never heard of them before today. was reading one of todays new articles on Cracked.com and they mentioned that many many many MANY apps were inadvertently leaking these "tokens" out onto the web for anyone thats how to find and use them. apparently, using these "tokens" allows whoever gets a hold of them to post on your account, as if you were posting, WITHOUT the need to phish for your password. normally i wouldnt mention this as my internet habits and security programs keep me secure. i have NEVER fallen for one of those scam links on facebook, and the only time facebook ever even has a false positive for me was when it thought me logging in from my phone was someone in Argentina or something (so EVERY time i used my phone browser to log in, when i got to a computer it MADE me change my password). but, 2 days ago, i was "innocently" browsing the web when i clocked over to my facebook tab to see if there were any wall updates. suddenly i noticed i had posted TWO links, with pornographic images, to **** sites. now, the browsing i was doing did NOT involve **** , or passwords, or any personal information. I filled out NO forms of any kind. and i dont use many apps on facebook, certainly not farmville or the other popular ones (besides Family Feud, and years ago, Mafia Wars). Moral of the story? if you want to secure your internet privacy and you use Facebook, find an extension for your browser that cuts off facebooks connection to the outside world. Chrome and/or Firefox has one called Facebook Disconnect iirc. the downside is it will block any images embedded from facebook from showing up.
This is a SERIOUS security threat. All i did was browse the internet late one night, and someone someone got a hold of one of these "tokens" and accessed my Facebook account.
There are so many reasons why being on facebook can eff up your life.
I'm not running around shouting "the sky is falling!"
If someone else can manipulate things inside of your account, and you can be legally held accountable for what you have in your account...
The more increasingly 'connected ' we become, the more you need to worry about your personal information. Security. all that stuff...
There are better ways to be 'social', imo.
It sucks though - Facebook was kinda enjoyable, being able to share some of my stuff...
Just go about on the internet assuming that anyone can have access to ANYTHING you put up there, or that's kept on your phone, or on any computer, even one not connected via wire or wireless.
[This message has been edited by FieroRumor (edited 07-09-2011).]
IP: Logged
10:29 AM
hookdonspeed Member
Posts: 7979 From: baltimore, md Registered: May 2008
i use FB, but im well aware of how things are "allowed" to post to your account, i.e. why i make sure i allow no apps to my account, theres a list of things u allowed to your account, make sure u have none, this INCLUDES GAMES!, you can be surprised how easy it is to get these tokens, but you do need to "allow" them.. huge fail for FB imo...
IP: Logged
10:34 AM
faaaaq Member
Posts: 3856 From: Madison WI, USA Registered: Sep 2009
Rumor, unfortunately, your advice, however well-intentioned, is in reality of little use. it is very complicated to completely delete your facebook now, and in relation to the amount of users there are, nearly nobody knows how (altho it isnt too awful hard to find out if you look it up. in fact i think i have a walkthru bookmarked). Fortunately for me, there is nothing on my facebook that i have any reason to fear someone finding out. im 100% unlisted as of last time i checked, so even havign my name and city i live in does nobody any good. my phone number is also nowhere on the net. for someone like me, facebook isnt much of a threat. for more "average" or inexperienced users (old people, young young people, and generally uneducated people), facebook can be pretty hazardus. but when it comes down to it, if everyone bails facebook, attackers will just target other websites, like PFF and message boards, that would be easier to crack into. the BEST protection lol, is to keep to yourself the information you know about the hazards of facebook, so everyone else stays on it but you stay off it. they will target them and not you.
and hooked, NOTHING on my facebook has permission to post on my account without my explicit permission at the time of posting. the only way to be more secure, is to not add ANY apps to your account. if it is on your account, it CAN post if you specifically allow it to on a per-situational basis. and apparently even that severely limited allowance is enough for the tokens to be used by evil sources.
also...can you describe these tokens in a simple format? im not a n00b with internet and tech, but im becoming increasingly lazy and lethargic lol. if it takes effort to understand, i usually just lose interest. you seem to understand tokens so i thought maybe you could enlighten us. are they like sophisticated cookies?
