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OverKill Speed and Color's #1 by OverKill
Started on: 04-10-2014 02:19 PM
Replies: 20 (718 views)
Last post by: OverKill on 05-19-2014 08:28 PM
OverKill
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Report this Post04-10-2014 02:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I've been building my car ever so slowly since 2009 when the iron duke started giving me trouble. It seemed like a good time to rip the entire car apart and start over.
This is what i started out with



this is what it looks like from inside Perfect Union


then when i got to college i started doing some front suspension work and installed an 88 front suspension and some bigger brakes.


notched to fit the new crossmember



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OverKill
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Report this Post04-10-2014 02:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
then i had it on the ground again


now shuffle a few years ahead and a few body mods that i put on and cut off. because i change the direction i was going with the car.


Now it's time for me to start working on the front body work and rear frame and suspension. I have a cadillac 472 I plan to stuff in the rear which means i will be removing and rebuilding the entire rear section of the frame out of tubing to clear the massive engine. I plan to run a sequential turbo set up with a water to air intercooler because the way i see it i am going to do my best to build the car one time and not tear into it and upgrade it so go big or go home.


as far as the body goes i plan on creating my own widebody front and rear. I'm looking to have it a bit more curvy than the others i have seen.
I started maching up my front end the last few weekends





Im open to all comments good and bad. I know Im a little crazy at times and am open to all the advice i can get.
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Report this Post04-10-2014 07:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for LT188GTClick Here to Email LT188GTSend a Private Message to LT188GTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Just one question. Why that engine?
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OverKill
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Report this Post04-10-2014 08:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Well first I was going to do a 3.1 then I bought a 3.4dohc then I decided I missed having a v8 car so I bought a 5.3 and I sold that because I figured plenty of people had ls based motors. I wanted something big so I did some research and decided that the cadi motors were a good choice they have high nickel casting which makes them light. A Cadillac 500 with an aluminum intake weighs the same as a small block Chevy. So you get huge displacement without sacrificing weight. Also these huge cadi motors got high teens for mileage un a fully loaded boat of a Cadillac. A company called Potter sells parts to make naturally aspirated Cadillac big blocks that make more than 800 hp. The cranks are strong so with some connecting rods and low compression pistons I have a solid base for a strong turbo engine.
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OverKill
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Report this Post04-27-2014 12:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Pardon my poor drawing skills but here is an idea of what I have in mind for the car.



Let me know what you think.
you can make fun of me if you want.

Ethan
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Ang84Indy
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Report this Post04-27-2014 03:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Ang84IndySend a Private Message to Ang84IndyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'm looking forward to this build! Do you have any details on the "88 front suspension swap? The question of what is involved comes up on the forum from time to time.
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OverKill
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Report this Post04-27-2014 04:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Ang84Indy:

I'm looking forward to this build! Do you have any details on the "88 front suspension swap? The question of what is involved comes up on the forum from time to time.


I have noticed that not many people do the 88 front suspension suspension swap. As you can see in some of my pictures the frame had to be notched and have new thread inserts welded into the frame. I was able to use the farthest forward bolts on the 88 cradle to bolt where the stock 85 cradle bolted to locate the subframe in its new home. Then I marked where I needed to cut the existing frame then after cutting I put the subframe back in place and drilled for the rear bolts then I removed the subframe and welde in thread inserts for the rear. Then I bolted the subframe in once again and fitted the plates where I had notched the frame and tacked them in place. I removed the subframe again and finished welding the plates where the notch was. Bolted the subframe in and drilled holes fir the 4 main bolts of the cross member removed the subframe one last time. Weld thread inserts into the frame and put some paint or coating of your choice over all the bare metal and then reassemble one last time.

kind of redundant and takes a little time but I feel its worth it.

also I have been tossing the name "The Mongoose" for the car.

Ethan
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Report this Post04-27-2014 05:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Ang84IndySend a Private Message to Ang84IndyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks for the information. It sounds like the most difficult part is the welding.
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OverKill
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Report this Post04-27-2014 06:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Well I hope my explanation wasn't impossible to understand

I also picked up troyboy's original enterra interior for The Mongoose.
I'm picking it up next time I run down to Archie's in a couple weeks and I will post some pictures of it.
Kinda cool I got lucky enough to paint the Enterra and I also get a piece of it for my own car.

Ethan
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Report this Post04-30-2014 11:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Well I put the engine on the cradle to see how bad fitting it would be and all I can say is that it looks like I'll be building a tube cradle as well. I will post some pictures up tomorrow.

Ethan
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OverKill
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Report this Post04-30-2014 11:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
i guess i didnt want to wait until tomorrow



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Report this Post05-01-2014 02:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I love different swaps and this one certainly is different! I also have a friend with a 454 BBC transverse and BMW V12 mounted transverse in a Fiero, so I am pretty sure you can make this swap work, but it will take some significant reworking of the chassis rails/cradle to accomodate the additional width.

