I go to Barrett-Jackson, Mecums and Auburn auctions, plus some other classic ones in the midwest. What ones are you suggesting. Of the ones Ive been to, never seen one go for more than $5-6K in person. At local used car auctions ive never seen one over $1,000. I sold mine at one for $5000 at one myself and it was a V8 low miles (4000), before its first oil change, and all new parts from bumper to bumper. Basicly only the body and frame were original, but it was redone in custom paint. It went with nearly $20k in reciepts.
Well I have see higher sold prices.
Just this last summer a friend sold his 88 GT for almost $15K to a guy who flew in from AZ to buy it. It was a low mile car at 14K but it was a clean like new example. I have seen this several times with 88 models in good original shape.
Generally Fieros are not going to sell big at large auctions as the folks there are looking for much higher dollar models. As for local auction they are generally dumping grounds for local used cars.
The highest Fiero prices are generally private sales as often they are original owners who sat on these cars looking to unload them when they never got rich on them. The buyers are Fiero fans that are looking for a good clean example that are not chasing auctions since few are there.
The key is the Fiero is a car that many like but the attraction has been low cost. As the good cars are not as common the prices are going up and the fans who can afford it will pay a little more. The price is on par for most clean V6 cars as a Camaro and TA from the same era less the TA pace car.
but on subject, the only Fieros I have seen sell for over 20k are very low miles WITH factory POWER STEERING, the same guy has bought two so far that I know of, both over 20k
Edit to add: they will all be worthless unless we can get some damn tail lights
[This message has been edited by sardonyx247 (edited 01-14-2016).]
but on subject, the only Fieros I have seen sell for over 20k are very low miles WITH factory POWER STEERING, the same guy has bought two so far that I know of, both over 20k
Edit to add: they will all be worthless unless we can get some damn tail lights
I have seen power steering units alone sell for more than many have in their cars LOL!
Again, value is what YOU would pay for one. I wouldnt personally pay more than $5-6K, but MAYBE UP TO $10K ....for a perfect one that I liked. Aftermarket companies dont make much of anything for them because there is no perceived market. They are fun cars, Ive had several. I enjoyed my Ferrari kit immensely and considered it probably the most fun and reliable car I ever owned. Ive personally owned hundreds of different cars in my life, from VWs to Presidential limos. Fieros are to be driven and enjoyed...they will never be investment material. You will never sell one for a big profit. You would be lucky to break even after owning it 20 years. Again, theyre to have fun with and drive. They are a great, if not one of the best platforms to experiment with modifying...expecially on a budget. You just have to get a clear picture of what they are. Yes there are collectors of Fieros...and there are collectors of Yugos (one here locally). I like them for fun, but have a lot of limitations. They are small. Little aftermarket. very limited drivetrain possibilities. Sure you can figure out how to pack a huge engine in one, but the rest of the driveline, mostly transmissions, are a weak link you cant get away from.
I have never paid more than 250 Bucks for any of my Fiero's. Both had under 100K on them. Both needed extensive repairs though, but back then I liked working on them and cars in general. Now not so much, health problems.
If you think a Fiero's is worth 30 K you buy it, me I would rather know that all the repairs done were done by me and someone I trust, other than that nobody works on my cars. Even if it does take me 4 times longer than it ever did. But to me that is what makes my Fiero's and other vehicles special, but that is only to me.
Knowing the typical cheapass Fiero owner, very few. That doesn't mean that SOMEONE out there wouldn't. The kind of cars that are selling for that kind of money aren't going to guys who are looking to build a Fiero or probably even be a part of "the Fiero community". These guys are collectors or are looking for something unique that they don't need to spend any time or money getting right.
Knowing the typical cheapass Fiero owner, very few. That doesn't mean that SOMEONE out there wouldn't. The kind of cars that are selling for that kind of money aren't going to guys who are looking to build a Fiero or probably even be a part of "the Fiero community". These guys are collectors or are looking for something unique that they don't need to spend any time or money getting right.
An just how many of those kind of people do you really think are left out there. The Fiero is a niche vehicle, like the corvette but cheaper, Fiero's will never be worth what a corvette of the same age shape will be. We are not all going to get 20K for our cars no matter how long we keep them. They are not fine wines that get better with age no matter how much you do to them. Unless they have under a hundred miles and just how many of them do you really think there are left for us to buy at any price?
Again, value is what YOU would pay for one. I wouldnt personally pay more than $5-6K, but MAYBE UP TO $10K ....for a perfect one that I liked. Aftermarket companies dont make much of anything for them because there is no perceived market. They are fun cars, Ive had several. I enjoyed my Ferrari kit immensely and considered it probably the most fun and reliable car I ever owned. Ive personally owned hundreds of different cars in my life, from VWs to Presidential limos. Fieros are to be driven and enjoyed...they will never be investment material. You will never sell one for a big profit. You would be lucky to break even after owning it 20 years. Again, theyre to have fun with and drive. They are a great, if not one of the best platforms to experiment with modifying...expecially on a budget. You just have to get a clear picture of what they are. Yes there are collectors of Fieros...and there are collectors of Yugos (one here locally). I like them for fun, but have a lot of limitations. They are small. Little aftermarket. very limited drivetrain possibilities. Sure you can figure out how to pack a huge engine in one, but the rest of the driveline, mostly transmissions, are a weak link you cant get away from.
I have hear you drone on about all your cars for years so let it rest.
The fact is there is a collectors market for about any car out there. They are not all in the same place and they are not all to the same type people.
There is a solid base for the Fiero as we even get 2-3 times the cars at our events that other more common models never see. The fact is the Fiero is still a young car as 30 years really is not much for a collector car but in this day and age where many try to make a collector car in the show room anymore.
Supply and demand drive price and with the Fiero the supply is still pretty strong and the demand is ok yet but no where near the numbers it needs to be if the car was in smaller numbers.
Right now there is a demand for low mile clean original cars and we are seeing prices realized in the teens now and that is a marked improvement over the past. To be honest getting them to where they may be worth what they were new is bringing out some of these cars that were put away for investments that did not pay off.
All I have ever claimed is the Fiero will follow the same path as the Corvair where it will remain a solid collector car with enough value to make it affordable but also you will see a small gain over time. No one here with half a wit is expecting Shelby numbers.
The modified car as you bring up will be a mixed bag. If they are modified with like the wide body panels and if they have well documented engine conversion they could see a increase in value in the future. But some of the hack jobs and patched up undocumented cars will languish in the lower half and not see much gain.
Cars with well documented options from the 80's will also see some value as many of these parts are also very rare. A T top in good condition also would add to the value even if it was a non 88 model.
A few years ago a Fiero in the teens was unthinkable. Some of the special cars like the $60K pace car were not even considered but these cars are there and the clean low mile cars are now in focus. Once these dry up the clean higher mile cars will find value to those looking for one.
But stop the foolishness of Barrett Jackson. That is not a Fiero Venue or a Venue for many cars out there. They cater to a specific market and that is all. A Fiero may show up once in a while but it is far from the best place to sell one.
The real future collectables are often hard to figure out. Some car are often hiding in plain sight. The Dino was one no one liked or wanted for years and then it took off passing up many more popular Ferrari models. Few saw that coming and yet to this day I am upset I passed on one for $16K but it is what it is.
In short we will never get rich on these cars but we will at least not lose our shirts if we are smart with what we buy and how we restore and modify them. I have had offers for mine much more than I would pay but I have no interest in selling. I could easily get what I paid new today and that is good with me. Few cars ever realize that.
