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Options on cheap rebuild of Chevy 235? by IanT720
Started on: 03-16-2016 09:28 AM
Replies: 20 (364 views)
Last post by: Quad Raider on 04-29-2016 11:14 PM
IanT720
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Report this Post03-16-2016 09:28 AM Click Here to See the Profile for IanT720Click Here to Email IanT720Send a Private Message to IanT720Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hey guys I scored a '55 Chevy Belair in fall. It's a true barn find, 235, Powerglide, 4 doors and patina . I got the car running and driving actually. The odometer says 50,000 miles. I believe it. I don't think the engine has ever been rebuilt. As of now, it runs smooth. But has lots of blow by, and low power. It burns a little oil on startup but smokes a lot from the breathers. I'm sure it's just worn out. Also I can actually rotate the engine easily by grabbing the radiator fan. So me thinks it has low compression, and coupled with the blow by. I bet the rings are shot. I'm on a very very tight budget. I already removed the engine.
-should I plan on new, stock rings and a hone?
-what do I measure?
-what's the limit where I need a bore?
I really don't want to buy oversized Pistons. But will if I have too. Opinions?

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Thunderstruck GT
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Report this Post03-16-2016 09:52 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Thunderstruck GTSend a Private Message to Thunderstruck GTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Rings probably just stuck.

Try running some Marvel Mystery Oil through it.

Pour about a 1/2 cup into each cylinder, let sit for a few days (longer is better) and put about 25% of it in an oil change.

Works a good percentage of the time.
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IanT720
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Report this Post03-16-2016 10:37 AM Click Here to See the Profile for IanT720Click Here to Email IanT720Send a Private Message to IanT720Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Thunderstruck GT:

Rings probably just stuck.

Try running some Marvel Mystery Oil through it.

Pour about a 1/2 cup into each cylinder, let sit for a few days (longer is better) and put about 25% of it in an oil change.

Works a good percentage of the time.


Interesting! Will try that.
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Patrick
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Report this Post03-16-2016 03:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Do those old engines have valve guide seals? If so, I'd imagine they'd be hard as stone by now.
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IanT720
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Report this Post03-16-2016 08:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for IanT720Click Here to Email IanT720Send a Private Message to IanT720Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:


Do those old engines have valve guide seals? If so, I'd imagine they'd be hard as stone by now.


No idea, but I'm sure it has something like that. I'm sure that's why it burns a little oil on startup. But not the blow by out the breather.
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rogergarrison
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Report this Post03-22-2016 09:18 AM Click Here to See the Profile for rogergarrisonClick Here to Email rogergarrisonSend a Private Message to rogergarrisonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If you search around, Offenhauser made a dual carb intake and split (dual) exhaust manifold for them. Gives you quite a bit of pep. Its the same engine used from 53-55 in Corvettes.
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IanT720
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Report this Post03-22-2016 10:28 AM Click Here to See the Profile for IanT720Click Here to Email IanT720Send a Private Message to IanT720Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rogergarrison:

If you search around, Offenhauser made a dual carb intake and split (dual) exhaust manifold for them. Gives you quite a bit of pep. Its the same engine used from 53-55 in Corvettes.


I've seen those, pretty cool! But my money goes to the Fiero

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Hank is Here
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Report this Post03-23-2016 12:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Hank is HereClick Here to Email Hank is HereSend a Private Message to Hank is HereEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Ah the old stove bolt I6's. If it has 50K and has never been rebuilt it does need a refersh. It it were me...I would do an old school inframe ring job and lapping of the valves. Pop off the head, pull the pan and go for it. While not much cost but would be a little more time I would recommed replacing the rear main seal with one of those chinese finger trap tools. --I think by 55 they had stopped all rear slingers and had rear main seals.
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IanT720
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Report this Post03-23-2016 05:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for IanT720Click Here to Email IanT720Send a Private Message to IanT720Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Hank is Here:

Ah the old stove bolt I6's. If it has 50K and has never been rebuilt it does need a refersh. It it were me...I would do an old school inframe ring job and lapping of the valves. Pop off the head, pull the pan and go for it. While not much cost but would be a little more time I would recommed replacing the rear main seal with one of those chinese finger trap tools. --I think by 55 they had stopped all rear slingers and had rear main seals.


Alright you have to educate me a little, in frame ring job? Just fresh rings? Lapping the valves? Just like a 3 angle grind? And I believe it has a rope rear seal.
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Report this Post03-24-2016 08:03 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Hank is HereClick Here to Email Hank is HereSend a Private Message to Hank is HereEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by IanT720:


Alright you have to educate me a little, in frame ring job? Just fresh rings? Lapping the valves? Just like a 3 angle grind? And I believe it has a rope rear seal.



This is all old school methods...at least to me. While I have never done it on a 235 in a car, I have done the head and valve lap on a 235 in a truck.
In frame...don't pull the motor just leave it sit in the car while doing the rings. Pull the head, pull the pan, remove the rod caps and bring the pistons out the top...replace rings, put back togther...viola! If you feel like it you could even run a quick flex hone on the cylinders.

Valve lap? this is not a full valve job, you don't really cut the valve/seats but just reseat the valves. Basically remove the springs, remove the valve, add some valve granding compound to the valve/seat and spin away. If you geel up to it hook a drill to the steam of the valve. If you replace the main seal it is good to loosen the main caps to get a little sag/wiggle our to geat the new rear main seal in place.

