quote Originally posted by fierobear: You SERIOUSLY equate the two? The Fed's policy of printing money and monetizing the debt is a serious risk to the country. Maxine Waters saying "The Tea Party can go to hell" is an appropriate thing for a sitting member of Congress to say? REALLY?

Treason is a serious charge, especially when Bernanke did not give comfort to a foreign enemy. Even Karl Rove said he was wrong to do so... I believe its a serious error on Perry's part, to make such an accusation. I think this is a bigger deal, since its an accusation of a crime without actual facts to back it up. But they were both wrong.

[This message has been edited by tbone42 (edited 08-22-2011).]

quote Originally posted by tbone42: Treason is a serious charge, especially when Bernanke did not give comfort to a foreign enemy. Even Karl Rove said he was wrong to do so... I believe its a serious error on Perry's part, to make such an accusation. I think this is a bigger deal, since its an accusation of a crime without actual facts to back it up. But they were both wrong.

Yeah, treason probably was too strong a term. How would you describe actions that are detrimental to our country, but aren't giving aid to an enemy?

quote Originally posted by fierobear: The Tea Party was so named in the spirit of protest, and in reference to "the Boston tea party". THAT'S what it is about. That others have chosen to interpret that as a sexual pejorative is on THEM, not us. If people want to be crass and condescending about it, then it is THEY who are crass and condescending.

when people cannot debate based on fact they turn to Ad Hominem attacks.

quote Originally posted by NickD3.4: when people cannot debate based on fact they turn to Ad Hominem attacks.

Whatever, uglyface.

quote Originally posted by newf: The tea party seems to be the far right of the republican party, if they want to be their "own" party they should run as third option IMO.

The "Progressives" are far left of the Democratic party and co opted the Democratic party instead of starting their own. Third parties do not fare well in American politics.

well, this thread certainly does highlite the truth of the topic title.

the thread stands as it own evidence. amazing how that works.

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: well, this thread certainly does highlite the truth of the topic title. the thread stands as it own evidence. amazing how that works.

Fail !

quote Originally posted by cliffw: Fail !

pffft. You mean people still ready pyrthian's posts?

The Tea Party movement from Wikipedia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_movement

quote The Tea Party movement (TPM) is an American populist[1][2][3] political movement that is generally recognized as conservative and libertarian,[4][5] and has sponsored protests and supported political candidates since 2009.[6][7][8] It endorses reduced government spending,[9][10] opposition to taxation in varying degrees,[10] reduction of the national debt and federal budget deficit,[9] and adherence to an originalist interpretation of the United States Constitution.[11] The name "Tea Party" is a reference to the Boston Tea Party, a protest by colonists who objected to a British tax on tea in 1773 and demonstrated by dumping British tea taken from docked ships into the harbor.[12] Some commentators have referred to the Tea in "Tea Party" as the backronym "Taxed Enough Already".[13][14] The Tea Party movement has caucuses in the House of Representatives and the Senate of the United States.[15] The Tea Party movement has no central leadership, but is composed of a loose affiliation of national and local groups that determine their own platforms and agendas. The Tea Party movement has been cited as an example of grassroots political activity, although it has also been cited as an example of astroturfing.[16] The Tea Party's most noted national figures include Republican politicians such as Michele Bachmann, Sarah Palin, Dick Armey, Herman Cain, and Ron Paul, with Paul described by some as the "intellectual godfather" of the movement.[17][18] Though the Tea Party movement is not, as of 2011, a national political party, polls show that most Tea Partiers consider themselves to be Republicans[19][20] and it has tended to endorse Republican candidates.[21] Commentators including Gallup editor-in-chief Frank Newport have suggested that the movement is not a new political group, but simply a rebranding of traditional Republican candidates and policies.[19][22][23] An October 2010 Washington Post canvass of local Tea Party organizers found 87% saying "dissatisfaction with mainstream Republican Party leaders" was "an important factor in the support the group has received so far".[24]

The Tea Party Caucus.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_Caucus

quote The Tea Party Caucus is a caucus of the United States House of Representatives and Senate launched and chaired by Minnesota Congresswoman Michele Bachmann on July 16, 2010.[1] The caucus is dedicated to promoting what it considers fiscal responsibility, adherence to the movement's interpretation of the Constitution, and limited government. The idea of a Tea Party Caucus originated from Kentucky Senator Rand Paul when he was campaigning for his current seat.[2] The caucus was approved as an official congressional member organization by the House Administration Committee on July 19, 2010[3] and held its first meeting on July 21. Its first public event was a press conference on the grounds of the U.S. Capitol, also on July 21.[4] Four Senators joined the caucus on January 27, 2011.[5]