Knowing the typical cheapass Fiero owner, very few. That doesn't mean that SOMEONE out there wouldn't. The kind of cars that are selling for that kind of money aren't going to guys who are looking to build a Fiero or probably even be a part of "the Fiero community". These guys are collectors or are looking for something unique that they don't need to spend any time or money getting right.
You are correct as I have noted some prime collection that have a Fiero sitting among some very expensive cars.
Ken Lingenfelter for one. He has about ever super car and many very historic cars in his collection and right in the middle Is a clean stock 1985 Fiero GT.
For years I used to be able to buy cheap muscle cars and fix them up and double my money. All my buddies did it back in the 80's. We could find complete GTO parts cars in junk yards etc. Then the collectors came in and drove the prices up. While the Collectors will buy in here they will go for the cleanest cars and pay top dollar for them. This will not make all the Fiero of higher value but it will at least stir interest and will help clean examples out there see some progress.
Of the 80's there are few cars of great value. The TA Turbo pace car is one that is moving as is a clean stock GN or GNX right now. A stock Monte Fastback with T tops is doing well. I suspect the Pontiac 2+2 at some point may see some love as well as the SVO Mustang and the Shelby models form Chrysler along with other rare models that are not real common.
The keys to see much value in the FIero will be clean [and I mean show room clean], V6, rare or desirable options, GT preferred 88 better, Pace Cars will still hold a place at some point. Rare parts like power steering and even the original DGP parts.
I have brought up documentation before. When building a car it is important. If you have rare or prototype parts even more important. I have some of the latter and made sure to keep all the info when I bought many new and even the GM parts I was able to get engineering drawings and info from the people who worked with these parts.
The down side is the base 4 cylinder cars will be like a 4 door 57 Chevy. They will never see the love the 88 GT will see. But this also makes them prime for the guys who do want to do that engine swap or race car and not have to pay more money for a car they will tear down. So what is a down side also has a silver lining. These are the cars that give this segment strength as they are the ones people see the most and get the most investment over time.
You are correct as I have noted some prime collection that have a Fiero sitting among some very expensive cars.
Ken Lingenfelter for one. He has about ever super car and many very historic cars in his collection and right in the middle Is a clean stock 1985 Fiero GT.
For years I used to be able to buy cheap muscle cars and fix them up and double my money. All my buddies did it back in the 80's. We could find complete GTO parts cars in junk yards etc. Then the collectors came in and drove the prices up. While the Collectors will buy in here they will go for the cleanest cars and pay top dollar for them. This will not make all the Fiero of higher value but it will at least stir interest and will help clean examples out there see some progress.
Of the 80's there are few cars of great value. The TA Turbo pace car is one that is moving as is a clean stock GN or GNX right now. A stock Monte Fastback with T tops is doing well. I suspect the Pontiac 2+2 at some point may see some love as well as the SVO Mustang and the Shelby models form Chrysler along with other rare models that are not real common.
The keys to see much value in the FIero will be clean [and I mean show room clean], V6, rare or desirable options, GT preferred 88 better, Pace Cars will still hold a place at some point. Rare parts like power steering and even the original DGP parts.
I have brought up documentation before. When building a car it is important. If you have rare or prototype parts even more important. I have some of the latter and made sure to keep all the info when I bought many new and even the GM parts I was able to get engineering drawings and info from the people who worked with these parts.
The down side is the base 4 cylinder cars will be like a 4 door 57 Chevy. They will never see the love the 88 GT will see. But this also makes them prime for the guys who do want to do that engine swap or race car and not have to pay more money for a car they will tear down. So what is a down side also has a silver lining. These are the cars that give this segment strength as they are the ones people see the most and get the most investment over time.
Let me add that there are the GTO owners, the Le Mans owners that wish or pretend they own a GTO and then there is the 6 banger Tempest owner that b itches that all those cars aren't worth what people think they are and would never pay the money for one.
No one ever gives Studebaker a second look, many say they are neither desirable or collectible. Don't look now but many Studebaker model's values have increased 140 - 145% in the past 7 years. In 2006 I was looking into a '62 GT Hawk that stood extremely tall at Carlisle for $15,000.00. Within 10 minutes I had the owner talked down to $12,500.00. I'm positive that with a little more persuasion I could have owned the car for $11,000.00. That very same car sold again in Carlisle this past fall for $31,000.00.
I've said it before and I'll say it again...... Some of you either don't own a Fiero, use to own a Fiero and don't anymore or shouldn't own a Fiero.
And to the people that modified your car and b itch it's only worth 20 - 25 cents on the dollar.... That's your problem, not the car's. You decided to hack it up and some of you chose a power-plant that no one wants, even in the cars they came out of. Again, not the car's fault.
Most of the time, when you modify anything YOU are the only one that can appreciate it. If you put $20,000.00 into your $5500.00 Fiero that's your problem, not the car's.
I put $38,000.00 into my custom Harley that today is only worth about $10,000.00 but I'm not b itching that no one wants to pay anymore than that and I certainly am not going on websites b itching that they are junk and not worth crap because no one wants to pay ME what I want or think I should get.
Here's another newsflash, I remember when no one wanted a 301 powered Trans Am especially one with a turbo or a V6 Trans Am with a turbo. Try buying one now!
The Fiero has had collectability since new and if you haters don't grow eyes in the back of your heads, the prices are going to run your ass over. If you don't like it, put yourself out of your misery and get rid of your Fiero.
[This message has been edited by Thunderstruck GT (edited 01-14-2016).]
Let me add that there are the GTO owners, the Le Mans owners that wish or pretend they own a GTO and then there is the 6 banger Tempest owner that b itches that all those cars aren't worth what people think they are and would never pay the money for one.
No one ever gives Studebaker a second look, many say they are neither desirable or collectible. Don't look now but many Studebaker model's values have increased 140 - 145% in the past 7 years. In 2006 I was looking into a '62 GT Hawk that stood extremely tall at Carlisle for $15,000.00. Within 10 minutes I had the owner talked down to $12,500.00. I'm positive that with a little more persuasion I could have owned the car for $11,000.00. That very same car sold again in Carlisle this past fall for $31,000.00.
I've said it before and I'll say it again...... Some of you either don't own a Fiero, use to own a Fiero and don't anymore or shouldn't own a Fiero.
And to the people that modified your car and b itch it's only worth 20 - 25 cents on the dollar.... That's your problem, not the car's. You decided to hack it up and some of you chose a power-plant that no one wants, even in the cars they came out of. Again, not the car's fault.
Most of the time, when you modify anything YOU are the only one that can appreciate it. If you put $20,000.00 into your $5500.00 Fiero that's your problem, not the car's.
I put $38,000.00 into my custom Harley that today is only worth about $10,000.00 but I'm not b itching that no one wants to pay anymore than that and I certainly am not going on websites b itching that they are junk and not worth crap because no one wants to pay ME what I want or think I should get.
Here's another newsflash, I remember when no one wanted a 301 powered Trans Am especially one with a turbo or a V6 Trans Am with a turbo. Try buying one now!
The Fiero has had collectability since new and if you haters don't grow eyes in the back of your heads, the prices are going to run your ass over. If you don't like it, put yourself out of your misery and get rid of your Fiero.
I don't think anyone who has posted is a hater of Fiero's, just realistic about it's value, And just for the record with a track record like restoring a bike paying 38K for parts for then only being able to get 10 for it you ain't the brightest bulb on the tree ether. This is exactly what others are saying, just because you put 30K in parts into a car, it doesn't make it worth 30K, it is worth what someone will pay for it. You made a mistake with the bike, what makes you so sure you are so right about the Fiero?