IP: Logged
10:40 AM
hookdonspeed Member
Posts: 7979 From: baltimore, md Registered: May 2008
facebook apps are issued "tokens" that are basically nice long hash marks, and your account has its own hash mark for each app it allows so with both hash marks, you can post to to the account that the hashmarks markup to...
its alittle more complicated then that, but thats basicly the deal...
(think of hashmarks as keys if you dont know what they are, the one "key" opens the door to face book, the other "key" opens the door to your account)
IP: Logged
11:04 AM
faaaaq Member
Posts: 3856 From: Madison WI, USA Registered: Sep 2009
thanks for that, that was very simplified but i thik it gets the point across still. i was unaware something like that could be used in such a way...
yep, the "tokens" are suppost to be secure and not allowed to get out... but like it has been said, there have been "leaks", technically facebook should revoke the "leaked" tokens access and deny them future tokens, basically baning them, but they are probably games and/or apps that are making decent $, so it is probably being "overlooked", just issuing a new key to the apps and a slap onthe wrist...
IP: Logged
11:15 AM
faaaaq Member
Posts: 3856 From: Madison WI, USA Registered: Sep 2009
according to cracked (yes i know, its Cracked, but they are basically as accurate as their sources) "As many as 100,000 apps had tokens leaked to [from?] them over a period of years." if that is accurate, it would seriously hurt facebook to in any way punish that many apps
It's not THAT complicated to 'delete' your account. Sure, ok, they may still have EVERY piece of what you've put up there, but nothing new.
Someone CAN edit your wall, can read your messages, and manipulate your account. If you are held legally liable for what you've supposedly said on there, you should get the hell off of it. I've been involved in such a situation, can't get into specifics,(I wasn't originially involved with the situation, I was brought on as a technical advisor) but wow, it's REALLY effed up what can happen to a person)
If you do use facebook, tone down the level of personal stuff you share. NEVER use your real birthday, Never say "Oh, I'm going out of town for a week, or discuss financial stuff (We just put the mortgage payment in the bank-wheee! Stuff like that...) This is NOT obvious to everyone...
(The Birthday thing - yeah, sure, people can easily get your ACTUAL birthday, but use a different one, and see just how much stuff you get related ot THAT date, in the mail, in emails and whatever...)
Just Don't want you to wake up one day and experience the "Oh SH*T!" that some people have as a result of their online exposure.
Not trying to wear tinfoil hats or tell people to be luddites...
But it's not that hard to
Use old code to alter the new.
Like hackin' a Mega Corporation by accessing one of their old modems connected to an XP box in some dusty, long-forgotten com closet... that's still around to do some menial task, such as stream stock quotes or display a spinning logo on a screen in the lobby...
[This message has been edited by FieroRumor (edited 07-10-2011).]
IP: Logged
10:55 AM
faaaaq Member
Posts: 3856 From: Madison WI, USA Registered: Sep 2009
it is EXTREMELY difficult to actually delete your account. gets more difficult all the time
And this face should make people consider that perhaps they SHOULD.
When I did it, it took two weeks each time wonked the account, (create account, populate account, terminate account) it took a few months. The initial account data's still there. But when this was done with a certain account, facebook was not able to provide the data requested of them... (a page created by an identitiy) they weren't able to destermine which identity created the page.
As with any large growing company, they have lost things in the shuffle. VALUABLE things. Which means that there are some very easy ways to see some interesting stuff if you happened to come across a certain hard drive which was tossed back when facebook had about a million users... Yes, they changed their security and coding and all that over the years, but they wouldn't want to 'lock' out millions of users who use something (lets say "farmville") so they might leave something 'open' rather then plug the hole and cut everyone out.
Just for sh*ts and giggles, In two months, remind me about "faaaaq's bellybutton lint".
