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alternator swing bolt rattle by Mike142
Started on: 05-24-2014 09:37 PM
Replies: 27 (478 views)
Last post by: 85 SE VIN 9 on 10-06-2014 09:01 PM
Mike142
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Report this Post05-24-2014 09:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike142Send a Private Message to Mike142Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hey all,

So, I've been chasing problems all over the fiero over the last few months, she's driving me crazy.

At any rate, the latest is that the "swing bolt" on the alternator, when tightened, still allows the alternator to rattle around. I noticed that when the engine runs, it sounds like there are rocks in it, becuase the alternator is rattling so badly... like 1/8" badly.

So, I figure it's the bolt. I don't know what the PO did, but it's definitely not the original. So, I looked it up and found that it could be a 3/8" or 10mm bolt, so I went with 10mm becuase it was a hair larger than the 3/8, thinking it was just worn down or whatever. I bought a nice shoulder bolt off McMaster.

So, I take out the old bolt, put the new one in, and I can still grab the alternator and rattle it around.

I'm imagining that this means that I need a new alternator, that the entire hole is chewed out and pretty much not repairable.

Thoughts?

Thanks again for the help,

Mike

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Neils88
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Report this Post05-24-2014 09:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Neils88Click Here to Email Neils88Send a Private Message to Neils88Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I might be misunderstanding...but if you are using a shoulder bolt are you actually able to tighten the bolt all the way in? Is the bolt itself loose? (I can't remember the stock Fiero configuration since I only have a 4.9 in mine now). If you are able to tighten the bolt all the way so it feels tight and you can still move the alternator, then you have the wrong bolt - get one that's threaded all the way. The bolt should be metric. (a pic wouldn't hurt either)
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Mike142
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Report this Post05-24-2014 09:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike142Send a Private Message to Mike142Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
sorry, the shoulder goes tight, but the bracket has tabs on the front and the back, so you don't actually grab the alternator with the swing bolt. I am fairly certain that the shoulder of this bolt is supposed to fit thtrough the alternator as a pivot point (not a hard bolt grab) and then the adjustment bolt at the bottom is how you tension and lock down the alternator.
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Neils88
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Report this Post05-24-2014 10:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Neils88Click Here to Email Neils88Send a Private Message to Neils88Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Can you post some pics? It would help to figure out options for you....I'm sure something can be done so you don't have to replace the alternator.
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Dodgerunner
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Report this Post05-24-2014 10:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for DodgerunnerClick Here to visit Dodgerunner's HomePageClick Here to Email DodgerunnerSend a Private Message to DodgerunnerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Does the Alt fit tight tight between the alt bracket. If someone changed the alt and it has a different length mount could make a difference in how tight it fits.
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Mike142
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Report this Post05-24-2014 10:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike142Send a Private Message to Mike142Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
No, it's loose between the bracket tabs...

and I can't really post a pic because of the way the bracket is and sits.

Basically, there's a bunch of play "front to back" or longitudinally to the alternator axle (or transversely with respect to the car overall).
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84fiero123
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Report this Post05-24-2014 11:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 84fiero123Click Here to Email 84fiero123Send a Private Message to 84fiero123Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
would a few washers behind the bracket and against the alternator stop the play? if so try that. if I am understanding you right.

Steve

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Dodgerunner
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Report this Post05-24-2014 11:33 PM Click Here to See the Profile for DodgerunnerClick Here to visit Dodgerunner's HomePageClick Here to Email DodgerunnerSend a Private Message to DodgerunnerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Sounds like you option is to get the correct alt. or space it out with washers. If you space it be sure you keep the pulleys all in alignment. IE space in front or behind as needed.

[This message has been edited by Dodgerunner (edited 05-24-2014).]

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fierosound
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Report this Post05-25-2014 10:30 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It sounds like you are missing the split bushing in the bracket.
It fits in the back hole and "takes up the slack" in between the mounting points.
It tightens up to the point that even after you remove the upper bolt, you have to pry the alternator out of the bracket!

Not a Fiero bracket, but shows the kind of bushing that should be in rear hole.



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[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 05-25-2014).]

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FieroJimmy
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Report this Post05-25-2014 02:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroJimmySend a Private Message to FieroJimmyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Does anyone have a source for replacement bushings? Other than a scrap yard, preferably.

I suppose one could enlarge the hole in the bracket and use a sleeve from the hardware store, trimmed to an appropraite length.

[This message has been edited by FieroJimmy (edited 05-25-2014).]

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Report this Post05-25-2014 08:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by FieroJimmy:

Does anyone have a source for replacement bushings? Other than a scrap yard, preferably.



GM PN from the P22 Parts Book is # 10028767 - sleeve, generator bracket

Looks like they also used the same sleeve to mount the A/C compressor.
Been used on GM products forever. You may want to visit the wrecking yard.

http://parts.nalleygmc.com/...ukey_product=3060741

Typical pic below. It is Part #8

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 05-25-2014).]

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Mike142
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Report this Post05-27-2014 01:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike142Send a Private Message to Mike142Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
yyyyyup, that looks like what I'm missing.

Thanks alot guys! Way cheaper than a new alternator!