Hey I love the little cars, have 2 and drive one everyday, weather permitting, I started at GM working in MA. in 1974 and was there when the Fiero was made, not at my plant but still working for GM. The Fiero is a one of a kind car, the first American mid engine 2 seater, But it ain't a Corvette and we all know that, well maybe except for you. See I see it like this, my Fiero is the poor mans corvette, and I had a 76 Stingray as well as a 67 Firebird convertible with a 400. You are acting like many of those same corvette people only about the Fiero, I didn't like that, I don't collect cars I drive them, that's what they were made for. Most everyone here drives one regularly or at least has. They are nice little cars but sadly in our lifetimes they will never be as collectable as a corvette and you know what I would still rather have my 86 SE than my 76 Stingray. All that car was, was a ticket machine because neither my wife or I could keep our foot off the gas pedal. And with a Vette if you are going 5 MPH over they stop you.
I love my Fiero's, but I am a realist about their values. I don't think anything but show cars and low number, think first off the line cars, super low mileage cars, will ever be worth more than 10 K, to me and most other owners, so getting that 30 K out of one is a long shot at best.
Steve
[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 01-15-2016).]
I have hear you drone on about all your cars for years so let it rest.
The fact is there is a collectors market for about any car out there. They are not all in the same place and they are not all to the same type people.
There is a solid base for the Fiero as we even get 2-3 times the cars at our events that other more common models never see. The fact is the Fiero is still a young car as 30 years really is not much for a collector car but in this day and age where many try to make a collector car in the show room anymore.
Supply and demand drive price and with the Fiero the supply is still pretty strong and the demand is ok yet but no where near the numbers it needs to be if the car was in smaller numbers.
Right now there is a demand for low mile clean original cars and we are seeing prices realized in the teens now and that is a marked improvement over the past. To be honest getting them to where they may be worth what they were new is bringing out some of these cars that were put away for investments that did not pay off.
All I have ever claimed is the Fiero will follow the same path as the Corvair where it will remain a solid collector car with enough value to make it affordable but also you will see a small gain over time. No one here with half a wit is expecting Shelby numbers.
The modified car as you bring up will be a mixed bag. If they are modified with like the wide body panels and if they have well documented engine conversion they could see a increase in value in the future. But some of the hack jobs and patched up undocumented cars will languish in the lower half and not see much gain.
Cars with well documented options from the 80's will also see some value as many of these parts are also very rare. A T top in good condition also would add to the value even if it was a non 88 model.
A few years ago a Fiero in the teens was unthinkable. Some of the special cars like the $60K pace car were not even considered but these cars are there and the clean low mile cars are now in focus. Once these dry up the clean higher mile cars will find value to those looking for one.
But stop the foolishness of Barrett Jackson. That is not a Fiero Venue or a Venue for many cars out there. They cater to a specific market and that is all. A Fiero may show up once in a while but it is far from the best place to sell one.
The real future collectables are often hard to figure out. Some car are often hiding in plain sight. The Dino was one no one liked or wanted for years and then it took off passing up many more popular Ferrari models. Few saw that coming and yet to this day I am upset I passed on one for $16K but it is what it is.
In short we will never get rich on these cars but we will at least not lose our shirts if we are smart with what we buy and how we restore and modify them. I have had offers for mine much more than I would pay but I have no interest in selling. I could easily get what I paid new today and that is good with me. Few cars ever realize that.
I keep on 'droning' because it shows im diverse and know something about collectible cars. You apparently dont listen so I have to keep repeating myself. I go to 3-4 car shows all over Ohio every week in season. Out of all those this past year, Ive seen ANY Fieros at 3 of them. One is electric and the other one is the same guy I know that used to be on the forum.
Yes any car has its following of collectors. A Fiero is no different in that....ITS JUST NOT A COLLECTIBLE TO CAR COLLECTORS. IT IS NOT AN INVESTMENT VEHICLE. You will only sell it for what you have in it...if you bought it right AND YOUR LUCKY. You will NEVER make a big profit on one. NONE of the collectors I know (serious collectors) have ANY interest in a Fiero...even if given to them.
There is NO ONE out there wanting to spend even $25K looking thru ads for a Fiero. Im not saying there might be someone dumb enough to do that. I dont care if that Fiero was taken off the assembly line and sealed in plastic in the back of a dealership since....no ones going to pay that with half a brain. The major auctions have any and all kinds of cars, from 1920s dump trucks to 62 Ford Falcons to new Veyrons. I can find ANYTHING at BJ, Mecum and Auburn. Anthing from $1000 to $10million. Theres no doubt some have inflated prices, but thats because there ARE idiots who will pay whatever they can for what they specificly want. I wouldnt pay $150K for a 0 mile Copo Camaro because I dont want it. I might for $25K. Modified cars of any kind are only worth what a buyer may want, no matter what was invested in it. I wouldnt pay $1million for the Batmobile, but some would. Strictly speaking stock, Ill guess the average Fiero owned in the forum is a $3,000-$4,000 one (to a Fiero enthusiast) Theres some really nice ones and some really crap ones...so it averages out.
Your welcome to set your cars value at whatever you want, but unlikely that you ever will get that...no matter what that price is. Its already been noted that the typical Fiero owner on this forum anyway, is cheap. They want to buy or fix their car as cheaply as possible. There are also some that only want the best, and done in the best way possible (some means a few). Ive seen things like 'can I plug off the rear brake lines since I cant afford to fix them, but need the car to drive to work." That guys not going to pay $1200 for a complete all new parts brake job.
To sum up...for the end on my part. I live in the world of reality, not Fantasyland.
[This message has been edited by rogergarrison (edited 01-15-2016).]
I have hear you drone on about all your cars for years so let it rest.
The fact is there is a collectors market for about any car out there. They are not all in the same place and they are not all to the same type people.
There is a solid base for the Fiero as we even get 2-3 times the cars at our events that other more common models never see. The fact is the Fiero is still a young car as 30 years really is not much for a collector car but in this day and age where many try to make a collector car in the show room anymore.
Supply and demand drive price and with the Fiero the supply is still pretty strong and the demand is ok yet but no where near the numbers it needs to be if the car was in smaller numbers.
Right now there is a demand for low mile clean original cars and we are seeing prices realized in the teens now and that is a marked improvement over the past. To be honest getting them to where they may be worth what they were new is bringing out some of these cars that were put away for investments that did not pay off.
All I have ever claimed is the Fiero will follow the same path as the Corvair where it will remain a solid collector car with enough value to make it affordable but also you will see a small gain over time. No one here with half a wit is expecting Shelby numbers.
The modified car as you bring up will be a mixed bag. If they are modified with like the wide body panels and if they have well documented engine conversion they could see a increase in value in the future. But some of the hack jobs and patched up undocumented cars will languish in the lower half and not see much gain.
Cars with well documented options from the 80's will also see some value as many of these parts are also very rare. A T top in good condition also would add to the value even if it was a non 88 model.
A few years ago a Fiero in the teens was unthinkable. Some of the special cars like the $60K pace car were not even considered but these cars are there and the clean low mile cars are now in focus. Once these dry up the clean higher mile cars will find value to those looking for one.
But stop the foolishness of Barrett Jackson. That is not a Fiero Venue or a Venue for many cars out there. They cater to a specific market and that is all. A Fiero may show up once in a while but it is far from the best place to sell one.
The real future collectables are often hard to figure out. Some car are often hiding in plain sight. The Dino was one no one liked or wanted for years and then it took off passing up many more popular Ferrari models. Few saw that coming and yet to this day I am upset I passed on one for $16K but it is what it is.
