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Possibly shopping for a bike. by Shill
Started on: 05-11-2011 11:43 PM
Replies: 50
Last post by: RandomTask on 05-15-2011 12:16 AM
Shill
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Report this Post05-11-2011 11:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ShillSend a Private Message to ShillDirect Link to This Post
I've been considering purchasing a bike, though I do not know much about them. The little bit that I do know is just how to ride them from my dirty bike days 10 years ago. I know street bike are a complete different beast, I'm looking for something I can learn, including the mechanics off them. And was told when I get an endorsement that I cannot legally ride anything bigger than what I tested on, so I may want to find something of decent size to avoid headaches later.

found this, guy wants 1500 for it, but was just browsing ads, and am not set on getting anything yet.

http://spokane.craigslist.org/mcy/2346251944.html


1. I ask for any advice from those who can offer it
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Report this Post05-12-2011 12:05 AM Click Here to See the Profile for pontiackid86Click Here to Email pontiackid86Send a Private Message to pontiackid86Direct Link to This Post
Be very careful when buying a used bike... My buddy bought a 90's ninja and got it for a good price. well in bikes you do get what you pay for. not only was the bike a death trap (killed him last week) the engine was stolen and frame previously damaged.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 12:15 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 87antuzziClick Here to Email 87antuzziSend a Private Message to 87antuzziDirect Link to This Post
There are 2 kinds of riders. The ones who have been down and the ones who are going down. So your serious about getting a bike? Prove it. Before you get a bike go get a set of leathers and a good SNELL/DOT helmet. I always tell people to get the gear first and 9/10 times they come back with nothing. On to the bike. What kind of riding are you going to be doing? Around town, long distance or a weekend play toy? There is a different kind of bike for each. You are just starting out so people are going to tell you to get a smaller CC bike (250). Dont do it. Power is your best friend if your not a complete dumbass with it. Power will get you out of a bad situation. Meaning when it doubt, throttle out. On a 250 this is not going to happen. The CBR is a good bike. I am a big fan of the 600F4i as they are nimble litter bastards. My personal favorite to ride is a GSXR or a good motard bike. If you not dead set on a sport bike look into the motards. They are easy to ride and are a lot more forgiving than a sport bike but still have enough to get out of trouble. It would really help to know what you are looking for rather than what others say. For instance I think the buel is a ugly hunk of crap but other love them. We really need to know your preferences. So please answer these:
.
Do you want a sportbike?
Are you looking any special brand?
How tall are you?
What kind of riding are you wanting to do?
Whats your budget?
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brandon87gt
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Report this Post05-12-2011 01:14 AM Click Here to See the Profile for brandon87gtClick Here to Email brandon87gtSend a Private Message to brandon87gtDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by pontiackid86:

Be very careful when buying a used bike... My buddy bought a 90's ninja and got it for a good price. well in bikes you do get what you pay for. not only was the bike a death trap (killed him last week) the engine was stolen and frame previously damaged.


Is this a freaking joke? Your buddy was going 100+ MPH on residential streets and lost control and it's the bikes fault? Every bike is a death trap when you ride like an idiot. Even if he was an ATGATT person which I can bet he wasn't, it wouldn't have saved him.

A quote from a recent post I read on another forum. Titled "ATGATT is worthless"

 
quote

It appears many people believe wearing ATGATT on the streets will make them invincible if they crash. They forget to use their most valuable riding gear. Their brain. Common sense and logic is gone. They ride precariously and at insanely fast speeds on public roadways being used by other vehicles. When they crash, ATGATT is worthless. They should have saved their money.


You don't need leather specifically but should wear some kind of gear, at least a jacket, helmet, gloves and boots with ankle support. Riding pants would be a good idea too. It probably is a good idea to go buy the gear first and then the motorcycle second. Otherwise you will buy the bike and then say you have no money to buy gear right now and it will just have to wait. Bad idea.

What is your height/weight? You can start out on an older 600 if you ride smart. There are some nice 500's out there too.

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Report this Post05-12-2011 01:37 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jacknightSend a Private Message to jacknightDirect Link to This Post
most bikes are stolen......... all new bikes down here are stolen in a matter of days.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 01:44 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 87antuzziClick Here to Email 87antuzziSend a Private Message to 87antuzziDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jacknight:

most bikes are stolen......... all new bikes down here are stolen in a matter of days.


Now where did you get that kind of info? A pad lock though the rotor hole makes a bike damn near impossible to take without 4+ people.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 01:48 AM Click Here to See the Profile for timmerSend a Private Message to timmerDirect Link to This Post
hmmm i better check my bike then to make sure it was not stolen when i bought it new in the crate ..... oops maybe i should go check it right now to make sure it has not been stolen.

silly statement
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Report this Post05-12-2011 01:52 AM Click Here to See the Profile for pontiackid86Click Here to Email pontiackid86Send a Private Message to pontiackid86Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by brandon87gt:


Is this a freaking joke? Your buddy was going 100+ MPH on residential streets and lost control and it's the bikes fault? Every bike is a death trap when you ride like an idiot. Even if he was an ATGATT person which I can bet he wasn't, it wouldn't have saved him.