The Tea Party Protests.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_protests

quote The Tea Party protests are a series of protests across the United States that began in early 2009; see List of Tea Party protests, 2009. The protests are part of a larger political movement called the Tea Party. It focuses on smaller government, fiscal responsibility, individual freedoms and upholding a conservative view of the Constitution. Among other events, protests have been held on: January 24, 2009 to protest a proposed 18% tax on non-diet soft drinks by former Governor of New York, David Paterson;[1] February 27, 2009 to protest the Troubled Assets Relief Program (TARP) bailout bill signed by President George W. Bush in October 2008 and the ARRA stimulus bill signed by President Barack Obama ten days prior to the protest;[2] April 15, 2009 to coincide with the annual U.S. deadline for submitting tax returns, known as Tax Day;[3][4] July 4, 2009 to coincide with Independence Day;[5] September 12, 2009 to coincide with the anniversary of the day after the September 11 attacks;[6] November 5, 2009 in Washington D.C. to protest the impending Health insurance vote;[7] March 14–21, 2010 in Washington, D.C. during the final week of debate on the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act.[8] Most Tea Party activities in 2010 have been focused on opposing the efforts (supported by the Obama Administration) to enact reforms to health insurance and health care delivery, and on recruiting, nominating, and supporting candidates for upcoming state and national elections.[citation needed] The name "Tea Party" is a reference to the Boston Tea Party, whose principal aim was to protest taxation without representation.[9][10] Tea Party protests have sought to evoke images, slogans and themes from the American Revolution, such as tri-corner hats and yellow Gadsden "Don't Tread on Me" flags.[4][11] The letters T-E-A have been used by some protesters to form the backronym "Taxed Enough Already".[12] Commentators promoted Tax Day events on blogs, Twitter, and Facebook, while the Fox News Channel regularly featured televised programming leading into and promoting various protest activities.[13] Reaction to the tea parties included counter-protests expressing support for the Obama administration, and dismissive or mocking media coverage of both the events and its promoters.[13][14]

Hopefully this clears up some misunderstandings.

More bad news for the Tea drinkers:

quote On the decline of the tea party Opinions Leonard Pitts it seems more than half the American electorate now holds a negative view of the tea party movement. If you’re wondering what that is a leading indicator of, the answer is simple: common sense. The noteworthy thing about the CNN/ORC poll, which was conducted Aug. 5-7, is not simply that it found 51 percent of Americans now regard the tea party unfavorably, up from 26 percent when they first started asking this question in January 2010. No, what’s telling is where the dislike is coming from. You see, the spike does not reflect a change of mind from the tea party faithful. Approval numbers have remained relatively stable over the 19-month history of the survey, starting out at 33 percent, peaking to 38 percent twice, falling back to 31 percent this month. Once one drinks the tea, apparently, the tea stays drunk. No, the fluctuation has come from those who previously knew nothing about the party. Twenty-four percent of Americans said in January of last year that they had never heard of it. Only 5 percent say that now. As that number has fallen, tea party disfavor has risen. To put that more simply: The more Americans learn about this movement, the more they dislike it. That is good news for those who had taken to muttering that famous old axiom about the birthrate of suckers, a hopeful sign for those who had resigned themselves to the fact that they lived in a nation where she who yells the most simplistic thing in the loudest voice wins the debate. It is a godsend for those who were ready to write an epitaph for American intelligence. Not that one can afford to be sanguine about the fact that “only” one American in three supports the tea party. Still, there is something reassuring in the realization that we have not completely lost our national mind. Yet. As the world grows larger and more fiendishly complex there is, make no mistake, something seductive about loud voices and simplistic answers. Especially when they demand nothing more of you than your capacity to feel frightened, angry and put upon. Government is the enemy! Taxes are unpatriotic! Re-education camps are being built! Death panels are raiding senior centers! Obama wants to destroy the economy! It is distressing to see that such obvious, asinine fear-mongering holds sway with a large number of Americans, amazing to know those fear mongers all but control a major political party, disheartening to realize they would rather wreck the economy than ding their ideological purity. http://www.aroundosceola.co...view=article&id=9650 n-the-decline-of-the-tea-party&catid=45&Itemid=58

http://somosrepublicans.com...publican-leadership/

51% of Americans have an unfavorable opinion of the Tea Party movement:
http://www.pollingreport.com/politics.htm

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Drive safely!