[This message has been edited by FieroRumor (edited 07-10-2011).]
IP: Logged
11:19 AM
PFF
System Bot
faaaaq Member
Posts: 3856 From: Madison WI, USA Registered: Sep 2009
Originally posted by FieroRumor: When I did it, it took two weeks each time wonked the account, (create account, populate account, terminate account) it took a few months. The initial account data's still there. But when this was done with a certain account, facebook was not able to provide the data requested of them... (a page created by an identitiy) they weren't able to destermine which identity created the page.
Just for sh*ts and giggles, In two months, remind me about "faaaaq's bellybutton lint".
i dont understand most of your first statement lol... but, when you "delete" your page, ALL info is saved, and is easily accessible if you access it directly (ie, using an images url for a "deleted" account will gain you access to the image. the ONLY way to "completely" delete an account is to go thru a HIDDEN process, and pretty much not use ANY page linked to facebook for at least 2 weeks. most people consider the "deactivation" as a deletion, but it is not. im not even sure how to access the deletion prompt other than using the direct URL. maybe for people like you it is a relatively simple process, but for younger people and people more involved in the net, it is not so much. since nearly all popular pages allow facebook connect. while in the deletion process, if you log in to any of those pages that are linked to facebook, it will restart/cancel (idr which) the deletion process. so for someone with many many accounts across the web, deleting your facebook for real is a very involved, time consuming process. (after writing that i think i understand SOME of your first part lol)
and also, i dont understand the last part. some joke i dont know about? or maybe referring to how PFF saves all the threads?
If you don't use Facebook in ANY WAY for those two weeks, it'll be deleted. Delete your cookies and history on your browser so you can't accidentally connect. Delete the apps on your phone that use Facebook. Everything.
And that will delete it.
IP: Logged
11:46 AM
faaaaq Member
Posts: 3856 From: Madison WI, USA Registered: Sep 2009
If you don't use Facebook in ANY WAY for those two weeks, it'll be deleted. Delete your cookies and history on your browser so you can't accidentally connect. Delete the apps on your phone that use Facebook. Everything.
And that will delete it.
said all that already :PPP just didnt post the link
all of the tests done to check information leakage were done using usually the top 20 apps...obviously all of which were by big companies that are generally trusted. you are trusting someone whose ONLY goal is to make money off of you.
IP: Logged
11:58 AM
Xanth Member
Posts: 6885 From: Massachusetts Registered: May 2006
Wow, I had a bunch of Apps listed in there i didn't remember adding. I removed everything except HTC Sense and Developer.
they hide the button to allow them a lot of the times, with the more shady apps at least. most often its in a picture, or a link redirects you directly to adding their app in such a way that it doesnt show you it was added
I just recently got back onto facebook. I find facebook to be annoying when I'm in a relationship and all because it just starts to much drama but right now.. single man so i just use it to keep up with my friends.
IP: Logged
02:36 PM
PFF
System Bot
Xanth Member
Posts: 6885 From: Massachusetts Registered: May 2006
I just recently got back onto facebook. I find facebook to be annoying when I'm in a relationship and all because it just starts to much drama but right now.. single man so i just use it to keep up with my friends.
never had any female drama due to facebook. i think that is due more to the people involved, and not facebook itself O.o lol
never had any female drama due to facebook. i think that is due more to the people involved, and not facebook itself O.o lol
Yes but the potential to find out things about eachother is much easier with facebook... This is why my best friend dosent have one.. he has one of thoes very high matinence girlfriends that gets pissy over the smallest little thing. they have been together for like 6 years and he has been faithful to her the whole time But, Like me in a relationship he needs times to be out hangin out with his friends without her there. We all go to bars clubs dave and busters hell even titty bars (its OK to look ) and not once in the years he has been sneeking out have i ever seen him do anything remotely unfaithful. Had to save him once we were drunk in Atlantic city and some prostitute(who was extremeley good looking by the way) and him were starting to get a little touchy with each other at the bar so being the wing man I was i stepped in (no I dident do anything with her just some conversation at the bar) turned out he was getting out his phone to take a pic of the 2 of them... When he was drunk he called me a **** blocker but when he sobered up he called me a life saver. But back on topic he dosent have facebook because he figures his girlfriend would find out about him sneeking out and chillin with us.