A quote from a recent post I read on another forum. Titled " is worthless"



well for one you dont know bullsh*t about what happened. Yes he was doing 100MPH but the bike WAS a legitimate death trap. My other buddy and his friend were given the bike after the accident and upon there inspection the frame was in horrible shape as well as its components (i dont even ride or know the 1st thing about motorcycles and i could tell it was bad after the bike was disassembled.... all things that a new biker(my friend) dident know to look at before buying it.I was making a warning to him to check the bike for safety and have it looked over to make sure it is safe to ride. It does not help that my friend was going that fast but I'm sure the condition of the bike did not help the cause either.

And what did this ATGATT have to do with anything I said?

[This message has been edited by pontiackid86 (edited 05-12-2011).]

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Report this Post05-12-2011 01:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for pontiackid86Click Here to Email pontiackid86Send a Private Message to pontiackid86Direct Link to This Post

pontiackid86

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quote
Originally posted by 87antuzzi:


Now where did you get that kind of info? A pad lock though the rotor hole makes a bike damn near impossible to take without 4+ people.


Nothin a good set of bolt cutters cant take care of.

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Report this Post05-12-2011 02:00 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jacknightSend a Private Message to jacknightDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 87antuzzi:


Now where did you get that kind of info? A pad lock though the rotor hole makes a bike damn near impossible to take without 4+ people.


A white van, 3-4 people, it would take less then 15 seconds to steal a motorcycle.... there was a video on youtube of them doing it in 5, I used to write blogs on how to protect your motorcycle..

300 Motorcycles are stolen a month down here...... I used to stunt motorcycles in 2005, I used to buy stolen parts, As there is no other way around it, You don't know if the parts are stolen or not, and you don't ask...

Unless your going to chain both wheels and the frame to some solid structure, there is no stopping them, and even that won't stop them.
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jacknight

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Lowjack GPS. It ****s all thieves... get it.

Lowjack busted a warehouse that had 300 motorcycles that where stolen... its a hell of a investment.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 02:12 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 87antuzziClick Here to Email 87antuzziSend a Private Message to 87antuzziDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jacknight:




You must live in the hood lol .There are locks that make is impossible to get to the rotor/lock to cut it.

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Report this Post05-12-2011 02:23 AM Click Here to See the Profile for brandon87gtClick Here to Email brandon87gtSend a Private Message to brandon87gtDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by pontiackid86:
well for one you dont know bullsh*t about what happened. Yes he was doing 100MPH but the bike WAS a legitimate death trap. My other buddy and his friend were given the bike after the accident and upon there inspection the frame was in horrible shape as well as its components (i dont even ride or know the 1st thing about motorcycles and i could tell it was bad after the bike was disassembled.... all things that a new biker(my friend) dident know to look at before buying it.I was making a warning to him to check the bike for safety and have it looked over to make sure it is safe to ride. It does not help that my friend was going that fast but I'm sure the condition of the bike did not help the cause either.

And what did this ATGATT have to do with anything I said?



Wait, you're telling me that after he slammed it into a pole at 100+mph and the bike was found a football field length away from his body that the frame was in horrible shape? You'll just have to imagine my shocked face. I'm sure your friends were clearly able to tell what damage was caused by the wreck and what wasn't.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 03:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ShillSend a Private Message to ShillDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 87antuzzi:

There are 2 kinds of riders. The ones who have been down and the ones who are going down. So your serious about getting a bike? Prove it. Before you get a bike go get a set of leathers and a good SNELL/DOT helmet. I always tell people to get the gear first and 9/10 times they come back with nothing. On to the bike. What kind of riding are you going to be doing? Around town, long distance or a weekend play toy? There is a different kind of bike for each. You are just starting out so people are going to tell you to get a smaller CC bike (250). Dont do it. Power is your best friend if your not a complete dumbass with it. Power will get you out of a bad situation. Meaning when it doubt, throttle out. On a 250 this is not going to happen. The CBR is a good bike. I am a big fan of the 600F4i as they are nimble litter bastards. My personal favorite to ride is a GSXR or a good motard bike. If you not dead set on a sport bike look into the motards. They are easy to ride and are a lot more forgiving than a sport bike but still have enough to get out of trouble. It would really help to know what you are looking for rather than what others say. For instance I think the buel is a ugly hunk of crap but other love them. We really need to know your preferences. So please answer these:
.
Do you want a sportbike?
Are you looking any special brand?
How tall are you?
What kind of riding are you wanting to do?
Whats your budget?


Yes, sportbike is preffered, probably wouldn't purchase it if it wasn't. something body style of late 90's or newer.

Brand, doesn't matter.

i' m 6'1" 200-220lb, depending on the month.

This will be a daily driver, as it will mostly be used to save on gas.

My budget is cheap.


I have had a few hard falls on my dirt bike, gone into shock once, I thought I was dead. Was only approx 45 mph on a dirt road and hit a pothole while braking, was young and inexperienced and cracked the helmet and bent up the bike pretty bad. I know how dangerous a bike is, I hope I don't turn into a maniac if/when I get one.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 07:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for naskie18Click Here to visit naskie18's HomePageClick Here to Email naskie18Send a Private Message to naskie18Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Shill:
And was told when I get an endorsement that I cannot legally ride anything bigger than what I tested on, so I may want to find something of decent size to avoid headaches later.

While I'm a big fan of finding something that's a decent size to start on just so you don't get bored and have to go buy something bigger in 2 months, I would be surprised if the above statement is accurate. I haven't heard of any state that categorizes motorcycle endorsements.

You may want to look into taking the MSF (Motorcycle Safety Foundation) course, it'll get you your endorsement as well as a lot of other information, and they provide bikes, so you don't have to buy one prior to taking it, you just need gear.

