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Scientology... what a load... by MDFierolvr
Started on: 07-12-2006 12:14 PM
Replies: 35
Last post by: under8ted on 07-13-2006 06:37 PM
MDFierolvr
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Report this Post07-12-2006 12:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MDFierolvrClick Here to Email MDFierolvrSend a Private Message to MDFierolvrDirect Link to This Post
So I have been researching scientology. Mainly because I have been hearing all these stories about how absolutely retarded it is. And frankly I had my doubts. No one could really be so stupid as to believe in xenu and rocket propelled DC-8* size aircraft and other such things. But its true. From what I can tell. And amazingly... if you want to learn how retarded it really is, watch the southpark episode on it. They hit the nail on the head. Watch it HERE. Its southpark so it may be NWS.

So I figure I want to see other peoples take on this new found "religion" do any of you have any kind of logical arguement as to why it is indeed a religion and not a huge scam? all thoughts and opinions appreciated.

EDIT: its DC-8 not DC-10... I was in the ballpark though...

[This message has been edited by MDFierolvr (edited 07-12-2006).]

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Report this Post07-12-2006 12:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TintonSend a Private Message to TintonDirect Link to This Post
Well....I've never really liked organized religion at all, but that's for another thread. Scientology is just so far beyond everything else though, I don't see how ANYONE could believe in that kind of stuff. Just goes to show that humankind will believe ANYTHING. I don't know much about scientology but IIRC they believe that some aliens came here to earth and died in a volcano or something, and now their souls are causing us problems today? .
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Report this Post07-12-2006 12:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BobadooFunkClick Here to visit BobadooFunk's HomePageClick Here to Email BobadooFunkSend a Private Message to BobadooFunkDirect Link to This Post
c-u-l-t

led by Tom Cruise.
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Formula88
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Report this Post07-12-2006 12:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Formula88Send a Private Message to Formula88Direct Link to This Post
Nah, John Travolta was a member before Tom Cruise. It's L. Ron's baby.
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NEPTUNE
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Report this Post07-12-2006 01:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for NEPTUNESend a Private Message to NEPTUNEDirect Link to This Post
Some people will believe ANYTHING:
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FieroRumor
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Report this Post07-12-2006 01:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroRumorClick Here to visit FieroRumor's HomePageClick Here to Email FieroRumorSend a Private Message to FieroRumorDirect Link to This Post
Yes, It physically hurts me sometimes, when people reveal their beliefs to me. I REALLY wish they would refrain from doing so. Believe what you want, but don't embarasses yourself by telling me about your imaginary friends.
Besides...

I happen to believe in the "One" "True" Faith:



Praise "Bob"!



Scientology is a scary thing, from what I have read about it. I DID enjoy reading Dianetics, though... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dianetics

[This message has been edited by FieroRumor (edited 07-12-2006).]

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Boondawg
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Report this Post07-12-2006 03:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BoondawgClick Here to Email BoondawgSend a Private Message to BoondawgDirect Link to This Post
Don't even get me started.

I spent a WEEK reading everything I could get my eyes on, both for and against Scientology.
As I spent the time to dig deeper, I found some things that disturbed me greatly.

Things to check out:

The guy who started it all.
What it's about.
How much it costs to become a better and better Scientologist.
Exact similarities in cult brainwashing & alienation of friends & family.
Keeping their "Bible" secret to all those who don't pay MILLIONS to read it.
Secrets about the religion you, as a member, must PAY for BEFORE you can find out about them.
The "Secret Police" of Scientology and there main target, The Media.
Lawsuits againest those who speak out against them.
The large amount of suspicious deaths of members who quit the religion.
Scientology-owned NARCONON, and it's contracts with prisons.
The number of businessís owned by Scientology that you may use everyday. (not just members, but OWNED, a subsidiary OF)

And much, much, more.
It will take you awhile, but if you want to find out, you can.

Their Site:
http://www.scientology.org/

The Anti-site:
http://www.xenu.net/
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ryan.hess
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Report this Post07-12-2006 03:33 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ryan.hessClick Here to Email ryan.hessSend a Private Message to ryan.hessDirect Link to This Post
Starting a religion is the greatest get rich quick scheme ever.
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Boondawg
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Report this Post07-12-2006 03:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BoondawgClick Here to Email BoondawgSend a Private Message to BoondawgDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ryan.hess:

Starting a religion is the greatest get rich quick scheme ever.


