I admit, I was one of the people who wasn't aware that the FB page wasn't owned by Pennocks. FB is ok, until it's time to search for something that was posted as a past event.
Some SEO optimization would certainly help, as the forum should be the first hit when anyone is searching for Fieros. In addition to that someone mentioned a modernization of the site look and feel. While it would help I cannot imagine what a huge undertaking that would be, unless you wanted to "Archive" the old site (make it a searchable database) and simply port users onto the new one.
It's true that internet forums aren't in vogue with younger users, but it remains one of the best ways to have detailed conversations with others about complex issues. I cannot fathom trying to read through a troubleshooting thread on Facebook.
Selfishly, I hope this site never goes away, or at minimum users are allowed to purchase the site on disk before shutdown. In a lot of ways, this site and the information it contains is one of the last unexplored links I have with my Dad. For whatever reason, he never shared a lot on information with me about this car; despite him knowing of our mutual interest. I was never as mechanically inclined as him, he was never as computer savvy as me; we all have our specialties. Whenever I would ask about what was going on with the Fiero, he would just give me a short description, if I asked for details he would gloss over, I don't know why.
I know he never intended me to get the car, mentioning in his build thread that he would have to sell it after his stroke; although I assume that had more to do with him being concerned about outliving his retirement and knowing I couldn't afford to purchase it from him.
And now, whether intended or not, I have this legacy to carry on; and the best person to help me care for and keep this thing on the road only exists here, through the magic of a search button and posting history.
For the final 15 years of his life he interacted with family, car nuts at drives and shows, and the members of the forum here. For those of you that interacted with him on the forums, that makes you among those that knew him best. When I come here looking for an answer through his post history or asking you guys, it's like being able to pick his brain. I hope I am able to do that for a while yet.
D
[This message has been edited by California Kid (edited 02-14-2020).]
I've been coming here for almost 20 years and like others have said, its the first place I visit each day, and the last site I visit before bed. I'd hate to see it go away. I don't think it needs any updates, it works just fine as it is. Only thing I wish we could have done was force everyone to place photo's on the Pennocks Server so we could see all the images from the older threads. Some great info out there but w/ out photo's its kind of wasted. If you do decide to end the forum, please allow us to purchase a copy of the database. Just don't forget that not all of us have DVD drives, so make it available on USB drives too.
I'm sorry things have changed so much for you over the years. I hope in some way this forum can become a source of income, or lead to a better future for you. I just have a few thoughts since so many others have already expressed good ones..
1. I cannot post using an Android phone, so I barely post anymore. Ever since the more mobile verrsion was created, It does not allow you to place a password in the field, so you cant actually log in.. When you go to reply to a post and click the password field, the keyboard pops up and immmediately goes away. Had this same issue on a few Android phones so gave up attempting to post fromthem. Also, the format goes a little wierd -placing the Forum banner as a floater across the middle screen, covering the thread itself, so you have to move the posts around the floating banner to read them. It looks wierd, and makes where folks can't post, nor easily read all the posts. This could be an issue that leads to less traffic, and certainly less positng since so many of us seem to live off mobile devices. . (I grabbed a laptop to post this, but normally would have read the forum from a mobile).
2. What about reaching out to the established Fiero Clubs and having a small section up top for links to each of them. Maybe charge a small monthly (or yearly fee)., and post their club logo with a link to their websites. It's not clutter, won't be an obtrusive ad, would actually provide a service to both you and the clubs, and maybe a source of income to you?
3. As a longtime member of this forum (At least 20 + years at this point), I'd love a copy of all the posts - 30 gigs or not. If you were able to somehow bundle it and sell that I'm sure quite a few of us would buy a copy. There is so much history here.
4. I have changed cars a lot over the years. Sold all the Fieros, bought one again, but no matter what cars I've had, there was always helpful info on this forum about them (Had an LS4, Grand Prix etc) and when looking to fight some issue, oddly i always found good info here, so I truly hope it stays Pennocks.
Smartaxel, I use android, Samsung S9, and dont have an issue. Some may for some reason? I do know you have to log in, and then go to a post to reply or post.
