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Feeling disheartened (tranny issues) by rednotdead
Started on: 01-15-2016 02:58 PM
Replies: 24 (336 views)
Last post by: hobbywrench on 01-23-2016 11:32 AM
rednotdead
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Report this Post01-15-2016 02:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rednotdeadClick Here to Email rednotdeadSend a Private Message to rednotdeadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My Formula has now spent the better part of the last 4 months in a transmission shop. Back in September, the throwout bearing and case was found to be damaged so they advised I swap in a "good" used Getrag. Had them do that, spent 1,700 bucks. Not a month after receiving the car the clutch starts slipping on a hard acceleration. They open everything up under warranty and find tranny fluid leaking into the clutch - turns out its a "front seal collar". Im guessing this thing: http://rodneydickman.com/ca...h=28&products_id=305

They say they cant find a replacement part and want to put yet another used transmission into the car, which they will not be able (or dont want to) to open up to verify the integrity of beforehand.

I feel like Im about to just have an endless number of bad used parts go into the car with these guys. I dont have the means or knowledge to do this kind of repair myself... Im starting to think after all the money I put into this car, it could just get worse until I am broke.

Sorry for the somewhat pointless rant. The car ran beautifully until this.
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Report this Post01-15-2016 03:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jaskispyderSend a Private Message to jaskispyderEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Will Rodney's part fix it?

Is this a "good" tranny shop? Highly recommended?

[This message has been edited by jaskispyder (edited 01-15-2016).]

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Gall757
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Report this Post01-15-2016 03:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Gall757Send a Private Message to Gall757Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The part is called the 'input bearing' around here, and it is visible without opening up the transmission......so you could at least verify it is OK on another Getrag...if they can find one.
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rednotdead
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Report this Post01-15-2016 03:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rednotdeadClick Here to Email rednotdeadSend a Private Message to rednotdeadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Not sure if it's "good", but Im starting to think maybe not. No negative yelp reviews, they seem to have a lot of business.

I had to send the lead mechanic the Rodney Dickman link myself- after more than week of "searching" he still hadn't come across that page (I found it within 5 minutes). He's calling to get details on the part. The cars now been up on the rack for more than a month, I think they are just slacking off at this point.

He did mention to me, that this would be the last Fiero they ever would agree to work on.
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zzzhuh
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Report this Post01-15-2016 03:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for zzzhuhSend a Private Message to zzzhuhEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rednotdead:

He did mention to me, that this would be the last Fiero they ever would agree to work on.


Doesn't sound like a very friendly shop. It also sounds like they aren't very motivated to work, I would either take it to a new place (and spend more money) or let them do it. Working on transmissions isn't necessarily a hard thing. It takes time, but if you could do it yourself, you'll know you did it right.
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Gall757
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Report this Post01-15-2016 03:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Gall757Send a Private Message to Gall757Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rednotdead:

He did mention to me, that this would be the last Fiero they ever would agree to work on.


This is not uncommon, and is mostly the shop telling you that they don't have the expertise. In LA you can certainly find a good shop with old-guy mechanics who know the car.
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Report this Post01-15-2016 04:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jaskispyderSend a Private Message to jaskispyderEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
You need a good tranny shop. I would call around and find one that has worked on FWD trannies and then go talk to them. Sounds like these guys are general mechanics.
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Report this Post01-15-2016 04:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Sorry to hear of this. There must besome competent Fiero folks around somewhere in LA right?

Maybe check with some of these folks:

Golden Gate Fieros - Bay Area: https://groups.yahoo.com/ne...nversations/messages

http://westcoastfiero.com/contact/index.php

[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 01-15-2016).]

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Report this Post01-15-2016 04:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

2.5

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Will they charge you for the next tranny and labor if you did use another one?
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California Kid
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Report this Post01-15-2016 05:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for California KidSend a Private Message to California KidEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jaskispyder:

You need a good tranny shop. I would call around and find one that has worked on FWD trannies and then go talk to them. Sounds like these guys are general mechanics.


I have to agree with the above statement. The Getrag is a tight tolerance Transmission, which means it must be worked on my knowledgeable mechanics, they will also know where to get parts if needed.
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Report this Post01-15-2016 06:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for wftbClick Here to Email wftbSend a Private Message to wftbEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
A real transmission shop could put in a new seal .You should have taken it to a shop that only works on trannys .Up here we have places like Mr Transmission and they will rebuild and install any transmision .The last one I had done cost me 1600.00 for all the work but
I think the same job is over 3 now .
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84fiero123
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Report this Post01-19-2016 10:12 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 84fiero123Click Here to Email 84fiero123Send a Private Message to 84fiero123Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Agree with a lot said, find another shop, RIGHT NOW !

They haven't got a clue about Fiero's if this thing is on a lift and they didn't drop the cradle to remove the trany. These cars are unusual and sometimes a biatch to work on, But not that bad. Well Maybe sometimes, Hey they are getting an hourly rate or did they give you a price up front?

