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zzp 1.0 fiero tune question by mx3800supercharged
Started on: 07-18-2014 09:59 PM
Replies: 51 (1075 views)
Last post by: Darth Fiero on 08-12-2014 01:41 AM
mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-18-2014 09:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
hello so zzp is suppose to delete the VATS system
yet i still have no pulse at my injectors
i tested my ICM i have power, ground, and signals going to the ICM from the crank and cam sensors, yet still no pulse.
i just tested my injectors. probably not the right way i did a quick power supply to all 6 then cranked her over and she fired but as no pulse she died just as quick as it started.
I have a 97 GTP engine and the stock 4t65E HD i think that's what the transmission is either way its the stock one from the donor car

I have a aftermarket Walbro 255 fuel pump wired in on a toggle switch on my dash to supply power totally avoiding my fuel pump relays and such, would that be a issue?
i just kind of figured if there was pressure it would work

i have been stuck on this project for a few months now and i have been trying to do it all myself but now i need some advice and some help
Please anyone for the love of auto sports please help me out
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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post07-19-2014 04:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I would buy, borrow or befriend someone with a quality scanner. No way to tell exactly what is going on without one. The anti-theft feature can sometimes be hard to disable on the later PCM's. but further evaluation is needed before you can say that it is the problem.

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larry mimbs
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Report this Post07-19-2014 06:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for larry mimbsClick Here to Email larry mimbsSend a Private Message to larry mimbsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Had exactly the same problem with a 98 GMC. Tried bypass modules, didn't work. Sent the ECM to a shop in Canada. $50 and no more problem. (Deleted VAT)
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Report this Post07-20-2014 08:33 AM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadClick Here to Email olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Two words of advice.....

Sinister Performance
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-22-2014 09:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
ill try and see if my friend can borrow the genesis 2 from his dealership and see what happens from that
but as for the VAT delete. the Fiero tune from ZZP is supposed to had the VATS deleted. that is the entire reason why i had it flashed by them.
now twice because i thought they did it wrong the first time.

i have read a few discussions on here that have mentioned sinister performance, but i had no clue they existed until after i paid and revived my PCM
if the later ones do not like the VATS delete, would a 2000 harness and ECM work. If so ill have to try and track that down or just pay fuelinjection.com for a new harness.

i wish there was a community of people in my town that could just meet up and help me out. This engine swap is a royal pain.

I can do a 460 big block swap in a weekend. i have been working on this for a couple years now off and on
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Report this Post07-23-2014 12:23 AM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by mx3800supercharged:

ill try and see if my friend can borrow the genesis 2 from his dealership and see what happens from that
but as for the VAT delete. the Fiero tune from ZZP is supposed to had the VATS deleted. that is the entire reason why i had it flashed by them.
now twice because i thought they did it wrong the first time.

i have read a few discussions on here that have mentioned sinister performance, but i had no clue they existed until after i paid and revived my PCM
if the later ones do not like the VATS delete, would a 2000 harness and ECM work. If so ill have to try and track that down or just pay fuelinjection.com for a new harness.

i wish there was a community of people in my town that could just meet up and help me out. This engine swap is a royal pain.

I can do a 460 big block swap in a weekend. i have been working on this for a couple years now off and on


FieroFlyer on this forum makes harnesses and accompanying PCM for the best price and he is in Canada to boot.
Get a 1998 Grand Prix GTP PCM and it will start and run your car. You may have to get a 98 MAF for the correct AFR and some codes will be present but it will run just fine.
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-23-2014 02:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by nosrac:


FieroFlyer on this forum makes harnesses and accompanying PCM for the best price and he is in Canada to boot.
Get a 1998 Grand Prix GTP PCM and it will start and run your car. You may have to get a 98 MAF for the correct AFR and some codes will be present but it will run just fine.


