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New owner - 85 SE by arbakken
Started on: 08-06-2018 06:35 AM
Replies: 26 (477 views)
Last post by: arbakken on 10-01-2018 10:25 AM
arbakken
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Report this Post08-06-2018 06:35 AM Click Here to See the Profile for arbakkenSend a Private Message to arbakkenEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I was born in 82 and growing up the guy across the street had one (mid 80s), then two (late 90s), then zero (early 2000s) Fieros. Every day I would see it and think it was the coolest car in the world. I never saw lamborghinis, ferraris, and rarely even corvettes. So whether or not it is worthy of such honors, it was my childhood dream car. I've always wanted one, but as they are terribly impractical I never bought one. Then, just the other day, I thought "what the hell, they're cheap, I'll buy one". So I did, an 85 se with the 2.5 5 speed. It was repainted poorly fairly recently, the seats are trashed, but the motor was rebuilt (why?!?!?) 8k miles ago.

Got it home, drove it for 3 days, and it broke down. Turns out the PO wasn't a very good mechanic and botched the fuel pump installation, so fixed that and found the clutch master wasn't working properly. I guess that's 30 year old GM for ya. Anyways, here I am!

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Report this Post08-06-2018 12:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mousemeatClick Here to Email mousemeatSend a Private Message to mousemeatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by arbakken:

I was born in 82 and growing up the guy across the street had one (mid 80s), then two (late 90s), then zero (early 2000s) Fieros. Every day I would see it and think it was the coolest car in the world. I never saw lamborghinis, ferraris, and rarely even corvettes. So whether or not it is worthy of such honors, it was my childhood dream car. I've always wanted one, but as they are terribly impractical I never bought one. Then, just the other day, I thought "what the hell, they're cheap, I'll buy one". So I did, an 85 se with the 2.5 5 speed. It was repainted poorly fairly recently, the seats are trashed, but the motor was rebuilt (why?!?!?) 8k miles ago.

Got it home, drove it for 3 days, and it broke down. Turns out the PO wasn't a very good mechanic and botched the fuel pump installation, so fixed that and found the clutch master wasn't working properly. I guess that's 30 year old GM for ya. Anyways, here I am!
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Negative attitudes will get you no where. what did you expect from an older car ? to blame the FIERO for it's breakdown, is unjust. blame the former owner, in the case of shoddy work....Heck, I've seen newer cars, including some very nice Pontiac Solstices, break down..because of either bad after market parts, or bad repairing...and yeah, some days your car will want to take the day of..but once you get the 'bugs' out of it, it should bring you hours of joy. My '87 acted up for an while...now, it purrs like a kitten...of course, it's not my daily driver...that honor goes to my 1991 isuzu Trooper..but if needed, my fiero, could take over...without fear of breakdowns..

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Report this Post08-06-2018 03:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by arbakken:

Anyways, here I am!

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Posting a two second video of a static object is rather impractical. Just take a photo!

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Report this Post08-06-2018 06:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierofoolClick Here to visit fierofool's HomePageClick Here to Email fierofoolSend a Private Message to fierofoolEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It might have been repainted poorly, but it looks pretty danged good to me. A lot of potential there.
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Report this Post08-06-2018 09:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for LarryinkcSend a Private Message to LarryinkcEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If the clutch master and slave aren't leaking you might try bleeding the clutch. I use V8 Archies procedure and it works good for me.

Clutch bleeding prodeedure
You can do it your way, But this method always works for me.
After checking to be sure there are no leaks in the Clutch Hydraulic system.
Complete ALL of the following steps before test driving the car:
1) Install a helper in the drivers seat to push in and let out the clutch pedal on command.
2) Remove the cover from the Master Cylinder reservoir.
3) Top off fluid in the reservoir.
4) During the course of this procedure DO NOT allow the "helper" to "pump" the pedal. The "helper" is to depress and release the pedal on command only, DO NOT PUMP THE PEDAL. (See theory below)
5) You will be opening and closing the bleed screw on the slave cylinder as instructed below. CAUTION: During this procedure protect your eyes from squirting brake fluid.
6) (Helper) Press clutch pedal in fully and hold.
7) (You) Open the bleed screw to allow fluid to escape.
8) (You) Close bleed screw.
9) (Helper) Release pedal completely
10) (You) Top off fluid in reservoir.
11) Repeat steps #6 thru #10 no less than 5 times before going to #12 below. NO PUMPING!
12) You have now bled the Master Cylinder and the hydraulic line. YOU ARE NOT DONE YET!!!!! We must now bleed the Slave cylinder. (This is what the manual doesn’t tell you)
13) With no further action to be done with the clutch pedal, you can no remove the "helper" from the drivers seat and have him (her/it) help you do the following.
14) After topping off the Master Cylinder, completely remove the bleed screw from the slave cylinder.
15) Have the "helper" stand at the ready with the bleed screw and the appropriate wrench for installing the bleed screw.
16) PROTECT YOUR EYES!
17) With the bleed screw removed. With both hands grab the push rod coming out of the slave cylinder and push it into the slave cylinder as far as it will go AND HOLD it in.
18) Your "helper" will now install and tighten the bleed screw while you hold the plunger in.
19) When bleed screw is tight release the rod and as it comes out guide it into the proper position on the clutch arm.
20) Top off the Reservoir and the job is complete.