You mentioned you want a sportbike, is that because you want the performance or you like the styling? If it's the latter, there are some other good options out there that look like sport bikes but don't have the same amount of power, and these bikes tend to be available pretty inexpensively and hold their value well, so if you decide in a year or two to move on to something new/bigger/different/whatever, you can probably sell it for pretty close to what you paid for it. I started on a Katana 750, and think that was a great starter bike. It looked similar to a sportbike, which is something I was certainly looking for, and it had enough power to move me easily, but it didn't have the power of a GSXR or something of that nature.

You mention it'll be your daily driver, what's your daily commute like? I'd recommend getting your endorsement prior to buying a bike so that you can test ride bikes and make sure you're comfortable on them.....I've ridden a couple 600s that friends had, and there's no way I could've stayed on them for more than 20 minutes at a time, the couple times I was on them I couldn't wait to get back off.

------------------
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Shill
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Report this Post05-12-2011 09:41 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ShillSend a Private Message to ShillDirect Link to This Post
I lean more toward the styling of vehicles. But I know that as my comfort/skill level increases, I know my want for performance will increase also. if it isn't I'll advised, I'd like to get something that will keep me content as the comfort level increases. I'd rather feel the want more than need more later on.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 10:24 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Gokart MozartClick Here to visit Gokart Mozart's HomePageSend a Private Message to Gokart MozartDirect Link to This Post
There's sites answering this question
http://www.bestbeginnermoto...torcycle-tall-people
http://www.motorcycleforum....owthread.php?t=82590

I agree on getting the gear first. What's your weather like? Rainy, get a good waterproof suit, boots and gloves. One great place to look at gear you never thought of is http://www.aerostich.com/ including alarms that connect to your cell phone, if that's an issue.

http://www.sportrider.com/f...cle_theft/index.html

Top 10 most stolen models
Honda CBR600 (15.8%)
H-D FLS series (13.4%)
Honda CBR900 (8.8%)
Suzuki GSX-R750 (8.1%)
H-D FXS series (7.8%)
Kawasaki ZX-600 (5.6%)
Kawasaki ZX-750 (5.2%)
Suzuki GSX-600 (4.9%)
H-D FLH series (4.5%)
Yamaha FZR600 (4.5%)

 
quote
Originally posted by pontiackid86:

Nothin a good set of bolt cutters cant take care of.


You know nothing of good locks. Kryptonite has been making locks that can break the jaws of life since the 80s.

[This message has been edited by Gokart Mozart (edited 05-12-2011).]

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Report this Post05-12-2011 10:50 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JazzManClick Here to Email JazzManSend a Private Message to JazzManDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Shill:

I've been considering purchasing a bike, though I do not know much about them. The little bit that I do know is just how to ride them from my dirty bike days 10 years ago. I know street bike are a complete different beast, I'm looking for something I can learn, including the mechanics off them. And was told when I get an endorsement that I cannot legally ride anything bigger than what I tested on, so I may want to find something of decent size to avoid headaches later.

found this, guy wants 1500 for it, but was just browsing ads, and am not set on getting anything yet.

http://spokane.craigslist.org/mcy/2346251944.html


1. I ask for any advice from those who can offer it


I can offer this advice: Do not get this as a first bike. The biggest mistake new riders make is assuming that their first bike will be the only bike they ever own, and as such go and purchase a super sport bike thinking they'll "grow into it." As often as not they wind up either getting killed or seriously injured on it, or get so scared they quit riding. Bikes are not like the pants and shoes that you got as a kid a couple sizes too large to allow for future growth. Sure, there are a few folks out there for whom a super sport bike worked out great as their first bike, but there's an equal number for which the bike was, indeed, their last bike.

The most important advice I can offer is to take the MSF course first before riding. In many states, successful completion of the MSF exempts you from the riding portion of the motorcycle endorsement test. In your state taking the MSF course exempts you from all tests, just show up and get your motorcycle endorsement. Washington State, Get your motorcycle endorsement. Your state shows a couple MSF classes in Spokane,Washington State Motorcycle training schools. You can also check to see if your local community college offers MSF training. Here my local CCD offered it for $180.

I would suggest not riding until you complete the MSF. Why? It'll save you the trouble of having to unlearn bad habits, for one, and the good habits the MSF teaches will make it less likely that your first few miles sharing the road with cars won't be your last.

The gear question is obvious: Anyone who doesn't wear a helmet doesn't deserve to keep their brains inside their skull. If you choose to ride helmetless, please sign your organ donor card so that your organs don't go to waste. Too many good people out there don't outlive their waiting list (have lost two friends that way, sad.)

As far as a bike recommendation, I strongly suggest a used Ninja 250. It's sporty, relatively inexpensive to purchase and maintain, holds its value extremely well, has a good support community, has more than enough power to get around any city or highway (will do 100mph, enough to be arrested for in all 50 states), gets fantastic gas mileage (with a cheap sprocket change I'm routinely in the low to mid 60's on my '06), and looks pretty modern. A new alternative is the Honda CBR250, it's fuel injected, Honda's renowned quality, looks great. It's not quite as fast, though, and being new to the US market is not that common.

Buying older used for your first bike is a good idea for several reasons: You'll likely drop it at least once your first year, even stupid stuff like slipping on gravel or forgetting to put the kickstand down. Buying used also frees up money for gear, expect to spend at least $500 for gear starting out (helmet, gloves, jacket, boots).