In short we will never get rich on these cars but we will at least not lose our shirts if we are smart with what we buy and how we restore and modify them. I have had offers for mine much more than I would pay but I have no interest in selling. I could easily get what I paid new today and that is good with me. Few cars ever realize that.
I keep on 'droning' because it shows im diverse and know something about collectible cars. You apparently dont listen so I have to keep repeating myself. I go to 3-4 car shows all over Ohio every week in season. Out of all those this past year, Ive seen ANY Fieros at 3 of them. One is electric and the other one is the same guy I know that used to be on the forum.
Yes any car has its following of collectors. A Fiero is no different in that....ITS JUST NOT A COLLECTIBLE TO CAR COLLECTORS. IT IS NOT AN INVESTMENT VEHICLE. You will only sell it for what you have in it...if you bought it right AND YOUR LUCKY. You will NEVER make a big profit on one. NONE of the collectors I know (serious collectors) have ANY interest in a Fiero...even if given to them.
There is NO ONE out there wanting to spend even $25K looking thru ads for a Fiero. Im not saying there might be someone dumb enough to do that. I dont care if that Fiero was taken off the assembly line and sealed in plastic in the back of a dealership since....no ones going to pay that with half a brain. The major auctions have any and all kinds of cars, from 1920s dump trucks to 62 Ford Falcons to new Veyrons. I can find ANYTHING at BJ, Mecum and Auburn. Anthing from $1000 to $10million. Theres no doubt some have inflated prices, but thats because there ARE idiots who will pay whatever they can for what they specificly want. I wouldnt pay $150K for a 0 mile Copo Camaro because I dont want it. I might for $25K. Modified cars of any kind are only worth what a buyer may want, no matter what was invested in it. I wouldnt pay $1million for the Batmobile, but some would. Strictly speaking stock, Ill guess the average Fiero owned in the forum is a $3,000-$4,000 one (to a Fiero enthusiast) Theres some really nice ones and some really crap ones...so it averages out.
Your welcome to set your cars value at whatever you want, but unlikely that you ever will get that...no matter what that price is. Its already been noted that the typical Fiero owner on this forum anyway, is cheap. They want to buy or fix their car as cheaply as possible. There are also some that only want the best, and done in the best way possible (some means a few). Ive seen things like 'can I plug off the rear brake lines since I cant afford to fix them, but need the car to drive to work." That guys not going to pay $1200 for a complete all new parts brake job.
To sum up...for the end on my part. I live in the world of reality, not Fantasyland.
[/QUOTE]
You left out how modest you are too. No need to continue droning as I hear you fine. No one ever said this car was an investment and I have stated that for years here. But the truth is a car can still be collectable and not be a investment. I think everyone here accept you get that pretty easily.
You for one miss represent of poorly explained your points here as you were never clear on this. All you like to do is say I go to tons of car shows and I know lots of collectors with lots of money and I love to hang out in third world countries etc.
This is the case plain and simple I have made.
#1 The Fiero has collectability and is considered a affordable collectors car. [Note not a car for investment]
#2 The price of the Fiero will follow the path of the Corvair where it will see modest growth over time and at some point some models will show increased growth but still as I often say not the kind of amount you will retire on.
#3 Clean and good examples are getting harder to find in original low miles and many collectors are buying them up as a novelty of late. Many have done the same for the Corvair, Amphicar and others. They are different and not all collectors are about investment but diversity. Just look at Jay Leno's collection. He is smitten of late with the Corvair adding a couple. Investment as not a consideration.
#4 The Fiero is not a BJ car of Pebble Beach it is a car that is mostly private sale and in these private sales are getting $10,000-$20,000 for clean examples with low miles. That is good for a Fiero and most cars from the 80's. These are becoming common prices and I have seen them first hand. Try getting that for most cars of the same era and you would be hard pressed even with a similar year Corvette in the same condition.
#5 30 years is not really a long time so you will not see much movment on any car of this era unless it is in high demand and low in volume.
#6 The Fiero is not a rare car with a lot of rare models. It used to be rare was 500 or less of a car that many wanted. Today many try to make cars made in the thousands rare and with only moderate demand.
#7 Predicting collector cars of value is not always that easy. Many that were claimed to see great value like the 78 Pace Cars were newer seen. On the other hand cars like the Superbird and Dino that both were far from popular and loved today are now seen as great investments. Demand today far out strips supply and desire. Some of the most popular cars including the Ferrari GTO at one time could be bought for less than $10,000 because they were used up old race cars that were difficult and expensive to repair. Today they are at $35-50 million dollars.
#8 just because of the name of a car it can still be collectable but still not see a ton of growth. Cars like a 308 are the poor man Ferrari a they are still pretty cheap. They will increase but never in the same percentage as a 250 GT Lusso. But they will still get a following because of the name and the styling. With the cost of the maintenance alone it is not what I would call an investment unless you can do it yourself.
Any ways that is how it is and I am far from the only one here that see it this way. Some of us have more of a clue than you like to let on. We are not here trying to show off but just share and discuss. Most of us here so what you do and much more but we do not have to post it to feel good. Sorry if I did not stroke your ego but that is just the way it is.
The reality is the Fiero will see slow and modest growth in value. It will grow for some models based on content and condition but not all models. It will never be an investment car as about 95% of most cars never realize but it will still hold collectability for the nature of how it is different. Many collectors will seek them for the novelty and being different just as many here do today. Cars for the most part are poor investments unless you have the money to play with the high value low volume models. Few people can do that but they still love to play with cars. This is one car that can really make someone enjoy something different and not be like the 50 other Camaro's at a cruise in or car show while not breaking the bank.
The slow growth and sustained value of the FIero will make it a little more than a money pit as if you do It right with the right model in the right condition you may not lose any money or at least break even. That is tough to do even on a 1988 Camaro anymore.
This is what most of us here understand and find to be an accurate assessment of the market. I really find very few here living in fantasy land thinking they are going to get rich from an investment aspect.
You for one miss represent of poorly explained your points here as you were never clear on this. All you like to do is say I go to tons of car shows and I know lots of collectors with lots of money and I love to hang out in third world countries etc.
This is the case plain and simple I have made.
#1 The Fiero has collectability and is considered a affordable collectors car. [Note not a car for investment]
#2 The price of the Fiero will follow the path of the Corvair where it will see modest growth over time and at some point some models will show increased growth but still as I often say not the kind of amount you will retire on.
#3 Clean and good examples are getting harder to find in original low miles and many collectors are buying them up as a novelty of late. Many have done the same for the Corvair, Amphicar and others. They are different and not all collectors are about investment but diversity. Just look at Jay Leno's collection. He is smitten of late with the Corvair adding a couple. Investment as not a consideration.
#4 The Fiero is not a BJ car of Pebble Beach it is a car that is mostly private sale and in these private sales are getting $10,000-$20,000 for clean examples with low miles. That is good for a Fiero and most cars from the 80's. These are becoming common prices and I have seen them first hand. Try getting that for most cars of the same era and you would be hard pressed even with a similar year Corvette in the same condition.
#5 30 years is not really a long time so you will not see much movment on any car of this era unless it is in high demand and low in volume.
#6 The Fiero is not a rare car with a lot of rare models. It used to be rare was 500 or less of a car that many wanted. Today many try to make cars made in the thousands rare and with only moderate demand.
#7 Predicting collector cars of value is not always that easy. Many that were claimed to see great value like the 78 Pace Cars were newer seen. On the other hand cars like the Superbird and Dino that both were far from popular and loved today are now seen as great investments. Demand today far out strips supply and desire. Some of the most popular cars including the Ferrari GTO at one time could be bought for less than $10,000 because they were used up old race cars that were difficult and expensive to repair. Today they are at $35-50 million dollars.
