I need to get some stuff off of my mind/heart before I explode.

I am mad. I am really upset at the way things have been turning out in my life.

Big thing: School & Finances.

Why is it that rich people's kids can get government student loans soooooooo easily?? Yet there are students, like myself, that cannot even AFFORD the schooling that we have worked hard to get, and are denied much needed funding!! Arent WE the ones that should get the govenmental funding? Isnt that the reason why the funding was set up in the first place?

I love school. I am studying to become a teacher, and a darn good one at that. I have been through 3.5 years of College, one semester of University, and I STILL have 3 more years left to finish off my schooling. In total, I will be $40,000 to $50,000 (CDN) in debt. My parents are NOT wealthy. BOTH are in an unhealthy state where they cannot work whatsoever. I am on my own financially. I have NO rich relatives to help me out, and the one person that may have had some money that I could borrow, just died yesterday afternoon. She was my surrogate grandmother (Im in a current state of shock about that too)

I am sad, upset and frustrated at my financial situation, let alone the rest of my life. I normally would not be posting something soooooooo negative and downhearted as this post on here on PFF, but I just felt like I needed to reach out for some moral support from you all. You guys are like my online family--I check PFF more than I do my own email

All kidding aside, I just dont get this crazy world and it's red tape. It frustrates me. I DESERVE my education, yet it looks like I may not be able to finish it at ALL. I cannot work any more hours this summer to make up the $1000 I need for September, for I am already working 40 to 60 hours a week. I havent had a weekend off since June, and I will ONLY be seeing two days off in total in August.

My body and mind needs a rest. In a big way.

Thanks for listening ya'll.
~Heather
ICQ #286225

Did you apply for (it's too late now but you can still do it for the spring semester)for a grant? I just received one for fall and spring. I am going to try and go full-time but I'm a mother and I hold a full-time job so my plate is already full.
There are lots of websites that award grant money. Some even offer scholarships. Try those out.
Good Luck!!!

Student loans are the easiest thing to get in the world. Typically, the less money you make or have, the more student $ you get. I make "so so" money at work, and get fat cash every sem for school. Ive never had to pay a dime for school (Im still in it obviously) because of student loans. When I graduate Ill have to pay it back, sure, but getting loans for school is just crazy easy!
HERES THE KICKER...if you live w/ your parents, forget it! No $ for you!

I am from Canada--Canadian grants are hard to find, even if there are any out there...

I received many Scholarships and Awards in my first two years of schooling, and then from there I have been flying solo. It has been really hard living somewhat beyond my financial means (even though Im a starving student). If I was not in school, I dont think I would ever have hopes of ever leaving my hometown. I NEED to leave soooooo bad, I feel trapped here. No, I *am* trapped here. *sigh*

I could of got a student loan but my feeling is, school costs a lot of money and I don't want to be saddled with a huge debt when I'm done.

[This message has been edited by annieL (edited 08-11-2001).]

O.S.A.P is difficult to get in Ontario for those who actually use it. If you dont mind being a little crooked, definatly tell them that you are living away from parents.

What year did you graduate high school. Once you have been out of highschool for 5 years (regardless of what you have been doing) your student loan becomes much easier to get because you are considered a mature student.

I recently finished 3 years a UofT, and am doing 2 years at Sheridan College, so I know what all the O.S.A.P is about. I am fortunant that my parents have a little bit of money, but they are/were very reluctant to help me with school, and hence I work all summers, and upto 25 hours a week during the school year, which, during Univeristy just kills you.

Check out your Financial Aid office, they typically have Burserys and stuff (they ALWAYS have a general bursery that is actually quite easy to get). You should also consider appealing your O.S.A.P amounts , which is also possible.

Good Luck

my parents dont make much, and all my $ i made this summer went into tuition (which i still owe 1/2) car insurance and rent.
i didnt get a student loan.
im screwed.

hey, i'm in the same boat. i can't seem to get my paychecks to add up. i'm not sure i'll have enough money to go back to school next semester either. i could apply for financial aid, but my mom claimed me as a dependent last year (i'm not, but it helped her out tax wise so i told her to do it) so they won't give me **** for loans/grants because my stepdad makes too much. i have a year and a half left and i'm not sure i'll ever finish. don't worry, you're not alone here. maybe one of us will figure something out and it'll work for everyone. it'll be alright, even if it doesn't seem like it will.

i recieve not a d@mn penny from financial aid cause of my parents income- but i do have 5 grand in scholarships every year, and keeping that money cause i was on deans list every quarter.

[This message has been edited by FieroLisa (edited 08-12-2001).]