[This message has been edited by pontiackid86 (edited 07-10-2011).]
IP: Logged
02:53 PM
faaaaq Member
Posts: 3856 From: Madison WI, USA Registered: Sep 2009
Originally posted by pontiackid86: But back on topic he dosent have facebook because he figures his girlfriend would find out about him sneeking out and chillin with us.
thats a sign of true love right there. only way to keep the relationship is to lie and sneak around :P. no offense but if i was your friend's friend, id break them up. if you cant be yourself around your girl, you need a new one.
thats a sign of true love right there. only way to keep the relationship is to lie and sneak around :P. no offense but if i was your friend's friend, id break them up. if you cant be yourself around your girl, you need a new one.
He dosent have a problem being himself around her its just shes always so needy and sh*t. She found out that he was invited not that he was going out on my friend preva's 21st we got a limo and all that bullsh*t it was me my girlfriend at the time preva a bunch of her friend and my buddy.. well she found out about this invatation and flipped sh*t that he dident tell her about it.. he wasent going to go but she still got on his grill about it... the 2 are ment to be together its obvious that they love each other and its going to lead onto marriage, its just he dosent like telling her when he goes out with the guys because shes they type that would follow him or some bullsh*t like that.. what she dosent know wont hurt her.
IP: Logged
03:03 PM
82-T/A [At Work] Member
Posts: 18244 From: Florida USA Registered: Aug 2002
Rumor, unfortunately, your advice, however well-intentioned, is in reality of little use. it is very complicated to completely delete your facebook now, and in relation to the amount of users there are, nearly nobody knows how (altho it isnt too awful hard to find out if you look it up. in fact i think i have a walkthru bookmarked). Fortunately for me, there is nothing on my facebook that i have any reason to fear someone finding out. im 100% unlisted as of last time i checked, so even havign my name and city i live in does nobody any good. my phone number is also nowhere on the net. for someone like me, facebook isnt much of a threat. for more "average" or inexperienced users (old people, young young people, and generally uneducated people), facebook can be pretty hazardus. but when it comes down to it, if everyone bails facebook, attackers will just target other websites, like PFF and message boards, that would be easier to crack into. the BEST protection lol, is to keep to yourself the information you know about the hazards of facebook, so everyone else stays on it but you stay off it. they will target them and not you.
I completely disagree... COMPLETELY. Faaaaaq, trying to be the most help here that I can, but let me be brutally honest with you... Facebook is just one of many fads to come on the Internet, and well into the future which will lead to exposing your sensitive information, more and more. The question you really want to have is... do you REALLY want to be known on the internet? What kind of exposure do you want on the internet? About the most exposure on the net that I have is... the Fiero Forum, and I would not be too distraught if one day Cliff's XML file gets trashed from anything older than a month. I have no Facebook account, MySpace Account, or anything else. I started off early doing AIM and IRC. I realized early on that having this much exposure is not only dangerous, but also unnecessarily time consuming.
If this is really what you want to do, that's cool... but beyond the concept of simple communication with like-minded individuals... Facebook is outright dangerous.
Personally, I keep a totally generic, blank facebook account with NOTHING on it (no friends, no picture, no personal information, nothing) just as a "container" so that someone else doesn't create an account with my same name and have it get linked to me somehow.