Theory:
Why do I insist that you REMOVE the bleed screw when pushing the plunger in on the slave cylinder? This is simple hydraulics. Fluid or air will always go the direction of least resistance. When you are pushing the rod into the slave cylinder you will find that it is impossible to push it in at a slowly and steadily pace. If you push it in too fast with the bleed screw still in and just unscrewed a few turns some of the brake fluid and/or air in the slave cylinder will go back up the hydraulic line that you just bled, thus necessating your starting over.
When bleeding your clutch....The biggest mistake or miss-conception a person can make is to pump the pedal.
The clutch Hyd. system, unlike the brake Hyd. system SHOULD NOT BE PUMPED. The only thing that happens when you "pump" the clutch is that you make any large air bubbles in the hydraulic system into a bunch of small air bubbles. BTW these small air bubbles are harder to bleed out than larger bubbles.
You cannot "pump up" a clutch. If you have to "pump up" the clutch to make a shift then you have a leak and you can bleed the system a dozen times to no avail.
On the clutch, think about it now, if you could "pump-up" the clutch wouldn't the T.O. Bearing tend to invert the clutch diaphragm and travel toward the engine until it met up with something solid like the flywheel. On a braking system, when you "pump-up" the brakes you force the brake pads into the rotor until the line pressure builds up enough that the resistance you feel when pumping the pedal increases. Further, as you press harder and harder on the brake pedal the pads just increase their pressure on the rotors.
GM Thought this through when they designed the system. To avoid "pumping up" the clutch hyd. system, GM put in a small bleed back hole in the master cylinder. (BTW not an original idea, all Hyd. clutches have it) This bleed back hole relieves line pressure every time the pedal is at the top of the stroke. Didn't you notice when you "pumped up" the clutch pedal that it doesn’t firm-up like the brake pedal does?
The only thing you accomplish when "pumping up" the clutch pedal is to take any air bubbles that are in the system and atomize them into smaller air bubbles, thus making the problem worse. Remember when you were at the soda shop, as a kid, and your parents kept giving you hell about playing with you soda and straw? Same theory here! The more you move that soda through the straw the smaller the air bubbles become.
BTW the "hand pumps" work ok but I’ve never needed to buy one yet. With the hand pumps you still need to ensure that the slave cylinder gets completely bled.
v8archie
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JMTUT
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Report this Post08-06-2018 10:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JMTUTClick Here to Email JMTUTSend a Private Message to JMTUTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Enjoy your fiero. Mine is an 85 SE also with the 4 cylinder. Keep in mind it is easier to work on than the 6 and is still a lot of fun in the canyons.
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Report this Post08-06-2018 10:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JMTUTClick Here to Email JMTUTSend a Private Message to JMTUTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

JMTUT

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Enjoy your fiero. Mine is an 85 SE also with the 4 cylinder. Keep in mind it is easier to work on than the 6 and is still a lot of fun in the canyons.
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Report this Post08-07-2018 12:08 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JMTUTClick Here to Email JMTUTSend a Private Message to JMTUTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
by the way, There is an 88 4 cylinder in the pic a part in Ogden if you need spare parts. Interior is ok. Seats are torn. You can use a lot of the parts. 88s do have a different setup for fuel injection and no distributor.
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Report this Post08-07-2018 12:13 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JMTUTClick Here to Email JMTUTSend a Private Message to JMTUTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

JMTUT

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by the way, There is an 88 4 cylinder in the pic a part in Ogden if you need spare parts. Interior is ok. Seats are torn. You can use a lot of the parts. 88s do have a different setup for fuel injection and no distributor.
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Report this Post08-07-2018 12:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by JMTUT:

by the way....


By the way, you're duplicating all your posts.

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arbakken
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Report this Post08-07-2018 06:20 AM Click Here to See the Profile for arbakkenSend a Private Message to arbakkenEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

Posting a two second video of a static object is rather impractical. Just take a photo!