thank you for the information, ill track him down and send a PM ASAP

AS for ZZPerformance, Turbo Tim is sending me a third PCM to try out now. I should have it in a week. ill see how this one goes and if it still does not do the Fuel enable i guess ill have to spend the extra cash on the 98 PCM and harness. all i want is for this car to run. then i know it will be worth finishing up.
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thismanyfieros
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Report this Post07-23-2014 02:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for thismanyfierosClick Here to Email thismanyfierosSend a Private Message to thismanyfierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If your getting frustrated stop by I will take you for a rip in my 3.8sc.... you wont be frustrated anymore.. tim
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-23-2014 02:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
your not to far from me, might be worth the trip up north one weekend.
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darkhorizon
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Report this Post07-23-2014 05:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
none of the grand prix pcm's have any security on them. The 01-03 pcms may stall after running for a few seconds, but it will run fine for that few seconds.
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-23-2014 08:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
if i decide to go the 98 to 2000 PCM and harness, what about the KR sensor on my 97 PCM, does that just get eliminated??
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-23-2014 09:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darkhorizon:

none of the grand prix pcm's have any security on them. The 01-03 pcms may stall after running for a few seconds, but it will run fine for that few seconds.


The PCM has a fuel enable output, that gets a signal from the BCM when the proper key is in the ignition. i have the PASSLOCK not the PASSKEY system in the 97 harness style.
so the bypass OHM trick wont work for me. plus i threw the lock cylinder away 3 years ago now. so i cant even try to wire that in and see if that would work. it was tempting to try but when i went through the shed i tossed a lot of stuff away. kinda regretting that now, after all i am doing a full out race dash in the car tearing it all out (dash, door panels, carpet, passenger seat, like everything) and putting some light weight rolled aluminum in place. so the GTP ignition lock switch could have been worked in somehow or another. its not a Fiero though so all you lovers dont get to mad at me for ripping it apart like this.

its a Mazda MX3, i am setting it up like one though. the engine is in the rear to make it a mid engine car, custom hatch to look like a Fiero, and the fuel cell is up front safe and sound in a cage.

I just thought all of you on this forum would be the best help and you all have experience doing this engine swap

When this project is done, the wife wants me to do a fiero for her though, but keep the interior. she is actually mad at me for ripping this one out.
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darkhorizon
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Report this Post07-23-2014 09:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
97 gtp has no security enabled. Period.
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-24-2014 12:34 AM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darkhorizon:

97 gtp has no security enabled. Period.




from what i read from a lot of other sites the 97 has a passlock system built into the ignition switch itself, when the key is in and turns it sends a magnetic field down to the BCM and from that it sends a signal to the PCM called fuel enable

BCM - pin A3
PCM - C1-55

ICM - D- PURPLE with WHITE stripe wire.
Fuel Injection Control Signal to ECM.
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darkhorizon
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Report this Post07-24-2014 08:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thats great and all but the pcm itself doesnt care. You can feed that security line anything you want and it will run fine. Its disabled in the code from the factory.
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-24-2014 09:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darkhorizon:

Thats great and all but the pcm itself doesnt care. You can feed that security line anything you want and it will run fine. Its disabled in the code from the factory.


hmmm... I did not know that

so can I just give it a 12V power source to that wire?
or a ground?

can you please explain a bit more??

much appreciated
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darkhorizon
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Report this Post07-24-2014 11:00 AM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
There is nothing to explain really... you just can ignore any of the security stuff on a 97 grandprix pcm... the input it is looking for is selectable inside of the pcm code between a serial communication.. triangle wave.. or nothing and all grand prixs before 01 are set to nothing.

Either way the failure mode of a security issue is not "no start" it is "start and run great for 3 seconds then shut off"

[This message has been edited by darkhorizon (edited 07-24-2014).]

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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-24-2014 04:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
With that said why am I not getting any fuel pulse?
I drove the car for over a Year before I pulled it out for the swap and it cranks ands has spark just no fuel pulse. That's why I think its the fuel enable from the security. I tested and replaced my ICM, with that said I am getting signals from the crank and cam sensors. Just no fuel pulse.
I tested my injectors and they do work.
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darkhorizon
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Report this Post07-24-2014 07:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If you are getting spark, then you might have a bad connection to the PCM. Would be neat to see what the PCM is doing with a scanner.
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-24-2014 08:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darkhorizon:

If you are getting spark, then you might have a bad connection to the PCM. Would be neat to see what the PCM is doing with a scanner.