The BEST thing you can do is type your full name (and any aliases you use) into Google. Go through all of the links you find and begin deleting them any way that you can. Go to all the message forums you know that you have access to and edit your profile and remove ANY personal information. Also... change the password to something you would never use, if you never plan on going on that message board again. Then create a bull-**** e-mail account that you only use for spam, and re-assign all those forums to that in case you ever decide you want to get back on them. On your birthday, you'll get mass e-mails from all of them... so it's pretty easy to find out which accounts you still have. You should remove your DOBs from all of those too... so when you DO get a happy birthday e-mail from something, make sure you edit the account from the site it's from and eliminate that DOB.
The only thing public that I have is my LinkedIn account, and I don't have my picture or too much personal information.
all of the tests done to check information leakage were done using usually the top 20 apps...obviously all of which were by big companies that are generally trusted. you are trusting someone whose ONLY goal is to make money off of you.
Top 20 apps you say...Big companies?
Here are the top 15 apps, (easiest list to find) current as of July 10th, 2011 http://www.appdata.com/
Developer Leaderboard Rank By: MAU|DAU|DAU/MAU 1. Zynga 281,135,371 2. Badoo 34,843,716 3. wooga 34,063,275 4. Electronic Arts 31,933,221 5. Mensing 31,225,136 6. RootMusic 29,955,244 7. Friskylabs 29,753,154 8. Playdom 29,184,863 9. CrowdStar 24,888,066 10. Zoosk 23,709,931 11. Digital Chocolate 22,342,874 12. Windows Live 20,382,617 13. Takeoff Monkey 20,315,898 14. Social Point 18,061,560 15. Popcap Games 17,700,214
Notice anything there? The top apps are ran by Zynga. Zynga is not a "big" company, they are a company that puts the games out there to get your information, and sell it to other places. They make very little from the games themselves. They make a lot by selling your surfing habits, and personal information.
Brad
[This message has been edited by twofatguys (edited 07-10-2011).]
IP: Logged
03:09 PM
faaaaq Member
Posts: 3856 From: Madison WI, USA Registered: Sep 2009
brad first. Zynga IS a big company. they will continue to get bigger. physical size and number of staff does not make a company "big" nor does the reason they make lots of money.
82-T/A now. Google my name. "Sean Patrick Carey." even gave you the middle name. tell me more than the city/state i live in and my birthday, IF you can figure even those out from google. Spokeo.com is an easy way to see how much readily available info there is on you on the net. everything you said people should do, is only for people who dont know what they are doing. EVERYTHING on my facebook is set individually for who i want to be able to see each individual thing. the internet only knows what you tell it.
and now PK. nothing you said goes against what i said... if he has to hide things, hes not being himself. lying does not lead to a happy, strong, mature relationship. and something leading to marriage nowadays really means nothing... thinking they appear to be meant for eachother means less. my and my x were together for 2 years. adults and other people our age all envied us because we appeared perfect. that was like 3 years ago. neither of us changed. we broke up because appearing perfect does not mean it is. as a matter of fact, the more you say about them the more strongly i feel what i said. them being together SIX YEARS and her STILL acting how she does is not a good thing, in any way. its a very, very bad sign. again, no offense, but i forsee a VERY VERY VERY awful divorce/breakup in the future. i suspect they are still together out of habit, fear of being alone, a spinoff of stockholmes syndrome that applies to relationships (i dont think its an established thing, and i dont have a name for it yet but i have had the idea for a long time), and/or some other weird reason i cant think of. must make it clear, I MEAN NO OFFENSE TO ANYONE INVOLVED. i have strict beliefs on relationships, and one of the biggest is if you cant be completely yourself with your partner, obviously you need a new one.
brad first. Zynga IS a big company. they will continue to get bigger. physical size and number of staff does not make a company "big" nor does the reason they make lots of money.
Right, but the opposite of what you posted earlier, big does not equal trust. It should set off red flags all over the place when someone says "They are big...It's OK."
