In a Sunday morning TV interview, the New York Democrat said the current all-voluntary military is strained. He said the nation can't send more troops to Iraq and challenge Iran or North Korea without a draft.
Rangel said he'll propose the measure early next year. The Korean War veteran has unsuccessfully sponsored similar legislation before.
Republican Sen. Lindsey Graham also appeared on the show. He said he thinks the military is doing fine with an all-voluntary service. And if it's not doing the job, Graham said the government will "look for some other option."
Polls have repeatedly shown that about seven out of ten Americans oppose a draft. And officials don't think it will ever return.
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Didn't we keep hearing it was Bush and the Republicans who wanted the draft? Guess not.
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05:53 PM
PFF
System Bot
sostock Member
Posts: 5907 From: Grain Valley, MO Registered: May 2005
I'd be curious to know as well. I think I'm at the max age where I can voluntarily go into the service (35).
I'm 40. I'd serve again if I thought the cause was just, but I don't think they'd take me now anyway (foot and ankle problems, weight and back problems Getting old bites - I wear glasses now, me glasses!!!). I heard the max age for enlistment now is 38. Anyone know for sure?
[This message has been edited by tutnkmn (edited 11-19-2006).]
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07:24 PM
84fiero123 Member
Posts: 29950 From: farmington, maine usa Registered: Oct 2004
from what i can tell its 18-26. the new draft will pull everyone registered between 18-26. all males, reguardless of college, marital, fatherhood status. congressmen, elected officials are exempt, imagine that...
with my feet i'm not worried.
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07:47 PM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
IIRC, you can join up until you're 40. It was extended to get more recruits.
A draft, if passed, will start pulling from the 18-26 year old group first. First you get classified:
1-A - available immediately for military service. 1-O Conscientious Objector- conscientiously opposed to both types (combatant and non-combatant) of military training and service - fulfills his service obligation as a civilian alternative service worker. 1-A-O Conscientious Objector - conscientiously opposed to training and military service requiring the use of arms - fulfills his service obligation in a noncombatant position within the military. 2-D Ministerial Students - deferred from military service. 3-A Hardship Deferment - deferred from military service because service would cause hardship upon his family. 4-C Alien or Dual National - sometimes exempt from military service. 4-D Ministers of Religion - exempted from military service.
Then, you're activated based on age by lottery:
A lottery based on birthdays determines the order in which registered men are called up by Selective Service. The first to be called, in a sequence determined by the lottery, will be men whose 20th birthday falls during that year, followed, if needed, by those aged 21, 22, 23, 24 and 25. 18-year-olds and those turning 19 would probably not be drafted.
If you are mentally able to drive, you are able to serve your country. Come off the chicken S--- excuses. .
i think that's a rather unfair statement. if he really has brain damage/and/or was on psychotropics he's probably schizophrenic. not making excuses but that's not the kind of person i'd like to have next to me in the middle of a gun fight.
lets not get too excited, nothing has happened yet.
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08:31 PM
never2old Member
Posts: 1854 From: Wyoming, Michigan USA Registered: Dec 2005
I guess my point is: Why is it not an honor to serve? I went in after I got out of high school, was "lucky" enough to have entered and exited between Korea and Viet Nam. But we had several close calls with Russia at that time. You meet great people in the service, some friends for life. I'm not in favor with what is happening now, but I guess someone has to volunteer or where would this country be? Meant no ill will to the gentleman, just it seems that everyone who doesn't want to serve seems to come up with an excuse.
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08:40 PM
madcurl Member
Posts: 21401 From: In a Van down by the Kern River Registered: Jul 2003
::cough cough:: guess i should refrain from posting at will..... . . paragraph im not actually going to post here . . soooooo im gonna just try not posting freely anymore so i dont look more of a fool?
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08:52 PM
never2old Member
Posts: 1854 From: Wyoming, Michigan USA Registered: Dec 2005
::cough cough:: guess i should refrain from posting at will..... . . paragraph im not actually going to post here . . soooooo im gonna just try not posting freely anymore so i dont look more of a fool?
lol its all part of the forum, post your thoughts/opinions there will always be people who think differently than you.
------------------ www.fierodomain.com Your guide to the Online Fiero Community, always under construction
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08:58 PM
aceman Member
Posts: 4899 From: Brooklyn Center, MN Registered: Feb 2003
The country has spoken! They want the Democrats in charge of things. This is what the majority wanted. Democrats have shown they're outstanding in war management (JFK/FDR) Throw more troops that the cause! Yes, yes, that was effective in Vietnam. Careful what you ask for people, you might just get everything you wanted and then some.
<----------Thankfully can retire from the Army in less than 3 years!!!!!
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09:20 PM
sostock Member
Posts: 5907 From: Grain Valley, MO Registered: May 2005
yes everybody is entitled to their opinion. that's the great thing about PFF. if everybody thought the same way there wouldn't be much to talk about?
mental illness is just as serious as cancer, MS, or a physical handicap.i just don't like people making light of a mental disease.
on the other hand, if my country was attacked by a legitimate country (not osama been hidding) i would have no problem joining the armed svcs. i almost joined the army in the late 90's because i had no money and was trying to get through college. they wanted two yrs active then i could come back and finish my schooling. i only had 2 yrs left so the trade off wasn't worth it to me. so i get to pay the us dept of ed a nice chunk of money every month.
i shoud add, i have a real "authority" problem. i don't like anyone telling what to do. well unless you are handing me some money.
In my case if the draft were reinstated I would go willingly, albeit nervously, and be proud to be part of America's Armed forces. I regret that I have not joined already, but I lack the determination/motivation or whatever it is to actually go sign up. The way I've chosen after high school resulted in having a girlfriend living with me and relying on both my financial and emotional support. I'm not sure I could go and deliberately leave that, but if I was asked I would do so, and would gladly go into active duty.