Mike
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Mike142
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Report this Post05-27-2014 01:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike142Send a Private Message to Mike142Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
BTW, I found this on Autoplicity.com for much cheaper than the other website... still over $17 for S&H!!!

whatever, all said and done for less than $20 and I'll be happy.

I'll let you know if I have any trouble getting it from these guys and how I make out.

Thanks again all!

Mike
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Mike142
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Report this Post05-27-2014 05:12 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike142Send a Private Message to Mike142Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Autoplicity doesn't have this part, order was refunded.

Will let you know if I find a suitable source.

Thanks,

Mike
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Mike142
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Report this Post05-29-2014 02:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike142Send a Private Message to Mike142Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Alright, well, Nalley Auto also does not have this part.

So, it is off to the junkyard for me!!! I will also try some 3/8" washers and see if that works at all.


Thanks for all the help guys,

Mike
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FieroJimmy
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Report this Post05-29-2014 11:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroJimmySend a Private Message to FieroJimmyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I've got an alternator and bracket next to my desk, and I measured about 0.015" clearance, so you'll need a very thin washer. I'm planning on making my way to a hardware store in the near future, myself.
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Report this Post05-30-2014 09:09 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by FieroJimmy:

I've got an alternator and bracket next to my desk, and I measured about 0.015" clearance, so you'll need a very thin washer. I'm planning on making my way to a hardware store in the near future, myself.


The thing is not JUST a washer. It's a sleeve that reduces the hole in the bracket to the size of the alternator bolt.

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FieroJimmy
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Report this Post05-30-2014 07:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroJimmySend a Private Message to FieroJimmyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I know that it isn't just a washer. Short term, a washer may eliminate noise and belt wear concerns, though.
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css9450
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Report this Post05-30-2014 08:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for css9450Click Here to Email css9450Send a Private Message to css9450Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Is this a 4-cyl. thing? I have a couple spare 2.8 alternator brackets I picked up from the junkyard and neither has this sleeve.
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Report this Post05-30-2014 10:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroJimmySend a Private Message to FieroJimmyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
No, they're on V6's. But the early 2.5's should have something similar, as should pretty much any car with a moveable alternator (i.e. something with manually tensioned belts).
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Report this Post05-31-2014 10:23 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by css9450:

I have a couple spare 2.8 alternator brackets I picked up from the junkyard and neither has this sleeve.


I have a spare myself. I have a reason to KNOW about the damn thing.

Funny story (almost) - I took my alternator bracket in to get ceramic coated. They called me back saying all that was left was the steel sleeve. !!
I really don't know what temp oven they were using, but they now have a "warning" sign up about possible damage to pot metal, alloys etc.
Luckily, there was a V6 Fiero at PnP that week. I've think I've only seen 3 V6 cars in 15 years (usually Duke engines).

Mike should find them on any 80-90's GM (don't know about newer models).
He'll have to pull the alternator and drive them out with a hammer and punch.

The thing centers the bolt and closes the gap when the bolt is tightened.



[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 05-31-2014).]

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85 SE VIN 9
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Report this Post05-31-2014 02:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 85 SE VIN 9Click Here to Email 85 SE VIN 9Send a Private Message to 85 SE VIN 9Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
TFS sells replacement alternator brackets that have stronger arms and include the sleeve. I just checked the one I have. Maybe they sell the sleeves also.
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85 SE VIN 9
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Report this Post05-31-2014 06:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 85 SE VIN 9Click Here to Email 85 SE VIN 9Send a Private Message to 85 SE VIN 9Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
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Mike142
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Report this Post06-02-2014 07:20 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike142Send a Private Message to Mike142Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hey guys,

Quick update,

After fighting with the alternator for the good part of 2 hours last night, and running out of daylight, I was able to get a small washer in there. The funny thing is that the whole sleeve isn't gone, apparently the flange on the inside has worn away. I first tried to get a pretty beefy washer in there, but there was no way. I got a standard thin washer to go in, used a centerpunch to line everything up, then finally got the bolt back in there. She's sitting MUCH tighter than she was before. Today I'll go back out there with the daylight and get the belt back on and tensioned and such.

I will say this, though....I will likely just get a new bracket from TFS if they still have them if (when, hahha) I have to change the alternator.

Thanks again guys,

Mike
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Mike142
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Report this Post06-02-2014 07:23 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Mike142Send a Private Message to Mike142Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Mike142

67 posts
Member since Jun 2011
Hey, 85SE where did you see those in The Fiero Store? I just did a quick look-see and didn't see them.

Thanks!

Mike
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85 SE VIN 9
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Report this Post06-02-2014 08:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 85 SE VIN 9Click Here to Email 85 SE VIN 9Send a Private Message to 85 SE VIN 9Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I can't find it either. I sent them an email asking what's up. Things do come and go at TFS.
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85 SE VIN 9
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Report this Post06-03-2014 06:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 85 SE VIN 9Click Here to Email 85 SE VIN 9Send a Private Message to 85 SE VIN 9Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
They say it's sold out until later this summer.
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85 SE VIN 9
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Report this Post10-06-2014 09:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 85 SE VIN 9Click Here to Email 85 SE VIN 9Send a Private Message to 85 SE VIN 9Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
They currently have them under Alternators.
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