Even BETTER, if you're a science fiction writer!
Just ask L. Ron.
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squisher86SE
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Report this Post07-12-2006 03:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for squisher86SESend a Private Message to squisher86SEDirect Link to This Post
Wasn't Mr. Hubbard high on narcotics while he was writing this stuff?

I found their "secret" documents somewhere and read through them, and it does read like an outline for a crappy Sci-Fi novel. Most likely people are shamed into staying with it, because they've "donated" however much money and don't want to look like an idiot for finding out it was completely worthless. Nevermind the fact that they look all the dumber for staying with it.
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Report this Post07-12-2006 04:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PyrthianClick Here to Email PyrthianSend a Private Message to PyrthianDirect Link to This Post
just like every other "religion", its just made up by some guy who wants your money.

everyone already knows right from wrong
greed & jealousy just drive people over the edge
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Report this Post07-12-2006 05:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JohnnyKClick Here to Email JohnnyKSend a Private Message to JohnnyKDirect Link to This Post
Meh, one fictitious character is as stupid as another.
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Report this Post07-12-2006 05:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for VonovClick Here to Email VonovSend a Private Message to VonovDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ryan.hess:

Starting a religion is the greatest get rich quick scheme ever.


"Never tell anyone the gods don't exist; it's too useful in the gentle art of bilking fools..."
---From the novel "Goat Song," by Frank Yerby
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Report this Post07-12-2006 06:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BoondawgClick Here to Email BoondawgSend a Private Message to BoondawgDirect Link to This Post
"A man is a god in ruins. When men are innocent, life shall be longer, and shall pass into the immortal, as gently as we awake from dreams."
~Ralph Waldo Emerson~
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frontal lobe
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Report this Post07-12-2006 06:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for frontal lobeClick Here to Email frontal lobeSend a Private Message to frontal lobeDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by JohnnyK:

Meh, one fictitious character is as stupid as another.


Depends on how you look at it, really. Example.

I believe that other religious people AS PORTRAYED are fictitious except Jesus (well, and even then, just as He is portrayed literally in the Bible, because the Jesus as portrayed by many "religions" is also a fictitious person in my mind).

But some are more harmful to individuals, families, and societies.

The David Koresh Jesus--harmful.
The Jones Jesus-harmful.
The Mohammed portrayed by some muslims-harmful.

The Mormon Jesus-not harmful as far as I can tell. Seem like pretty nice neighbors and families, even though they believe in and worship what I consider a fictitious version of Jesus.

The L.Ron Hubbard aliens, etc., seems to be harmful.

Basically, any "religion" that doesn't "lay all its cards on the table" up front, to me, is a harmful one. So if you have secret levels, and secret information and writings, that is a red flag. If it tries to isolate you from your "non-believing" family members--harmful and dangerous. If advancement is based on money given--harmful and dangerous. If you are punished for leaving-harmful and dangerous.
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Report this Post07-12-2006 06:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ryan.hessClick Here to Email ryan.hessSend a Private Message to ryan.hessDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by frontal lobe:
So if you have secret levels, and secret information and writings, that is a red flag.


I think that is a staple of all religions. I don't know of any that DON'T have secret writings only available to the upper levels...

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Report this Post07-12-2006 06:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MrPBodyClick Here to visit MrPBody's HomePageClick Here to Email MrPBodySend a Private Message to MrPBodyDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ryan.hess:

Starting a religion is the greatest get rich quick scheme ever.

Something I read years ago, don't know the primary source for, and can't prove (but I'll throw it in anyhow):

Allegedly, at a science fiction convention some time in the 1930's (?), L. Ron Hubbard gave a speech in which he commented that the best way to get rich without paying taxes is to start your own religion. Not long afterward, he founded Scientology.

