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Curiosity: did God create the universe with Stephen Hawking by NickD3.4
Started on: 08-08-2011 04:16 PM
Replies: 111
Last post by: uhlanstan on 08-17-2011 03:47 PM
82-T/A [At Work]
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Report this Post08-08-2011 09:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 82-T/A [At Work]Send a Private Message to 82-T/A [At Work]Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by newf:

Are you butt talking again? Where do you get the "desperately wants to make a name for himself"? He is one of the preeminant Scientists in the world, and one of the most famous..isn't he?



Hah, I just watched a documentary on him on the SyFy channel on Saturday (?), and that was EXACTLY what the narrorator said he wanted.

(EDIT: Might have been NatGeo? But pretty sure it was SyFy... it was yesterday, Sunday)


Also, EDIT, this was because when people asked who were the fore-most prominent scientists (EDIT: Physicist) in the world (related to his area of study), he didn't even make the top-5 list. He was way down at like 22 or something, and only one person voted for him. They went into detail about that too... I'll see if I can find the documentary for you. But I got to be honest, I'm really getting tired of doing this. Do I really have to prove every other word I say to you?

Next you're going to ask me to prove the definition of "THE"


EDIT: It was either "Stephen Hawking, Master of the Universe" or it was the newer one that just came out in 2010.

[This message has been edited by 82-T/A [At Work] (edited 08-08-2011).]

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Report this Post08-08-2011 09:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Formula88Send a Private Message to Formula88Direct Link to This Post
I find it ironic that someone as logical as Hawking would make such an illogical assumption.
IF God exists according to the Christian doctrine, then He exists outside of space-time. Therefore He could have easily been around before time began, and would have actually created it.
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Report this Post08-08-2011 10:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for scrabblegodClick Here to Email scrabblegodSend a Private Message to scrabblegodDirect Link to This Post
I would rather live like there is a God and find out there is not, than live like there isn't one and find out there is!
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Report this Post08-08-2011 11:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bClick Here to Email ray bSend a Private Message to ray bDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by scrabblegod:

I would rather live like there is a God and find out there is not, than live like there isn't one and find out there is!


ok but what if you pick the wrong one
like you think st pete is on the gate
you show up and meet Vishnu or pluto

I would rather live life without fear of a invisible friends wrath
esp when nobody has an invisible friend
just like I have no fear of ghosts holy or unholy

but people who fear invisible friends
are not rational and live a life stunted by that fear

------------------
Question wonder and be wierd
are you kind?

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Report this Post08-08-2011 11:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for tbone42Send a Private Message to tbone42Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by scrabblegod:

I would rather live like there is a God and find out there is not, than live like there isn't one and find out there is!


But is that belief or just hedging your bets?
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Report this Post08-08-2011 11:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for newfSend a Private Message to newfDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:


Hah, I just watched a documentary on him on the SyFy channel on Saturday (?), and that was EXACTLY what the narrorator said he wanted.

(EDIT: Might have been NatGeo? But pretty sure it was SyFy... it was yesterday, Sunday)


Also, EDIT, this was because when people asked who were the fore-most prominent scientists (EDIT: Physicist) in the world (related to his area of study), he didn't even make the top-5 list. He was way down at like 22 or something, and only one person voted for him. They went into detail about that too... I'll see if I can find the documentary for you. But I got to be honest, I'm really getting tired of doing this. Do I really have to prove every other word I say to you?

Next you're going to ask me to prove the definition of "THE"


EDIT: It was either "Stephen Hawking, Master of the Universe" or it was the newer one that just came out in 2010.



Sorry but I guess maybe it's the "tone" or the way you write your messages and my interpretation. I seem to get the sense that you feel you "know" certain things when they are apparently more your opinion.

Statements like "The man desperately wants to make a name for himself, and he wants to keep himself in the spotlight to keep his funding and financing flowing." for example make it sound like you are an authority on Steven Hawking when I assume you are not. I guess it's statements like those that I see as reasons for rumours and untruths being spread. Not saying everything you say is untrue or rumours by a long shot but I find it gets cloudy when some statements appear to be and some not. No offense intended.

[This message has been edited by newf (edited 08-08-2011).]

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Report this Post08-08-2011 11:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for twofatguysClick Here to Email twofatguysSend a Private Message to twofatguysDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by tbone42:


But is that belief or just hedging your bets?


Same thing I was thinking.

I think it's called hedging your bets.