[This message has been edited by NEPTUNE (edited 08-22-2011).]

quote Originally posted by NEPTUNE: it seems more than half the American electorate now holds a negative view of the tea party movement. If you’re wondering what that is a leading indicator of, the answer is simple: common sense.

Heh, common sense indeed.
In other news, half the population does not pay income taxes and wants to keep spending other people's money.

[This message has been edited by cliffw (edited 08-22-2011).]

quote Originally posted by NEPTUNE: More bad news for the Tea drinkers: 51% of Americans have an unfavorable opinion of the Tea Party movement:

Close to Obama's numbers.
So is it bad news when he is no more popular than the Tea Party?
Sure you will post a new thread that Obama is no more popular than atheists, Muslims or the Tea Party!

quote Originally posted by NEPTUNE: More bad news for the Tea drinkers:

I'm curious about the angry face on your post, I would think that news would make you happy as a pig in poop.
Also, not that I necessarily expect an answer, but I'll ask anyway. As succinctly as possible, in your own words, could you explain to me what it is about the "tea party", or even more specifically, what the tea party (in general, not some microscopic faction thereof) is seeking, that is so distasteful?

quote Originally posted by Taijiguy: I'm curious about the angry face on your post, I would think that news would make you happy as a pig in poop. Also, not that I necessarily expect an answer, but I'll ask anyway. As succinctly as possible, in your own words, could you explain to me what it is about the "tea party", or even more specifically, what the tea party (in general, not some microscopic faction thereof) is seeking, that is so distasteful?

I see a bunch of angry, white people who seem to be filled with hate and driven by the mistaken belief that there are simple solutions (a fence?) to complex problems.
They seem to be enthralled by people who pander to the human races basest instincts: hate, distrust, greed, even magic.
Witness the popularity in some quarters of Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, and Rick Perry.
None of whom has a snowballs chance in Galveston of ever setting foot in the White House except as a guest.

Yet reality seems to be lost on the very faithful, and now I'll ask YOU:
Why is that?

(the emoticon was a typo)

[This message has been edited by NEPTUNE (edited 08-22-2011).]

quote Originally posted by partfiero: Close to Obama's numbers. So is it bad news when he is no more popular than the Tea Party? Sure you will post a new thread that Obama is no more popular than atheists, Muslims or the Tea Party!

yeah...they all suck, dont they?!
out of the above list of Obama, Tea Party, Muslims & Athiests - I preffer Muslims over the rest.
but, maybe thats because I actually know Muslims, and dont see maniac suicide bombers when I hear the word "muslim".
and, not sure wtf athiests is even doing in this comparison??

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: and, not sure wtf athiests is even doing in this comparison??

Ask Tune, he authored the thread.

quote Originally posted by NEPTUNE: I see a bunch of angry, white people who seem to be filled with hate and driven by the mistaken belief that there are simple solutions (a fence?) to complex problems. They seem to be enthralled by people who pander to the human races basest instincts: hate, distrust, greed, even magic.

Then you are seeing what you *want* to see.

Are we angry? You bet. We are seeing our country slip away under suffocating debt, and we see politicians - on BOTH sides of the aisle - doing "business as usual". If the course doesn't change, we will *all* suffer the consequences.

The monikers of "hater" and "racist" are getting old, but some keep repeating it. As the old saying goes, keep repeating a lie until it is true?

quote Originally posted by NEPTUNE: I see a bunch of angry, white people who seem to be filled with hate and driven by the mistaken belief that there are simple solutions (a fence?) to complex problems. They seem to be enthralled by people who pander to the human races basest instincts: hate, distrust, greed, even magic. Witness the popularity in some quarters of Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, and Rick Perry. None of whom has a snowballs chance in Galveston of ever setting foot in the White House except as a guest. Yet reality seems to be lost on the very faithful, and now I'll ask YOU: Why is that? (the emoticon was a typo)

Uhm, "why is that?" I'm not sure I know what you're asking me. If you're asking me to explain some component of human nature, of course I can only speculate. If that isn't your question I'll need some elaboration. If it is your question, I can try, but as I said, I can only speculate.