2.5. Yeah, apparently if I log in ahead of time, it captures the password and works. (Thanks!). I'm posting this from the phone. Otherwise it doesnt at all. Samsung a20 here, and Moto g7 power, both with the issue. Not sure folks would know they had to log on first. I totally didn't. Thanks!
1. I cannot post using an Android phone, so I barely post anymore. Ever since the more mobile verrsion was created, It does not allow you to place a password in the field, so you cant actually log in... When you go to reply to a post and click the password field, the keyboard pops up and immmediately goes away.
Well, that's odd. It isn't supposed to do that. I have no issues on my Android phone.
quote
Also, the format goes a little wierd -placing the Forum banner as a floater across the middle screen, covering the thread itself, so you have to move the posts around the floating banner to read them.
The forum banner should be on the top, not the middle of the screen (see below screenshots)
quote
2. What about reaching out to the established Fiero Clubs and having a small section up top for links to each of them. Maybe charge a small monthly (or yearly fee)., and post their club logo with a link to their websites. It's not clutter, won't be an obtrusive ad, would actually provide a service to both you and the clubs, and maybe a source of income to you?
Yes, I like that idea.
Anyway, I'm not sure why it looks and works so weird on your phone. I've attached a few screenshots of how it is supposed to look.
Also, if you are on your mobile phone, rotating your phone to landscape mode causes the forum to automatically switch to "classic" GUI.
I think I know what caused the "floating" forum banner on some devices. That should be fixed now. Still no idea why you aren't able to enter your password. Perhaps it was caused by the same problem.
The banner also "floats" in the middle of the screen for me, most of the time. I'm on a Galaxy S8 using the DuckDuckGo browser. It's kind of a nuisance, but when I'm on my phone I can just work around it.
I've been here for almost 20 years. I found my way here from one of the old Fiero mailing lists. Although I'm not very active, I can't really imagine the Fiero scene without PFF.
EDIT: **And, just like that, it's fixed.**
[This message has been edited by FieroJimmy (edited 02-15-2020).]
An some of us will never understand why we have pay for a community we’ve contributed to for over decade..This is getting absolutely ridiculous an probably why a lot fellow members find themselves opening up an actual shop manual before we ever get any suggestions from something else we’re eventually going to have pay for 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
An some of us will never understand why we have pay for a community we’ve contributed to for over decade..This is getting absolutely ridiculous an probably why a lot fellow members find themselves opening up an actual shop manual before we ever get any suggestions from something else we’re eventually going to have pay for 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
87 blu quad fourmula out
Not sure what you are saying here. You think it's ridiculous I'm trying to make a buck off of PFF? And that's the reason people don't come here anymore?
I think I know what caused the "floating" forum banner on some devices. That should be fixed now. Still no idea why you aren't able to enter your password. Perhaps it was caused by the same problem.
The floater is fixed. The password issue not yet. (Thanks for floater). When you click the password field, the keyboard pops up for maybe a second then goes away immediately. You can't enter a password without the keyboard. Pics below
An some of us will never understand why we have pay for a community we’ve contributed to for over decade..This is getting absolutely ridiculous an probably why a lot fellow members find themselves opening up an actual shop manual before we ever get any suggestions from something else we’re eventually going to have pay for 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
87 blu quad fourmula out
Oxf,
Its costly to run the site. Hosting costs money, storage costs money, and there is all the time Cliff has to spend managing things and dealing with general stupidity and drama that comes with a forum. I dont see how anyone would not understand that he should make a few dollars (some compensation) for managing this place for 20 years. I manage a few websites for people (for free) and find it a general pain in the butt. It's time consuming, and time is worth money.. especially as we are all getting older and dont have as much time left as we used to.
Cliff- no matter what you do, I think Facebook will take a huge chunk of traffic. Current generation prefers handheld devices and Facebook for everything. That may change as Millenials dont seem to like Facebook as much, but arguably they arent into cars that much either. I think all forums will dwindle, no.matter how good they are.
I can understand the situation you're in. About a decade ago, another large auto-hobby conglomerate (Andy's auto or something), was on a buying spree, and bought up a huge Ford forum, and a few of the GM forums. Thankfully, the look and feel didn't change much, and the mods were allowed to keep being mods if they wanted.