I'm approaching 27,000 miles riding experience in 26 months on my Ninja 250 and am having a blast. The fact that I haven't broken $14 for a fill up yet is pretty nice, too.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 11:06 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ShillSend a Private Message to ShillDirect Link to This Post
Do you consider 6'1" to be tall?
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Report this Post05-12-2011 11:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Hank is HereClick Here to Email Hank is HereSend a Private Message to Hank is HereDirect Link to This Post
Have you looked at Suzuki SV650 and their derivations. I have one as my first bike for years. The power was reasonable (less than a 600 SS bike) yet the torque still made it fun to ride.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 12:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nmw75Send a Private Message to nmw75Direct Link to This Post
Having experience on a dirt bike is a huge advantage. I've saved myself from going down on my street bike because of riding on dirt for years before I bought my street bike.
Dont be scared of the # of cc's the bike has. Lots of it has to do with the gearing. I went from a 250cc enduro to what I have now. A 1200cc Suzuki Bandit. Its very manageable power. I'm only 5'8" & 150 lbs I have no problem with it. Had it for 10 years this month.



------------------
86 GT
87 coupe restoration project.

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Report this Post05-12-2011 12:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 87antuzziClick Here to Email 87antuzziSend a Private Message to 87antuzziDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Shill:

Do you consider 6'1" to be tall?


No. Im 6'4 and have no issue. Im going to say look at the sv600. Its not the greatest thing to look at but is a good bike all around.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 01:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for bristowbSend a Private Message to bristowbDirect Link to This Post
Having Raced 250-1000 cc bikes on the track. You can have a 250 out run a 1000 anyday of the week depending on rider. GET GEAR FIRST!!!! FULL EVERYTHING. GO WITH LEATHER! It WILL save your skin better than anything. DON'T buy The cheap crap either. My leather suit was $2000. My helmet $600. even my gloves were expensive. I am not saying go that expensive but don't get the crap stuff. DO IT RIGHT OR DON"T DO IT... A modern 600 is just as fast as a 1000cc. The real differance is mid range punch. and top end. I have been over 180 mph on a 1000cc and 160mph on a 600cc. Once you get everything take the bike to a track day. Look up Ed Bargy track school, Sportbike track time Those are just a few of the many track clubs you can join. You WILL learn how to be a faster smother rider on a track than on the street. Then you can transform you track skills to the street. The average track fee is about $125 a day maybe $300 for 3 days. Better than a speeding ticket and no traffic or cops or animals to watch for. it's also very addicting. Remember get the right gear. Even in summer i wore my gear ALWAYS. I'd rather sweat than bleed. Be careful. for a perfect bike Look to a modern(5-8 years old) 750cc Suzuki and Kawasaki has them. Great balance of power and agility. STAY OFF OF YOUR BACK BREAK. It's one of the worst things you can do in a panic situtation. Good luck and don't be a squid. You will learn that term soon enough.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 02:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JazzManClick Here to Email JazzManSend a Private Message to JazzManDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Shill:

Do you consider 6'1" to be tall?


Nope. Plenty of Ninjette riders over that height. If need be, you can get bar risers, but the pregen Ninja cockpit isn't cramped at all. My inseam is about 33" and I find there's plenty of room. Oh, the pregen ('07-back) have a fairly standard upright riding position, much more comfortable for real day to day riding. I average 1,200-1,800 miles a month on mine with stock bars and pegs, and my longest ride to date was two back to back comfortable 800+ mile days. For that last pair of rides I did have a Corbin saddle as I find the stock saddle uncomfortable after only 200 miles or so.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 02:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Falcon FieroClick Here to Email Falcon FieroSend a Private Message to Falcon FieroDirect Link to This Post
Get something 500cc or better. You will be much happier with appropriate power and mileage doesn't suffer.
I got 55+ mpg on a 1300cc when riding reasonable speeds. A 500cc bike my nephew had got over 60mpg.
Get the best you can afford, and the best gear.
Go to a dealer and sit on a LOT of bikes and see what fits best.

I recommend http://www.motorcyclegear.com/ for cheap new gear.

------------------

[This message has been edited by Falcon Fiero (edited 05-13-2011).]

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Report this Post05-12-2011 02:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TommyRockerClick Here to Email TommyRockerSend a Private Message to TommyRockerDirect Link to This Post
Considering you already have experience on 2 wheels, I would also recommend the CBR600 F4. Fuel injected, super reliable, common, parts are very available. If you are mechanically inclined you'll be able to do any maintenance it would require. The biggest PITA will be the valve adjustments, but that isn't THAT bad, just tedious. I am a big fan of 600cc sportbikes of the older classes like this one. They are a more relaxed position than more modern bikes, they are fast enough to have fun but they won't wheelie on you if you open the throttle (assuming you know how the clutch works--same as a dirt bike) they are stable, get good mileage, and are easy to ride. Much more forgiving than a 1000RR would be. My first bike was a ZX6r. I bought it new in 07, put almost 20,000 miles on it before my ex took it..

Also, the rule you stated with the displacement limited by what you tested on... thats weird. around here, as long as you test on a registered motorcycle above 50cc you are good. Trikes are different.