Draw your own conclusions.
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Report this Post07-12-2006 07:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for NEPTUNESend a Private Message to NEPTUNEDirect Link to This Post
You MAY be in a cult if:
You vigorously deny the existence of thousands of gods claimed by other religions, but feel outraged when someone denies the existence of yours.
You laugh at polythiests, but have no problem believing in a Triune God.
You turn purple with anger when you hear of the "atrocities" attributed to Allah, but have no problem when you hear about how God/Jehova slaughtered all the babies of Egypt in Exodus and ordered the elimination of entire ethnic groups in Joshua including women, children, and even trees!
You believe that the entire population of this planet with the exception of those who share your beliefs(excluding those of all rival sects) will spend eternity in an infinite Hell of suffering. And still consider YOUR religion the most tolerant and loving of them all.
Although modern science, history, geology, biology and physics have failed to convince you otherwise, some idiot rolling around on the floor "speaking in tongues" is all the evidence you need to "prove" your religion.
I could go on all night, but I know that I will never change anyones mind.
Until, that is, you see me handle the Holy Jesus Snakes in church this Sunday!
Scientology is no more illogical or strange than any other cult, IMO.

[This message has been edited by NEPTUNE (edited 07-12-2006).]

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under8ted
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Report this Post07-12-2006 07:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for under8tedClick Here to Email under8tedSend a Private Message to under8tedDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by frontal lobe:


The Mormon Jesus-not harmful as far as I can tell. Seem like pretty nice neighbors and families, even though they believe in and worship what I consider a fictitious version of Jesus.



I gues you just havent deal with enough of thier incessant condescending sniveling, while looking at them thru bleary eyes and a monster hangover--just wanting to grab the nearest one by the neck and scream in his face "shut the FREAK up and get the HELL off my porch and QUIT FREAKEN BOTHERING ME every saturday morning"

They are EXTREMELY harmfull--especially to a good mornings recuperation sleep.

Ah, the joys of city living that I dont miss.

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motoracer838
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Report this Post07-12-2006 07:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for motoracer838Click Here to Email motoracer838Send a Private Message to motoracer838Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ryan.hess:

Starting a religion is the greatest get rich quick scheme ever.


That explains why I'm not rich, and probably never will be!!!

On topic, My First GF Had me go to a meeting with her. Even at the age the age of twenty I could see it for the scam that it was, and told her that she could leave with me or find another way home( this meeting was about 45 miles away ) I drove home alone and that was the end of that relationship.

Cheers Beers n Gearz. Joe

[This message has been edited by motoracer838 (edited 07-12-2006).]

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Report this Post07-12-2006 09:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TKSend a Private Message to TKDirect Link to This Post
I have a friend that was in Scientology for several years (he bailed finally). One thing he said struck me in an odd way:

He compared Scientology with psychiatry with the only difference being that Scientology isn't bound by any patient-doctor confidentiality. You start just talking (which is good) and slowly work towards understanding what your issues are. Unfortunately this includes discussing/confessing various things (might even be *sins*) about your life. What they do with that information is where the trouble starts. They are bound by nothing.

Of course we have to ignore their version of the cause of your problem (alien souls).

You know, it's just not doing it for me...

The another friend was in the Moonie's for two years......
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Report this Post07-12-2006 09:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for whadeduckClick Here to Email whadeduckSend a Private Message to whadeduckDirect Link to This Post
It ends in "ology." How can it be a religion? lol Psych-ology, bi-ology, endocrin-ology. They're not religions, they're bases of study. Wouldn't it seem logical then that scient-ology is more or less the study of science? Just a thought. I can't think of another religion that uses "ology" as an ending. Am I missing one? Not including cults.

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Report this Post07-12-2006 09:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ryan.hessClick Here to Email ryan.hessSend a Private Message to ryan.hessDirect Link to This Post
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Report this Post07-13-2006 09:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for rogergarrisonClick Here to Email rogergarrisonSend a Private Message to rogergarrisonDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ryan.hess:

Starting a religion is the greatest get rich quick scheme ever.


