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iPad dash by kgoodyear
Started on: 08-10-2014 09:50 PM
Replies: 23 (871 views)
Last post by: hercimer01 on 08-29-2014 12:19 AM
kgoodyear
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Report this Post08-10-2014 09:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for kgoodyearClick Here to Email kgoodyearSend a Private Message to kgoodyearEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Has anyone incorporated an iPad dash panel into a fiero dash yet?

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Report this Post08-25-2014 11:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hercimer01Send a Private Message to hercimer01Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'm looking into Rooting a Kindle Fire HDX 10.1 and running Torque as an instrument representation. It would have Wifi, Bluetooth and 4G Cellular. It could be tethered to a cell phone or run as a stand alone. My concerns are instrument representation and having to build a whole new cluster to house it.

I'm not sure how much an Ipad cost or if there is even an app to represent the gauges. You could probably install it in the center console some how as an entertainment and navigation tool.
A Kindle Fire HDX 10.1 could be had for 250 to 300 and can be rooted to run the latest Android OS, thereby giving you access to all the apps on the market.

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kgoodyear
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Report this Post08-25-2014 11:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for kgoodyearClick Here to Email kgoodyearSend a Private Message to kgoodyearEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My decision to go with an I pad was only because my mechanic has on his GM vehicle and uses a blue tooth technology to transmit from the ecu to his laptop. Now, let me tell you something I have learned since I posted this opening thread, and there is a lot of merit to it. The iPad should be used as a research tool to gather information not as a real-time dashboard. So what I have decided to do is put dual and quad "analog" gauges in the dash and have narrowed them down to the most important indicators: Tach with a small speedometer, oil and water temperature and pressure. Fuel and electric stay where they are. I'll probably customize the console to hold the iPad displaying what information I am curious about only when I can take my eyes off the road. The idea is after a "run" to analyze the data. I'm still not sure what the fuzz would think about an iPad in the dash as the instrument panel when it can so easily be switched to a movie. I'll be replacing my radio space with intercooler information again in an analog format.

Thanks for the feed back. I'd sure like to hear others' opinions.

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Report this Post08-26-2014 12:26 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Id go with a Android device with a smaller screen. Torque is awesome, will do data logging and you might even be able to relocate the camera for track recording. No rooting necisary and you might find what your looking for as cheap as $100. You'd want a recent version of android, gps, bluetooth and wifi. The elm327 adaptors are cheap, $12 and under.


http://pages.ebay.com/link/...201150278176&alt=web Has everything you'd need and its a name brand.

[This message has been edited by jmbishop (edited 08-26-2014).]

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Report this Post08-26-2014 10:16 AM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jmbishop:
The elm327 adaptors are cheap, $12 and under.


They're also crap, and not really elm327s. They are cheap clones from China that don't do things correctly, and have weird version numbers that aren't the proper Elm versions. They're also slow. I have one sitting right here, and I couldn't even manage to get a proper serial connection to it over Bluetooth. I then bought an OBDLink MX, and it works perfectly, and it's also much faster than the Elm 327 and clones. It also has a powered down sleep mode for when you're not using it, to minimize battery drain.

If you're going to mount a tablet in the car though, then USB would be better anyway. It's faster, and you can avoid battery drain when you remove the tablet from the car.

But none of that matters unless you're running a swapped OBD-II system in the car. You can't use those with the stock Fiero ECM, and even if you could, the Fiero ECM is way too slow for a live dash system.
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Report this Post08-26-2014 06:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by dobey:


They're also crap, and not really elm327s. They are cheap clones from China that don't do things correctly, and have weird version numbers that aren't the proper Elm versions. They're also slow...........

What isn't made in China? You do have to check to make sure you got a good one, if not get your money back and try again. 2 out of the 3 I've bought worked flawless the 3rd they refundeded me instantly when I said I had a problem with it. Usb is a better idea however.

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kgoodyear
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Report this Post08-26-2014 08:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for kgoodyearClick Here to Email kgoodyearSend a Private Message to kgoodyearEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
What kind of information will be available to the iPad from a GM 3800 SC swap? How does one use the USB port with the ECU?

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Report this Post08-26-2014 10:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jmbishop:

What isn't made in China? You do have to check to make sure you got a good one, if not get your money back and try again. 2 out of the 3 I've bought worked flawless the 3rd they refundeded me instantly when I said I had a problem with it. Usb is a better idea however.


It's not about whether it's made in China or not. It's about whether it's a cheap knock-off or not. The iPad is made in China too. The cheap $8-20 ones are junk clones. Sure, sometimes they will work, and Torque and other apps might seem to work OK with them, but they aren't fast enough to do flashing, and they are buggy. Hard wired for any real dash info would be much better though.
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Report this Post08-26-2014 10:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by kgoodyear:
What kind of information will be available to the iPad from a GM 3800 SC swap? How does one use the USB port with the ECU?