Brad
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Report this Post08-08-2011 11:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Formula88Send a Private Message to Formula88Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ray b:


ok but what if you pick the wrong one
like you think st pete is on the gate
you show up and meet Vishnu or pluto

I would rather live life without fear of a invisible friends wrath
esp when nobody has an invisible friend
just like I have no fear of ghosts holy or unholy

but people who fear invisible friends
are not rational and live a life stunted by that fear



You fear anything with an "R" after it's name.
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Report this Post08-08-2011 11:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for NickD3.4Click Here to Email NickD3.4Send a Private Message to NickD3.4Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

I've seen on TV where it was said that experiments like that are currently underway.

But so far, no one who reports an "out-of-body" experience has accurately identified the messages or numbers that were discretely hidden from their normal view.

In other words--results to date are negative. At least, as far as the "out of body" experience being connected with the same world that we inhabit when we are normally alive.

hmm, that's opposite to what I saw. The reports were positive.
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Report this Post08-08-2011 11:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for uhlanstanClick Here to Email uhlanstanSend a Private Message to uhlanstanDirect Link to This Post
..hawking is a DROOLING dork,, one of the few cripples who got what he deserved,, am I a good forgiving christian or not??
you should have seen him IN HIS WHEELCHAIR flying down hill on fire,completely engulfed in flames,SCREAMING THRU HIS VOICE BOX..
HIS FAMILY TREE PRODUCED A BIG NUT

There is no measure of Time past it is unknown,
DO YOU UNDERSTAND
THE BIBLE WAS WRITTEN BY MAN FROM TALES & STOREYS .
NO SWEAT I,M JOINING THE JEWBOYS,,LOOKING MORE & MORE LIKE SOME SERIOUS ACTION MILITARY/POLITICAL/ RELIGIOUS IS COMMING
THEY HAVE US TOTALLY SURROUNDED GOTTEM WHERE WE WANT THEM

[This message has been edited by uhlanstan (edited 08-09-2011).]

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Report this Post08-09-2011 10:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bClick Here to Email ray bSend a Private Message to ray bDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Formula88:


You fear anything with an "R" after it's name.


well they are a clear and present danger to freedom
and very good at causing depressions
but at least they are real

unlike ghosts gods vampires werewolfs unicorns dragons angels or devils
those are all fairytales and not real
but believers in any or all of the above
are also a clear and present danger to freedoms
as the believers are all to real
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Report this Post08-09-2011 01:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TKSend a Private Message to TKDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by tbone42:


But is that belief or just hedging your bets?


I'm not sure how this would work. I don't think people can turn on and off a belief any more than someone can believe I have a T-Rex in my backyard (assuming there was some compelling reason to do so.) Most people just can't do that. So while they say they believe, they really don't.

One eyebrow is always up. Maybe some people can.
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Report this Post08-09-2011 01:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by NickD3.4:

The evidence of God is just as strong as any evidence presented there is no God. Its Subjective to the person theorizing. For some scientist, Science removes any faith in a deity, while with others, their beliefs in God becomes stronger with every discovery.



This would be a good 1st post.
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Report this Post08-09-2011 01:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Direct Link to This Post

2.5

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I think Hawkins motivation for the noise of late is basically hedging his bets. Purpose of setting his mind at ease as he is getting no younger. The more people who believe what he does maybe somehow means to him he will be more correct.
Aliens, big bang with no god, etc.

[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 08-09-2011).]

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Report this Post08-09-2011 01:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 8-PSend a Private Message to 8-PDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 2.5:

I think Hawkins motivation for the noise of late is basically hedging his bets. Purpose of setting his mind at ease as he is getting no younger. The more people who believe what he does maybe somehow means to him he will be more correct.




Just out of curiosity, how does it benefit him if he's correct? Surely being convinced that there is no God doesn't make someone more comfortable with the thought of dying...
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Report this Post08-09-2011 01:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JazzManClick Here to Email JazzManSend a Private Message to JazzManDirect Link to This Post
You guys even hate Stephen Hawking? That's really sad...
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Report this Post08-09-2011 01:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 8-PSend a Private Message to 8-PDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by JazzMan:

You guys even hate Stephen Hawking? That's really sad...



Some people are threatened by science.
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Report this Post08-09-2011 01:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BoondawgClick Here to Email BoondawgSend a Private Message to BoondawgDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by JazzMan:

You guys even hate Stephen Hawking? That's really sad...