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Report this Post03-24-2016 09:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Thunderstruck GTSend a Private Message to Thunderstruck GTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Hank is Here:
This is all old school methods...at least to me. While I have never done it on a 235 in a car, I have done the head and valve lap on a 235 in a truck.
In frame...don't pull the motor just leave it sit in the car while doing the rings. Pull the head, pull the pan, remove the rod caps and bring the pistons out the top...replace rings, put back togther...viola! If you feel like it you could even run a quick flex hone on the cylinders.

Valve lap? this is not a full valve job, you don't really cut the valve/seats but just reseat the valves. Basically remove the springs, remove the valve, add some valve granding compound to the valve/seat and spin away. If you geel up to it hook a drill to the steam of the valve. If you replace the main seal it is good to loosen the main caps to get a little sag/wiggle our to geat the new rear main seal in place.


LOL!

Try doing this on todays cars.
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IanT720
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Report this Post03-24-2016 09:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for IanT720Click Here to Email IanT720Send a Private Message to IanT720Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks for the insight! I actually got the engine on a stand so that makes my life easier haha. I will let you know how it goes!
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Report this Post03-24-2016 04:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rogergarrisonClick Here to Email rogergarrisonSend a Private Message to rogergarrisonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Earlier versions of that engine, I think pre 54, didnt even have bearing inserts. They were called babbit bearings, where you just polished the block and caps surfaces.
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IanT720
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Report this Post03-24-2016 04:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for IanT720Click Here to Email IanT720Send a Private Message to IanT720Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rogergarrison:

Earlier versions of that engine, I think pre 54, didnt even have bearing inserts. They were called babbit bearings, where you just polished the block and caps surfaces.


Really? Non-detergent oil's gotta be a must in those! Heck mine, since it's a Belair has the optional oil filter lol

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Report this Post03-27-2016 06:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rogergarrisonClick Here to Email rogergarrisonSend a Private Message to rogergarrisonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I had a 53 Bel Air convertible and a 55 hardtop. I think the 53 had the babbit bearings, the 55 had an optional canister type filter that used a roll ot toilet paper as a filter if im remembering right. Power steering pump was the back of the generator. It also had vacuum wipers that quit when you gave it gas.
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Patrick
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Report this Post03-28-2016 02:10 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
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Originally posted by rogergarrison:

It also had vacuum wipers that quit when you gave it gas.


Yep, I recall my parents' 55 Chev and how the wipers would slow down when the car went up a long hill.

 
quote
Originally posted by rogergarrison:

...the 55 had an optional canister type filter that used a roll ot toilet paper as a filter if im remembering right.


I'm old enough to remember seeing ads in magazines for the toilet-paper-roll-oil-filter gimmick/gizmo. I guarantee it wasn't OEM on the '55.

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 03-28-2016).]

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IanT720
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Report this Post03-28-2016 08:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for IanT720Click Here to Email IanT720Send a Private Message to IanT720Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Oh man! I thought you guys were joking! Hahaha. Mine has the optional external filter. It's like a big can which has an element inside. Not sure what it looks like though.
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Report this Post03-28-2016 06:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rogergarrisonClick Here to Email rogergarrisonSend a Private Message to rogergarrisonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
No that filter was aftermarket. I guess I wasnt clear enough saying optional. It was not from the factory. And yes, I had cars with the factory canister type too. How many have seen oil filled air cleaners. .....5 quarts in the block and 1 in the air filter....? Both of my Mercedes SLs used an alloy canister, with a replaceable filter inside. It was under the block like a spin on filter. Its hard to believe cars all didnt come with an oil filter unless you ordered it.

[This message has been edited by rogergarrison (edited 03-28-2016).]

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Patrick
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Report this Post03-28-2016 06:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rogergarrison:

How many have seen oil filled air cleaners. .....5 quarts in the block and 1 in the air filter....?


...
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Hank is Here
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Report this Post03-31-2016 10:16 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Hank is HereClick Here to Email Hank is HereSend a Private Message to Hank is HereEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have heard of the tiolet paper filters but never bothered to see one before. Do you get better filtering if you use quilted double ply? lol These actually look like they could contaminate more than they would filter. Heck even the Russian paper oil filters for my motorcycle are better than TP.

I am still very familiar with these old engines, oil bath air filters, vacuum wipers and such. My father has a 1946 Chevy 1.5 ton with a 216, a 1950 Chevy sedan with a 216, and a 1966 pannel truck with a 292. Heck we still have some misc 235 parts (crank, head) sitting around as well as a spare compelte 216. I love the whole family of GM stovebolt I6 engines. They are not powerful, but they run well and long.

How many folks can have driven a three of the tree, or a vehicle with a two speed rear, or a vehicle with more than one transmission, a vehicle with all mechanical brakes, etc.
Maybe working on all of this stuff is why I hate new cars.
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Report this Post04-29-2016 11:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Quad RaiderClick Here to Email Quad RaiderSend a Private Message to Quad RaiderEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
In the early 90s I bought a basket case 68 Chevy pickup. It had been sitting in a guy's front yard for years and he sold it to me for $50, as long as I didn't break the rotten eggs a chicken had laid behind one of the wheels. We towed it home, cleaned the turpentine out of the gas tank and put a battery and carburetor kit in it and it started right up. Never used oil or smoked. I can't remember what size it was, either a 250 or 292, but it was bulletproof.
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