#8 just because of the name of a car it can still be collectable but still not see a ton of growth. Cars like a 308 are the poor man Ferrari a they are still pretty cheap. They will increase but never in the same percentage as a 250 GT Lusso. But they will still get a following because of the name and the styling. With the cost of the maintenance alone it is not what I would call an investment unless you can do it yourself.
Any ways that is how it is and I am far from the only one here that see it this way. Some of us have more of a clue than you like to let on. We are not here trying to show off but just share and discuss. Most of us here so what you do and much more but we do not have to post it to feel good. Sorry if I did not stroke your ego but that is just the way it is.
The reality is the Fiero will see slow and modest growth in value. It will grow for some models based on content and condition but not all models. It will never be an investment car as about 95% of most cars never realize but it will still hold collectability for the nature of how it is different. Many collectors will seek them for the novelty and being different just as many here do today. Cars for the most part are poor investments unless you have the money to play with the high value low volume models. Few people can do that but they still love to play with cars. This is one car that can really make someone enjoy something different and not be like the 50 other Camaro's at a cruise in or car show while not breaking the bank.
The slow growth and sustained value of the FIero will make it a little more than a money pit as if you do It right with the right model in the right condition you may not lose any money or at least break even. That is tough to do even on a 1988 Camaro anymore.
This is what most of us here understand and find to be an accurate assessment of the market. I really find very few here living in fantasy land thinking they are going to get rich from an investment aspect.
Face it!
Some get it, others never will.
Hell, how many times have you kicked yourself for not buying a Shelby Cobra or an XKE Jag when they were $4995.00 NEW because people thought those things were piles that no one else would ever want? Or a '69 Judge GTO because who in their right mind would ever want one of those stripped down, stickered up POS's?
Sorry, but no stock Fiero is worth $10,000 unless it has a special story. You rarely see one at any auctions and when you do, they dont sell for much. I know LOTS of collectors, some that own museums...and none of them have any interest at all in having a Fiero. There is a place for them as there are people who do love them obviously...just like Pintos and Gremlins. You will never see one go for $50K or even $25K. Modified ones may, depending on whats done to them.
$17,000+, The highest price Ive ever seen for one is the factory built, one off, 4 seater, GM sold a few years back. That was hardly a stock Fiero either. http://www.barrett-jackson....GT-2And2-COUPE-72042
$5,000+ ,one of the most desired Fieros by fans. Its an 88 V6, black, mint cond, low miles...only thing not perfect is its an automatic. Even signed by Hulki. http://www.barrett-jackson....C-FIERO-COUPE-101697
Many don't want to believe this reality but it is. We want to think that the Fiero is super special and it is to us. But after several years I am convinced that the Fiero is just like a Corvair. A cool rare car of the era but not a highly collectible to the people that pay high $$. People bought nice 88Gts for $15k back in 1988 and put them in storage and now they are worth about the same if they were perfectly preserved. A friend of mine bought a very nice 86 GT with 10K miles for less than $5k. A crappy Fiero sells for free to $2k. A decent one sells for $1500 to $4000. A very nice one sells for $4k to $8k. A highly modified one with a well done engine swap and ready to got o a car show sells for $8K to $15k. A zero mile well preserved will sell for about the cost it was new. It is what it is. Deal with it. And I doubt it will change in the next 20 years. Which I think is great because I will be able to afford one if I need one. Just enjoy you Fiero but don't think it will be your kid's retirement fund
I think what is being confused her is the difference between collectable and valuable.
Everything and anything is collectable Any and all cars can be collectable and almost all have a web forum some where. Special interest and like can provide added value over say some normal family truckster but not enough to call it valuable.
Not every car is valuable nor are many going to be valuable. But that still does not mean they can not be collectable.
The Fiero is in that group that is higher than the average car that will see slow growth and enough to make it a car you may break even on as long as you don't get stupid and pump a lot of money into it.
For instance I could sell mine for what I paid new. In a few years it may be worth what I have in it with parts and insurance from over the years. I am not going nor plan to retire on it. As of now it is cheap to keep and maintain and interesting enough of a car to keep. It also is my first new car so I hold a little sentimental feeling that adds no value to anyone else.
The Corvair path is the prototype to the Fiero future.
The basic Corvair holds little value and can be had cheap if in base or sedan form. This is the 4 cylinder coupes.
The Coupes and the 65 and later cars show more interest from the public so they tend to bring a little more. Think of them as the V6 notch backs.
The next models that show value are the Rampsides, Spyders and Corsa models. They are like the 88 Formula's with just a little more added value
Then the Convertibles are the 88 GT T top. These tend to bring the top money with and a little more with the added performance parts.
Most of these cars were under $5K back in the day and can be anwhere from $4K for the best example of the lest desireable to the top dollar models in top condition being around $15-$20K.
The wild cards are the Yenko Stingers, Any Covair connected to John Fitch. For the Fiero the wild cards are the show cars, The race cars, The real pace cars and even some of the well built and documented DGP cars.
The top Fiero at this point is Freds Cart Pace Car. It has the highest price and holds the documentation of not only being one of the original track used Indy Pace Cars but also that it has the DGP body and was a Cart Pace car and still has the SD engine. The car holds a history that is attractive to many different people and that is why it went for so much. Documentation is key.
I think I've derived more 'value' from my '84 SE by driving it than keeping it 'low mileage' for 31+ years. It has 371,000 kilometers (230,000 miles) on it now, and the maintenance and repair costs recently equaled the purchase cost. $0.07 per kilometer ($0.11 per mile) is pretty cheap transportation. Worthless car = cheap transportation. And in style!
I bought my Formula with 5,200 kilometers (3230 miles) in 2008 for $10,000 from the original owner. That's $6300 in 1988 dollars when inflation is factored in, or about 50% of the original cost of the car. I doubt it'll ever match the '84 SE return on investment ($0.07 per km) but the smiles per mile are just as valuable.
Hell, how many times have you kicked yourself for not buying a Shelby Cobra or an XKE Jag when they were $4995.00 NEW because people thought those things were piles that no one else would ever want? Or a '69 Judge GTO because who in their right mind would ever want one of those stripped down, stickered up POS's?
And you knew that bike would be worth 30 k as well, you are the one living in an alternate reality.
Some of you have real bad memories about just how much these things cost new.
Original MSRP for the 88 GT was, , , , , , Wait for it, , , , , , , $13,999
High Retail Value This vehicle would be in excellent condition overall. It could be a completely restored or an extremely well-maintained original vehicle showing very minimal wear. The exterior paint, trim, and mechanics are not in need of reconditioning. The interior would be in excellent condition. Note: This value does not represent a '100 Point' or '# 1' vehicle *. * '100 Point' or '# 1' vehicle is not driven. It would generally be in a museum or transported in an enclosed trailer to concours judging and car shows. This type of car would be stored in a climate-regulated facility.
So unless the dam thing is unmolested by any custom crap and has 0 miles on it even NADA says they aren't high cost collectors cars.
Original MSRP $13,999
Low Retail $2,375
Average Retail $5,150
High Retail $9,200
Steve
[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 01-16-2016).]
High Retail Value This vehicle would be in excellent condition overall. It could be a completely restored or an extremely well-maintained original vehicle showing very minimal wear. The exterior paint, trim, and mechanics are not in need of reconditioning. The interior would be in excellent condition. Note: This value does not represent a '100 Point' or '# 1' vehicle *. * '100 Point' or '# 1' vehicle is not driven. It would generally be in a museum or transported in an enclosed trailer to concours judging and car shows. This type of car would be stored in a climate-regulated facility.