That made me smile.
I may be the only one here, but I like you more everyday!
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Report this Post08-09-2011 02:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 8-P:

Just out of curiosity, how does it benefit him if he's correct? Surely being convinced that there is no God doesn't make someone more comfortable with the thought of dying...


If there is one, where would Stephen think his soul is headed? He would have the choice of no soul, ceasing to exist, or the soul goes on.
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Report this Post08-09-2011 02:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Direct Link to This Post

2.5

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quote
Originally posted by JazzMan:

You guys even hate Stephen Hawking? That's really sad...


Who Stan? He hates on alot of people where u been? j/k

I don't think he is hated, how so (outside of stans comments)? Disagreeing with a person or their ideas or ideals doesn't mean you hate them.

[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 08-09-2011).]

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Report this Post08-09-2011 03:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BlacktreeClick Here to visit Blacktree's HomePageClick Here to Email BlacktreeSend a Private Message to BlacktreeDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:

EDIT: It was either "Stephen Hawking, Master of the Universe" or it was the newer one that just came out in 2010.

I think I saw the same show recently, on the Science Channel. I was a little surprised that the scientific community holds him in such low regard. Apparently, at least some of it is due to his popularity in the media. Scientists are kinda funny like that.

Also, it seems Stephen Hawking's life goal is to find a "theory of everything", a scientific theory that fills in all the gaps in our current scientific theories and ties everything together. He still hasn't found that theory. And his health is getting worse. So yeah, I think he's starting to get desperate.
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Report this Post08-09-2011 03:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for tbone42Send a Private Message to tbone42Direct Link to This Post
Scientists are pretty cutthroat, as are historians. Food historians... they are the meanest.
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Report this Post08-10-2011 07:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for uhlanstanClick Here to Email uhlanstanSend a Private Message to uhlanstanDirect Link to This Post
..Hello ladies & gentlemen we are here at aldershot,England, home of the para regiment for the air show & parachute jumps,next up Steven Hawking makes the first wheel chair parachute jump.
here comes the plane around,jumpmaster checking the wind,theres Hawkings in the door,WO! Is that jumpmaster uhlanstan given him a real boost kick out the door ?/ whats this??hawking appears to have no parachute ,he is spiraling toward the ground at 400mph speed increasing,his voice box is hooked up to the air field sound system,ARGGGGGG ,,,MY GOD hawking has sprouted horns,HE REALLY IS A DEVIL, hes at 600feet,""o my god lady & gents his wheel chair has burst into flames"" he looks like a FLAMING
SACK O SHEIIT,, HEADED FOR THE GROUND,WAIT LUCKILY HE IS HEADED RIGHT INTO A PORTA POTTY,SPLASH DOWN!!, SPLASH IN!! LUCKY THE POTTY WAS JAM FULL FROM THE HUGE CROWD & THE MOIST BROWNISH POO PUT OUT THE FLAME..
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Report this Post08-10-2011 07:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for GandalfSend a Private Message to GandalfDirect Link to This Post
NM

[This message has been edited by Gandalf (edited 08-10-2011).]

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Report this Post08-10-2011 02:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for tbone42Send a Private Message to tbone42Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by uhlanstan:

..Hello ladies & gentlemen we are here at aldershot,England, home of the para regiment for the air show & parachute jumps,next up Steven Hawking makes the first wheel chair parachute jump.
here comes the plane around,jumpmaster checking the wind,theres Hawkings in the door,WO! Is that jumpmaster uhlanstan given him a real boost kick out the door ?/ whats this??hawking appears to have no parachute ,he is spiraling toward the ground at 400mph speed increasing,his voice box is hooked up to the air field sound system,ARGGGGGG ,,,MY GOD hawking has sprouted horns,HE REALLY IS A DEVIL, hes at 600feet,""o my god lady & gents his wheel chair has burst into flames"" he looks like a FLAMING
SACK O SHEIIT,, HEADED FOR THE GROUND,WAIT LUCKILY HE IS HEADED RIGHT INTO A PORTA POTTY,SPLASH DOWN!!, SPLASH IN!! LUCKY THE POTTY WAS JAM FULL FROM THE HUGE CROWD & THE MOIST BROWNISH POO PUT OUT THE FLAME..