I so agree with you on the scanner part, but the issue with that is my OBD2 port does not work and that is another thing on my WTF list of things.
I did chop out a lot of stuff like the ABS and other stuff I don't need from the harness and I think with that something went wrong there.
when I test the injectors the node light stays on, but no flash when cranking

I read a few times that the 97 does have a VAT system, it sends a signal from the ignition switch with that magnetic field to the Instrument pack, then to the BCM then to the ICM or something like that, are you sure, the 97 actually does not do that


I should probably just invest in a standalone harness from that fuelinjection.com site and just go from there as the port will work and it will be much cleaner.

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WHEELIE
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Report this Post07-24-2014 08:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for WHEELIEClick Here to visit WHEELIE's HomePageClick Here to Email WHEELIESend a Private Message to WHEELIEEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have a 1997 3800 ECM from a park ave. I deleted all the codes with a powrtuner and it still quit after 2 seconds. I purchased a module from Baker electronix and it works. Check them out... Yes spelled with x
Wheelie

[This message has been edited by WHEELIE (edited 07-24-2014).]

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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-24-2014 09:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by WHEELIE:

I have a 1997 3800 ECM from a park ave. I deleted all the codes with a powrtuner and it still quit after 2 seconds. I purchased a module from Baker electronix and it works. Check them out... Yes spelled with x
Wheelie



I have a passlock system not a passkey1 or 2 system, it is a bit different, would it still work??
for 35$ its worth a try
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-24-2014 09:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
also did your park avenue have a passlock or passkey system?
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darkhorizon
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Report this Post07-25-2014 09:47 AM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I own a 97gtp and drive it regularly but I cant say if the passkey system ever does anything.. my 98 olds 88 throws a security light because I cut the wires going to the tumbler for the ohms check and it still runs fine.

If your scan tool cant connect to the pcm you have a problem... the scan tool needs power ground and 1 class2 data connection... if you dont have that right it would be a great first step of troubleshooting even if it doesnt make your car run.

Remember that even with the most horrible passkey security problems YOUR CAR WILL STILL RUN FINE FOR 3 SECONDS
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-25-2014 01:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darkhorizon:

I own a 97gtp and drive it regularly but I cant say if the passkey system ever does anything.. my 98 olds 88 throws a security light because I cut the wires going to the tumbler for the ohms check and it still runs fine.

If your scan tool cant connect to the pcm you have a problem... the scan tool needs power ground and 1 class2 data connection... if you dont have that right it would be a great first step of troubleshooting even if it doesnt make your car run.

Remember that even with the most horrible passkey security problems YOUR CAR WILL STILL RUN FINE FOR 3 SECONDS


so before I try to get any further I should try and figure out my OBD and see why it wont connect, I think I still have that diagram in my stack of papers. when I eliminated some stuff I noticed that some of the wires went to the OBD. maybe I eliminated the ground for it by mistake...
also I never hooked up the security light yet or the check engine indicator light either. i noticed a few people talking about they see the light either flashing or its on steady, for me i have no clue because of that. i have just been focusing on why it wont start.

mine wont even run for the 3 seconds then die like most, it just does not get the fuel at all, and that is what i have been focusing on.
if i cant find my wiring diagram for that would you happen to have a copy for the 97, i really don't want to pay for alldata.com again.

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darkhorizon
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Report this Post07-25-2014 01:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Gmtuners.com has wiring diagrams.

There is no security light on a fiero because there is no bcm. The pcm has no influence on the security system its only function is to turn off after 3 seconds if it doesnt have the input its looking for. Again the grand prix is not looking for any inputs to satisfy the security.
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Report this Post07-25-2014 02:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadClick Here to Email olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
All of your wiring issues will be solved by looking at the pinouts provided at the link that DH provided.
www.gmtuners.com
(Sinister Performance)
The first place to check for solving swap wiring issues.
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-25-2014 03:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darkhorizon:

Gmtuners.com has wiring diagrams.

