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Getrag Input Shaft Sleeve/Bearing Assy Supplier? by Bloozberry
Started on: 04-02-2011 04:47 PM
Replies: 32 (741 views)
Last post by: ZaraSpOOk on 01-04-2013 08:11 AM
Bloozberry
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04-02-2011 04:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I'm repairing a customer's car that had a vibration in the clutch pedal when engaging or disengaging the clutch. Now that it's apart, it's clear what the problem was... the sleeve that the throw-out bearing slides on (that's normally an integral part of the input shaft bearing) is separated from the bearing. I've spent a fair bit of time searching the internet for a supplier of the Getrag input shaft sleeve/bearing assembly but have come up emtpy-handed. Here's a picture of what I'm looking for:

[This message has been edited by Bloozberry (edited 04-03-2011).]

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fierogt28
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04-02-2011 06:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierogt28Send a Private Message to fierogt28Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Blooze, I've been looking for the same part as you. I went to a AC Delco dealer here in NB and they are dis-continued. That bearing is listed for other GM cars / transmissions. I guess we need to find old stock somewhere's or find a re-building transmission shop that has some extras on hand. That tranny shop in Florida (Manstrans) may be a good try. There was a thread on here that someone was lucky and bought it from Manstrans.

There about 80$. If you find an extra, let me know, I need one too.

Thanks,

------------------
fierogt28

88 GT, Loaded, 5-speed.
88 GT, 5-speed. All original.

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Bloozberry
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04-02-2011 06:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by fierogt28:

There was a thread on here that someone was lucky and bought it from Manstrans.




I stole the picture from that thread. If I find a supplier I'll order one for you too.

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1fatcat
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04-02-2011 06:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 1fatcatSend a Private Message to 1fatcatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I appologize in advance if this info is worthless, but I just relpaced one of those in a 96 Saturn SL2 w/1.9L. I don't know what the tranny was (other than a 5 speed manual) but the part was $22.70 at my discount price, and the GM part # was 21120405. Again, I have no idea if this is the same part, but it was the same construction and looks very similar. It was the input shaft bearing, seal and throwout bearing sleeve all in one.

I had to split the tranny to remove the old one as it was pressed in from the outside and could only be pressed out from the inside. I tried cutting two slots into the sleeve and using a two jaw puller to extract it, but that didn't work for me. The sleeve is very thin and flimsy. Maybe I could have gotten it if I had cut the slots closer to the base and cut three slots instead of two, then used a three jaw puller instead of a two jaw?

[This message has been edited by 1fatcat (edited 04-02-2011).]

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Bloozberry
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04-02-2011 07:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Thanks for the info fatcat. The bearing in the Getrag is exactly the same design... crappy thin little sleeve. After reading a few threads here on PFF I also realize that the case will need to be split to change it out. Trying to pull it out with a puller isn't going won't work in my case because the sleeve has already come off the bearing.

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americasfuture2k
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04-02-2011 07:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for americasfuture2kSend a Private Message to americasfuture2kEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

the place that reconditioned my 282 got one for 50 bux. you could try calling them and seeing where they got it from. it was http://www.blumenthalmfg.com/ ph# (405) 232-9557 or (800) 262-9557

i believe they had to press mine out.

[This message has been edited by americasfuture2k (edited 04-02-2011).]

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joesfiero
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04-02-2011 10:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for joesfieroClick Here to Email joesfieroSend a Private Message to joesfieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I think mantrans is going to be your best bet for new, I do think they have them left I bought a rebuild kit from them off ebay a few months ago and it included bearings, seals and blocker rings.

Worst case scenario if you absolutely cant find a new one I have one here that I replaced just a month or two ago, there was nothing wrong with it but it is used. PM me if you need it, you can have it for shipping.

-Joe

[This message has been edited by joesfiero (edited 04-02-2011).]

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1fatcat
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04-02-2011 10:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 1fatcatSend a Private Message to 1fatcatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I'm suprised Rodney doesn't have some beefy version of it.

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Bloozberry
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04-03-2011 07:39 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Thanks AF2K, I'll try getting ahold of Blumenthal and Mantrans on Monday. Joe, thanks for the offer on the used one... set it aside for me just in case!

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Blacktree
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04-03-2011 10:38 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BlacktreeClick Here to visit Blacktree's HomePageClick Here to Email BlacktreeSend a Private Message to BlacktreeEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I just realized my home address is clearly visible in that photo. Oops

Anyway, yes you will need to split the case and use a press to replace the bearing/seal unit. Also, oddly enough, the hole that the bearing/seal unit sits in is a straight-through hole. There is no ledge or ridge or whatever to act as a stop for the bearing/seal unit. So you will need to be careful how far you press the unit into the trans casing. On mine, I don't think I pressed the unit in far enough, and it rubbed a little against the clutch disc hub. Luckily, that didn't cause any damage to the tranny or clutch. But just FYI.

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1fatcat
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04-03-2011 11:24 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 1fatcatSend a Private Message to 1fatcatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Another tip. Use a thin coat of sealant on the new piece to ensure transmission oil doesn't seep out through the press fit area. Silicone, anarobic, or even a loc-tite product will do.