With the right hardware and software, all the info on the ECU should be available, assuming you're actually running an OBD-II system and not an earlier ECU to control a Series II engine for example. But, if you've got the right OBD adapter, and the software you're using supports all the info in the ECU, then you can see it all. Plenty of info is in the Class-2 bus protocol, and may not be accessible by many of the apps out there though. Probably all the things you care about, you should be able to get at, though.
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Report this Post08-27-2014 08:35 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hercimer01Send a Private Message to hercimer01Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jmbishop:


http://pages.ebay.com/link/...201150278176&alt=web Has everything you'd need and its a name brand.



The 4G portion doesn't work. I could be wrong but I don't see Blue tooth in the specifics. It looks like it has only WiFi.

Edit: I was wrong. It does have blue tooth, but it is refurbished and only 7 inch. Here's a 10 inch new with 3G Dongle ability for less.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-...ice&tpos=unknow&rd=1

[This message has been edited by hercimer01 (edited 08-27-2014).]

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kgoodyear
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Report this Post08-27-2014 10:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for kgoodyearClick Here to Email kgoodyearSend a Private Message to kgoodyearEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My mechanic uses blue tooth and he has a small transmitter he plugs into the ecu (I think) of his gm pickup. I haven't done a lot with it yet as we are still working on the swap.
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Report this Post08-28-2014 09:43 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ltlfrariClick Here to visit ltlfrari's HomePageClick Here to Email ltlfrariSend a Private Message to ltlfrariEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I suspect that having an iPad or any such device in the console of a Fiero would be inviting someone to break into your car.
That Torque Pro app is ODB2 so it's not going to work on a stock Fiero.
When I did my swap I had an adapter cable I made to connect the Fiero's odb to a laptop and some software (forget which) to log the ecm data.
If you wanted to do something similar with a mobile device you'd probably have to create some hardware (an Arduino would work) to grab the data from the Fiero odb and then sent it via bluetooth (arduino bluetooth shield) to the mobile device but you'd still need an app to grab the data and display it.
I don't have that much time anymore to spend it doing that lot!. Be cool to do though


Edit. Just found this http://www.reddevilriver.com/ALDL_Bluetooth.html


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[This message has been edited by ltlfrari (edited 08-28-2014).]

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Report this Post08-28-2014 10:24 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by hercimer01:


The 4G portion doesn't work. I could be wrong but I don't see Blue tooth in the specifics. It looks like it has only WiFi.

Edit: I was wrong. It does have blue tooth, but it is refurbished and only 7 inch. Here's a 10 inch new with 3G Dongle ability for less.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-...ice&tpos=unknow&rd=1


That one might be better and I didn't search to hard to find the absolute best option but with android staying away from the no name chinese tablets is a good idea, there are a few good ones but for a little more name brand gives you piece of mind.
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Report this Post08-28-2014 10:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by hercimer01:
The 4G portion doesn't work. I could be wrong but I don't see Blue tooth in the specifics. It looks like it has only WiFi.


It's the 2012 Nexus 7, which only has WiFi, and no 3G/4G. I have one sitting on my desk, basically new, that I've been trying to sell, as I don't need it any more.

And 10" is too big to stick anywhere useful, in a Fiero, anyway. Heck, 7" is too big, and there's really no good place to put one in a stock interior Fiero.
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Report this Post08-28-2014 10:55 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by dobey:


It's not about whether it's made in China or not. It's about whether it's a cheap knock-off or not. The iPad is made in China too. The cheap $8-20 ones are junk clones. Sure, sometimes they will work, and Torque and other apps might seem to work OK with them, but they aren't fast enough to do flashing, and they are buggy. Hard wired for any real dash info would be much better though.


No bugs or lag with any of the good ones I kept. I decided to crack the case on the one I keep in my truck, sure enough the first one I bought for $12 it's a real elm 327 according to the interwebs. My strategy is to only buy from us sellers who have good feedback and have sold a good number of adaptors. The one in my wife's car was $8, I'll crack it open when she gets home.

Flashing with anything other than a wired connection is a bad idea period.
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Report this Post08-28-2014 11:15 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by kgoodyear:

What kind of information will be available to the iPad from a GM 3800 SC swap? How does one use the USB port with the ECU?



You'd have to google the available apps for the iPad to see what they support, chances are they will support just as much as the torque app for android. Here is another awful track recorder video of someone driving on the street in a 2000 grand prix GTP.
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Report this Post08-28-2014 12:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jmbishop:
No bugs or lag with any of the good ones I kept. I decided to crack the case on the one I keep in my truck, sure enough the first one I bought for $12 it's a real elm 327 according to the interwebs.