I know I would have second thoughts in the field with regard to our government and people who placed me there, but at that point they would no longer be my concern. I imagine it would be a great thing to serve with fellow Americans and know we are all watching out for each other.
The question now is if its really necessary, is the war going worse than we are being told? Or is this some exercise of power for the Democrats?
------------------ www.fierodomain.com Your guide to the Online Fiero Community, always under construction
[This message has been edited by Xanth (edited 11-19-2006).]
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09:40 PM
Xanth Member
Posts: 6886 From: Massachusetts Registered: May 2006
I just read more about this guy's idea on AOL, its actually pretty interesting:
quote
Rep. Charles Rangel, D-N.Y., said Sunday he sees his idea as a way to deter politicians from launching wars.
"There's no question in my mind that this president and this administration would never have invaded Iraq, especially on the flimsy evidence that was presented to the Congress, if indeed we had a draft and members of Congress and the administration thought that their kids from their communities would be placed in harm's way," Rangel said.
Proposing to reinstate the Draft as a deterrent to starting wars seems like a unique idea. I would in fact suggest that the current opposition to the idea backs up his claim that it would work.
------------------ www.fierodomain.com Your guide to the Online Fiero Community, always under construction
[This message has been edited by Xanth (edited 11-19-2006).]
Yes, but ammo against who? She's been protesting Bush, and the draft initiative is being sponsored by Democrats.
I read in another article about the draft that 7 out of 10 people oppose it.
Just making a note... not Democrats... A single Democrat.
I do like the way Israel does it to a point. They have to have a standing military and everyone serves. Every Israeli citizen knows how to pick up a weapon and use it. Only issue I've heard is complaints that due to the continuous turnover, not as many decide to stay in the military and the elite aren't really that elite when it comes to infantry.
I oppose a draft, I did my bit against registration when I was young. Not against the military, I volunteered... against registration and the draft. One thing that some might argue... if you have a tool your going to use it. We sure use the hell out of ours, abuse might be a better word.
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10:38 PM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
Just making a note... not Democrats... A single Democrat.
True, but I doubt the distinction would be made with Republicans either, point being without the support of their own party the bill is doomed to fail. But yes, 1 person is introducing the bill, and he's a Democrat.
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10:54 PM
PFF
System Bot
Scott-Wa Member
Posts: 5392 From: Tacoma, WA, USA Registered: Mar 2002
It will be interesting to see if he gets co sponsors. I have a feeling that's going to be almost as tough as getting it any further than he did under the republican congress.
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11:14 PM
84fierotrevor Member
Posts: 4998 From: puyallup washington Registered: Oct 2001
Ok, serious question. I am working on getting into the marines. I have a recruiter I talk with. when I was young I didn't get my highschool diploma, I am working on getting it now. If they reinstate the draft, will I be drafted into the military branch I don't want to be in? I want to join the marines, and have 031100 infintary as my mos. if the draft happends. and I havn't already made it into the marines bye then. where are they gonna stick me? just where they want me in whatever branch they need me in? how long of a timeline do I have with this draft thing? I need to speed **** up get my **** together and get in before its to late!
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11:24 PM
Nov 20th, 2006
AusFiero Member
Posts: 11513 From: Dapto NSW Australia Registered: Feb 2001
Ok, serious question. I am working on getting into the marines. I have a recruiter I talk with. when I was young I didn't get my highschool diploma, I am working on getting it now. If they reinstate the draft, will I be drafted into the military branch I don't want to be in? I want to join the marines, and have 031100 infintary as my mos. if the draft happends. and I havn't already made it into the marines bye then. where are they gonna stick me? just where they want me in whatever branch they need me in? how long of a timeline do I have with this draft thing? I need to speed **** up get my **** together and get in before its to late!
I have a feeling if you were drafted and you requested the Marines you would get it. Normally they just stick people in the Army, but the Marines are "first responders" of the military and few people drafted actually WANT to go to the Marines. They would be happy to have you volunteer I think. It's not that the Marines are a "lesser" organization that people don't want in, they are tougher (my opinion) than the Army and take more risks being the "first on the beach." Not to offend any Army folks, the Army is tough too but the Marines have traditionally been looked upon as the "elite" in many Military circles.
When I was a young Airman we had a lot of fights at our Airmen's Club. The Marines were the toughest SOBs in the bar!
All our military branches are tops.
George Adams former SSgt USAF, 1st Gulf War veteran 1991
BTW: There is no such thing as a "former" Marine. Even retired or out of service they still call themselves Marines! Semper Fi!
[This message has been edited by tutnkmn (edited 11-20-2006).]
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08:44 AM
Wolfhound Member
Posts: 5317 From: Opelika , Alabama, USA Registered: Oct 1999
If you were drafted in the 60,s you were offered the opportunity to enlist at induction. Choice was limited to the Army and Marines. You were told that if you enlisted there was less chance that you would be infantry.
That wasn't true but many grabbed at the straw. In Vietnam they were some of the maddest troops there.
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08:55 AM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
Originally posted by tutnkmn: BTW: There is no such thing as a "former" Marine. Even retired or out of service they still call themselves Marines! Semper Fi!
Yeah. I heard a Marine explain that once you're a Marine, it's forever. You're a Marine until the day you die. After that, you're a dead Marine.
What i find funny is that the dems spent all this time decrying the war and the military, but the moment they get in power they start talking about the draft.
Geesh, damned hyprocrits. ( i think both parties are nuts before you label me )
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09:43 AM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001