Of the names you mentioned, you didn't name Paul, who is of course considered to be the father of the tea party. I don't believe any other candidate including those you mentioned truly embrace the ideals of the tea party. I think there are those who are using the concept to gain favor with some who want smaller government and lower taxes, but still want federal government intervention in our daily lives. (Such as retaining Roe V Wade, and federal restrictions of same sex marriage) None of which describe Paul's stance. He wants the federal government out of our lives entirely. I don't think he finds answers to be simple, I just think he findds the answers to be not the business of the federal government. Do you think RP is in the same category with the others?

Again, a reality check seems to be in order.
Ron Paul isn't representative of the Tea Party,as exemplified by the candidates I mentioned previously.
He too stands less than a snowballs chance in Tucson of even getting the nomination, much less being elected President.
And even, as if by magic, he WERE to get elected, congress would show him more contempt than even Jimmy Carter experienced.
So would I be correct in assuming that many Tea Party backers live in a fantasy world, and that the rest are playing the group for their own ends?
Sounds reasonable to me.
But I don't believe in many things, like simple solutions to fix complex problems affecting millions of people.

[This message has been edited by NEPTUNE (edited 08-22-2011).]

quote Originally posted by NEPTUNE: Again, a reality check seems to be in order. Ron Paul isn't representative of the Tea Party,as exemplified by the candidates I mentioned previously. He too stands less than a snowballs chance in Tucson of even getting the nomination, much less being elected President. And even, as if by magic, he WERE to get elected, congress would show him more contempt than even Jimmy Carter experienced. So would I be correct in assuming that many Tea Party backers live in a fantasy world, and that the rest are playing the group for their own ends? Sounds reasonable to me. But I don't believe in many things, like simple solutions to fix complex problems affecting millions of people.

But Tune, you promised the "Smart Guys" would fix it.
Now all but one has left the anointed one.
So where do we go now because everything that has been tried seams to have failed.
And since you are so stuck on numbers, have you seen that only about 25% agree with Obama's handling of the economy?
Time for change, no Hope that he has any answers left.

[This message has been edited by partfiero (edited 08-22-2011).]

quote Originally posted by NEPTUNE: So would I be correct in assuming that many Tea Party backers live in a fantasy world, and that the rest are playing the group for their own ends? Sounds reasonable to me.

Hmm...sounds like a simple *assumption*. Is that the same or different than a simple solution?

quote But I don't believe in many things, like simple solutions to fix complex problems affecting millions of people.

So, why not tell us *your* plan?

..,MASSIVE overwhelming support for Tea Party In Orlando,Florida,.Neptune country, TEA party friendly candidates expect & will get land slide victory in ORLANDO FLORIDA area,it will be like a Dam burst of JOY,only west Orlando center of marxist,socialist ,gime a Gov check!!will vote for slitherering commie democrats like ""they want you to die"" super lib weasel attorney Grayson

....TOTAL TEA PARTY VICTORY IN 2012,EVEN THE MAYAN,s can not stop it

[This message has been edited by uhlanstan (edited 08-25-2011).]

quote Originally posted by NEPTUNE: Again, a reality check seems to be in order. Ron Paul isn't representative of the Tea Party,as exemplified by the candidates I mentioned previously. He too stands less than a snowballs chance in Tucson of even getting the nomination, much less being elected President. And even, as if by magic, he WERE to get elected, congress would show him more contempt than even Jimmy Carter experienced. So would I be correct in assuming that many Tea Party backers live in a fantasy world, and that the rest are playing the group for their own ends? Sounds reasonable to me. But I don't believe in many things, like simple solutions to fix complex problems affecting millions of people.

You're correct that RP doesn't represent the TP in the same way as the ones you mentioned. However you do realize that he is the reason the TP exists. That it actually got it's start when he raised over 6 million in one day in 2007?

So putting aside the speculation of his or anyone else's possibilities for success, what is your perception of his ideas? Or even simpler, let me ask a few very simple questions, I'm not asking you to explain your answers, I'm simply trying to get a feel for what role you believe government should play in our lives, and how much is acceptable, and if there's a limit to it.

Do you think we should have more or less government in control of our lives?
Do you think that the rate of spending we currently have is reasonable, and sustainable? And do you think that it can be sustained by higher taxes?
Do you think that we should have some say in how our tax dollars are spent?
Do you believe we should just allow an uncontrolled flow of immigration into the country?
Do you believe that we should be sustaining the wars that we are, and that we should have military bases all over the world? If not, are there any in particular that you think we should close, and any wars we should be out of? Do you think we should have gone into Libya?
Is there a limit to how much power and authority the government should have? Where is that limit if it exists?