If you can afford a bike, you can afford leather/helmet/gloves. DO IT! I used to wear textile, til a friend low sided at ~40 and shredded his. Get Leather. Also, a FULL helmet. I don't care one way or another about SNELL because I've read about the testing and the safety issues that arise from meeting SNELL requirements. Look into HJC, they are a good affordable brand that will protect your head. People who swear you need to spend $700 on a helmet are simply wrong. a 2-300 helmet with DOT rating will serve you well.

Anyways, a 10 year old 600cc bike will be fast enough for fun and reliable enough to be reasonable. Also, light enough to pick up when you drop it, forgiving enough to keep your ass safe, and FUN!!

I would avoid a 250 if you are planning on riding as an enthusiast rather than just bear minimum commuting gas saver penny pincher. There is a group of people who love the 250s, but they are inadequate for most enthusiast, in the same way that a Geo Metro is inadequate for most enthusiasts. It will get you there but it isn't designed to really move your soul.

Oh, and take the MSF courses.
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brandon87gt
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Report this Post05-12-2011 04:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for brandon87gtClick Here to Email brandon87gtSend a Private Message to brandon87gtDirect Link to This Post
If this is going to be your daily driver then you really need to buy gear before the bike. You will need more than one set of gear depending on the weather and conditions. You'll easily drop 1k+ on gear even if you buy cheap stuff.

Look into the ninja 650r if you want the sport bike styling but something not quite as powerful.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 05:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JazzManClick Here to Email JazzManSend a Private Message to JazzManDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by TommyRocker:

I would avoid a 250 if you are planning on riding as an enthusiast rather than just bear minimum commuting gas saver penny pincher. There is a group of people who love the 250s, but they are inadequate for most enthusiast, in the same way that a Geo Metro is inadequate for most enthusiasts. It will get you there but it isn't designed to really move your soul.


This would be bad information,and a somewhat disparaging comparison between the 250 Ninja and the Geo Metro. I encourage the OP to do some original research. Also, would be a good idea to search youtube for "motorcycle crash" and study what kinds of bikes and circumstances are commonly associated with new rider crashes.

 
quote
Originally posted by TommyRocker:
Oh, and take the MSF courses.


This we can agree on.

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Report this Post05-12-2011 05:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 87antuzziClick Here to Email 87antuzziSend a Private Message to 87antuzziDirect Link to This Post
Im gonna have to agree NOT to get the 250. They are great to learn how to stun on but gutless for a daily driver application.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 05:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JazzManClick Here to Email JazzManSend a Private Message to JazzManDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 87antuzzi:

Im gonna have to agree NOT to get the 250. They are great to learn how to stun on but gutless for a daily driver application.


We've had this discussion before. Suffice to say, you're factually incorrect. Stun? You mean stunt? Sorry, that's for squids. Hopefully the OP isn't one of those. It's bad enough the reputation they give the rest of us.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 06:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pontiackid86Click Here to Email pontiackid86Send a Private Message to pontiackid86Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by brandon87gt:


Wait, you're telling me that after he slammed it into a pole at 100+mph and the bike was found a football field length away from his body that the frame was in horrible shape? You'll just have to imagine my shocked face. I'm sure your friends were clearly able to tell what damage was caused by the wreck and what wasn't.


considering there was damage at the back end of the bike away from where he hit... yes it was damaged before the incident. so please go piss off.

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Report this Post05-12-2011 06:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for naskie18Click Here to visit naskie18's HomePageClick Here to Email naskie18Send a Private Message to naskie18Direct Link to This Post
Shill, those of us that ride are very divided on whether a 250cc bike is a good bike for a few months, or for a longer period of time. You'll have to not only sit on bikes, but ride them and get a feel for how they perform in order to decide what you think is the best option. If you do take the MSF course, don't judge all 250s or 500s by the bikes they provide, the bikes they provide are very obviously in rough shape, and performance from a newer bike will be much better. To decide whether you'll like it or not, like everything else, you'll have to go actually try it.

To the six or seven of us who just did this in another thread: Let's not turn this into another thread where we spend 3 pages arguing about the merits of a 250. Some people think they're great for daily use, some don't, and none of us will convince the other they're wrong, so let it freaking go.
 
quote
Originally posted by pontiackid86:
considering there was damage at the back end of the bike away from where he hit... yes it was damaged before the incident. so please go piss off.

I'm sure it sucks losing a friend, but any damage to the rear of the bike (a) still could've been caused while it was going end over end, round and round, or however else it went after the front hit whatever it hit. Doing 100+, it wasn't likely the bike simple stopped when it hit something other than a wall, it likely would've bounced off and continued to acquire damage as momentum took it somewhere else. Maybe it was a stable bike, maybe not, but based on your account of the accident, it probably didn't matter what condition the bike he was riding was in. If you have specifc things to tell the poster to look for, that's great. If you're as unfamiliar with bikes as you've stated and have nothing to offer other than "don't buy damaged bikes" and "don't hit potholes in turns while doing 100", then maybe this isn't a thread for you.

[This message has been edited by naskie18 (edited 05-12-2011).]

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Shill
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Report this Post05-12-2011 06:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ShillSend a Private Message to ShillDirect Link to This Post
From what I see, definitely stay away from the 750cc+ range, as that would be like trying to learn on a SC mustang or other high HP vehicle. 600cc, would be like trying to learn clutch on a 3800 fiero, where 250 would be like learning on a stock 2.8/2.5(just throwing out examples as I see fit, I know bikes are a complete different beast).

600cc should be my limit, as it as it wont be obnoxiously hard, depending on a few other factors. Also won't be outgrown too quickly, if at all.

