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PENSION PADDING: THE OTHER SIDE OF UNIONIZED CURRUPTION by madcurl
Started on: 05-22-2011 10:09 PM
Replies: 16
Last post by: fierobear on 05-26-2011 10:34 AM
madcurl
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Report this Post05-22-2011 10:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for madcurlClick Here to Email madcurlSend a Private Message to madcurlDirect Link to This Post


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Report this Post05-22-2011 11:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ls3machSend a Private Message to ls3machDirect Link to This Post
Nothing to do with this, but have you ever said what you do for a living?

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spark1
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Report this Post05-23-2011 01:16 AM Click Here to See the Profile for spark1Send a Private Message to spark1Direct Link to This Post
Andrew Cuomo said of pension padding “It’s been going on for a long time, everyone knows it but no one’s done anything about it.” He is right but it’s not just an “Albany” story, it’s much more widespread. People high in public office are the worst offenders because they can accumulate vacation, sick and overtime hours without the restrictions in place at lower levels.

But since human nature is the same everywhere, this game isn’t just restricted to public employees. In the corporate world different methods are used to fashion golden parachutes.
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Report this Post05-23-2011 11:14 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierobearClick Here to Email fierobearSend a Private Message to fierobearDirect Link to This Post
Not sure what Madcurl is complaining about. I assume he votes Democrat. What does he expect?

[This message has been edited by fierobear (edited 05-23-2011).]

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Pyrthian
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Report this Post05-23-2011 11:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PyrthianClick Here to Email PyrthianSend a Private Message to PyrthianDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:
Not sure what Madcurl is complaining about. I assume he votes Democrat. What does he expect?


right / wrong does not equal Democrat / Republican

just shows he's many ways above most of us....
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Report this Post05-23-2011 11:35 AM Click Here to See the Profile for avengador1Click Here to Email avengador1Send a Private Message to avengador1Direct Link to This Post
This has been common knowledge in New York for decades. I know several police officers in New York City that confirmed this story to me back then. Their retirement pay is based on their last year's wages, sick time and overtime. When an officer is in his last year of duty he will save any accrued sick time and he will be allowed to work as much overtime as he can. All of this is to pad how much he will make for that final year of service. It will significantly raise what his retirement benefits will finally be and this will end up costing the taxpayers more money to pay for it. This is all legally done because of the agreement the police union has with the city and that is what needs to be changed.
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spark1
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Report this Post05-23-2011 12:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for spark1Send a Private Message to spark1Direct Link to This Post
It has little to do with unions. Many lawmakers will sell their souls to get an endorsement from a police association. That's why the pension laws are written the way they are.
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madcurl
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Report this Post05-23-2011 04:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for madcurlClick Here to Email madcurlSend a Private Message to madcurlDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:

Not sure what Madcurl is complaining about. I assume he votes Democrat. What does he expect?



I'm sorry, this isn't some type of a "football" were YOU are allowed to spike the ball. Rather "pension padding" is a pandemic problem that reaches every state and every tax payer's pocket. As the video indicated, a officer whose yearly salary is 74k can "pad" (1-year prior) his/her retirement and net 199k for life. Thus the tax payers is left holding the bag.

Yet, Fierobear is wondering what I'm complaining about.
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madcurl
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Report this Post05-23-2011 05:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for madcurlClick Here to Email madcurlSend a Private Message to madcurlDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by spark1:

It has little to do with unions. Many lawmakers will sell their souls to get an endorsement from a police association. That's why the pension laws are written the way they are.


I think you've already answered the question, but let my clarify.

How is it that this provision was allowed for this to occur? Was it an oversight on the part of the unions who wrote this provision? Obviously, the unions are the ones that write the contracts, right? The politicians are the ones who need the union's votes to be elected, right?

There is one thing that is obvious. The "gig" is up. "Pension padding" is the best thing since slice bread and all are jumping in on the sweet heart deal. However, "Chickens come home to roost" and the tax payers are left holding the bag.
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spark1
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Report this Post05-24-2011 02:12 AM Click Here to See the Profile for spark1Send a Private Message to spark1Direct Link to This Post
I doubt that the pension system in New York State is an employment contract provision. In the State that I am familiar with, the public safety pension system was created by the State and it serves all the various local governments that choose to participate. Since issue is commonly discussed in Albany, it is likely a State system they are talking about there too. New York City is large enough to have it's own system so maybe a union agreement is part of that one.

Pension systems are required to be actuarially sound. They control vast amounts of money invested in various ways to help build the fund and pay the pensioners or their beneficiaries. Typically the supporting funds also come from employee contributions and a similar amount contributed by the employer.

The padding described can have many effects. It may reduce or eliminate any cost of living increase that pensioners might otherwise receive from investment earnings. It also may cause current employees and agencies (taxpayers) to contribute more to keep the fund sound. The taxpayers aren’t the only ones taking a hit on this.

