
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Report this Post05-01-2012 10:25 AM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by cam-a-lot:

take it from a guy who just blew up his tranny.... go get an F23 so you don't have to pull the darn engine/trans again in a few months. If you are going to baby the car to avoid trans problems, then why bother putting a high HP motor into it

Good luck with the swap. I love my SC...better on gas than the 2.8 and double the power!


Point taken. But that's a tough call for me right now since I already have the clutch and the mounts for the Isuzu. If I could verify the spline on the clutch disk matches the F-23 I'd consider it right now. But than I've also got to look into shifter linkage and axles... Also, I am the original owner with 107km on the odometer, ive been nice to the tranny and changed the gear oil a few times. But upping the hp from 90 to 300+ brings up some obvious concerns
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Report this Post05-01-2012 10:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike GonzalezClick Here to Email Mike GonzalezSend a Private Message to Mike GonzalezEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I ran the isuzu on my L67 for a couple years, only change to the 65e-hd because of the low gear ratios of the 5 speed. 1st and 2nd gear were about useless.
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Report this Post05-01-2012 10:31 AM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by spartan_chaz:

very cool man! I just got my 3800SC and am starting to save the money for everything. I am tearing my engine down tomorrow and hope to get a build thread started. So i will be keeping my eye on this thread for tips and trick


Good luck with the swap, I'm happy to answer any questions I can. We've both got lots of work ahead!
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Report this Post05-01-2012 10:44 AM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Mike Gonzalez:

I ran the isuzu on my L67 for a couple years, only change to the 65e-hd because of the low gear ratios of the 5 speed. 1st and 2nd gear were about useless.


That's good news, I'm hoping if I can restrain myself from WOT until 3rd I won't tear up the gears but I don't want to baby the thing. I can live the the high ratios as I don't plan on any long hwy trips. But I hear ya, 1st gear must get annoying
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Report this Post05-01-2012 10:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Mike Gonzalez:

There are several of us on here that can build your harness for you, or help you out along the way if you tackle it yourself. PM me when you're ready to get started on it !


And thanks, I planned to tackle it myself but I want to avoid the headaches if I can. I have no prob snipping and soldering but it's the pin connectors and connecting to the chassis harness where I'm a little concerened
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Report this Post05-01-2012 11:17 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Clutch and axles will also work with the F23. I don't see the point in using the isuzu.

------------------
Turbo 3800 E85 5spd spec5
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Report this Post05-01-2012 12:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for CarrollesClick Here to Email CarrollesSend a Private Message to CarrollesEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Not trying to hijack the thread but the differential bearings in my stock 88GT Getrag are shot. I'm nervous as to how much damage I'll find when I crack the case. Is the F23 a good candidate for a replacement for a stock 2.8 in an 88GT? What cars did it originally come in?
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Report this Post05-01-2012 08:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
you guys are on the ball, at this point I'd be stupid not to swap in an F23. I did a quick search on car-part.com and found dozens of F23's within an hour drive of me for around $200. From what I read, its the cavalier tranny I want the bell housing and input shafts will line up? After working on imports for a few years this all seems to good to be true...
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Report this Post05-02-2012 07:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Looky what I brought home today...

This images is larger than 153600 bytes. Click to view.







PP and clutch fit, just barely clear the bellhousing. The flywheel ring gear might scrape the case by the output but I can file down the case. I just hope to hell there's enough clearance for the axle shafts to go in...

[This message has been edited by slideways (edited 05-02-2012).]

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Report this Post05-02-2012 11:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
That transmission will not bolt up to your 3800 . You need one from a 2000 caviler with a 2.2L vin 4.
You need the one on the left in this picture.


------------------
Turbo 3800 E85 5spd spec5
11.54@132.7

[This message has been edited by Justinbart (edited 05-02-2012).]

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slideways
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Report this Post05-03-2012 08:16 AM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks for helping a noob out. I painfully realized that when I tried to bolt it up last night... The scrapyard said it was not out of an ecotech, but this is most not the 60deg bellhousing I need

[This message has been edited by slideways (edited 05-03-2012).]

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slideways
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Report this Post05-03-2012 08:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

slideways

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I guess worst case I can buy a damaged one and swap the bell housing if they won't exchange it.
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Report this Post05-03-2012 10:04 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
You should have 30 days to exchange it for the right one.

------------------
Turbo 3800 E85 5spd spec5
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Report this Post05-03-2012 10:06 AM Click Here to See the Profile for MstangsBwareClick Here to Email MstangsBwareSend a Private Message to MstangsBwareEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by slideways:

Thanks for helping a noob out. I painfully realized that when I tried to bolt it up last night... The scrapyard said it was not out of an ecotech, but this is most not the 60deg bellhousing I need



They should take it back as most have a 30 day exchange....Plus if it was listed wrong then it is on them.....
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Report this Post05-03-2012 11:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Just called they will exchange it for the right one (01' 2.4L)
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Report this Post05-03-2012 11:46 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by slideways:

Just called they will exchange it for the right one (01' 2.4L)


2.2L VIN 4

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Turbo 3800 E85 5spd spec5
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Report this Post05-04-2012 08:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Justinbart:


2.2L VIN 4



You will probably be reading 'Thanks agian' alot in this thread, just warning you
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Report this Post05-04-2012 09:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mattwaClick Here to Email mattwaSend a Private Message to mattwaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yep, I was just late to this thread. I started my F23 before Justin. You made an excellent decision to avoid the headache that is the Isuzu. I was wondering when I started reading your post...Isuzu...L67....Stage 4 solid hub clutch?! Made no sense, that clutch would shatter an Isuzu. Haha.