Some forums, including car forums and other hobbies, have small "member packets" for the paying members each year. In addition to the option of the dedicated sub forum (I know I wouldn't mind moving my N.C. Fiero site here, especially with some of the hosting issues I was/am having), the other plays had little things each year, member badges and such. And I would just point my domain to my 'sub forum' here, so more ad traffic for you!
I chip in a little to you each year, but I would much rather pay more monthly/yearly, than see this place go away. I do not, and will not, use facebook.
I talk with other guys who are on the "car groups" on facebook... and there's no history, no "threads", just constant churning of the same damn questions. Now I know that happens here, from people either not using search, or too many threads popping up because they go off topic.
I also would gladly pay you for a way to export my private messages. I could probably find a faster way to compile them into coherent Word files that way, versus the cut-paste-format-edit method I've been trying. lol
Sorry to hear there's a Facebook PFF impostor.
[This message has been edited by Trinten (edited 02-16-2020).]
I have been a member here for years. I do not actually post much, as I am not terribly social, however there is a plethora of information on this site. *IF* you do decide to shut it down or sell it off, I would gladly pay for a copy of the content, as some others have mentioned. I pray things turn around for you soon, and you are able to keep the forum up and going.
------------------ --Jess
'87GT - stock cruiser '86SE - parts car '85SE - ...eh, ...missing the chassis
"If you expect the unexpected, was it really even UNexpected in the first place?"
Cliff, are you still selling the PFF on CD? Does it have all of the pictures in the messages? I know that some of the pics have been removed to save server space but I was wondering if the CD has the pics?
BTW, you should increase your price. It's still a great deal at twice the price.
Cliff, are you still selling the PFF on CD? Does it have all of the pictures in the messages? I know that some of the pics have been removed to save server space but I was wondering if the CD has the pics?
No, since it no longer fits on a single DVD. It had all pictures (that were posted on the PFF server). I never removed images to save server space. I used to delete unused imaged (images that were not used in any of the posts on PFF) to prevent people from using the PFF servers as their personal photo storage.
I can probably put it on a 64Gb flash drive or something similar, but I would have to rewrite the program I wrote back then to access the data.
Cliff, Even though this site does not sell anything you could actually monetize it you have a membership base and programming skills. I invest in domains. http://www.premiumnamedomain.com. I hosted Tylerstoy website early on for about a year. I also would like to preserve the database and also understand hurdles of domains. If you would like to discuss your thoughts and objectives send me a pm I would happily share views.
Cliff, wow, I didn't know you were divorced. Man I'm envious. Never have I offered you a donation but today I will even though I haven't worked for over a year and a half. I enjoy the forum you provide.
So anyway, floating banner fixed. But keyboard still disappears to log in. Google Chrome was on this phone at purchase--must be what I use? J2. Bought new last year.
No Google search engine for me. I use Startpage or Dogpile and Duckduckgo. Google is a vampire. No Facebook. Zuckerberg is a related Vampire. No app stuff because it takes some sort of Google log in.
Most all the frequent sellers here are most likely participating in the Facebook group and are thankful that PENNOCKS is the title of the FB group for making their sales trail easier for buyers to follow.
The trolling on for-sale threads has moved some traffic away from the forum version of Pennocks to other places. Comments like: 'why should I buy yours when I can buy this other one for less' , instead of sending the seller a PM like a human being, which means that open trolling was the only goal. People can sell on plenty of other locations instead of spending time defending their price or condition. People posting in this thread do some of the trolling.
Trolling is something that all internet locations struggle with handling, but not having it addressed accentuates the problem that ultimately leads to a downturn in traffic. And for the Construction Zone forum comment guy he should know that some of us barely look at it.
I would definitely buy a USB stick with PFF. How about a yearly subscription with updates every 3 to 6 months which allows us to download the new posts and add them to our copy of the PFF database?
Originally posted by sourmash: So anyway, floating banner fixed. But keyboard still disappears to log in. Google Chrome was on this phone at purchase--must be what I use? J2. Bought new last year.