Aww crap! I had gotten a new iphone that does that 'live' photo thing and hadn't turned it off yet when I took the picture. I didn't think it would post a video, that's annoying.

JMTUT, you happen to know if that car has a sunroof or luggage rack?

With regards to the clutch, when I tried bleeding it I didn't have a helper, but both vacuum and pressure bled it several times. If that doesn't get the air out... But anyways, the first time you push the pedal in a while it works okay, but subsequent pushes the pedal gets lower and lower. I replaced the slave because the bleed screw was so rusty fluid couldn't pass through it.

[This message has been edited by arbakken (edited 08-07-2018).]

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Report this Post08-07-2018 06:55 AM Click Here to See the Profile for LarryinkcSend a Private Message to LarryinkcEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I installed one of Rodneys aluminum slave cylinders and didn't have a helper this time. I used a speed bleeder which got most of the air out, fluid in clear tubing on the bleeder was clear but still didn't have a good pedal. I pushed the slave piston all the way back with the bleeder screw out as Archie recommends and that got the last of the air out and clutch works great now.
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Report this Post08-07-2018 07:04 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierofrenzyClick Here to Email fierofrenzySend a Private Message to fierofrenzyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hey, you finally did it, bought a Fiero that is, so congradulations and welcome to the club !
Yes, Fiero"s are the coolest cars in the world", dollar for dollar that is. Anybody who really wants one can most likely find a good deal for one and have it in their driveway in no time at all. ( I would like a Ford GT but I'm a little shy of the $450,000 price tag )
I wouldn't be upset at all about the needed repairs. I imagine any 30 year old car would need some kind of work. Mine did too.
I just purchased an 87 4cyl. automatic about two months ago. I put a few hundred dollars into it, and boy does this car run GREAT ! I'm so happy about it. I enjoy this car so much,
So the same will happen with you I bet. And if your like me, your gonna get a lot of compliments which will make you appreciate your Fiero even more.
And then...if your like us.....you may want another one.....and parts....and the Fiero Forum every day.....and....and.....oh well, you'll see .
Have a great time with your new toy !
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arbakken
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Report this Post08-08-2018 06:21 AM Click Here to See the Profile for arbakkenSend a Private Message to arbakkenEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Please don't take my disparaging remarks about my Fieros reliability thus far as anything but humor. My main car is a 00 Ford Focus that I've had for 12 years, has 240k miles, and I wouldn't hesitate to drive it around the world. The Fiero will get there in pretty short order now that I own it.

The Fiero is actually really close to my first car, which was a 86 Buick Century. Same 2.5 iron duke and TH125 (although thankfully the fiero has the isuzu and not the crap TH125... not humor, that trans sucks!) The Century was okay but I did lose a head gasket when the head stud through the coolant passage snapped, and had to drive the last mile home in the dark with no headlights to conserve juice when the alternator went out. Oh, and the upper motor mount that attaches to the dogbone snapped off causing all kinds of issues when the motor banged around in there.
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Report this Post08-08-2018 10:31 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JMTUTClick Here to Email JMTUTSend a Private Message to JMTUTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Arbakken,

The car in Ogden Pic a Part did have a luggage rack but it did not have a sunroof.


I hope this catches you before you drive down, but I had to go out there today for something else and the 88 fiero in the lot does NOT have a luggage rack.

[This message has been edited by JMTUT (edited 08-08-2018).]

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longjonsilver
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Don't stress, everyone of us with the manual tranny has been thru this!

Every year i change the fluid in my clutch system.

This is the easiest way possible. Park on a hill so that the front is higher than the back (or use the curb) i use my driveway. With a q tip clean out the master cylinder walls and then with a turkey baster (i bot my own, i don't want to use the wifes as i dont want to eat brake fluid) to suck all the old fluid out. Fill master with new fluid. Crack open the slave bleeder valve, or better yet remove the bleeder valve. Place can under the slave on the cradle to catch the fluid. Allow the natural gravity flow to push the fluid out of the master thru the line to the slave. Don't let the master run out of fluid. Let it bleed for a good half hour. Don't touch the clutch pedal!!!!!!!!!!. If you have no leaks in the system, your clutch will be bled. If it still doesn't work, then check behind the clutch inside the car around the carpet and see if you can feel fluid. If you can then the master is leaking.

Improve the clutch with Rodney Dickmans adjustable clutch arm, or do as i did and weld your own. Then replace the GM slave piston with a Toyota piston (available from Fiero store or is it Rodney Dickman) that has the double seal. No more problems.
jon

------------------
I'm the original owner of a white ' 84 2M4 purchased Dec 10, 1983 from Pontiac. Always garaged, no rust, 4-wheel drifts are fun! 3800 SC swap to come!