What version of the Elm327 is it? Even if it's the v1.3 chip, the company selling it at $12 would be making no profit. The cheapest discount for that version for the official chip puts them at $11.08 per chip. The newer versions are over $12 just for the chip alone. So if it's real, then whoever is selling them is taking quite the loss.

As for the bugs or lag, I'd say you've just been lucky. For data logging and just glancing to see oil temp or something, the lower speed is probably fine. But there are other things where it's not so great. And just because you haven't seen the buggy pieces, doesn't mean they aren't there. Torque and some other apps tend to have workarounds to deal with the buggy pieces, or just ignore them.
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Report this Post08-28-2014 05:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for kgoodyearClick Here to Email kgoodyearSend a Private Message to kgoodyearEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I was originally going to make my dash out of an iPad (or what-ever) but it didn't take long for me to figure out all that neat stuff happening on that screen would rate up there with texting while driving. Guys being guys we are going to want to watch and analyze while we are driving and will end up hurting someone. It will be interesting once we get the engine fired up just what information is available. I suspect it will be limited. I suppose the ideal toy would be for it to record your coordinates and follow along on a map where you are going and what the stats were at that time. But in the end, I'm not so sure there are many benefits in rehashing information not already on the dash. I've figured out the most important information is Tach (and speedometer), oil and water: temperature and pressure. Any of the latter go south, you could play hell with your engine very quickly. The next would be the intercooler water temp and pressure. These can all be easily seen on the middle dash with the fuel and voltage.

Much of the information I wouldn't know what it meant anyway. I do like bells, whistles and widgets though!

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Report this Post08-28-2014 05:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for kgoodyearClick Here to Email kgoodyearSend a Private Message to kgoodyearEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Wow, I just watched Mr. Bishop's video and that is very distracting. I tried to pretend I was the driver and found myself glued to those gauges and I would have rear ended that pickup more than once. There is way too much information overload (for me anyway). I think the pattern recognition of an "analog" meter in the dash is more friendly to the eyes and is far better. Just like it is easier to tell time on an analog clock than a digital one.

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Report this Post08-28-2014 06:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If you just want more info available while driving, you might want to look at a HUD setup. Some HUDs have pages you can switch between with a button on the dash or steering wheel, and some have customizable screens, so you just get the bits you need. And since it's just light reflecting off the windshield, it'll be directly in your field of view while driving, and much less distracting.
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Report this Post08-28-2014 08:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by kgoodyear:

I was originally going to make my dash out of an iPad (or what-ever) but it didn't take long for me to figure out all that neat stuff happening on that screen would rate up there with texting while driving. Guys being guys we are going to want to watch and analyze while we are driving and will end up hurting someone. It will be interesting once we get the engine fired up just what information is available. I suspect it will be limited. I suppose the ideal toy would be for it to record your coordinates and follow along on a map where you are going and what the stats were at that time. But in the end, I'm not so sure there are many benefits in rehashing information not already on the dash. I've figured out the most important information is Tach (and speedometer), oil and water: temperature and pressure. Any of the latter go south, you could play hell with your engine very quickly. The next would be the intercooler water temp and pressure. These can all be easily seen on the middle dash with the fuel and voltage.

Much of the information I wouldn't know what it meant anyway. I do like bells, whistles and widgets though!



What is the engine swap?
Torque does everthing you've mentioned would be nice, I am saticefied with it on my phone for occasional use.

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Report this Post08-28-2014 08:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for kgoodyearClick Here to Email kgoodyearSend a Private Message to kgoodyearEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My swap is an 87 fiero GT with a GM 3800 SC. Donor is a 98 Grand Prix.

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Report this Post08-28-2014 08:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for kgoodyearClick Here to Email kgoodyearSend a Private Message to kgoodyearEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
This phone app you show in the video is sweet! I have to get me one of those! Maybe it is one of those widgets I could somehow justify!

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Report this Post08-29-2014 12:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for hercimer01Send a Private Message to hercimer01Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by dobey:


And 10" is too big to stick anywhere useful, in a Fiero, anyway. Heck, 7" is too big, and there's really no good place to put one in a stock interior Fiero.


Exactly my point. You have to remove the stock cluster and build a housing for the tablet.
With it mounted in the dash, taking videos with the track recorder wouldn't be possible.
Plus it really wouldn't be too noticeable to passers by with my tinted windows.
I have Torque and the track recorder is cool, but the video quality is poor.
I use my Galaxy S3 taped to my rear view mirror for videos when i'm at the track racing.

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