No Google search engine for me. I use Startpage or Dogpile and Duckduckgo. Google is a vampire. No Facebook. Zuckerberg is a related Vampire. No app stuff because it takes some sort of Google log in.
Most all the frequent sellers here are most likely participating in the Facebook group and are thankful that PENNOCKS is the title of the FB group for making their sales trail easier for buyers to follow.
Not true, just flat out not true. It's all relegated to the "Fiero Engine Conversion", "Fiero", and "Fiero Classifieds" pages, which are not at all linked to the "Fake" Pennocks page. You would know this if you had any idea how the things you fail to utilize out of paranoia (the irony that you're using an Android phone and using GOOGLE Chrome, is not lost on me).
If you do not embrace and implement new tools, the problem that Cliff is having will only continue, don't stick your head in the sand and say "Well that's for the young folk" if you care at all about this hobby surviving.
Sorry for being somewhat aggressive, but this type of mentality bothers me when it leads directly to why Cliff is in this problem to begin with.
I would definitely buy a USB stick with PFF. How about a yearly subscription with updates every 3 to 6 months which allows us to download the new posts and add them to our copy of the PFF database?
I think that's a great idea, but my problem now is that even though it's easy for me to put the data on a USB stick, making the data easily accessible is another story. I would need to write a program (or find some existing program that can do it).
I think that's a great idea, but my problem now is that even though it's easy for me to put the data on a USB stick, making the data easily accessible is another story. I would need to write a program (or find some existing program that can do it).
Why not host it on Google Drive for all to download? 1TB of Google Drive space is RIDICULOUSLY cheap. Could even provide the shareable Google Drive "Download View" link for a small fee to others too?
Not true, just flat out not true. It's all relegated to the "Fiero Engine Conversion", "Fiero", and "Fiero Classifieds" pages, which are not at all linked to the "Fake" Pennocks page. You would know this if you had any idea how the things you fail to utilize out of paranoia (the irony that you're using an Android phone and using GOOGLE Chrome, is not lost on me).
No, akshoelee you missed the intentional irony. The problem with the internet is people capable of posting on it aren't always capable of understanding it. Really it's our rote-learning education to blame which commands the ability to produce 'something' without having to have knowledge of the content. In 1492, Columbus sailed the ocean blue...
And how come I just found a cute little mouse named George talking about status on development and selling some GT tail light lenses on FB Pennocks?
I just learned Facebookers created a page and used his name without asking. Wow. After the horse was out of the barn Cliff accepted it and isn't warring over it. That's good for his temperament but has cost him financially. You're a supporter?!
I created a FB dealio once and joined some groups to sell items on a phone that wasn't assigned to me. Not long after FB wanted me to upload a pic of myself to connect with an identity. I don't use Facebook for a REASON. The REASON is the same as 10s of millions of other deplorables. Millions have since stopped by choice, not paranoia. We don't want to encourage the vampire privacy thefts that the platform has admitted to, some endangering children. Per Android, it's a better platform of the two majors (that's called an opinion). Apple makes continual admissions of privacy thefts by the company and it's affiliates which come out periodically. Still, I chose an iPhone work phone at my last job to compare the two. Ick. Sucked. Android has known privacy issues too. I used the installed Chrome browser to initially search for the engines mentioned which stay open tab. If I had the ability of one of my acquaintances who can wipe a new phone and root it with his own chosen code and programs, I would.
quote
If you do not embrace and implement new tools, the problem that Cliff is having will only continue, don't stick your head in the sand and say "Well that's for the young folk" if you care at all about this hobby surviving.
So again you're saying to embrace facebook Pennocks instead of using this forum---and that will help Cliff. Ah, it's a make it worse so it can get better thing.
The people my age created the platforms that are being expanded upon by younger people. So don't pretend the younger people invented it. Someone developed the transistor one day. Thankfully Al Gore invented this technology so everyone can know the mood and pronouns of snowflakes.
This is the forum which I (the unemployed) just contributed a little funds to to help Cliff some. I have property taxes, property insurance/car insurances due this month on top of the house and utilities payments that are always due each month. There is no unemployment or welfare of any kind in my near future. Each month is an uncertainty. Each month. This month especially.