So unless the dam thing is unmolested by any custom crap and has 0 miles on it even NADA says they aren't high cost collectors cars.
Original MSRP $13,999
Low Retail $2,375
Average Retail $5,150
High Retail $9,200
Steve
You can not go by NADA or any of these other trade in guides for one of these cars unless it is of average miles and condition for a car 30 years old.
Most of the cars we are speaking of are far over book value as that is why so many of us have collectors insurance on them..
I have personally seen 88 GT models with the miles in the teens go for up to and around $14-15K. Yes people paid this and more than one sold for this. People right now are willing to pay more for clean 88 models vs. something with high miles and in need of work as many times to fix it up right would cost more than to just buy a clean model.
To be honest the $14K really is not a lot of money anymore when it comes to cars.
If one was to look around for a clean car of about any type it is going to set you back $10K or more if the miles are under 30K.
The day of the old clean cars needing little work for 2-5K is no longer.
Even to restore an old GTO right anymore may cost you as much as the car is worth unless you do most of the work yourself. Just the paint alone may be $10K or more for a perfect car. Even here it may be best to buy a restored and documented car and come in cheaper. Too many get in over their heads and need bailed out leading to some good buys.
You can not go by NADA or any of these other trade in guides for one of these cars unless it is of average miles and condition for a car 30 years old.
Most of the cars we are speaking of are far over book value as that is why so many of us have collectors insurance on them..
I have personally seen 88 GT models with the miles in the teens go for up to and around $14-15K. Yes people paid this and more than one sold for this. People right now are willing to pay more for clean 88 models vs. something with high miles and in need of work as many times to fix it up right would cost more than to just buy a clean model.
To be honest the $14K really is not a lot of money anymore when it comes to cars.
If one was to look around for a clean car of about any type it is going to set you back $10K or more if the miles are under 30K.
The day of the old clean cars needing little work for 2-5K is no longer.
Even to restore an old GTO right anymore may cost you as much as the car is worth unless you do most of the work yourself. Just the paint alone may be $10K or more for a perfect car. Even here it may be best to buy a restored and documented car and come in cheaper. Too many get in over their heads and need bailed out leading to some good buys.
So non of them are right because Hemming's is like the corvette owners bible as far as prices go and this is what they have as prices for them..
Among 17 ad(s) found in the last 3 years that list prices:
The average asking price is: $13,110.29 The highest asking price is: $34,900.00 The lowest asking price is: $1,250.00
By the way, that Stealership that wants $34,000 for his car still has that car for sale so it doesn't look like anyone is buying his line of BS ether. it ain't sold yet, it's still listed as for sale.
What someone pays for the car is what it is worth, to them. Hell if I still had my retirement IRA I still wouldn't buy his car and the price he is asking wouldn't even put a dent in it back before I had all my medical issues, but my medical issues sure killed it. Nothing is ever worth the asking price to me, Dickering rules up here in Maine, and most of the rest of the country if not world.
Condition #1 vehicles are the best in the world. The visual image is of the best vehicle, in the right colors, driving onto the lawn at the finest concours. Perfectly clean, the vehicle has been groomed down to the tire treads. Painted and chromed surfaces are mirror-like. Dust and dirt are banned, and materials used are correct and superbly fitted. The one word description for #1 vehicles is "concours."
#2 Excellent $14,100
#3 Good $9,300
#4 Fair $6,000
Steve
[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 01-17-2016).]
Among 17 ad(s) found in the last 3 years that list prices:
The average asking price is: $13,110.29 The highest asking price is: $34,900.00 The lowest asking price is: $1,250.00
By the way, that Stealership that wants $34,000 for his car still has that car for sale so it doesn't look like anyone is buying his line of BS ether. it ain't sold yet, it's still listed as for sale.
What someone pays for the car is what it is worth, to them. Hell if I still had my retirement IRA I still wouldn't buy his car and the price he is asking wouldn't even put a dent in it back before I had all my medical issues, but my medical issues sure killed it. Nothing is ever worth the asking price to me, Dickering rules up here in Maine, and most of the rest of the country if not world.
Condition #1 vehicles are the best in the world. The visual image is of the best vehicle, in the right colors, driving onto the lawn at the finest concours. Perfectly clean, the vehicle has been groomed down to the tire treads. Painted and chromed surfaces are mirror-like. Dust and dirt are banned, and materials used are correct and superbly fitted. The one word description for #1 vehicles is "concours."
#2 Excellent $14,100
#3 Good $9,300
#4 Fair $6,000
Steve
These numbers are more in line with what I have seen going on in the last year. They are higher than you NADA stuff and reflect the true collector car trade values.
I would toss the Asking price as that one is never right as asking and sold are two different things.
A good top rated GT can see prices in the teens. They do not have to bee absolutely perfect in the treads but they do need to be in good and even perfect orange peeled factory paint will be a plus.
Now keep in mind it was not all that long ago these cars were having a hard time breaking $10K to $12K with little to no miles.
They will continue to see slow growth and increase in value but never to the level of say a Hemi car or 64 GTO but few cars do.
They will always be in the mid space where they will see some growth but no great large gains unless there is something documented special. Like I said it will follow the path of the Corvair.
But they are all still way below 38K. That is what I was talking about, the rarity of those vehicles and the small number of people who would even pay close to the asking price are so small that that one that was advertised in this months auction in Florida. It will never go that high, $38,000 is way to high for a Fiero, even that Fiero.
I do not see Fieros rising in price very much over the years. The ones that sell for decent money are either low mileage 88's or highly customized GT's The car looks like a sports car yet performs like an economy car. If you look at the cars selling for the bucks, they are either muscle cars, performance cars, limited production, certain convertibles, customs, or special interest cars. Heck even 80's era Vettes are not selling and when they do sell they are going cheap. If you compare the 84-88 Vettes against the Fiero, you get far more for your money with the Corvette. The Vette handles far better is nicer overall ,but most 80's GM cars are slugs. The value of the Fiero is for the person who wants a platform to build a custom car on and wants to start on the cheap.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
But they are all still way below 38K. That is what I was talking about, the rarity of those vehicles and the small number of people who would even pay close to the asking price are so small that that one that was advertised in this months auction in Florida. It will never go that high, $38,000 is way to high for a Fiero, even that Fiero.
Steve
Who ever said the average Fiero would be $38K? The truth is they may hit that mark some day but that $38K would also not hold as much value as it does today either.
The dollar does not go as far as that has played a big roll in what things are worth today too. The average price of a car in 1985 was $12,000 and today it is $35,000. Who would have ever though a new Malibu with a 4 cylinder would cost up to $35,000?
That is the biggest reason why a $3000 Corvair is selling for $15,000 today.
But on the other hand there are a lot of cars from the same era the Corvair was from that hold nearly no value what so ever. A 4 door 4 cylinder Tempest from 1963 really holds little value even in good condition. Same for a 4 door Valiant or 4 door Falcon.
I do not see Fieros rising in price very much over the years. The ones that sell for decent money are either low mileage 88's or highly customized GT's The car looks like a sports car yet performs like an economy car. If you look at the cars selling for the bucks, they are either muscle cars, performance cars, limited production, certain convertibles, customs, or special interest cars. Heck even 80's era Vettes are not selling and when they do sell they are going cheap. If you compare the 84-88 Vettes against the Fiero, you get far more for your money with the Corvette. The Vette handles far better is nicer overall ,but most 80's GM cars are slugs. The value of the Fiero is for the person who wants a platform to build a custom car on and wants to start on the cheap.