There is no security light on a fiero because there is no bcm. The pcm has no influence on the security system its only function is to turn off after 3 seconds if it doesnt have the input its looking for. Again the grand prix is not looking for any inputs to satisfy the security.


well i am not putting this into a Fiero, its actually going into a 1995 Mazda MX3 presidia. its a mid engine car now with all the custom frame work and hours work to do so. i put it in the rear.
so the GTP harness and all was transferred to the MX3, BCM and all.

but like you said before i should try and figure out my OBD first and scan and go from there
that should tell me whats wrong right.
because it does not run for the 3 seconds then die, like you say it should. it just does not start at

ill look into the OBD port this weekend and let you know what is up from that if i can figure that part out
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Report this Post07-25-2014 03:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadClick Here to Email olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Mazda, Fiero, whatever, the info is there to solve your problem.
If you know the wiring of the Mazda, its easy to morph the 3800 into it and have it run......
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-25-2014 06:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
ok so I found the chart on that link you provided

but were it says 18X reference attach to pin c, but I am using the ICM from the gtp. so I never thought that would need to done

I take it you cant just take the wiring harness from the GTP
wire in the ignition bypass to the mazda and be done??
because that's pretty much what I did so far.
it cranks, everything has power it sparks but no fuel.

sorry if I don't seam to understand a few things I am way to new at this **** .
I can build a big block carbureted engine but this is a whole new ball park

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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-25-2014 06:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

mx3800supercharged

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Member since Jul 2014
the chart says omitted pin numbers are not used

i am assuming i can go ahead and remove all the wires from the pin locations that are not mentioned to clean it up a hell of a lot
is that right?
just trying not to **** up too much

you guys are vary helpful thanks
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Report this Post07-25-2014 07:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
You dont need the BCM for anything.

The 18x wires should run from the ICM to the PCM using the factory wiring. You shouldnt have to change any of that.

The main "swap wiring" bits are just:

1. hook up switched power to pink 12+ wires. There are roughly 12 of these in the harness in some form.
2. Hook up grounds.
3. Hook up B+ to the PCM for constant battery power.
4. Hook up gauges, reverse lights, fan controls, fuel pump enable, etc as desired.
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-25-2014 08:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darkhorizon:

You dont need the BCM for anything.

The 18x wires should run from the ICM to the PCM using the factory wiring. You shouldnt have to change any of that.

The main "swap wiring" bits are just:

1. hook up switched power to pink 12+ wires. There are roughly 12 of these in the harness in some form.
2. Hook up grounds.
3. Hook up B+ to the PCM for constant battery power.
4. Hook up gauges, reverse lights, fan controls, fuel pump enable, etc as desired.


so just take out my BCM from the harness and toss it, k

all I did for the power part was connect power to my underhood electrical center and hook up the grounds, that I can see noticeably. then I ran the ignition and starter wires to the mazda ignition switch so the 3800 would crank.
so I am missing some other power wires that you are mentioning in step 1.

the B+ to the pcm would that be C1-20 - battery positive voltage (hot at all times)

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Report this Post07-26-2014 01:24 AM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
if you somehow hacked in the grand prix fuse box, then you have the power you need... probably.... Its pretty basic to check all of the 12 volt things.
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-26-2014 10:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darkhorizon:

if you somehow hacked in the grand prix fuse box, then you have the power you need... probably.... Its pretty basic to check all of the 12 volt things.


yeah I took the entire harness from the GTP underhood center and all, and then wired that into the mazda and ran a main power feed from the battery so that's why I thought that was all I needed to do for the power for everything, then I took all the grounds I could see and attached them to either the frame I made for the new engine cradle I made or if they were near the new battery location I attached them right to the batteries negative post.

does the pcm look for power from the underhoods fuel relays and such to the fuel pump?
reason I ask is that is that I bypassed all that and I put a inline walbrow 255 from the fuel cell wired directly to a toggle on my dash would that have something to do with my issue?
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-26-2014 10:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

mx3800supercharged

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so your saying if I don't want to use that underhood I could just apply power to the pink wires and just get rid of that huge underhood center?
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darkhorizon
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Report this Post07-27-2014 12:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
i run my fiero swaps into the 2 fiero "engine fuses" then the ICM to the fiero "igntion" fuse.... So yes you could do something similar to that. At this point in time I might not pull it all apart again, but it wouldnt hurt, and you could clean up the wiring a bit.