Give him a few bucks. I'll send him a few dollars when I can.
quote
Sorry for being somewhat aggressive, but this type of mentality bothers me when it leads directly to why Cliff is in this problem to begin with.
You can apologize to yourself. YOU saying someone posting here is directly responsible for his divorce, loss of work, lack of funds, theft of his name while pretending to not be part of the exit from forums, well....typical. I'm not interested in being a Googling Facbooker. Although I gotta admit being a snowflake does sound appealing. I won't say I won't give it a try.
Originally posted by sourmash: I just learned Facebookers created a page and used his name without asking. Wow. After the horse was out of the barn Cliff accepted it and isn't warring over it. That's good for his temperament but has cost him financially. You're a supporter?!
Clearly you did not read much about what I said prior. I suggested that we direct these groups, ALL of them, not just the sparsely viewed Pennock's FB group, over to the forums. To put it nice and simple for you, to work together as the respect given to this page on these groups is large.
quote
Originally posted by sourmash: I created a FB dealio once and joined some groups to sell items on a phone that wasn't assigned to me. Not long after FB wanted me to upload a pic of myself to connect with an identity. I don't use Facebook for a REASON. The REASON is the same as 10s of millions of other deplorables. Millions have since stopped by choice, not paranoia. We don't want to encourage the vampire privacy thefts that the platform has admitted to, some endangering children. Per Android, it's a better platform of the two majors (that's called an opinion). Apple makes continual admissions of privacy thefts by the company and it's affiliates which come out periodically. Still, I chose an iPhone work phone at my last job to compare the two. Ick. Sucked. Android has known privacy issues too. I used the installed Chrome browser to initially search for the engines mentioned which stay open tab. If I had the ability of one of my acquaintances who can wipe a new phone and root it with his own chosen code and programs, I would.
Rooting an Android phone fixes part of that issue, however the bigger issue is the Android kernel itself and how since it is not truly Open Source and does meet the GNU standard. Source, I run Arch Linux on most of my machines and am well versed in this kind of stuff. The kernel can be purified but I don't think you care to look into that from your high-horse.
I share your ideologies, probably more than you realize, however I choose to operate from within as many people could use the education and guidance, I guess that is one difference between me and you.
quote
Originally posted by sourmash: So again you're saying to embrace facebook Pennocks instead of using this forum---and that will help Cliff. Ah, it's a make it worse so it can get better thing.
No, again, go back and read what I said on page 2 or 3. I said we communicate with them and link back to the forums. Read.
quote
Originally posted by sourmash: The people my age created the platforms that are being expanded upon by younger people. So don't pretend the younger people invented it. Someone developed the transistor one day. Thankfully Al Gore invented this technology so everyone can know the mood and pronouns of snowflakes.
Never did I imply that "younger" people invented it, but I'd be willing to bet that younger people ARE embracing the technologies more, as your inability to root a phone and co-exist with these tools shows. All I am suggesting is to link back to the forums as a reference point and as a discussion area. Facebook offers things that the forums cannot, HOWEVER, the forums offer I'd argue MORE things that Facebook cannot offer.
quote
Originally posted by sourmash: This is the forum which I (the unemployed) just contributed a little funds to to help Cliff some. I have property taxes, property insurance/car insurances due this month on top of the house and utilities payments that are always due each month. There is no unemployment or welfare of any kind in my near future. Each month is an uncertainty. Each month. This month especially.
Other than trying to earn sympathy points, I fail to see the relevance.
quote
Originally posted by sourmash: You can apologize to yourself. YOU saying someone posting here is directly responsible for his divorce, loss of work, lack of funds, theft of his name while pretending to not be part of the exit from forums, well....typical. I'm not interested in being a Googling Facbooker. Although I gotta admit being a snowflake does sound appealing. I won't say I won't give it a try.
Wow, way to take my entire comment out of context. It is in NO WAY Cliff's fault for anything, rather people not linking things back to the forums AND not communicating is what is leading to these problems. The monotization and proper ad revenue gathering, in addition to several great ideas for a pay-wall model are great ways to increase money for Cliff and the site. I love you're trying to inject politics into this subtly, even though I probably share many of the same core philosophies. It makes me feel real grimy knowing I share these things with someone making such a terrible argument as this.