The problem most early C4 Vettes are cheap as dirt. The problem is many of the issues they suffered like dash failure, seat failures and Cross Fire issue cost nearly as much to fix as the car is worth. That is not counting all the other cost issues with a Crovette. That is why I have seen them selling for less than many Fiero's.
Same for the 928 Porsche. They can be bought for next to nothing as simple things like a Fuel Pump if you can find one will set you back nearly half the value of the car. Same on many 944 and 944 Turbo models. Even a blown motor in a MR2 can be beyond cost effective to replace. Swaps are not easy there.
The thing about many 80's cars out side a Camaro, Fox body Mustang and A body GM is that most of them are not cheap or easy to fix or find replacement parts for. The Fiero is one that is since it shared many parts has lended itself to making a car that you can work with and not lose your shirt even if it is not a get rich car. It is kind of the MG of America.
Few cars of the 80's will be worth a ton. There will be a handful that will gain a lot of value and larger group that will be reasonable including the Fiero and then the cars that will be the total write off because no one cares at all.
Even the Ferrari name can not save some of their cars. There are many models out there that even with a V12 they old little value as they are not cars people like or want. Many of them once the rust gets to them they are not worth saving and are worth more in parts.
There is one 250 GT that is often stripped for parts for the Ferrari GTO replicas that get built. They got this particular model as it has the right engine and suspension and they normally toss the bodies.
There are even a lot of Rolls Royce models that can be had for less than $15K but they need work and often more than they are worth.,
There are web sites in Europe where they sell parts from many exotic cars as they hold so little value they are not worth the money to fix them up. They part them out on the web and often are worth more in parts than together.
This is one of those big picture things and you have to look at all aspects of the hobby. The truth is only a small portion of collector cars are the big money cars. Most fall in the middle and many non collector cars like the 4 doors and cars that just hold little interest fall off the map. Cars like a Chevy Monza are rare and most will vanish because no one cares and were are you going to get parts.
Even look at Pontiac from the same era as the Fiero. Only the TA and Fiero really hold much for the future as the rest of the cars no one cares about. Sure one pops up now and then from someone who squirreled it away but at is about it. When was the last time you saw a Grand Lemans in good shape from the 80's or even a Grand Am Turbo that still was running with the original engine and Turbo.
The Fiero because of what it is and the fan base will always have a slot in the hobby of car collecting. We may not be number one for value but we do hold a slot and because of the affordability and ease of keeping them running we will be around for a long time as a collectable car. Again do not confuse Collectable with valuable beyond your dreams value.
Who ever said the average Fiero would be $38K? The truth is they may hit that mark some day but that $38K would also not hold as much value as it does today either.
quote
Originally posted by Thunderstruck GT:
No, you're probably spot on with the exception of the "getting in and out of". There are a hell of a lot of blue-hairs re-living their childhood dreams in plastic Chevys and those are a bigger PITA to get in and out of than a Fiero.
I'm seeing many '88 GT's selling from the mid-teens to as high as 38k. '86 - '87 GT's have also been on a steady climb as of the past few years.
What I really find funny/odd are the people on this site that do a lot of putting down of the car. Either these people don't own a Fiero, use to own a Fiero and don't anymore or shouldn't own a Fiero. Due to their uniqueness these cars will stand the test of time.
I don't know this guy but do know he is not the brightest bulb on the tree, he joined last October and I for one am leery of new members until they show their true colors. Lately we have had old members who were band long ago, or in some cases just recently Who come back time after time and stir the pot again. We see them in OT all the time, they are usually not bright enough to start in tech to get a rating before they go off on other members. Not saying that is what this guy is but I am also not saying he isn't. Do you know him personally?
He customized a Bike and was expecting to get back what he put into it because he put money into it.
We all know better than that, unless he is those guys in NY who make custom bikes on TV for like the wounded warriors. you know Paul Teutul Sr. from that American Chopper: The Series.
Hey I am an old man, I have seen things over the last 60 years that have shown me that things and people are not always what they seem, lets just see this weekend coming if that Stealership that has been advertising that 88 GT sells for in the Florida auction. They wanted $38K for it, lets just see what it goes for at an auction, hey for all we know this could be the guy trying to increase his profit on that car, being it was a Stealership you know they didn't pay half what they are looking to get, now don't we.
Steve ------------------ Technology is great when it works, and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't
Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.
[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 01-17-2016).]
It is apparent to me why you don't see too many NOS parts or too many higher quality cars available in The Mall. People here won't spend money.
Then when parts and cars end up on Ebay, at a swap meet or a credible auction the ones that won't pay complain and attempt to devalue.
At least there are a few here that get it.
And for the record, I never said that the Fiero would be a $60,000.00 car, if I could predict that, I'd buy more lottery tickets. However, whether or not a few here want to believe it, I have seen some '88 GT's sell in the $30's. You want to deny it, that's your prerogative, it's a free country and I really don't give a damn because I don't live my life based on what someone else thinks.
What I do know is that I've done pretty damn good over the years with my car collection. I'm proud to say that I've owned some fairly interesting vehicles and probably made money on almost all. The only time I have lost any money was on customs or modified vehicles due to the fact that they are a "personal preference" type vehicles, you either love 'em or you don't. Unless your name is Foose or Ring or Kindig or Trepanier or some other big name, you can expect 20 to 50 cents on your dollar when one sells anything modified. It is what it is.
I really think me and hyperv6 are on the same page with only minor differences in our thinking.
[This message has been edited by Thunderstruck GT (edited 01-17-2016).]
I don't know this guy but do know he is not the brightest bulb on the tree, he joined last October and I for one am leery of new members until they show their true colors. Lately we have had old members who were band long ago, or in some cases just recently Who come back time after time and stir the pot again. We see them in OT all the time, they are usually not bright enough to start in tech to get a rating before they go off on other members. Not saying that is what this guy is but I am also not saying he isn't. Do you know him personally?
He customized a Bike and was expecting to get back what he put into it because he put money into it.
We all know better than that, unless he is those guys in NY who make custom bikes on TV for like the wounded warriors. you know Paul Teutul Sr. from that American Chopper: The Series.
Hey I am an old man, I have seen things over the last 60 years that have shown me that things and people are not always what they seem, lets just see this weekend coming if that Stealership that has been advertising that 88 GT sells for in the Florida auction. They wanted $38K for it, lets just see what it goes for at an auction, hey for all we know this could be the guy trying to increase his profit on that car, being it was a Stealership you know they didn't pay half what they are looking to get, now don't we.
Steve
Seriously!?!?
How long have you been playing with old cars? How many do you have? How many have you had? What were they?
Anytime you want to compare notes I'm ready.
I would also like you to post where I said I wanted to make money on my custom bike. Fact is I still have it and it is not for sale.
Just because I joined in 10/15 you're going to stereotype. I didn't realize this was your website.
How long have you been playing with old cars? How many do you have? How many have you had? What were they?
Anytime you want to compare notes I'm ready.
I would also like you to post where I said I wanted to make money on my custom bike. Fact is I still have it and it is not for sale.
Just because I joined in 10/15 you're going to stereotype. I didn't realize this was your website.
Believe me you don't want to do that, compare notes with me. I have been working on cars since the mid 60s, some custom vehicles my dad got, one had caddy tailfins with the gas cap underneath and a dodge rear end with the counterclockwise lug nuts on one side. worked at GM from 73 until the 90s, restored many cars for daily drivers just because I liked them, I never wanted show cars, just daily drivers, but I have owned some interesting cars over the decades many collectable, many not.