250 is the optimum beginner bike, but will more than likely be outgrown quickly

The best plan of attack would be to first get my license, taking a class, and paying all the state licensing fees, etc. should be about $150, probably not more than $200

Find a quality set of gear, plan to spend about $1000, if not more. This will be my protection, as cars come with their protection, bikes protection must be found separately.

begin shopping for a bike, long ways away yet but should I focus on a bike whose power levels are adequate for my skill level. i.e. don't buy a bike I can't keep upright and in a controlled forward motion. or should i search for a bike which fits my body perfect, even if it is way below my skill level? I know you all will say find one which fits both perfectly, but inevitably I know that won't work out. I will begin shopping, get excited and try and snatch up the best deal as fast as possible. So, if I had to sacrifice one or the other, which would you go with?
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Report this Post05-12-2011 06:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ShillSend a Private Message to ShillDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by JazzMan:


We've had this discussion before. Suffice to say, you're factually incorrect. Stun? You mean stunt? Sorry, that's for squids. Hopefully the OP isn't one of those. It's bad enough the reputation they give the rest of us.


Definitely not a stunt rider, atleast I hope not. Though I do not feel like it now, I know most of us are guilty of exploring every once in a while. Just like seeing that nice swooping corner ahead, and the sign says it recommends 25 but you know you can do it at atleast 60, or seeing that honda next to you at the light revving his engine, and his fancy stick on decals.

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Report this Post05-12-2011 06:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ShillSend a Private Message to ShillDirect Link to This Post

Shill

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quote
Originally posted by naskie18:

To the six or seven of us who just did this in another thread: Let's not turn this into another thread where we spend 3 pages arguing about the merits of a 250. Some people think they're great for daily use, some don't, and none of us will convince the other they're wrong, so let it freaking go.



Where is this thread located, i'm sure it'd be best to leave it separate. I'll be sure to have a peek at it.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 06:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TommyRockerClick Here to Email TommyRockerSend a Private Message to TommyRockerDirect Link to This Post
Go to a dealer and sit on bikes. You WILL find one that fits you and offers the level of performance you require. I could also recommend the SV650/SV1000. I don't personally like how they ride or feel, but they are a great city bike with good ergonomics for taller people. I am about 6 feet and they are a good height for me, maybe a TAD on the tall side. They are a V twin setup, so plenty of low and midrange. My buddy has an SV1k and in roll-ons at pretty much any speed 30+ he was even with my 600 Ninja.

Another thing to look at is supermoto...since you have dirt experience.




As for the Ninja 250... They are common. Sit on one. See if it fits you. You may be one of the crowd that is happy with it. Just don't buy into the salesman telling you it will outhandle and outbrake a ZX10R. It won't. Yeah, it's light, but it also has lower end suspension and brakes designed to do the bare minimum job.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 07:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JazzManClick Here to Email JazzManSend a Private Message to JazzManDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Shill:

From what I see, definitely stay away from the 750cc+ range, as that would be like trying to learn on a SC mustang or other high HP vehicle. 600cc, would be like trying to learn clutch on a 3800 fiero, where 250 would be like learning on a stock 2.8/2.5(just throwing out examples as I see fit, I know bikes are a complete different beast).

600cc should be my limit, as it as it wont be obnoxiously hard, depending on a few other factors. Also won't be outgrown too quickly, if at all.

250 is the optimum beginner bike, but will more than likely be outgrown quickly

The best plan of attack would be to first get my license, taking a class, and paying all the state licensing fees, etc. should be about $150, probably not more than $200

Find a quality set of gear, plan to spend about $1000, if not more. This will be my protection, as cars come with their protection, bikes protection must be found separately.

begin shopping for a bike, long ways away yet but should I focus on a bike whose power levels are adequate for my skill level. i.e. don't buy a bike I can't keep upright and in a controlled forward motion. or should i search for a bike which fits my body perfect, even if it is way below my skill level? I know you all will say find one which fits both perfectly, but inevitably I know that won't work out. I will begin shopping, get excited and try and snatch up the best deal as fast as possible. So, if I had to sacrifice one or the other, which would you go with?


Just remember this WRT your first bike purchase: Used 250's are very affordable and hold their value very well. If you're patient it's quite possible that you'll be able to sell a used 250 for more than you paid for it, after having put miles on it learning how to ride in the world of roads and cars. The problem with a high-horsepower bike is not that it's too fast, the Ninja 250 will outrun most vehicles on the road today and will definitely get you thrown in jail, it's that the supersport bikes are very, very unforgiving of newbie mistakes. Bobble the throttle a bit on a 250 and it's no big deal. Do it on a super sports bike and suddenly you're doing 80+ in a residential area holding on to the bars for dear life. You have to be really, really smooth with brakes, throttle, and bar inputs or you'll find yourself pretty much past your own limits and the bike's in zero time flat.

Look at it this way: Would you rather learn how to fly in a modern fighter jet, or a Cessna? Which do you think will kill an inexperienced pilot faster?

The biggest error that new riders make is thinking that their first bike is going to be their only bike. If you get a small bike and feel like "upgrading" (not really the right word, but gets used a lot) then you can sell it quick and buy the larger bike. Or you may find (as many who actually have meaningful experience on the smaller bikes) that you like the light weight nimble handling and don't find yourself needing to do zero to 90 runs in 4.0 seconds all the time. Or for that matter, you can do what so many enthusiasts do and just keep more than one bike. The only downside IMHO of the smaller bikes is the big-bore snobs dissing all the time. That behavior doesn't bother me but it bothers some.