One concern would be the transmission you plan to use. The 472/500 caddy engines got decent fuel economy (for a big block) because the transmission and final drive didn't have the engine spinning a lot RPM's at cruise. Unless you go with an F40 6 speed, the engine will spin too many RPM's and your cruise economy will likley be under 13 mpg. With the F40 and the lower cruise RPM you will have a chance for some better fuel economy.
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Report this Post05-01-2014 05:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fieroguru:

I love different swaps and this one certainly is different! I also have a friend with a 454 BBC transverse and BMW V12 mounted transverse in a Fiero, so I am pretty sure you can make this swap work, but it will take some significant reworking of the chassis rails/cradle to accomodate the additional width.

One concern would be the transmission you plan to use. The 472/500 caddy engines got decent fuel economy (for a big block) because the transmission and final drive didn't have the engine spinning a lot RPM's at cruise. Unless you go with an F40 6 speed, the engine will spin too many RPM's and your cruise economy will likley be under 13 mpg. With the F40 and the lower cruise RPM you will have a chance for some better fuel economy.


I have also been thinking about how short the gearing on my 5 speed are. 1st gear would probably be pointless to have with a turbocharged 472.

My long term plan was to use an f40 and seeing as i have to build everything its not like it would be difficult at that point. does anyone have any good links to the f40 swap? My main questions are in the axle department and shift linkage.

i did a quick search on car-part.com to see what f 40's were going for in my area but nothing was real close so i will have to call some local yards.

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Report this Post05-01-2014 07:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by OverKill:
My long term plan was to use an f40 and seeing as i have to build everything its not like it would be difficult at that point. does anyone have any good links to the f40 swap? My main questions are in the axle department and shift linkage.



My LS4/F40 build thread covers the 4 speed shifter mods and mocking up the 2 getrag select cables to build the shifter cable bracket.
http://www.fiero.nl/forum/F...3/HTML/000123-7.html

Since you will need to shift the transmission a few inches to the DS to get the engine in the engine bay, at a minimum you will need a custom driver side axle. I used 2 Saab 9-5 intermediate shafts and another piece of steel shafting to make a longer intermediate shaft so I could use a stock G6 axle on the PS and just needed to swap the CV end to a Fiero CV.

With the torque that the caddy would have w/o the turbo (let along with a turbo), you are going to have outer CV issues and will likely need to upgrade the rear wheel bearings so you can run larger CV housings.
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Report this Post05-01-2014 08:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fieroguru:

With the torque that the caddy would have w/o the turbo (let along with a turbo), you are going to have outer CV issues and will likely need to upgrade the rear wheel bearings so you can run larger CV housings.


my plan so far is to use Chevy Astro van spindle and wheel bearing figuring that they would be heavier duty.

Ethan
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OverKill
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Report this Post05-04-2014 09:39 AM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
So yesterday i went for it. got the saw zall out and got the rear section out of my way so i could fit the 472 in. Once i get it all placed where i need it i can start building my back half.




trunk was pretty solid for a WI car that i drove in the winter.


This was surprisingly light i was able to pick it up myself and move it.


Something is missing here....










Its all looking feasible now. Lets see if i can put my all too expensive specialty "Motorsports Chassis Fabrication" section from WyoTech to use.

Ethan
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Report this Post05-11-2014 07:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Picked up the enterra interior yesterday. fiberglass is in great shape but the upholstery and the seats are pretty roached.




I will try to add better pictures of the interior parts.

------------------
Ethan

1985 Base "The Mongoose" under the knife 472 turbo build

1988 Formula daily driver

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OverKill
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Report this Post05-11-2014 07:23 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post


heres an example of a restored Enterra interior.
Im not planning the wood grain though and I am thinking modern gauges is a must.


------------------
Ethan

1985 Base "The Mongoose" under the knife 472 turbo build

1988 Formula daily driver

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Report this Post05-11-2014 07:35 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by OverKill:




That is certainly one way to get it to fit!

I am interested to see what kind of structure you put back.
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OverKill
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Report this Post05-11-2014 07:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I
 
quote
Originally posted by fieroguru:


That is certainly one way to get it to fit!

I am interested to see what kind of structure you put back.



I took memorial week off of work and Allan to get most of my back half welded in. So you will see in q couple weeks.
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OverKill
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Report this Post05-19-2014 08:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OverKillSend a Private Message to OverKillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I've been doing a little reading on the f23 5speed. Any thoughts or advice on putting it behind my big block?
Thanks,

------------------
Ethan

1985 Base "The Mongoose" under the knife 472 turbo build

1988 Formula daily driver

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