Changes to pension laws usually grandfather those affected and only apply to new members. So don't look for a quick fix to this problem.
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Report this Post05-24-2011 02:28 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierobearClick Here to Email fierobearSend a Private Message to fierobearDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by madcurl:


I'm sorry, this isn't some type of a "football" were YOU are allowed to spike the ball. Rather "pension padding" is a pandemic problem that reaches every state and every tax payer's pocket. As the video indicated, a officer whose yearly salary is 74k can "pad" (1-year prior) his/her retirement and net 199k for life. Thus the tax payers is left holding the bag.

Yet, Fierobear is wondering what I'm complaining about.


And which political party is more in bed with the unions? Or are you not smart enough to know that? Geez.
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madcurl
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Report this Post05-24-2011 12:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for madcurlClick Here to Email madcurlSend a Private Message to madcurlDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:


And which political party is more in bed with the unions? Or are you not smart enough to know that? Geez.



I repeat: THIS THREAD IS ABOUT THE CORRUPTION IN PENSION PADDING AND UNIONS. IT IS NOT ABOUT WHAT POLITICAL PARTY THAT SUPPORTS THE UNIONS. IT IS ABOUT TAX PAYERS BEING HOSED!
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madcurl
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Report this Post05-24-2011 12:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for madcurlClick Here to Email madcurlSend a Private Message to madcurlDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by spark1:

I doubt that the pension system in New York State is an employment contract provision. In the State that I am familiar with, the public safety pension system was created by the State and it serves all the various local governments that choose to participate. Since issue is commonly discussed in Albany, it is likely a State system they are talking about there too. New York City is large enough to have it's own system so maybe a union agreement is part of that one.

Pension systems are required to be actuarially sound. They control vast amounts of money invested in various ways to help build the fund and pay the pensioners or their beneficiaries. Typically the supporting funds also come from employee contributions and a similar amount contributed by the employer.

The padding described can have many effects. It may reduce or eliminate any cost of living increase that pensioners might otherwise receive from investment earnings. It also may cause current employees and agencies (taxpayers) to contribute more to keep the fund sound. The taxpayers aren’t the only ones taking a hit on this.

Changes to pension laws usually grandfather those affected and only apply to new members. So don't look for a quick fix to this problem.



Then what you're implying is; there's a loop-hole that is being exploited. Exploited either by those in these unions. If the state (or those in charge) of oversight was caught sleeping then there's a major problem. Obviously, this exploitation or oversight can't continue or "pension padding" will break the state (to which is well underway or if not off to a bad start already).

The only real solution is to put a stop to pension padding and revoke all past "paddings" and pay them the "correct" retirement pay. If revoking past retirement pay sounds a bit too harsh I'd bet my employer will come after me if there was a mistake in my retirement package.

[This message has been edited by madcurl (edited 05-24-2011).]

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FriendGregory
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Report this Post05-24-2011 12:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FriendGregoryClick Here to Email FriendGregorySend a Private Message to FriendGregoryDirect Link to This Post
I must be one of the few that understand. The state and local governments are losing control of their budgets due to these badly designed pension provisions. How many "Heros" can we afford to pay excessive pensions - that are even beyond the generous pay/pension that we agreed to? How do you tell that government pay is too high? People want the job. Heck, when I had a good job, I wanted a government job.
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spark1
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Report this Post05-26-2011 01:52 AM Click Here to See the Profile for spark1Send a Private Message to spark1Direct Link to This Post
I wonder what union this guy is in?

Lawmakers Concerned About Ex-IMF Director's 'Golden Parachute'

 
quote

The former head of the International Monetary Fund accused of sexually assaulting a New York hotel maid will receive a $250,000 severance payment -- paid in part courtesy of the American taxpayer -- unless U.S. lawmakers can stop the "golden parachute" from landing in the French politician's bank account.

The IMF claims it has no discretion in the matter of Dominique Strauss-Khan, who was already pulling down nearly $500,000 as managing director when he resigned after being arrested in New York. The one-time severance, along with a much smaller annual pension, was part of his contract.


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Report this Post05-26-2011 08:28 AM Click Here to See the Profile for phonedawgzClick Here to visit phonedawgz's HomePageClick Here to Email phonedawgzSend a Private Message to phonedawgzDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by madcurl:
I repeat: THIS THREAD IS ABOUT THE CORRUPTION IN PENSION PADDING AND UNIONS. IT IS NOT ABOUT WHAT POLITICAL PARTY THAT SUPPORTS THE UNIONS. IT IS ABOUT TAX PAYERS BEING HOSED!


There is a political party that is owned by the unions? I did not know that.
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fierobear
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Report this Post05-26-2011 10:34 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierobearClick Here to Email fierobearSend a Private Message to fierobearDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by madcurl:
I repeat: THIS THREAD IS ABOUT THE CORRUPTION IN PENSION PADDING AND UNIONS. IT IS NOT ABOUT WHAT POLITICAL PARTY THAT SUPPORTS THE UNIONS. IT IS ABOUT TAX PAYERS BEING HOSED!


Unions cannot hose the taxpayers directly. They need government help. We all know which party is helping them (except you, evidently).

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