Originally posted by maryjane: Look no further than congress and the liberals here on this board. There's a reason Neptune and others have called conservatives selfish in relation to the this bill--he wants them to pay someone else's share. You know--like the idiot guy down the highway from me with 4 kids, highspeed internet, a new Dodge diesel pickup--with a custom loud exhaust, three fourwheelers in his back yard, a drug habit, a booze habit, cig habit, a bass boat that I couldn't afford if I wanted to, but no job and he can't wait for this to go into law so his family can have healthcare coverage. No thanks, but if you wish, I'll pm you his address and you folks who favor this can pay for his--and the rest of the people in his trailer park.
dont forget the large flat panel TV if you carry any kind of health insurance - you already are paying for other peoples healthcare - thats how health insurance works tho, it is funny to see you covet the lifestyle of the trailer park folk. if its so much fun, why dont you make some better choices, so you can enjoy it too? or it that not the truth? just spouting spiteful junk?
and, isnt this a bit O/T - go start a thread if you got junk to spew forth.
the ONLY fair health care system is everyone pays their own way. not thru a shared insurance pool of any kind. this forces health care providors to be cost effective. forces the health care recipients to be concsious of their health. and, the darwinists get their "culling of the herd", because some of the lame will not make it, due to costs.
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12:01 PM
MDFierolvr Member
Posts: 2025 From: Great Mills, MD Registered: Mar 2004
Look no further than congress and the liberals here on this board. There's a reason Neptune and others have called conservatives selfish in relation to the this bill--he wants them to pay someone else's share. You know--like the idiot guy down the highway from me with 4 kids, highspeed internet, a new Dodge diesel pickup--with a custom loud exhaust, three fourwheelers in his back yard, a drug habit, a booze habit, cig habit, a bass boat that I couldn't afford if I wanted to, but no job and he can't wait for this to go into law so his family can have healthcare coverage. No thanks, but if you wish, I'll pm you his address and you folks who favor this can pay for his--and the rest of the people in his trailer park.
Well have you filed a petition with the state so you don't have to pay his healthcare already? Because you do anyway, and at much more expense than it would with this reform. Because if his kids need medical care, who covers it? why of course you do. I don't want to pay for your War in Iraq because I don't think we should be there. You pay for it.
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Originally posted by partfiero:
In a million years I couldn't have stated it more clearer. You have given the best example I have ever heard on why government run health care will fail. Thanks for the brilliant observation.
You couldn't state it clearer because you aren't paying attention. Honestly it is the Republicans who are screwing this up with their propaganda and lies about how it will change things. "Death Panels" really? It's paranoia but the reason that the Dems are seeking bipartisanship is because they know that they don't have a willing flock following them like the Reps who will follow without question. Almost all Reps are extremely right, where Dems are Conservative, Moderate, and Liberal.
Also, the rest of the world thinks our lack of some form of public healthcare is in tune with our arrogant unsophisticated nature. Most of you will say, "Screw Em!" But we owe them a lot of money so maybe them having a favorable opinion of us and them seeing us as trustworthy is a good thing. Hell just having our current president made polls jump.
EDIT:
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Originally posted by Pyrthian: and, isnt this a bit O/T - go start a thread if you got junk to spew forth.
I tried to do this by refocusing on that link where Jon Stewart nails Faux News to the wall but they all blew right past it.
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Originally posted by Pyrthian: the ONLY fair health care system is everyone pays their own way. not thru a shared insurance pool of any kind. this forces health care providors to be cost effective. forces the health care recipients to be concsious of their health. and, the darwinists get their "culling of the herd", because some of the lame will not make it, due to costs.
If we did this with the current system and the way things cost the only people who would be able to afford healthcare are in the top 5% or so of the wealth in this country. Would be interesting to see though because then Republicans would definately be wishing for UHC.
[This message has been edited by MDFierolvr (edited 11-24-2009).]
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12:12 PM
ryan.hess Member
Posts: 20784 From: Orlando, FL Registered: Dec 2002
Wow... I can't believe this whole thread is about Fox being "caught" using file footage instead of a live image. Ooooooooh, scandal and controversy, scandal and controversy...