Some details: If you're buying for economizing, i.e. saving gas, you need to look at all the costs associated with long-term maintenance since you have to ride pretty much full time to get meaningful fuel savings. Look at things like periodic maintenance such as adjusting valves: Can you do it (skills, tools?) or will you have to pay. If you do it yourself are the valves screw adjusters or bucket and shim? Shim kits can get pretty pricey. Chains and sprockets? Some high HP bikes eat them like candy and a new chain/sprocket setup can cost several hundred dollars. Tires? Hard touring tires last longer, larger or uncommon sizes are more expensive. Older bikes can have sizes that are now hard to find. Soft tires can wear out in 5K miles but allow you to safely use more HP and brakes. Oil filters common and cheap, or rare and expensive? Check that too. How about prices for parts commonly damaged in newbie drops? That's one downside of pregen Ninjas, fairings and tanks are mucho hard to find and expensive, think several hundred bucks each. Buy a "pre-wrecked" pre-gen for under $1k and don't worry about it.

WRT gas mileage, many claim to get high 50's in the larger bikes, but that's only likely if the bike is babied and never ridden fast. People I know that ride bikes like that even close to their limits on the street get 30's-40's at best. I get a documented solid 62-63 long term average, with 68 being the high record, with normal safe highway speeds (75mph+) and in-town commuting (about 70-30 split).

Lately my data shows that I'm saving around $210 a month by riding instead of driving. I paid off the bike a few months ago in fuel/oil change savings and am now paying off the gear. At current prices it will all be paid for by fuel savings by the end of the year.
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Report this Post05-12-2011 10:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ShananigansSend a Private Message to ShananigansDirect Link to This Post
It doesn't matter what bike you buy,what matters is your self control of your right hand on the throttle. It's too easy to haul ass and if your the kind of person who has no self control,stick to a smaller hp bike because if your inexperienced you can Fxxxxck up real quick and kill yourself fast. If your totally inexperienced and have never even ridden a motorcycle...boy do you have alot to learn. It is true that dirt riders who have been riding since youth have a tremendous edge on those with no experience, they can use there knowledge and skill to avoid an accident,where an inexperienced rider might panic because of lack of experience. I recommend you start small and work yourself up gradually. Liter bikes and even some 600cc bikes are way too fast for the inexperienced rider,they are much too fast and are almost like riding on a rocket ship. You can be doing well over 100 mph smoothly and effortlessly before you even know it, but when it comes time to stop or avoid collision in an emergency situation, your life could be in serious jeopardy. Motorcycle are great and I am a serious motorcyclist with many motorcycles but they require a tremendous amount of respect. I have had to use my know how many times to avoid serious injury or death,Good Luck.
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Report this Post05-13-2011 05:28 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Gokart MozartClick Here to visit Gokart Mozart's HomePageSend a Private Message to Gokart MozartDirect Link to This Post
http://www.bestbeginnermoto...art-250cc-motorcycle

Top 5 Reasons to Start on a 250cc Motorcycle

1. You'll Learn Faster Than a 600cc
Riding a motorcycle is hard for most people. Sure, put someone on a motorcycle for a few months or a year and it will eventually become second nature. Until you build the muscle memory that you need to properly operate a bike, you need to stack as much in your favor as you can. One of the easiest ways to do that is by choosing a 250 as a first motorcycle.

With a 250 you don't have to worry too much about twisting the throttle and pulling a power wheelie (although I have seen it done by a pro 250 rider at the track). With a 600 it is quite easy to reach 40 or 50 miles per hour in first gear with just a twist of the wrist, add into that target fixation and you soon become a human missile headed for an oncoming car. When you take the power out of the equation you can build a solid foundation of skills that you can transfer to a larger motorcycle later. You learn to shift properly, carry your speed into turns, look where you want to go etc... All of it is achievable on a larger motorcycle, but you can learn it quicker and more efficiently on a 250cc.

2. They are Cheap to Buy and Run

You can pick up a brand new Kawasaki Ninja 250 for under $3,500 (maybe a few hundred dollars more or less depending on the dealer), or a 2008 Honda Rebel for about $3,200. By contrast an 08 Kawasaki Ninja ZX-6R is over $9,000 brand new! That's a lot of moola to spend on a bike that you are most likely going to drop at least once during your first year of riding.

250's generally get twice or three times the miles per gallon (MPG) that their larger counterparts do. A smaller engine means less gas is needed to get you where you are going. Add to that the fact that they are usually at least a hundred pounds lighter than a 600 and its going to increase that MPG even further. If you insure your motorcycle (which is the law in California) then you will also notice a pleasant surprise if you own a 250 versus a 600. Small motorcycles are more inexpensive in every department, plus when you are done with them you can get almost all of your money back when you sell (especially if you buy them used first).


3. They Hold Resale Value

One of the great things about these motorcycles is they really hold their resale value. Tons of new people are getting into motorcycles ever year, and that means a lot of beginner riders that want to buy their first bike. The most sought after motorcycle is of course the 600, and the market is literally flooded with them from new riders who buy them and try to sell them less than a year later because they either crashed, or they found out the hobby wasn't for them. A lot less people buy 250's for their first bike, but because of the internet the idea of starting on a smaller bike is gaining ground. There is a short supply of 250's and a much greater demand for them, this keeps their resale value extremely high.