There may be others but those are just the ones that come to me off the top of my head. You may have answered these in some way previously, but honestly, I tend to skip over all the arguing and bickering these days, and I know you get called out just about any time you say anything, so I'm hoping you'll indulge me.

quote Originally posted by Taijiguy: There may be others but those are just the ones that come to me off the top of my head. You may have answered these in some way previously, but honestly, I tend to skip over all the arguing and bickering these days, and I know you get called out just about any time you say anything, so I'm hoping you'll indulge me.

Yes.
And no.
I don't have hours to waste here.
But thanks for being civil.
We aren't so far apart as the blowhards would have you believe.

quote Originally posted by Taijiguy: Uhm, "why is that?" I'm not sure I know what you're asking me. If you're asking me to explain some component of human nature, of course I can only speculate. If that isn't your question I'll need some elaboration. If it is your question, I can try, but as I said, I can only speculate. Of the names you mentioned, you didn't name Paul, who is of course considered to be the father of the tea party. I don't believe any other candidate including those you mentioned truly embrace the ideals of the tea party. I think there are those who are using the concept to gain favor with some who want smaller government and lower taxes, but still want federal government intervention in our daily lives. (Such as retaining Roe V Wade, and federal restrictions of same sex marriage) None of which describe Paul's stance. He wants the federal government out of our lives entirely. I don't think he finds answers to be simple, I just think he findds the answers to be not the business of the federal government. Do you think RP is in the same category with the others?

yup. this is much why I dont like the Tea Party. They sing one song (Libertarian) - but they vote & behave another (Religous). I in fact LIKE what the Tea Party originaly stood for. But, that is NOT what they are actually striving for. They seem intent on being the Christian branch of the Taliban. Which has NOTHING to do with taxes or "small g'ment". The church has hi-jacked the Tea Party.

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1985 Fiero SE - Plain Red 3.1 V6 Coupe
Engle18Cam DIS 4.10-4spd 7730 WCF Long Tubes Borla
D.A.M.M. - Drunks Against Mad Mothers

quote Originally posted by NEPTUNE: I don't have hours to waste here.

But you do have minutes to insult the Tea Party, and find articles and polls that disparage it?

quote Originally posted by NEPTUNE: Yes. And no. I don't have hours to waste here. But thanks for being civil. We aren't so far apart as the blowhards would have you believe.

It's not so hard to be civil. I think we get so caught up in the details that separate us, we forget to find the commonalities. I actually do believe we can learn from each other if we're willing, even if we don't agree on everything. I do hope you'll fill me in on those questions when you can, it may be hard to believe, but I really am interested.

..Tea party is very diverse,libertarian,democrat republican,whig,mile high club,,its about goverment oppression & Taxes

...I underestimated Tea party victory,,much larger than I said in above Post

...elections comming,, unfortunately some Fool Clown will be elected

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: The church has hi-jacked the Tea Party.

Got a link or is this just off of the top of your head.

I have a sister who is a very active member, and she said she is calling BS on you.

quote Originally posted by uhlanstan: ...elections comming,, unfortunately some Fool Clown will be elected

That's EVERY election.

quote Originally posted by tbone42: That's EVERY election.

Just a different clown suite!

Think the few that can handle the job are either not interested, or are not pretty enough for TV.

Wow it looks like the term "Tea Bagger" is trying to be reclaimed!!

http://theweek.com/article/...-the-word-tea-bagger

quote Originally posted by NEPTUNE: I see a bunch of angry, white people who seem to be filled with hate and driven by the mistaken belief that there are simple solutions (a fence?) to complex problems. They seem to be enthralled by people who pander to the human races basest instincts: hate, distrust, greed, even magic. Witness the popularity in some quarters of Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, and Rick Perry. None of whom has a snowballs chance in Galveston of ever setting foot in the White House except as a guest. Yet reality seems to be lost on the very faithful, and now I'll ask YOU: Why is that? (the emoticon was a typo)

You would so love the progressive movement in a flip of the coin story I posted. Imagine the day when you get to round up anyone who stands in the way of progress. When that fails to create a liberal utopia, you can round up more.

quote Originally posted by cliffw: Fail !

seriously!

I'd rather be a tea bagger than the one being tea bagged.

quote Originally posted by avengador1: I'd rather be a tea bagger than the one being tea bagged.

hahaha really now?

quote Originally posted by avengador1: I'd rather be a tea bagger than the one being tea bagged.

Or in other words- I'd rather be the tea-bagger than the tea baggee. LOL