I have doubts that your PCM is even turning on. I am not sure how much of it runs to the driver management box, but I believe that it is limited to just switched power, so I would expect that you are not getting positive power to the PCM.
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mx3800supercharged
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Report this Post07-27-2014 06:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mx3800superchargedClick Here to Email mx3800superchargedSend a Private Message to mx3800superchargedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darkhorizon:

i run my fiero swaps into the 2 fiero "engine fuses" then the ICM to the fiero "igntion" fuse.... So yes you could do something similar to that. At this point in time I might not pull it all apart again, but it wouldnt hurt, and you could clean up the wiring a bit.

I have doubts that your PCM is even turning on. I am not sure how much of it runs to the driver management box, but I believe that it is limited to just switched power, so I would expect that you are not getting positive power to the PCM.


well if I get her running like this, then over the winter ill eliminate the GTP's underhood and tie it in much nicer into the mazdas. I never even thought of doing it that way. as you can tell I am quite new to a pain in the ass engine swap. but that sounds like a much cleaner install. definitely something I would want to do down the road.

so the PCM's main power feed is C1-20 according to that chart you sent me the other day right? so should I back probe that pin location and look for a 12V source?
if their is no power than I would have to trace that and see why, but if there is, it must be some other issue.

ill test that after work tomorrow, I would love to now, but the wife will be pissed, laying new floors in the house today so sadly no car time this weekend.
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darkhorizon
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Report this Post07-28-2014 10:16 AM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Backpin everything that doesnt work... Get the scanner working by backpinning it to the ECU, ground, and power... When you have that figured out and it still doesnt work go and pin out the PCM to find out why it isnt turning on.. which it just needs B+ power, switched power and ground.... and continue on from there as you find other stuff that doesnt work.
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Darth Fiero
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Report this Post07-28-2014 02:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Darth FieroClick Here to visit Darth Fiero's HomePageClick Here to Email Darth FieroSend a Private Message to Darth FieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darkhorizon:

97 gtp has no security enabled. Period.


Not true. Every 1997 GTP PCM tune I have on disk right now DOES have VATS enabled in it from the factory and it will NOT allow the engine to run for more than 2 seconds without a VATS fuel enable signal coming into the PCM on the dedicated VATS fuel enable wire (pin C1-55). I know because I've tried it.

Now you wouldn't know this by working on an actual 1997 Grand Prix GTP car. There's no special ignition key used by these cars to indicate it has VATS (at least there wasn't any used with the GTPs I worked on). But, despite this, the BCM in these cars still sends a fuel enable signal to the PCM on the dedicated PASSKEY 2 fuel enable wire (connecting to PCM pin C1-55). And if that signal is missing, the engine won't run for more than 2 seconds.

A custom PCM tune needs to be made to disable VATS in the 1997 GTP PCM. I know how to do it and I've been doing it for longer than anyone else. 1996 L67 PCM tunes are the same way.

1998-2000 GTP PCM tunes don't have VATS enabled from the factory, at least none that I have on file do. That changed around 2001 model year with the introduction of the PK3 VATS system into some of these cars. By the 2003 model year, all GTPs had PK3 and those stock PCM tunes would not let the engine run for more than 2 seconds missing the fuel enable signal. Again, I know how to disable it in these PCM tunes as well.

That having been said, the engine should still start and run for 2 seconds (giving the injectors pulses for 2 seconds) before the PCM shuts it down due to a missing VATS fuel enable signal. If you aren't getting injector pulse at all, then you have another problem.

It's worth mentioning that if whoever tuned your computer didn't know what they were doing and improperly changed a setting in a failed attempt to disable VATS, they could have corrupted the file which could cause the PCM not allow the injectors to pulse at all.

-ryan

------------------
OVERKILL IS UNDERRATED

Custom GM OBD1 & OBD2 Tuning | Engine Conversions & more | www.gmtuners.com

[This message has been edited by Darth Fiero (edited 07-28-2014).]

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