Imagine CNN showing file footage of Al Gore with thousands of people at a rally from 1992, while talking about a book signing with a total of 3 people there.
O'Reilly, and many here, would be foaming at the mouth.
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12:30 PM
jstricker Member
Posts: 12956 From: Russell, KS USA Registered: Apr 2002
Palin's book has already sold 750,000 copies and there are many accurate videos of people standing in line to buy and have her autograph the books.
John Stricker
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Originally posted by ryan.hess:
Imagine CNN showing file footage of Al Gore with thousands of people at a rally from 1992, while talking about a book signing with a total of 3 people there.
O'Reilly, and many here, would be foaming at the mouth.
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12:47 PM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
Palin's book has already sold 750,000 copies and there are many accurate videos of people standing in line to buy and have her autograph the books.
John Stricker
Whether there were 3 or 30,000 people there in line shouldn't matter... You can see how it could be construed as trying to manipulate public opinion. It's the news producer's job to catch things like that.
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01:00 PM
partfiero Member
Posts: 6923 From: Tucson, Arizona Registered: Jan 2002
If you're not a liberal when you're 20, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative when you're 35, you have no brain.
Hmm. I am totally left out of that equation. I am neither liberal nor conservative and I am 71 but have a brain and a slightly defective heart. Perhaps I should begin watching TV again. Is M*A*S*H still on?
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01:16 PM
Pyrthian Member
Posts: 29569 From: Detroit, MI Registered: Jul 2002
Originally posted by Formula88: If you're not a liberal when you're 20, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative when you're 35, you have no brain.
yes, I've heard this as "everyones a democrat, until they leave home" but, there is alot of truth in these simple statements somewhere in there is a balance
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01:26 PM
GT86 Member
Posts: 5203 From: Glendale, AZ Registered: Mar 2003
Honestly it is the Republicans who are screwing this up with their propaganda and lies about how it will change things.
Really? The Democrats control the House, the Senate, and the White House. The Democrats are the ones who have written the bills, and the amendments to the bills. The backroom deals going on now are to appease Democrats who are looking out for their own-self interests. The Democrats have essentially laughed every Republican proposal out of the room. Yes, the Dems say they want bipartisanship on this "reform", but as always (regardless of which party is in power), the definition of bipartisanship seems to be "Vote for our bill. We want your vote, but not your input".
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Originally posted by MDFierolvr: Personally I agree with you somewhat. Though I think if you are going to make the transition at least be dedicated to it not do it halfway like what is being done for "bipartisanship." You will never make everyone happy regardless of what you do, so just do what is best at the time.
The problem with moving towards the public sector is that the ability to contain costs virtually disappears. Rationing health care is a fact--there is a limited supply of doctors, hospitals, equipment, etc. It's just like anything else, it isn't unlimited. So it has to be rationed, whether you like that term or not. But by putting politicians in charge, who hand out money like candy in order to buy votes, any chance we have of reducing costs disappears. Simply put, there's no incentive for a politician to cut monetary costs, because there's a political cost as well.
Our system as it is now isn't sustainable. But neither is single payer, because so many people won't have to contribute. It would be funded by the "rich", just like everything else. Remember, about 50% of the population pays no taxes. But as it is now, more than 50% have health insurance. So, we actually have more people paying for healthcare now than we would under single payer.
[This message has been edited by GT86 (edited 11-24-2009).]
I don't see the issue here. Palin drew huge crowds, even the Seattle times, a liberal paper, reported she drew 4,000 at Fort Bragg. They say they used the wrong footage and apologized. Had Palin only drew a hundred people, and they showed this video, ok, I could see an argument. The fact is Palin has been drawing thousands at all the signings, so there is no need to fake anything. Common sense. This is just liberal spin. Sorry Neptune, but there is no logic behind your title.
What is faking it, is when MSNBC shows a man at a tea party with an AR-15 and says he is white, but does not show his skin color. Turn out another camera was there showing the man, and oops! he was black. That my friend is faking it.