Classy.
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Report this Post08-10-2011 07:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for uhlanstanClick Here to Email uhlanstanSend a Private Message to uhlanstanDirect Link to This Post
..I can not help my self,,hawking is such a twit ,,a real target,next time i will make it funny,,Im sorry you guys did not enjoy this I though it was funny,,I had to tone down when the jumpmaster kicked him out best part..
sorry, I can not post the story of hawking visits the volcano,its a real hoot but much to crud
I do like that hawking thinks time traveling Aliens are space bandit Nomads,the guy reads to many comic books

[This message has been edited by uhlanstan (edited 08-11-2011).]

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Report this Post08-10-2011 10:35 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 82-T/A [At Work]Send a Private Message to 82-T/A [At Work]Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by newf:


Sorry but I guess maybe it's the "tone" or the way you write your messages and my interpretation. I seem to get the sense that you feel you "know" certain things when they are apparently more your opinion.

Statements like "The man desperately wants to make a name for himself, and he wants to keep himself in the spotlight to keep his funding and financing flowing." for example make it sound like you are an authority on Steven Hawking when I assume you are not. I guess it's statements like those that I see as reasons for rumours and untruths being spread. Not saying everything you say is untrue or rumours by a long shot but I find it gets cloudy when some statements appear to be and some not. No offense intended.




Hah.... well, I'm not an authority on Stephen Hawking... but never the less, what you quoted there is almost an exact quote from the documentary... including such specific adjectives like "desperately" and nouns like "spotlight" etc.


Anyway, we both speak the King's language... you should be able to tell when I'm giving opinion and when I'm simply stating things. Unless we're talking about socialism, in which case I KNOW I'm right... I usually say "I think" or... "I believe"
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Report this Post08-10-2011 10:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for newfSend a Private Message to newfDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
Anyway, we both speak the King's language... you should be able to tell when I'm giving opinion and when I'm simply stating things. Unless we're talking about socialism, in which case I KNOW I'm right... I usually say "I think" or... "I believe"


Isn't the Queens language right now? Totally kidding

I wish you would use more terms like "I think" and "I believe" but again I think I've been nitpicking you in particular too much as of late, my apologies if I offended in anyway.
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Report this Post08-11-2011 12:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Nurb432Send a Private Message to Nurb432Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by twofatguys:


Same thing I was thinking.

I think it's called hedging your bets.

Brad


yup. and if true, i bet the 'god' wouldn't be pleased with the scam.
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Report this Post08-11-2011 12:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Nurb432Send a Private Message to Nurb432Direct Link to This Post

Nurb432

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quote
Originally posted by JazzMan:

You guys even hate Stephen Hawking? That's really sad...


Not all of us.
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Report this Post08-11-2011 01:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RWDPLZClick Here to visit RWDPLZ's HomePageSend a Private Message to RWDPLZDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by NickD3.4:
did God create the universe with Stephen Hawking


Yes he did.

"Since time began with the big bang, and time did not exist before the big bang, therefore was no time for god to have existed".

This statement assumes the big bang was the beginning of existence. However, some have speculated that the big bang was the result of all matter in the universe contracting in on itself, in an unending cycle of bang > expansion > contraction, in which case there can be no beginning or end (of existence and time). If you believe there is only one (our) universe, there has always been existence and time, which is to say there has always been something, somewhere.

I think Stephen made this statement intentionally to be controversial, in order to spur debate and further interest in the field.
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Report this Post08-11-2011 01:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TKSend a Private Message to TKDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by RWDPLZ:

...

I think Stephen made this statement intentionally to be controversial, in order to spur debate and further interest in the field.


Exactly. To think he doesn't know what every single word in his sentences mean or even implies is foolish. He says things for a specific reason. It was intentional but I suspect it was directed more to the other researchers than the public in general.

It's easy to jump all over this comment but I wouldn't want to argue it with him.

[This message has been edited by TK (edited 08-11-2011).]

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Report this Post08-13-2011 07:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for heybjornClick Here to Email heybjornSend a Private Message to heybjornDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by JazzMan:

You guys even hate Stephen Hawking? That's really sad...


Where do you get this, Jazzman? Who said anything about hating Hawking? What's sad is that you mistake reasonable questions for hate. I am sure that the Christians here pray for Hawking, and you, and Wichita, and the other atheists. I do.