So they bought a used trany?
And now that trany has problems?
Yet instead of fixing the problem before they installed it they now say just buy another used one?
I got to ask, just how much this has cost you, Soooo far?

Standards are not that hard to work on, they are mechanical, not hydraulically driven. any mechanic worth his salt would have at least opened a used standard and checked bearings and seals as well as at least looked at the gears for damage.
edit to add is AMMCO still around here in the states?

Oh Ya

http://www.aamco.com/

Steve

------------------
Technology is great when it works,
and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't



Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 01-19-2016).]

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hobbywrench
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Report this Post01-19-2016 12:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hobbywrenchSend a Private Message to hobbywrenchEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Sorry to hear of your problems. Go to the "technical discussions" page 1 and see a current thread on Getrag rebuild. The transmission is difficult to work on but can be done without all the tooling. Assembly after complete teardown is tedious and time consuming. The $1700 figure is not unreasonable if competent labor is employed, even $2500 , IMO. But beware of that figure as a marketing ploy and the term "rebuilt" is undefined. The "usual " replacement parts are not expensive, although a couple are not readily available. Labor is the thing. I got a nice salvage unit by way of car-parts.com (the second one), but I notice there are some advertised as "rebuilt" for circa $1700, and who knows what is rebuilt.

Eventually this forum will produce the best information and techniques for rebuilding the Getrag due to the dedicated and knowledgeable folk. I got my first "Getrag" core for $175 and put in over $300 in parts. Not perfect , but the next one will be better. Keep the faith.
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rednotdead
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Report this Post01-19-2016 07:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rednotdeadClick Here to Email rednotdeadSend a Private Message to rednotdeadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I haven't sunk any more money that what the original price tag was - 1,850 for another used 282, labor, a rear engine seal and new clutch. But they only cover up to the original cost of repair: I'm just worried they will pop in another tranny that will break on me in a few months, and Ill be back where I started, just much poorer.

It's supposedly a specialist shop, too. They only do transmissions. I really, really wish I had shopped around more carefully though.

 
quote
Originally posted by California Kid:


I have to agree with the above statement. The Getrag is a tight tolerance Transmission, which means it must be worked on my knowledgeable mechanics, they will also know where to get parts if needed.


Hm, somehow I thought it was a low tolerance - hence "getrag rattle"...

 
quote
any mechanic worth his salt would have at least opened a used standard and checked bearings and seals as well as at least looked at the gears for damage.
edit to add is AMMCO still around here in the states?


That's what I would have figured too. I almost assumed it - I mean, what shop would put a one-year full warranty on an unverified used transmission?

Sometimes I think I'm just paranoid with my cars, constantly asking mechanics to explain what they're doing an how they'll do it... then stuff like this happens.
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Report this Post01-20-2016 12:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hobbywrenchSend a Private Message to hobbywrenchEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
One should probably not include the 282 Getrag in "transmissions" because of relative rarity. From what I have experienced and read the 282 is actually quite rugged. Assumptions that a commercial transmission shop should be able to rebuild a 282 properly may be correct if you happen to get that one talented mechanic willing to put in the time, but IMO there is a learning curve and you are unlikely to find happiness at AAMCO and others. But there are some checks that could be made with a bare salvage unit: Shift thru the gears to feel the synchro action (smooth?). Turn the transmission over by hand many times to detect uniform sound and action. With lubricant inside tip the unit , unit input shaft down and let it sit to see if the front seal leaks. In car-parts.com there are many chat functions. What can the chat guy do for you? Possible nothing, but you can judge the knowledge and honesty of the "yard guy" and along with the mileage, professed condition.
(A,B, C), to improve your chances. I have bought 2 that way, one across country, the other local.

[This message has been edited by hobbywrench (edited 01-20-2016).]

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Rodney
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Report this Post01-20-2016 12:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RodneyClick Here to visit Rodney's HomePageClick Here to Email RodneySend a Private Message to RodneyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
drivetrain.com 's warehouse is in Las Vegas I believe. Exchange it for a rebuilt unit. They may not have a Fiero specific 282 on hand so get a FWD 282 and use my FWD conversion kit.

------------------
Rodney Dickman

Fiero Parts And Acc's Web Page:
All new web page!:www.rodneydickman.com
Rodney Dickman's Fiero accessories
7604 Treeview Drive
Caledonia, WI 53108
Phone/Fax (262) 835-9575

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Report this Post01-21-2016 12:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hobbywrenchSend a Private Message to hobbywrenchEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My experience with drivetrain in Las Vegas in not so good. They are rather indifferent and do not return calls they promise. I hope you have better luck than this private party.
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84fiero123
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Report this Post01-22-2016 07:12 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 84fiero123Click Here to Email 84fiero123Send a Private Message to 84fiero123Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
http://www.aamco.com/

They are all over the country, but like other franchises they are only as good as the local shop and those are all different, ask around about the best one. Hey you guys all have cell phones, see what they are rated online.