Check your local craigslist.com and you will see hundreds of advertisements for 600cc bikes, but when you check for 250's they are few and far between. Bookmark a few of the 600 ads and check them again in a week and you will notice that a lot of them are still there. If you do the same thing with a few of the advertisements selling 250's you will notice that most if not all of them will have been sold already. This is how it is in the California Bay Area, so I would imagine it would be the same in most other parts of the country with a thriving motorcycle community.


4. 2008 Ninja 250

Yes, the 08 Ninja is a great reason to start on a 250 motorcycle. Simply put this bike looks better than some of the 600cc, or 1000cc bikes I have seen! I realize that some people out there might like the 'dated' look of the 2007 models and earlier, but I think those folks are crazy. It's taken the Kawasaki engineers nearly 2 decades to come out with a new version of the 250 and this one takes the cake. This is probably one of the only times in the last 10 years where people are buying a 250cc bike for the looks, and not for the practicality.

The new version of Kawasaki's famous ninjette is also quite a bit more powerful than its predecessors. Most riders feel like they are riding a bike with at least 100 more CC's than they actually are. This is great because it will make the transition to a 500cc or 600cc bike that much easier if you choose to do so. Honestly for the price, and for the looks, this is one bike that makes being a beginner motorcycle rider really cool.


5. You Can Ride Them to Their Limits

Ask anyone with a Yamaha r1 if they have ridden their bike to its limits on the street. If they answer yes, they are lying, unless you happen to be talking to a corpse. The same can almost be said for most 600cc inline-fours as there are very few people that have the balls or the skill to ride a bike that that to its limits on public roads. The reason being is because once you have enough experience to actually take a bike to its limits, you are generally not dumb enough to do so in an area with cars coming the other direction.

The 250cc bike though is a different story. Most of them top out before they reach 100mph which means you won't be smoking any lambo's on the freeway. This makes the ideal terrain for the beginner bike the twisty roads often found in the hills on the outskirts of town. Here you can lean the bike over, crack open the throttle, and carry your speed into turns a lot easier than with a 600cc bike. For the ninja 250 you'll be shifting out of first before you even hit 20mph, the same cannot be said for its big brother the Kawasaki ZX-6R. While riding the 250 you'll have much more of a racer feel because you will be shifting more to keep the bike in the ideal power range. To get the same feeling with a 600cc bike you would have to be going two to three times the speed.


Honorable Mention:

6. They are Great for Lane Splitting (California Only)

250 bikes are small, and that is a blessing in California! As far as I know we are the only state which allows lane sharing or 'lane splitting'. This means motorcycles can actually ride on the dotted white line that separates the lanes and which allows them to ride through standstill traffic. This is a blessing since it is quite easy for a motorcycle to overheat, especially during California summers. It also helps with traffic congestion because it allows one less vehicle to add to the large line of slowly moving cars.

The tricky thing about lane sharing though is you don't want to hit other cars, especially their mirrors that are sticking out. It's much easier to avoid doing this if you have a small, narrow framed motorcycle like the Honda Rebel or Ninja 250. I've seen riders on big BMW's and Harleys with saddlebags try and lane split before, but they either go extremely slow to avoid hitting anything, or they don't even bother splitting at all. When you ride a ninja 250 in traffic the bike is so skinny that it feels like you have a full lane in between the cars!
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naskie18
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Report this Post05-13-2011 08:25 AM Click Here to See the Profile for naskie18Click Here to visit naskie18's HomePageClick Here to Email naskie18Send a Private Message to naskie18Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Shill:
Where is this thread located, i'm sure it'd be best to leave it separate. I'll be sure to have a peek at it.
We've had this discussion multiple times, but this is the only one I see in my recent posts list: http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum6/HTML/084406.html

To your question about whether to sacrifice power or comfort if you need to sacrifice one of them, that depends more on your riding. What's your typical commute like? If you spend 20 minutes going to most places, then long term comfort likely isn't as important as it would be if it takes you an hour to get to most of your destinations. If you're getting any sport bike style bike from the mid 90s forward, I doubt there will really be anything there that doesn't have enough power for you, although you may want to pay attention to the weights of bikes as you look at various models. While the lighter ones are easier to throw around curves, they also notice wind a lot more, particularly crosswinds. Comfort and power of bikes are both things that can be improved, although it's probably easier to improve the comfort significantly than it is to increase the power significantly. You can always get bar risers or lower (or raise, if necessary) the footpegs to find a more comfortable body position, and there's a number of choices out there for more comfortable seats as well, most of which are custom jobs and can be done to whatever specifications you want, so if you want the seating position raised or lowered, that can be accommodated. If you find a bike that you really like the looks and performance of, but maybe the seating position isn't as comfortable as you'd hoped, try sitting on it with your hands pulled just up and back of the handlebars, maybe a half inch, then an inch, then an inch and a half, you can simulate what it'd be like with different thicknesses of bar risers and see if one of those positions gets you to something more comfortable.

This is a kinda neat site that'll let you approximate your riding position, as well approximating the impact that some changes like bar risers or a different seat height.

Another thing that was mentioned before, but is probably worth mentioning again: Regardless of what size bike you start with, don't shy away from bikes with some damage to the cosmetics. If you buy something used that's already been dropped, (a) you'll be able to get it for a decent price and (b) you won't feel as bad the first time you drop it.
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