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Report this Post08-08-2018 08:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RaydarClick Here to Email RaydarSend a Private Message to RaydarEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Nice ride!

I'm with fierofool. Your car looks nice to me. Lots nicer than my coupe.
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Report this Post09-28-2018 11:24 AM Click Here to See the Profile for arbakkenSend a Private Message to arbakkenEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Larryinkc:

I installed one of Rodneys aluminum slave cylinders and didn't have a helper this time. I used a speed bleeder which got most of the air out, fluid in clear tubing on the bleeder was clear but still didn't have a good pedal. I pushed the slave piston all the way back with the bleeder screw out as Archie recommends and that got the last of the air out and clutch works great now.


Oh, forgot to give an update. I tried that, but was unable to push the slave piston in at all. The master was definitely bad, so I replaced it. Bled it, still wasn't able to push the piston in, but clutch releases great now. However, a couple times under hard (… I mean, hard for an iron duke) acceleration in 4th or 5th, the clutch seems to slip a bit. I think it's because the slave is all the way in and keeping the clutch plate from grabbing completely. That was yesterday, so today I should have an answer.
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Report this Post09-28-2018 11:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by arbakken:

...was unable to push the slave piston in at all.


With the bleeder open?
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arbakken
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Report this Post09-28-2018 03:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for arbakkenSend a Private Message to arbakkenEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

With the bleeder open?


Yes... BUT, that brings me to another question. My car has an extension that goes between the slave cylinder rod and the clutch release arm, and I assumed it was supposed to be there. I'm now thinking that it was a 'rigged fix', and not supposed to be there at all. My slave cylinder is retracted all the way all the time as a result, which puts pressure on the clutch arm all the time, causing it to slip.

Oh the joys of used cars... can anyone confirm there isn't supposed to be an extension on the clutch slave rod?
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Report this Post09-28-2018 07:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierofoolClick Here to visit fierofool's HomePageClick Here to Email fierofoolSend a Private Message to fierofoolEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The pushrod for the Isuzu slave is about 5.75 inches long, off the top of my head. It's a one-piece pushrod.
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Report this Post09-28-2018 08:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by arbakken:

can anyone confirm there isn't supposed to be an extension on the clutch slave rod?


I'd love to see a picture of this Mickey Mouse arrangement.

What is the total length of the rod and "extension"?
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Report this Post09-29-2018 09:28 AM Click Here to See the Profile for arbakkenSend a Private Message to arbakkenEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'll post up a picture a little later, after I take one. Without measuring, the extension added probably 1.25 inches. I took it out and the clutch still disengages fully, but barely. The catch point is a little lower than I'd like but I think my pedal is slightly bent. I have the aluminum pedal, and when I did the master I noticed the banjo had wore into the step pretty badly so I ground the step off the pin and used a bushing. It's not right, but I wanted to drive the car. I'll probably have a new pedal today
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Report this Post09-29-2018 01:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by arbakken:

...the extension added probably 1.25 inches.


That doesn't tell us much when we have no idea what length rod it's being used with. (Can't just assume it's the original clutch slave rod.)
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Report this Post09-29-2018 02:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mousemeatClick Here to Email mousemeatSend a Private Message to mousemeatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by mousemeat:
Negative attitudes will get you no where. what did you expect from an older car ? to blame the FIERO for it's breakdown, is unjust. blame the former owner, in the case of shoddy work....Heck, I've seen newer cars, including some very nice Pontiac Solstices, break down..because of either bad after market parts, or bad repairing...and yeah, some days your car will want to take the day of..but once you get the 'bugs' out of it, it should bring you hours of joy. My '87 acted up for an while...now, it purrs like a kitten...of course, it's not my daily driver...that honor goes to my 1991 isuzu Trooper..but if needed, my fiero, could take over...without fear of breakdowns..


Well stated! as nice as my '87 GT is, every once in an while, it wants to take the day off...on the flip, I'm always looking to replace or upgrade any thing on my GT. 31 yrs on, and she still turns heads...

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Report this Post09-29-2018 07:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by mousemeat:

Well stated!


Are you complimenting your own post? lol
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Report this Post10-01-2018 10:25 AM Click Here to See the Profile for arbakkenSend a Private Message to arbakkenEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

That doesn't tell us much when we have no idea what length rod it's being used with. (Can't just assume it's the original clutch slave rod.)


I thought of that as well. I found the old slave in the scrap bin, but the rod had fallen out. I'll dig a little deeper, I'd really like to figure this all out even if it doesn't really matter. Haven't really had much of a chance to look.

I did have a chance to find a complete front and rear suspension off an 88, as well as a new unbent looking clutch pedal!
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