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Originally posted by sourmash: I'm not interested in being a Googling Facbooker
Shows A LOT.
[This message has been edited by Vicophine (edited 02-18-2020).]
Don't hate me. It's just trying to get with your suggestion of embracing that new wave you're espousing. top attacking what you don't understand. You made false statements. People will correct you in the world. You aren't even following your own quotes. I said most frequent sellers here are most likely selling in the FB Pennocks. Your quote is:
quote
Not true, just flat out not true. It's all relegated to the "Fiero Engine Conversion", "Fiero", and "Fiero Classifieds" pages, which are not at all linked to the "Fake" Pennocks page. You would know this if you had any idea how the things you fail to utilize out of paranoia (the irony that you're using an Android phone and using GOOGLE Chrome, is not lost on me).
You missed the irony. And I proved how right I was and how wrong you are with Startpage in .26 seconds wherein George is over there too with new lenses to produce/sell.
You attacked with 'paranoia" comments because I said I don't Facebook or Google. Reality says I vote with my feet and don't want to sacrifice more privacy than needed to companies that are found to be (1) oppressive, (2) invasive (3) heading for regulatory action. You've made your stand and taken the adverse position and anything other than your behavior is paranoia. Now you won't acknowledge that. MY position is called PRINCIPLE. Activism. Practicing by example.
Nobody said the straw argument that Cliff was responsible for his situation. You said I am to blame (after I said I was on my way to sending him money directly). What world is that?
IYou said it was my fault he's in his situation for not embracing new blah-blah-blah.
My acquaintance is running it on Linux, so you're close to catching up here.
My initial posting inject the obvious that those two companies are vampires on the same side. You responded it was paranoia, I guess because you support them by using them. I don't have to do what you do. Why would you care what search engine I use?
This is about Cliff's forum. Stop trying to make it about me--or really about you pretending to white knight. Give Cliff some money directly. If an unemployed person currently experiencing a temporary heavy debt load this month can manage something, so can most anybody. You see, it's not about you or me. It's about the forum. 11.79 or so is 10 Euro. 21.59 or so is 20 Euro.
Don't hate me. It's just trying to get with your suggestion of embracing that new wave you're espousing. top attacking what you don't understand. You made false statements. People will correct you in the world. You aren't even following your own quotes. I said most frequent sellers here are most likely selling in the FB Pennocks. Your quote is:
You missed the irony. And I proved how right I was and how wrong you are with Startpage in .26 seconds wherein George is over there too with new lenses to produce/sell.
You attacked with 'paranoia" comments because I said I don't Facebook or Google. Reality says I vote with my feet and don't want to sacrifice more privacy than needed to companies that are found to be (1) oppressive, (2) invasive (3) heading for regulatory action. You've made your stand and taken the adverse position and anything other than your behavior is paranoia. Now you won't acknowledge that. MY position is called PRINCIPLE. Activism. Practicing by example.
Nobody said the straw argument that Cliff was responsible for his situation. You said I am to blame (after I said I was on my way to sending him money directly). What world is that?
IYou said it was my fault he's in his situation for not embracing new blah-blah-blah.
My acquaintance is running it on Linux, so you're close to catching up here.
My initial posting inject the obvious that those two companies are vampires on the same side. You responded it was paranoia, I guess because you support them by using them. I don't have to do what you do. Why would you care what search engine I use?
This is about Cliff's forum. Stop trying to make it about me--or really about you pretending to white knight. Give Cliff some money directly. If an unemployed person currently experiencing a temporary heavy debt load this month can manage something, so can most anybody. You see, it's not about you or me. It's about the forum. 11.79 or so is 10 Euro. 21.59 or so is 20 Euro.
I'll give you George, he is a good example to your point, however he also can be a perfectly example to my point. I do not blame him for going to Facebook since the reach in general will be higher there than this forum, however, communication with him in regards to possibly hosting the orders here as a way to bring about more ad revenue for the forum and the income that Cliff deserves.