I don't care who you are but some of the things you have posted in other threads kind of sound trollish like many other trolls we have had over the years who continue to come back and start things and end up getting band again and again and again.
Lets just wait and see what happens at that auction that is coming up in FL. with that 38K car as far as prices go. What do you think, is he going to even get his asking price? I say no way !
I know certain cars are worth more than others because of the year, mileage, options, and other things but for a Fiero to be worth 38K to me it had better be Hulki's personal car, and by the way he drove his, so it can't be worth that much other than the fact that he owned it. I am no newbie at this as you can tell, I have had corvettes, even worked at a corvette restoration shop in Taxachusettes, Cobra's, Harley's and many more, and that was all on a working mans salary.
Believe me you don't want to do that, compare notes with me. I have been working on cars since the mid 60s, some custom vehicles my dad got, one had caddy tailfins with the gas cap underneath and a dodge rear end with the counterclockwise lug nuts on one side. worked at GM from 73 until the 90s, restored many cars for daily drivers just because I liked them, I never wanted show cars, just daily drivers, but I have owned some interesting cars over the decades many collectable, many not.
I don't care who you are but some of the things you have posted in other threads kind of sound trollish like many other trolls we have had over the years who continue to come back and start things and end up getting band again and again and again.
Lets just wait and see what happens at that auction that is coming up in FL. with that 38K car as far as prices go. What do you think, is he going to even get his asking price? I say no way !
I know certain cars are worth more than others because of the year, mileage, options, and other things but for a Fiero to be worth 38K to me it had better be Hulki's personal car, and by the way he drove his, so it can't be worth that much other than the fact that he owned it. I am no newbie at this as you can tell, I have had corvettes, even worked at a corvette restoration shop in Taxachusettes, Cobra's, Harley's and many more, and that was all on a working mans salary.
Steve
One can always tell when he has the upper hand, the name calling starts. Will played sir, please carry on.
Oh, and if you're referring to Mecum? Look for the bright green/white top/white interior '69 SS 396 - 4 speed Convertible, we're going to be looking for $45,000.00.
One can always tell when he has the upper hand, the name calling starts. Will played sir, please carry on.
Oh, and if you're referring to Mecum? Look for the bright green/white top/white interior '69 SS 396 - 4 speed Convertible, we're going to be looking for $45,000.00.
Rich people with their money are not always the brightest bulbs on the tree. I didn't call you anything, I did say what you are doing is trollish, not that you were a troll just the way you post is troll like.
Misdirection is also another thing trolls do when they can't beat you.
Personally I think you are just the Stealership that wants to get big bucks for a car they paid about half what it was worth to a person who traded it in. Trying to drum up his selling price for a car that they stole,But that's me.
edit to add,
another misdirection away from the topic at hand. lets see what another car totally unrelated to the Fiero is worth, we aren't talking about another car, we are talking about the price Fiero's are worth. Many cars over the ages increase in price to certain people. me I would pay that much for an old 67 firebird convertible with the 400 4 barrel, because I had one as a kid in high school. But that's me, not everyone would pay that price and to be honest I can't afford to do that now, disabled and on a fixed income.
Steve
[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 01-18-2016).]
Who ever said the average Fiero would be $38K? The truth is they may hit that mark some day but that $38K would also not hold as much value as it does today either.
The dollar does not go as far as that has played a big roll in what things are worth today too. The average price of a car in 1985 was $12,000 and today it is $35,000. Who would have ever though a new Malibu with a 4 cylinder would cost up to $35,000?
That is the biggest reason why a $3000 Corvair is selling for $15,000 today.
But on the other hand there are a lot of cars from the same era the Corvair was from that hold nearly no value what so ever. A 4 door 4 cylinder Tempest from 1963 really holds little value even in good condition. Same for a 4 door Valiant or 4 door Falcon.
According to a handy inflation calculator I googled up, $12k in 1988 is equivalent to $24k today, so the Fiero would still be relatively cheap compared to today's cars, BUT a Fiero would not sell as-is in today's market. Think of everything a modern car has that the Fiero (even a "loaded" model" lacks
--Airbags (and tons of other "safety" stuff) --Integrated infotainment --GPS --OBD --Power steering --ABS --Traction control
Many of those features are optional, but a lot of them are required by law. It's unlikely you could build and sell a new Fiero today and have it be recognizable compared to our cars. Even deleting options such as power steering and robust infotainment doesn't do away with a lot of weight and expense. The airbags and related systems and other "safety" features eat up a lot of space, thus making the car bigger and heavier. On top of that, that stuff doesn't come cheap. My GTO has almost NO options and is as stripped down of a "nice" car as you could get and it STILL cost $35k and weighs 3800lb. I'm not saying a Fiero would be THAT big and heavy, but of the three attributes of a Fiero that are desirable (small, light, cheap) you only get to pick two.
If I wanted an extremely low mileage all original Fiero I'd probably pay upwards of 20k, it's really not that much money these days.
It's a bit embarrassing sometimes to even be apart of certain parts of the Fiero community.. some owners are so stubborn/cheap/ignorant they think everything should be free, or damn near it, and because they're cheap everyone should be and the cars should all be worthless.
If I wanted an extremely low mileage all original Fiero I'd probably pay upwards of 20k, it's really not that much money these days.
It's a bit embarrassing sometimes to even be apart of certain parts of the Fiero community.. some owners are so stubborn/cheap/ignorant they think everything should be free, or damn near it, and because they're cheap everyone should be and the cars should all be worthless.
meaning over 20 K or up to 20K
Because some here think a car like that is worth 38K NOW
Steve
------------------ Technology is great when it works, and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't
It is what it is and the prices are out there so there is no point to argue.
The pattern is set and the path is clear where the car is going.
It kind of takes opinion out of it.
The history of the car has been affordable because there was just to damn many of them. As time goes on it has tempered the prices of good examples as they are just not on every corner anymore. Because the demand may have remained the same but the supply of very good models are becoming less the values have seen some moderate increase but not crazy money.
Also now that the car is getting older it has proven to be an interesting model to some collectors who have added it to their collections over the years. As many I have run into have a big money car at the show but they tell me Hey I got one of these at home. It is a fun little car.
As the market goes so will the Fiero as it will increase slowly as like most collectable cars of interest.
Like I said it will not progress like a 1965 GTO but it will do a little better than a Sunbird and almost as good as a TA of the same era.
If it ever does get to the point of real value most of us will be too old to get in it anyways.
It is what it is and arguing is not going to change it either way.
As for the cheap people. They are not cheap they bought in on this car because it was affordable. Not everyone can afford an expensive car and that was one reason there are as many people on this web site as there is. Now that the car is getting older and some folks are paying more for some clean examples prices for parts may also go up as some people can afford to pay more if they have a need. The bottom line is you can not have affordable and valuable at the same time. I think that point alone shows that we have seen some progress on values.
[This message has been edited by hyperv6 (edited 01-18-2016).]
As for the cheap people. They are not cheap they bought in on this car because it was affordable. Not everyone can afford an expensive car and that was one reason there are as many people on this web site as there is. Now that the car is getting older and some folks are paying more for some clean examples prices for parts may also go up as some people can afford to pay more if they have a need. The bottom line is you can not have affordable and valuable at the same time. I think that point alone shows that we have seen some progress on values.
progress yes, not over the top prices like this 38K Fiero the Stealership is looking for on one car in this thread.
like I said to me no Fiero is worth over 10 K unless it is documented and perfect 11 out of 10.
To Jay Leno maybe, but not to me or many others even here.