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02:48 PM
GT86 Member
Posts: 5203 From: Glendale, AZ Registered: Mar 2003
dont forget the large flat panel TV if you carry any kind of health insurance - you already are paying for other peoples healthcare - thats how health insurance works tho, it is funny to see you covet the lifestyle of the trailer park folk. if its so much fun, why dont you make some better choices, so you can enjoy it too? or it that not the truth? just spouting spiteful junk?
and, isnt this a bit O/T - go start a thread if you got junk to spew forth.
the ONLY fair health care system is everyone pays their own way. not thru a shared insurance pool of any kind. this forces health care providors to be cost effective. forces the health care recipients to be concsious of their health. and, the darwinists get their "culling of the herd", because some of the lame will not make it, due to costs.
Why should someone be rewarded for being poor? I haven't read the rest of this thread past the first page, but I take it in this paragraph you're critivizing someone because they don't like to pay for other people's health care.
Explain to me why poor people get rewards and free stuff? I'm not suggesting that every poor person is lazy. People live in trailers for a variety of different reasons.
A) They are Canadian snow-birds who have a summer home in Florida and don't mind spending it in a trailer. B) They've made poor choices, and now have to live in a trailer. C) They've been struck by really bad luck, and now have to live in a trailer. D) They enjoy the trailer life style (or they don't know any better)
I don't think ANY of those are deserving of getting free stuff, free food, free money, free subsidies, or a lower tax bracket.
What you're basically saying is that someone is MORE deserving of something.
Do you realize how much money we spend subsidizing and "helping" the poor? If this actually worked, don't you think poverty in America would have been resolved? Why is it that China, for example, is slowly improving their entire class structure, and money is flowing freely by CREATING JOBS and CREATING OPPORTUNITY FOR GROWTH? China, Malaysia, Singapore, etc... their economies aren't growing exponentially because their government subsidizes their poor...
Liberals really have a completely warped sense of reality.
If you ARE capable of working, then we should do everything in our power to encourage and give you the opportunity for employment... not subsidize everything until one day you get out of it.
I encourage you to read this article I wrote. Feel free to comment:
Many of the liberal media women hate her for the simple reason that, unlike them, she became very successful and didn't have to sleep her way to the top.
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03:09 PM
avengador1 Member
Posts: 35467 From: Orlando, Florida Registered: Oct 2001
Wow... I can't believe this whole thread is about Fox being "caught" using file footage instead of a live image. Ooooooooh, scandal and controversy, scandal and controversy...
Did you just hear something go whooshing over your head? It was the point. It isn't about a couple of "accidentally on purpose" file footage flubs. Its the day in, day out mission of Murdoch, Ailes, and the FOX "news" channel that has been outed so many times. FOX is OBVIOUSLY leading the charge in the war.
The message is only important to you when it fits in with your agenda. You are not interested in truth. You are the fighting a one sided war.
A lot of other people here are interested in the truth and you are just one aspect of their war.
You are simple,shortsighted and conceited. A mix that creates a pompous no[sic] it all that contributes nothing to actual advancement.
Apparently I know more than you. And I can tell the truth from FOX bs. Here's a video that won't tax your abilities too much. http://cablenews-ate-my-bra...r-on-fox-update.html You should begin to work on critical thinking skills. You've already got the personal insults and denials down pat.
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[This message has been edited by NEPTUNE (edited 11-24-2009).]
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05:35 PM
GT86 Member
Posts: 5203 From: Glendale, AZ Registered: Mar 2003
Hmm. I am totally left out of that equation. I am neither liberal nor conservative and I am 71 but have a brain and a slightly defective heart. Perhaps I should begin watching TV again. Is M*A*S*H still on?
No, but Oprah is getting her own network!! LOL
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05:41 PM
PFF
System Bot
NEPTUNE Member
Posts: 10199 From: Ticlaw FL, and some other places. Registered: Aug 2001
Hmm. I am totally left out of that equation. I am neither liberal nor conservative and I am 71 but have a brain and a slightly defective heart. Perhaps I should begin watching TV again. Is M*A*S*H still on?