It's all about the forum and the Fiero communities survival as a whole as well, these two topics should be intertwined. Do you disagree that ignoring modern day social media, where a lot of Fiero discussion is taking place, is a good thing? That is my ENTIRE point, that is why I truly feel like we should communicate and try to work together.
I would also just like to add, I feel that working together with various groups, whether it be social media or what have you is imperative for our hobbies survival. I've seen it first hand, the Michigan Fiero Club is literally about to completely die and fold because of two reasons: Peoples age and "retiring down to Florida", and the inability for them to properly utilize social media and even e-mail. I've heard this from the VP themselves, and it to me it's just incredibly sad. I hope for the best and will do what I can to help that, but it does speak to a larger problem in our communities!
[This message has been edited by Vicophine (edited 02-18-2020).]
Yes, I'm completely on board with this being about Cliff's presence in Fiero community and it's expansion. The FB version it seems he's looking at as water under the bridge and isn't associated with him. Does the FB group gain financially from using his name and his association in this forum? That's something I don't know.
His archives are worth a fair amount, and from what people post there isn't another avenue that can currently offer a simpler access to archived info? But if they're available for sale in bulk can he protect it from a similar unofficial use? Taking the name was easy. Buying the bulk and it getting posted online for someone else's benefit, is that a danger?
If he's got no other avenue for support currently, maximize what you have. Hey guys (the guys at the FB site), I'm not flush like before so maybe it's time to take back some of what's mine even if it's just the name so I can put it to work for myself. Or start his own PennocksFieroForum on FB. There are many of us who be there though.
Originally posted by sourmash: Yes, I'm completely on board with this being about Cliff's presence in Fiero community and it's expansion. The FB version it seems he's looking at as water under the bridge and isn't associated with him. Does the FB group gain financially from using his name and his association in this forum? That's something I don't know.
I do not think so as I have been a moderator on several groups, and it seems only corporate groups get income or if it's a page setup for just yourself as a means of self-promotion. I am about 95% sure of these things, however, he is correct in that that page, and OTHER Fiero pages do take away ad revenue from Cliff.
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Originally posted by sourmash: His archives are worth a fair amount, and from what people post there isn't another avenue that can currently offer a simpler access to archived info? But if they're available for sale in bulk can he protect it from a similar unofficial use? Taking the name was easy. Buying the bulk and it getting posted online for someone else's benefit, is that a danger?
I believe there are some third party websites that can easily host 30GB of information that can have a pay-wall behind them, that however, that is not my area of expertise. If it generates money to Cliff AND keeps the forums alive, that would be perfect.
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If he's got no other avenue for support currently, maximize what you have. Hey guys (the guys at the FB site), I'm not flush like before so maybe it's time to take back some of what's mine even if it's just the name so I can put it to work for myself. Or start his own PennocksFieroForum on FB. There are many of us who be there though.
I agree with BOTH of these options, hell even if some where to make one directly from these forums on behalf of Cliff and just exclusively posted links back to the forums, that'd do a lot. Label it as the official one, may help. Again, I agree just keep spreading the word. I'll make a post later on today in the "Fiero" group, again, that one is way more heavily trafficked than the other ones, asking for assistance.
I'm glad we could come to an agreement and find mutual areas of cooperation! More need to do their part on BOTH sides of technology to assist Cliff AND keep the forum/communities alive.
[This message has been edited by Vicophine (edited 02-18-2020).]
I have been lurking for 6 months and registered today just to reply to this thread. I want you to succeeded.