And to make even more money.....its totally tax deductable........(well except for the $50 @ week salary you will claim)

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Report this Post07-13-2006 10:31 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroRumorClick Here to visit FieroRumor's HomePageClick Here to Email FieroRumorSend a Private Message to FieroRumorDirect Link to This Post
If there IS/Are a God(s) up there, he/she/it/them is one twisted Diety if they let their followers suffer so much because of some "Plan" that they can't understand. You can bow down and thank this super powerful being, but When I stand before, him/her/it/them, I will lay down the nastiest pile of feces as my sacred offering, and smile as I am hurtled into the depths of the pit of fire. It seems God wasn't hugged enough as a Godling....? He had to create an entire universe and populate it with beings that look like him, yet were too dumb to know about his "Big Plans?" Pretty twisted. Or maybe not...I suppose it depends on his "Plan"

Not that most of the other religions are that much better.
*shrugs*

ok, on some level, I'm a bit jealous of those that have faith in a religion.

I don't feel "holier then thou" because I believe that religions are just extensive fairy tales. I feel like crap, because the alternative is NOTHING, and that's kinda sad when you exist in a world that is filled with happy religious people hanging out. I DO enjoy spiritual ceremonies, just not a fan of the structured religion stuff...
I may feel like crap occasionally, but that's not enough for me to join up to some religion and just turn my intellect off.

Is there something "higher" then us...? Maybe. I think we're all part of one big system, and that's about it. If God should ever choose to reveal himself to me, and let me in on his little "plan" that woiuld be just swell too.

I don't need a Religion to tell me how to live a good life. But it doesn't hurt to read up on them, many of them have great stories and "rules" to live by which aren't too horrific.
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Report this Post07-13-2006 11:17 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ryan.hessClick Here to Email ryan.hessSend a Private Message to ryan.hessDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by FieroRumor:
If there IS/Are a God(s) up there, he/she/it/them is one twisted Diety if they let their followers suffer so much because of some "Plan" that they can't understand. You can bow down and thank this super powerful being, but When I stand before, him/her/it/them, I will lay down the nastiest pile of feces as my sacred offering, and smile as I am hurtled into the depths of the pit of fire.


Just remember... God is f***** in the head. We were made in his image. Draw your own conclusions.
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Slater_334
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Report this Post07-13-2006 11:49 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Slater_334Click Here to Email Slater_334Send a Private Message to Slater_334Direct Link to This Post
Be careful with what you say... you may be come a SP. (suppressive person) Once you become a SP you are put on a list and then the fun begins. They will harass you until you cave in to what they want you to do.

"ENEMY SP Order. Fair game. May be deprived of property or injured by any means by any Scientologist without any discipline of the Scientologist. May be tricked, sued or lied to or destroyed."
- L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 18 October 1967
[SP = Suppressive Person a.k.a. critic of Scientology]

"A truly Suppressive Person or group has no rights of any kind and actions taken against them are not punishable."
- L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 1 March 1965, HCO (Division 1) "Ethics, Suppressive Acts, Suppression of Scientology and Scientologists"

"There is no more ethical group on this planet than ourselves."
- L. Ron Hubbard, KEEPING SCIENTOLOGY WORKING. 7 February 1965, reissued 27 August 1980

"Iím drinking lots of rum and popping pinks and greys."
- L. Ron Hubbard in a 1967 letter to his wife, written during the period when he was creating Scientologyís secret "upper levels." (Bent Corydon and L. Ron Hubbard, Jr. a.k.a. Ronald DeWolf, L. RON HUBBARD: MESSIAH OR MADMAN? Random House 1989)

"Scientology is the only specific (cure) for radiation (atomic bomb) burns."
- L. Ron Hubbard, ALL ABOUT RADIATION, p. 109



We have alot of the cult members in Clearwater. They just about own downtown. We currently have a guy doing a documentary on them, he has been threatened, physically assaulted and so forth. Thatís a nice way for a church to treat its opponents huh?
I know a guy that they convinced to mortgage his house and sell everything he had to take more "classes" and become a better scientologist. His wife divorced him and took the kids. The church would not help him because he was only a 9.

(you are rated on a number scale. I think its 1-30. The higher you get the more they tell you about this scam.)

How many churches make you pay hundreds of thousands of dollars to become a good person?
Scientology was a crazy guys way to get rich. The more people blindly followed him the more ludicrous his claims became. He was in it for the money, he even said he was.
Would you join a religion created by a guy who wrote a book on how to brainwash people? Sounds like a good idea to me.