Apparently I know more than you. And I can tell the truth from FOX bs. ... You should begin to work on critical thinking skills. You've already got the personal insults and denials down pat.
Your hypocrisy is reaching new levels of hilarity. Just when it seems you won't be able to top yourself, you manage to tighten your blinders down a bit further.
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05:50 PM
pokeyfiero Member
Posts: 16189 From: Free America! Registered: Dec 2003
Imagine CNN showing file footage of Al Gore with thousands of people at a rally from 1992, while talking about a book signing with a total of 3 people there.
O'Reilly, and many here, would be foaming at the mouth.
You mean like how the media used only certain pictures and videos of the Capitol TEA party protest. Ones that were taken at such odd angles as to make the crowd appear drastically smaller then it actually was? <sarcasm> Shame on you, Fox News! Shame! Oh wait, that wasn't Fox, was it? </sarcasm>
Have you not figured it out yet? They BOTH (Fox on the right, and CNN, HNN, MSNBC on the left) have an agenda! Neither one is "Fair and Balanced" no matter what Fox's slogan may be. That they both attempt to sell an agenda to their audience should be accepted as given. However I know several people who seem to have Neptune's attitude that Fox is nothing but a right wing mouth-peace, Rupert Murdoch is evil incarnate (playing 2nd fiddle only to GWB) yet will scream at the top of their lungs "WHAT BIAS?! THERE'S NO BIAS!!!!!!!" When CNN/MSNBC comes up. At best its just silly, at worst its dishonest.
[This message has been edited by OKflyboy (edited 11-24-2009).]
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06:07 PM
jstricker Member
Posts: 12956 From: Russell, KS USA Registered: Apr 2002
I'm not arguing that. Nowhere have you read that I agree or support Fox using the file footage.
That doesn't change the fact that the conditions you set did not apply.
John Stricker
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Originally posted by ryan.hess:
Whether there were 3 or 30,000 people there in line shouldn't matter... You can see how it could be construed as trying to manipulate public opinion. It's the news producer's job to catch things like that.
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06:14 PM
OKflyboy Member
Posts: 6607 From: Not too far from Mexico Registered: Nov 2004
Originally posted by NEPTUNE: FOX is OBVIOUSLY leading the charge in the war.
Sorry if you don't like the messenger. Or me. The message is important.
I never said I disliked you, but I dislike, and disavow your so-called "message". Its telling that you "rarely post in political threads anymore"unless its to bash a conservative. You call the Conservatives on PFF "haters", but you don't exactly seem to be the beacon of enlightenment yourself, pal. So spare us your righteous indignation. It rings hollow when you cannot see past your own gloating nose.
------------------ "The flag should be displayed with the union down, as a signal of dire distress in instances of extreme danger to life or property."
Read my Earthship thread in Totally O/T si vis pacem, para bellum
"The said constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms." - Samuel Adams
What part of "SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED" is so hard to understand?!
[This message has been edited by OKflyboy (edited 11-24-2009).]
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06:15 PM
cliffw Member
Posts: 35990 From: Bandera, Texas, USA Registered: Jun 2003
Originally posted by cliffw: Collecting taxes for several years before even implementing services will do that. I've got some ocean front property I'd like to sell you.
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Originally posted by MDFierolvr: 100 miles inland in NC? Sure I would love to see it. And in the contract I will make sure to state that you must continue to drive that low mpg beast so that I can have my ocean front just a little bit sooner.
Don't tell me you still believe in the Easter Bunny and Santa Clause too.
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Originally posted by MDFierolvr: I keep hearing about this and for some reason you keep thinking that we who are for it are against paying for it. I would love to know where this started or any sources that support this idea.
Then pay for it and shut us up. Oh, that's right. You can't even pay for your own. We who are for it is about 1/3rd of the nation. About 50% of the nation does not even pay taxes. Almost 1/2 of the people who don't pay taxes are not for it.