Big things I do not trust
Federal Government
Wal-Mart
Sumo Wrestlers
Humvees
Body Builders
Disney
Great Danes
The Bearded Lady
Bulldozers
The people telling me to take my meds
My penis
Facebook
Google
Microsoft
Brad
IP: Logged
03:50 PM
faaaaq Member
Posts: 3856 From: Madison WI, USA Registered: Sep 2009
Right, but the opposite of what you posted earlier, big does not equal trust. It should set off red flags all over the place when someone says "They are big...It's OK." Brad
i never said people SHOULD trust big things. i said they DO.
I understand they are a billion dollar company, and are therefore huge. I was aiming more at the "generally trusted" part. My morning coffee is now kicking in, and things are clearing up.
quote
all of the tests done to check information leakage were done using usually the top 20 apps...obviously all of which were by big companies that are generally trusted. you are trusting someone whose ONLY goal is to make money off of you.
lol, I think we are both on the same side here, just saying it in different ways.
Brad
...probably...lol. it just seemed like you were trying to say i said that they are big and therefor SHOULD be trusted lol. i still believe they (including Zynga) ARE for the most part trusted. just gotta remember, most people arent as informed as most people here seem to be
IP: Logged
03:59 PM
82-T/A [At Work] Member
Posts: 18244 From: Florida USA Registered: Aug 2002
82-T/A now. Google my name. "Sean Patrick Carey." even gave you the middle name. tell me more than the city/state i live in and my birthday, IF you can figure even those out from google. Spokeo.com is an easy way to see how much readily available info there is on you on the net. everything you said people should do, is only for people who dont know what they are doing. EVERYTHING on my facebook is set individually for who i want to be able to see each individual thing. the internet only knows what you tell it.
Your Facebook account; http://www.facebook.com/Flavormackaliscous You're 33 years old (looks like?) You're a member of the AV club You like Indie-Rock, and I don't know what this is, but this address comes up: "124 W Towne Mall, Madison, WI"
I only searched for a quick second.
EDIT: As for Spokeo... it picks up anything when it's doing it's routine "harvest" of the internet. I'm pretty sure you removed yourself from it though because a search didn't come up for that. I removed myself from that too. I regularly search for my name.
But, your name is now also tied to this Fiero Post, which will now end up in the Archives. Now... the internet knows that your alias is Faaaaq.
When I search for that, it now gives me a much larger perspective of what it is you are into.
lmao, almost all completely wrong. im not 33 or even close, im not in any AV Club, i really really dont like indie rock, that address is the West Town Mall here in madison lol, youtube shows nothing but my sisters wedding and my dog, overclock forum i dont even think i made any posts, and im most def not a republican lol. and i also didnt remove myself from Spokeo. it seems to return nothing for almost everyone i know in real life except my dad-
gandalf, the post below, is also incorrect except for the email address...which is easily obtained from here on pff
[This message has been edited by faaaaq (edited 07-14-2011).]
IP: Logged
08:09 PM
Jul 13th, 2011
Gandalf Member
Posts: 647 From: Stockport, England Registered: May 2009
Im not going to waste my time, but given your name its also very easy to get all kinds of information on you if you've ever taken out a home loan or owned a home or had any sort of conviction or even a traffic ticket. It goes on from there. And if you can take any of those forums and they log your IP address as all do, and get that IP as some post it, its not impossible to work that back to a lot more information.
Google is also using their android phones in a war driving attack and is currently mapping the GPS coordinates of every single wifi device on the planet, and they in fact had that entire database queryable to the public until it leaked out that they were doing this and a big stick rose a few weeks ago.
What does that mean? Depending on the settings of your phone, andriod or iPhone or anything, if someone were to get the right information, very easily from a phone post to a forum linked to your PFF name which is now linked to your real name, its not completely unfeasable that someone could track your very location any time of the day. Once they had the MAC of your phone its easy. Google certainly could do it, as so anyone inside google in the right areas, and up until a few weeks ago anyone on the planet could, and who knows what parts of that system Google has left open or is doing that we dont even know about. You can still query the database but they have done something to muddy up the results from what I have seen.