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Bloozberry
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04-03-2011 12:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Blacktree:

I just realized my home address is clearly visible in that photo. Oops



Not anymore. Thanks for the additional tips 1fatcat and Blacktree.

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joesfiero
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04-03-2011 10:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for joesfieroClick Here to Email joesfieroSend a Private Message to joesfieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Blooz I dont know if you have the FSM that illustrates rebuilding the getrag, but there are a couple more things to consider when replacing that bearing. It says to press the old one out from the gearset side of the case half towards the bellhousing side. To reinstall you want to make sure that the oil seepage hole in the bearing is at the bottom when the trans is in the car and press it in from the bellhousing side toward the gearset side. You want to press on the acutal bearing itself, not the sleeve and stop when the bearing shoulder is flush with the case.

-Joe

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Bloozberry
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04-04-2011 07:12 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Thanks Joe. I've got the '88 FSM as well as a few well documented threads here for reference. I'll be calling around today to see if I can still get a new bearing somewhere.

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04-04-2011 08:35 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 1fatcatSend a Private Message to 1fatcatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

If you don't have any luck, give these guys a shot. http://www.zbag.com/. They are located in MN and specialize in manual trannys. I bought my F40 from them.

The name might sound funny, but it stands for Zumbrota Bearing And Gear. Located in Zumbrota, MN.

[This message has been edited by 1fatcat (edited 04-04-2011).]

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Rodney
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04-04-2011 09:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for RodneyClick Here to visit Rodney's HomePageClick Here to Email RodneySend a Private Message to RodneyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by 1fatcat:

I appologize in advance if this info is worthless, but I just relpaced one of those in a 96 Saturn SL2 w/1.9L. I don't know what the tranny was (other than a 5 speed manual) but the part was $22.70 at my discount price, and the GM part # was 21120405. Again, I have no idea if this is the same part, but it was the same construction and looks very similar. It was the input shaft bearing, seal and throwout bearing sleeve all in one.


Hearing this makes me think I may be able to get these made? If this design is used in other transmissions I may be able to get them made. Anyone have a used ones I could use for R&D?

------------------
Rodney Dickman

Fiero Parts And Acc's Web Page:
All new web page!:www.rodneydickman.com
Rodney Dickman's Fiero accessories
7604 Treeview Drive
Caledonia, WI 53108
Phone/Fax (262) 835-9575

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Bloozberry
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04-04-2011 09:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Rodney, I can send you the one I'm removing. The only problem with it is that the TO bearing collar is separated from the bearing. PM me if you're interested.

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joesfiero
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04-04-2011 09:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for joesfieroClick Here to Email joesfieroSend a Private Message to joesfieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

rodney PMed me asking about sending him my used one, Blooz if you have found a source I will send him mine. Let me know.

-Joe

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04-05-2011 06:08 AM Click Here to See the Profile for billybad5Send a Private Message to billybad5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

autozone has the complete bearing kit that has the input shaft bearing in it. http://www.autozone.com/aut...r=391481_14444_5208_

made by pro-king, maybe could contact them and see if they will sell it by itself.
i have a used one in good condition, that came out of my getrag if you don't have any luck getting a new one. i had my trans rebuilt with the pro-king kit.

[This message has been edited by billybad5 (edited 04-05-2011).]

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Bloozberry
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04-05-2011 07:25 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I found a new one locally yesterday Joe, so you can send yours to Rodney. Thanks again, and to you too Billybad (a "+" for you).

[This message has been edited by Bloozberry (edited 04-05-2011).]

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Bloozberry
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04-06-2011 03:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Well it's back to square one. I followed Blacktree's awesome thread here www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/109502.html to split the case. Except for the rubber-coated detent cover plate, I had no problems getting the detent assembly nor the case halves apart thanks to his great photos. I had to puncture the detent cover to pry it out of the case. I then pressed the old input shaft bearing out of the differential cover without any problems. Where I ran into a snag was when I tried to press the new bearing in.

The one I found locally turned out to be 0.025" larger in diameter than the one I pulled out of the transmission. This difference isn't noticeable by eyeballing the two together but it sure became apparent when I tried to press it into the case-half. It just wouldn't go, so I gave it a little more pressure and ended up slipping with the press. That bent the sleeve and when I pressed it out to check it, the bearing was seized from having been squeezed into a hole too small. Arrrgh! When I decided to measure the OD of the bearing I discovered why it wouldn't go in. Looks like I'll be buying a complete overhaul kit just for the one bearing... possibly the one Billybad posted a link to from Autozone. I've looked everywhere else.

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12-19-2012 08:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hdryderClick Here to Email hdryderSend a Private Message to hdryderEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Blooz, did the input shaft sleeve from AutoZone work for the Getrag you were working on?

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Bloozberry
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12-19-2012 08:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

The part number BK234 from Autozone is the correct kit for the Getrag. I ended up ordering the same part number through a Canadian supplier and it had all the correct components as shown in the Autozone link. That kit isn't cheap though. If that part number is no longer available, then Rodney has developed a replacement for the bearing alone.