In germany and france they are not considered a religion, and in germany they are not allowed to be involved in government due to their "intelegence gathering" and thier uncontrollable habit of changing government records to make themselves look better.


slater


Just do some research and the things they do will horrify you.
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FrugalFiero
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Report this Post07-13-2006 01:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FrugalFieroDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by FieroRumor:
You can bow down and thank this super powerful being, but When I stand before, him/her/it/them, I will lay down the nastiest pile of feces as my sacred offering, and smile as I am hurtled into the depths of the pit of fire.


I was sorta thinking taking a crap would be one of those "earthly" things that we won't need to do anymore when we meet our maker....

Tim
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Report this Post07-13-2006 02:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BoondawgClick Here to Email BoondawgSend a Private Message to BoondawgDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Slater_334:


Just do some research and the things they do will horrify you.


Yeah, just research what happens when you do reach the Top Level, called "Sea Org", I think!!!!!

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Report this Post07-13-2006 04:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mysticfire6602Click Here to Email mysticfire6602Send a Private Message to mysticfire6602Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by under8ted:


I gues you just havent deal with enough of thier incessant condescending sniveling, while looking at them thru bleary eyes and a monster hangover--just wanting to grab the nearest one by the neck and scream in his face "shut the FREAK up and get the HELL off my porch and QUIT FREAKEN BOTHERING ME every saturday morning"

They are EXTREMELY harmfull--especially to a good mornings recuperation sleep.

Ah, the joys of city living that I dont miss.


my grandparents are mormon and they are the kindest people you will ever meet...

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Report this Post07-13-2006 04:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroRumorClick Here to visit FieroRumor's HomePageClick Here to Email FieroRumorSend a Private Message to FieroRumorDirect Link to This Post
In all seriousness, perhaps we should stop discussing this here.
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Report this Post07-13-2006 04:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ToddsterClick Here to Email ToddsterSend a Private Message to ToddsterDirect Link to This Post
People forget that L Ron Hubbard wrote Dianetics in the 50's when jets were new and unavailable as a mode of transportation to the masses, everyone was afraid of being nuked by the Ruskies, and Aldous Huxley had the entire country on Mescaline. You can see how zany it looks today but back then, he had quite a following from people eager for something to believe in. Anyone beleiving in it today has no excuse, they are mentally ill.
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Report this Post07-13-2006 05:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BoondawgClick Here to Email BoondawgSend a Private Message to BoondawgDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by FieroRumor:

In all seriousness, perhaps we should stop discussing this here.


Well, it would be nice if at least people woud start their religous comments with, "I feel" or "I think" or "In my opinion".(me included!)
That way, it can be taken as less of a "statement of fact" or attack, and more as a "personal observation"!
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Report this Post07-13-2006 05:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JohnnyKClick Here to Email JohnnyKSend a Private Message to JohnnyKDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by FieroRumor:

He had to create an entire universe and populate it with beings that look like him


Nope. Just earth. Thats why when we find ets that don't look like us, that whole religion thing is out the window, finally.. OR, people can do what they'v ealwasy done and 'reinterpret'..
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litespd
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Report this Post07-13-2006 05:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for litespdSend a Private Message to litespdDirect Link to This Post
No...I don't have Religion checked on my list. So I wonder why this showed up...
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under8ted
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Report this Post07-13-2006 06:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for under8tedClick Here to Email under8tedSend a Private Message to under8tedDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by mysticfire6602:


my grandparents are mormon and they are the kindest people you will ever meet...




They may well be---however, at something-stupid-thirty on a Saturday AM, when I am feeling the effects of a Friday PM.......the only "kind" people are those too far away for me to hear. .

Joking aside, it really dont matter to me WHAT anybody's beliefs are--just dont show up at my door trying to "share". I'm not interested at that place and time, and I may be polite about it once or twice--but sooner or later I get downright pissy about the issue. Same goes for door-to-door solicitations and sales efforts, which I lump into the same catagory as J-W's and Mormans when it comes to the door knocking routine.


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