[This message has been edited by mattwa (edited 05-04-2012).]

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Report this Post05-04-2012 09:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
2000-2002 cavalier/sunfire with 2.2L pushrod eng. uses 60* bell housing f23 for sure. What I have here is an ecotec f23 from 2003 2.2L dohc with only 33k miles I am trading it in for an 01' tomorrow but with 120k miles
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Report this Post05-04-2012 09:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by mattwa:

Yep, I was just late to this thread. I started my F23 before Justin. You made an excellent decision to avoid the headache that is the Isuzu. I was wondering when I started reading your post...Isuzu...L67....Stage 4 solid hub clutch?! Made no sense, that clutch would shatter an Isuzu. Haha.

But by any chance is that an FY1 transmission? From an 2009 to 2010 Chevy cobalt XFE. It would be worth keeping if it is, at least I think it would be. That way, you would get the 3.63 final drive instead of a 3.94 (which is short, believe me. I have got my 3800/F23 drive-able recently and those gears are short!!). All you would need to do is swap bellhousings. I'm passively looking for one.


I can just picture what a 4k launch would do to that poor Isuzu and i dont want to have to make up trans mounts twice when I replace it with the f23. I've seen what Justin has done with that Frankenstein rock crusher and thats something to think about... but i dont mind driving a supercharged row boat and its good to know theres more replacement trannys in the junkyard than a downtown core.

[This message has been edited by slideways (edited 05-04-2012).]

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Report this Post05-04-2012 11:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BlownFiero86Send a Private Message to BlownFiero86Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
First off I am new, so I am sorry for the stupid questions. How do you start a build thread, because I bought my first fiero last september (by the way I love this car) and I have been doing a 3800sc swap. I would like to post my pics and info just so I can show everyone what I have done and get some comments or some constructive criticism about my build.
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Report this Post05-04-2012 11:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike GonzalezClick Here to Email Mike GonzalezSend a Private Message to Mike GonzalezEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by BlownFiero86:

First off I am new, so I am sorry for the stupid questions. How do you start a build thread, because I bought my first fiero last september (by the way I love this car) and I have been doing a 3800sc swap. I would like to post my pics and info just so I can show everyone what I have done and get some comments or some constructive criticism about my build.

Welcome to PFF !!

Just start a new thread in TD&Q or General.....Download and install PIP from the bottom of the page, and start posting...if it is worthy it will be moved to the constuction zone.
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Report this Post05-04-2012 11:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BlownFiero86Send a Private Message to BlownFiero86Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thank you, what do you mean by download PIP?

------------------
86GT, 3800SC, GETRAG, true duals, 3.4 pulley, comp VS cam, zzp match flow injectors, zzp power log, WCF air intake, ARP bolts, comp lifters and push rods, 90# springs, SI stainless valves, aero-force scantech meter

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Report this Post05-04-2012 11:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike GonzalezClick Here to Email Mike GonzalezSend a Private Message to Mike GonzalezEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by BlownFiero86:

Thank you, what do you mean by download PIP?



Pennocks Image poster, the blue and red little box at the bottom of every page.
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Report this Post05-05-2012 12:02 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BlownFiero86Send a Private Message to BlownFiero86Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
COOL!!! THANKS
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Report this Post05-05-2012 12:17 AM Click Here to See the Profile for mattwaClick Here to Email mattwaSend a Private Message to mattwaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by slideways:


I can just picture what a 4k launch would do to that poor Isuzu and i dont want to have to make up trans mounts twice when I replace it with the f23. I've seen what Justin has done with that Frankenstein rock crusher and thats something to think about... but i dont mind driving a supercharged row boat and its good to know theres more replacement trannys in the junkyard than a downtown core.



If you haven't seen my thread for ideas, here it is.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/087609.html
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Report this Post05-05-2012 06:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by mattwa:


If you haven't seen my thread for ideas, here it is.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/087609.html


Some good reading there, thanks.
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Report this Post05-05-2012 06:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for slidewaysSend a Private Message to slidewaysEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

slideways

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Member since Apr 2012
Got the right one, bolts up, and I dont see any clearance issues with the PP or ring gear buts its close!! I will tripple check it once its all bolted up. Does anyone know if there's supposed to be a pilot bearing in there? I dont see where it would go, and i cant seem to find a p/n

[This message has been edited by slideways (edited 05-05-2012).]

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