As others have pointed out, where did the laws of physics, mechanics, thermodynamics, or chemistry come from? If there were no laws governing the operation of the universe, Hawking wouldn't have a job. Marvin McInnis, randye, and AntiKev couldn't be engineers if the these laws didn't exist. If acceleration was 18 ft/sec^2 today, 9.5 tomorrow, and 187 the next day, we couldn't build anything to operate reliably. Certainly not airplanes and convey belts. So where did they come from? The intellect to write the laws has to be outside the laws. So what is it?
I'll go with God. Now, you, Wichita, and Stephen Hawking explain it, please.

 
quote
Originally posted by Wichita:

Does He have a penis? It could be a woman.


No. Things would go completely random every 28 days.

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Report this Post08-15-2011 01:35 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GADJetSend a Private Message to GADJetDirect Link to This Post
The big bang is a theory. Not proven just man's excuse to disprove the existance of God. Nothing more.


If the universe were created by the BIG BANG, all that proves is we have discovered the way God created it.


 
quote
Originally posted by Nurb432:


Who's god? Yours, the guy sitting across the hall, the Buddhist friend of mine, or how about an ancient Greek who felt there were numerous gods? All beliefs have the same merit and NO ONE knows the truth. They think they do, but they cant actually know.



Our God. The one true living God. The creator of the Universe! (So my beliefs lead me) Romans 1:20 Read it.

Anyways, point being, I stand firm on my beliefs in God mainly because I have a personal relationship with him. He speaks to me and I listen. (Most of the time anyways) <-- But when I don't I have chosen to sin. It all comes down to choices in life. You can choose to trust and obey or distrust and live for yourself. Keep in mind your cheating yourself and your loved ones when you do this. Romans 6:23 Read that too.

Those of you that do not believe is it because you have chosen to trust this after you have read the bible or is this a decision you have chosen because your parents raised you this way? The reason I ask this is because I was raised in church and I took my parents ways first. (Christian life style) I was saved at 9 and lived a Christian life until age 15. Then I rebelled. From ages 16-24 I lived like I wanted to. God let me run like I saw fit until it got out of hand. He corrected me and pulled me back. (I can give my testimony to anyone who wants it) I lived the drunken and drug life for several years. I finally came to conclusion where I was in life. Why? Because I ALWAYS felt empty inside. I never was filled and always searching for the truth and what I needed when I sinned constantly without care. Jesus fixed that for me. PM me if you want more.
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TK
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Report this Post08-15-2011 02:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TKSend a Private Message to TKDirect Link to This Post
I don't think it's all that simple really.

[This message has been edited by TK (edited 08-15-2011).]

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GADJet
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Report this Post08-15-2011 02:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GADJetSend a Private Message to GADJetDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by TK:

I don't think it's all that simple really.



To most, apparently not. If it were, we wouldnt be having this converstaion in the first place. To me however, it absolutely is.
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Report this Post08-15-2011 05:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TKSend a Private Message to TKDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by GADJet:


To most, apparently not. If it were, we wouldnt be having this converstaion in the first place. To me however, it absolutely is.


I commend your conviction.
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GADJet
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Report this Post08-16-2011 08:28 AM Click Here to See the Profile for GADJetSend a Private Message to GADJetDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by TK:


I commend your conviction.


So does He. And thank you.
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Pyrthian
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Report this Post08-16-2011 09:25 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PyrthianClick Here to Email PyrthianSend a Private Message to PyrthianDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Formula88:

I find it ironic that someone as logical as Hawking would make such an illogical assumption.
IF God exists according to the Christian doctrine, then He exists outside of space-time. Therefore He could have easily been around before time began, and would have actually created it.


yup.
the very concept of "God" (any - not just the Jew God) would pretty much exist beyond the 4 dimensions of time/space.
tho - I do find it amazing that for a long long time science was disproving god, but, now that science is heading down deep, it is starting to find god again.

yes, Hawking is fixated on "The Big Bang". And, especially fixated on the Big Bang being a singular event. One of the sucky parts of "the big bang" is that it puts "edges" to the universe. it is no longer infinite. the universe is just the "bang". like a bubble. but - now - what is this "bubble" floating in? some other medium? and, why could there not be "bangs" scattered all over this medium? and so on.... The Big Bang is a pretty solid theory, and has much science behind it. But, it does open a whole new box of problems.

so - how's about them other 8 dimensions? .....
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GADJet
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Report this Post08-16-2011 09:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for GADJetSend a Private Message to GADJetDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Pyrthian:

so - how's about them other 8 dimensions? .....



Please inform me of what the other 8 are. Please forgive my ignorance. I am not very educated here.

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