Steve
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Report this Post01-22-2016 09:10 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jaskispyderSend a Private Message to jaskispyderEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 84fiero123:

http://www.aamco.com/

They are all over the country, but like other franchises they are only as good as the local shop and those are all different, ask around about the best one. Hey you guys all have cell phones, see what they are rated online.

Steve


Very true. The local tranny shop I used for the Aztek was very good. The tranny shop I used in another town for the Fiero... Well, let's say they put 90W oil in the tranny after replacing an axle seal. (it even says 5w-30 on the fill plug, via a plastic tab!!!). So... talk to the shop, in person.
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Rodney
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Report this Post01-22-2016 09:30 AM Click Here to See the Profile for RodneyClick Here to visit Rodney's HomePageClick Here to Email RodneySend a Private Message to RodneyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by hobbywrench:

My experience with drivetrain in Las Vegas in not so good. They are rather indifferent and do not return calls they promise. I hope you have better luck than this private party.

The rebuilder factory is in MN. I know the owner somewhat personally. He buys some of my Getrag parts occasionally. I buy my Getrag input bearings from him.

The Las Vegas place is only a warehouse. Possibly most there are not very knowledgeable. They only ship out these transmissions.

Even the MN guy may not have a lot to tell you as he deals with a large variation of many different transmissions over more than a few decades. He may not know that much about one transmission in general (282 Getrag). It is the guys in the shop that might know the most. I'm sure he would be reluctant to have people calling asking to speak to the guy that rebuilds the 282 Getrags for tech questions.

------------------
Rodney Dickman

Fiero Parts And Acc's Web Page:
All new web page!:www.rodneydickman.com
Rodney Dickman's Fiero accessories
7604 Treeview Drive
Caledonia, WI 53108
Phone/Fax (262) 835-9575

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Report this Post01-22-2016 12:35 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hobbywrenchSend a Private Message to hobbywrenchEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Very good discussion and hopefully will show up in this forum search function along with the technical section information.

But there remains , even among the trusted transmission shops, the question of what is a "rebuilt" transmission? Current situation seems to be if you trust the shop they replaced the "usual" items probably seen on only a "split the case" effort. But a high wear item is the synchro rings which require complete disassembly and lots of hydraulic press time to replace. Until a purchaser can somehow learn if these have been replaced a $2500 price tag is suspect, IMO. But $1500 may be ok if you trust the shop. And of course there is always a chance of scoring a low mileage original unit which has not been abused. I was lucky with my 89 Beretta unit sourced on car-parts.com. It took me to a local yard where I could play with the unit. Also the general impression of the personnel and the cleanliness of the business was encouraging. It all helps. Price about 5 years back $375.
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Report this Post01-22-2016 12:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RodneyClick Here to visit Rodney's HomePageClick Here to Email RodneySend a Private Message to RodneyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Drivetrain.com bought up many NOS Quad 4 Getrags from GM several years ago. I can't remember how many. 750? They took them apart and saved all the worthy parts that could be used in rebuilding 282's. So if drivetrain.com rebuilds a 282 there is no shortage of any internal part (except maybe the input bearing/seal).

------------------
Rodney Dickman

Fiero Parts And Acc's Web Page:
All new web page!:www.rodneydickman.com
Rodney Dickman's Fiero accessories
7604 Treeview Drive
Caledonia, WI 53108
Phone/Fax (262) 835-9575

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Report this Post01-22-2016 04:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hobbywrenchSend a Private Message to hobbywrenchEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
So drivetrain bought up NOS Getrags for parts?? They broke down new transaxles for parts? Please clarify. Perhaps quad 4 Getrags are a different model?

[This message has been edited by hobbywrench (edited 01-22-2016).]

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Rodney
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Report this Post01-22-2016 04:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RodneyClick Here to visit Rodney's HomePageClick Here to Email RodneySend a Private Message to RodneyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Quad 4 Getrags have a different bell housing to fit the Quad 4 engines. Will not fit the 2.8. Also many Quad 4 Getrags have slightly different 1,2 4 and 5th gear ratios. Some have the 3.91 ring gear set. I think it is 3.91? Have not said that in a long time.

------------------
Rodney Dickman

Fiero Parts And Acc's Web Page:
All new web page!:www.rodneydickman.com
Rodney Dickman's Fiero accessories
7604 Treeview Drive
Caledonia, WI 53108
Phone/Fax (262) 835-9575

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Report this Post01-23-2016 11:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for hobbywrenchSend a Private Message to hobbywrenchEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks, Rodney. Like I said before. Why don't you and your contacts produce a Getrag handbook with pictures. Go all the way thru the complete teardown. Even a youtube past the case splitting would help. I know this is not easy.
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