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09:43 PM
cliffw Member
Posts: 35990 From: Bandera, Texas, USA Registered: Jun 2003
Originally posted by MDFierolvr: Well have you filed a petition with the state so you don't have to pay his healthcare already? Because you do anyway, and at much more expense than it would with this reform.
The Congressional Budget Office says different. The CBO says public option premiums will be higher than private insurance premiums are now.
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Originally posted by MDFierolvr: I don't want to pay for your War in Iraq because I don't think we should be there. You pay for it.
Your Dumbs voted that you do want to be there.
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09:50 PM
NEPTUNE Member
Posts: 10199 From: Ticlaw FL, and some other places. Registered: Aug 2001
No it's not, but you can continue to believe it is, since the White House told you it was. Carry on--but no one's really listening to your biased ramblings.
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 11-24-2009).]
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11:06 PM
PFF
System Bot
Nov 25th, 2009
cliffw Member
Posts: 35990 From: Bandera, Texas, USA Registered: Jun 2003
Originally posted by NEPTUNE: OK, since you guys have run almost all of the people who disagree with a warped view of the world away from Pennocks Right Wing Forum, ......
Yeah, ok, whatever. How do you explain liberal non existent talk radio ?
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08:05 AM
Indiana_resto_guy Member
Posts: 7158 From: Shelbyville, IN USA Registered: Jul 2000
That reminds me of what my mother used to say to me when, as a kid, I tried to use that same bogus argument: "If all the other kids jumped off a cliff, would you think it was a good idea to jump too?"
I don't think that is a fair statement. You would be the first off.
Well have you filed a petition with the state so you don't have to pay his healthcare already? Because you do anyway, and at much more expense than it would with this reform. Because if his kids need medical care, who covers it? why of course you do. I don't want to pay for your War in Iraq because I don't think we should be there. You pay for it. .
No, I do NOT pay his share--as usual, you're ill informed, and assume much. I will be more than happy to pay for the war in Iraq--my share and one other's.
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09:15 AM
Pyrthian Member
Posts: 29569 From: Detroit, MI Registered: Jul 2002
how about that Newsweek cover with that frivilous sweatsuit getup? I myself thought it was cute, and gave it a but, apparantly some thought it was inappropriate, and an intentional jab yes - we can guarantee the cover was no mistake, and was intentional
so - yes media bias is FINALLY proven. until now, we've all only heard rumors of such things.
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09:22 AM
fierobear Member
Posts: 27083 From: Safe in the Carolinas Registered: Aug 2000
Originally posted by MDFierolvr: You wonder why support has been wavering? Well that is because congress has been changing and adding to an overall good bill and making it completely worthless. It looks like a race to find out how many loopholes can be added before a deadline. Honestly if we didn't have a system lead by corrupt aristocrats like we do now it probably would look a lot better and maintain support. Leave it to politicians to screw things up... again.
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Originally posted by partfiero:
In a million years I couldn't have stated it more clearer. You have given the best example I have ever heard on why government run health care will fail. Thanks for the brilliant observation.
There is another angle to his post - he's basically saying "if things just weren't as they are, they'd be better!" Another liberal hopey-dopey-ism. There is a *reason* why things are as they are, and that's the problem that the left just can't wrap it's head around.
dont forget the large flat panel TV if you carry any kind of health insurance - you already are paying for other peoples healthcare - thats how health insurance works tho, it is funny to see you covet the lifestyle of the trailer park folk. if its so much fun, why dont you make some better choices, so you can enjoy it too? or it that not the truth? just spouting spiteful junk?
Oh, it's the truth about the family, and their possessions, and their white trash habits, but untrue about me coveting their lifestyle. Not sure where you got that from but I have a pretty good idea. If I had a need or desire for any of that kind of crap, I'd go buy it. I have my own lake, so I have no need for a bass boat--I just walk 500 ft and start fishing. Boats are a hole in the water to throw money down. I have 2 tvs already, which I may watch about 30 minutes/day.