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12-19-2012 09:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hdryderClick Here to Email hdryderSend a Private Message to hdryderEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Thanks for that info. Do you recall the name of the source in Canada?

A while back, a month or so, I thought I read on a thread that someone removed the broken part without splitting the trans. case, by using a Dremel tool and carefully cutting it enough to get it out. Does this sound possible?

Thanks for the help.

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Bloozberry
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12-19-2012 10:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Unfortunately I don't know who the supplier was since I bought it through my local transmission shop and it came in a plain brown box. Here's a picture of the contents:



If you Google the part number BK234 you should get several suppliers in the USA... at least I did the last time I tried. Whether they actually have a kit in stock or not is the question. As for removing the old bearing without splitting the case, I suppose it could be done but you would certainly get metal filings inside the case if you tried it. The next obstacle would be reinstalling the new bearing since it is a really tight fit. I could not simply use a rubber mallet and a socket to drive even the proper one in... it took several tons of pressure in a hydraulic press to slide it into place. You can only do that with the empty case half installed on the press.

Splitting the case seems a little daunting at first, but I found my first time doing it quite fun... and following Blacktree's thread made it fool proof. Once it was apart, I just brought the new T/O bearing and the empty case half to my transmission shop where they pressed it in for free. Easy as pie.

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12-20-2012 05:53 AM Click Here to See the Profile for hdryderClick Here to Email hdryderSend a Private Message to hdryderEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

It looks like Blacktree's thread above for splitting the Getrag trans. case is no longer available.

Does anyone have a current working link for that thread, or know how to access that information?

Thanks for the help.

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Bloozberry
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12-20-2012 08:04 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

It's over in the How To Section: www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum9/HTML/000008.html For some reason the search function doesn't seem to work either for that thread.

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12-20-2012 10:12 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ZaraSpOOkClick Here to Email ZaraSpOOkSend a Private Message to ZaraSpOOkEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

What I am wondering is are all the parts in the kit somewhat easily installed by the home mechanic? I'd love to hear your experience.

I am also wondering if anyone has rebuilt a Getrag, did you replace the syncros? how was the job?

[This message has been edited by ZaraSpOOk (edited 12-20-2012).]

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Bloozberry
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12-20-2012 11:33 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I only replaced the input bearing, the axle seals, the fork shaft seal, and the big rubber detent mechanism cover, so no, I didn't get into the syncros or other bearings

Replacing anything else pretty much needs the tools and expertise of a transmission shop IMHO. For example, the differential bearings would seem an easy replacement, but then setting the correct clearances involves using special one-time use crush washers in a trial and error process and requires eye or a feel for how much is just right, and replacing syncros gets much more difficult as the gears have to be pressed off the shafts using exxtreme hydraulic pressure... somewhere in the neighbourhood of 20 tons.

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12-20-2012 02:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZaraSpOOkClick Here to Email ZaraSpOOkSend a Private Message to ZaraSpOOkEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

the rebuild kit is no longer available, which brings us right back where we started

[This message has been edited by ZaraSpOOk (edited 12-20-2012).]

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12-20-2012 04:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for n7vrzClick Here to Email n7vrzSend a Private Message to n7vrzEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I just googled BK234 and got a hit with Advance Auto Parts. Says they have it in stock. Now whether or not they REALLY have it is something I haven't looked into.

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01-03-2013 09:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hypo327Click Here to Email hypo327Send a Private Message to hypo327Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Bloozberry:

Well it's back to square one. I followed Blacktree's awesome thread here www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/109502.html to split the case. Except for the rubber-coated detent cover plate, I had no problems getting the detent assembly nor the case halves apart thanks to his great photos. I had to puncture the detent cover to pry it out of the case. I then pressed the old input shaft bearing out of the differential cover without any problems. Where I ran into a snag was when I tried to press the new bearing in.

The one I found locally turned out to be 0.025" larger in diameter than the one I pulled out of the transmission. This difference isn't noticeable by eyeballing the two together but it sure became apparent when I tried to press it into the case-half. It just wouldn't go, so I gave it a little more pressure and ended up slipping with the press. That bent the sleeve and when I pressed it out to check it, the bearing was seized from having been squeezed into a hole too small. Arrrgh! When I decided to measure the OD of the bearing I discovered why it wouldn't go in. Looks like I'll be buying a complete overhaul kit just for the one bearing... possibly the one Billybad posted a link to from Autozone. I've looked everywhere else.


Do you have another link for this transmission overhaul thread...this one no longer works???! Thanks

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ZaraSpOOk
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01-04-2013 08:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ZaraSpOOkClick Here to Email ZaraSpOOkSend a Private Message to ZaraSpOOkEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by hypo327:
Do you have another link for this transmission overhaul thread...this one no longer works???! Thanks


here you go

and no Advanced Auto Parts does not have the overhaul kit, nor does AutoZone, nor O'Relley, nor the company that put the kit together

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