I personally only deal with one forum that is pay to play and they seem to do very well. Its the AOMCI antique outboard motor club, Inc. They also have a Facebook presence where local chapters chat about upcoming events. Annual membership is $40, includes a regular magazine and forum access. Classifieds are free access to all but only paid members can post ads (here is a place to make some funds). The magazine could be a burden or a great advertising tool, if you feel like becoming or can get an editor/content creator. https://aomci.org/forums/
But more importantly I would urge you to become intimately familiar with Ryan Cochran's H.A.M.B and the Jalopy Journal, one of, if not the largest enthusiast automotive site, like yours with a narrow focus, in this case traditional hot rods and customs. They have also lost big volume to Instagram and Facebook, though his numbers are huge compared to yours. I have been a member for 15+ years. His "Alliance Membership" program could be your salvation. It is totally optional. For a $50 annual fee you get a custom plaque and discounts at well over a hundred companies. https://www.jalopyjournal.com/?page_id=176 Look at who he is working with, some of them could be with you as well. Not just Fiero specific parts but tires, wheels, car covers, glass, oils, welders, tools, paint suppliers the possibilities are endless. Members who sign up are given a red "Alliance Member" banner below their avatar, so all know who has ponied up and who has not. Ryan is very open on his dislike of FB and the state of his forum. I think you should actually call him, hunt him down if you have to and ask/plead/beg for advice.
Also you are leaving much (everything?) on the table with your merch. Frankly it stinks. I wanted to like something. Not everyone wants a hoodie with a GT on it, where is the black bumper love or the Formula love, Notchie love, hats, beanies, key chains, posters, books, licence plate frames ect. There has to be members who are graphic artists who can create original t-shirt content, for reasonable compensatio or, a cut or a percentage of sales. You don't have to make it up all yourself! When the HAMB puts stuff up it sells out amazing fast, then often shows up on eBay for a premium. https://jalopyjournal.mysho...llections/hard-parts Yes you need to buy stuff and stock-pile it. Takes some money to make money, partner with a merchandiser to profit from your "Brand". Ask Ryan how to do it! Have custom items created in limited by craftspeople who need to get paid for their work, market up reasonably 30% and distribute to your waiting audience. Using a third party supplier to handle shipping and production eats the profit and makes you charge more for lower quality stuff. Hot Rodders are just as cheap as Fiero folks yet they continue to shell out cash for good, high quality, hand selected HAMB merch, I have. You have a captive audience of Fiero lovers, give them what they want or didn't know they wanted.
Just trying to help.
Thanks for the site, I wish you success and prosperity.
I think that's a great idea, but my problem now is that even though it's easy for me to put the data on a USB stick, making the data easily accessible is another story. I would need to write a program (or find some existing program that can do it).
I think that's a great idea, too. I'm on board for a USB if you do this. I would definitely buy one.
I have been lurking for 6 months and registered today just to reply to this thread.
First of all, thank you for all your comments and ideas! And (a belated) welcome!
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Also you are leaving much (everything?) on the table with your merch. Frankly it stinks.
As much as it pains me to say it, I agree. I am also a graphics designer but for some reason, when it comes to PFF merch I'm just unable to create something that's original (or up to standard of the other things I create).
I'm glad we could come to an agreement and find mutual areas of cooperation! More need to do their part on BOTH sides of technology to assist Cliff AND keep the forum/communities alive.
I had switched on "Automatic Ad Optimization" in Google's AdSense. But I noticed Google put ads in the weirdest of places. Like in the middle of posts. Something I do not want.Yes, the number of clicks actually more than doubled but I don't want ads in the middle of people's posts. So I disabled it.
The good thing though, is that it does pay off if I optimize ad placement.
I had switched on "Automatic Ad Optimization" in Google's AdSense. But I noticed Google put ads in the weirdest of places. Like in the middle of posts. Something I do not want.Yes, the number of clicks actually more than doubled but I don't want ads in the middle of people's posts. So I disabled it.
The good thing though, is that it does pay of if I optimize ad placement.
Is it possible to have the ads between posts, instead of within?
I had switched on "Automatic Ad Optimization" in Google's AdSense. But I noticed Google put ads in the weirdest of places. Like in the middle of posts. Something I do not want.Yes, the number of clicks actually more than doubled but I don't want ads in the middle of people's posts. So I disabled it.
The good thing though, is that it does pay of if I optimize ad placement.
Been here a long time and have been on many other boards (mostly agriculture and military). I've never done fb and to me, a FB group riding Cliff's coat tails is a crappy turn of events. The ads in the middle of the posts don't bother me a bit. I will say too, unlike most boards, that the ads I see actually do reflect my interests and browsing history.