“Why is it that rich people's kids can get government student loans soooooooo easily??”

To expound on this; why is it that rich people’s brats get through college once they waltz in? Special favor is given to rich kids in the way of grades. There are protected students. Contrary to what many forum members believe, I’m not a fan of organized education as far as the administration goes. I do, however believe organized education is so much more structured that a person can learn more in less time. However, it can be ‘fast-food,’ as is the case wit ASU.

“Arent WE the ones that should get the govenmental funding? Isnt that the reason why the funding was set up in the first place?”

That’s disenheartening. I thought Canada was all about socialized medicine and socialized education.

“I love school. I am studying to become a teacher, and a darn good one at that.”

What a noble, but thankless job. Oh, and I hate school!

“cause i was on deans list every quarter.”

Why, what did you do wrong?!

My favorite Justice teacher came from Italy as an immigrant. He had a BS and a JD (Juris Doctorate) from Italy when he was given a scholarship to Penn State Law School. He received his JD from there, became an attorney, decided he didn’t like it, and decided to pursue his PHD from ASU. So he’s on a scholarship from there right now, teaching undergraduate students. I’m not trying to rub in the pain here, just telling you that you might have a chance getting a scholarship from a US university and possibly citizenship status as well. The INS would probably not be the place to check, but possibly checking the various statuses with universities in America might be an option. I don’t know the policies of Canadian corporate employers, but American corporate employers often reimburse tuition and books. Most require you to extend your current occupation, as opposed to an unrelated field, but my employer paid for my education even though it was unrelated. Maybe check into some manufacturing jobs there if they pay tuition. Would you like me to check with ASU’s policies and see if they have any paraphernalia about your situation and send it, even if for nothing more than a barometer of the US university system?

I’m really sorry about your loss. I just had to travel to Texas with my girlfriend due to her mom dying. She’s still recovering. Take care kiddo, Ed.

I am in a similar situation as Lisa. I have no chance of getting "free" money. I was very lucky get a loan from Dept of Edu(which I have to and am currently paying back).

My dad had to pay his way through school since his parents couldn't afford it for him. He feels since he had to pay his way, I should too(makes you a man, you get what you earn type of thing), so I don't get free money anywhere. I decided to stop DeVry for the first 2 years of college and take the more general classes at our local community college for $29 per credit hour. I am saving so much this route I am able to pay off my student loan from one semester at DeVry($$$) and still go to school.
Are Canadians allowed to cross to the US and get loans/grants/etc for schooling here? They almost hand money out for school here.

The only problem I had with the grant I got was (don't get me wrong, free college money is nice) I got more for a work study grant than for a pell grant. I don't want to take a part-time job on top of my full-time job and go to school full-time and balance my family life on top of that. I do not have to take the work study grant but, the other grant is only enough for the classes and not enough for the books.

Thanks everyone for your insights to my frustration.

Up here in Ontario, we have a loan system through the government called OSAP (you may have seen it above). Ontario Student Assistance Program (not the Ontario Stereo Acquisition Program like SOME people I know like to call it ). OSAP is rather picky about to whom they lend money to, and exactly how MUCH they give you. For three years, I received OSAP, and each year they would promise me X amount of dollars. But by the time January semester came around, they decided that they had given me too much, and reduced the amount given to me for the balance of the year (so I was ALWAYS left short). Three years of their antics was getting on my nerves.

My fourth year of schooling, OSAP decides to only give me 1/3rd of what I needed to get through school--I was scraping to make up the rest. However, they did not tell me that they were only giving me 1/3rd of the potential amount until late October, HALF WAY through the first semester. To top it off, second semester (when I switched schools because I was done one), OSAP decided that they paid me TOO MUCH, and wanted me to give back $1200 before they would even lend me money again.

I wanted to scream at them: Uhhh duh guys--I kinda NEED money to go to school, how the heck am I supposed to come up with that HUGE amount when I was scraping two pennies together as it was. They just dont make sense.

That situation forced me to move back home, live in a hopeless town with NO vehicle or means of transportation to feed my independence craving. Sadly, for my fifth year of schooling, I am faced with this uphill battle for tuition. I have looked into scholarships and bursaries, but there are not too many for Distance Education students that I would even be eligible for.

NO WAY would I move to the US for schooling either, tis not a viable option--waaaaaaaaay too expensive, and I would not have much luck with a job and stuff, for I would need a green card/visa, and they are expensive as well.

At least I am living at home, with a roof over my head, some sort of food in the cupboards/fridge, and moral support from my parents, right? Someone please tell me that this is a good thing...

GodSend: I finished High School in April of 97. I wont be a "mature" student until next year--which doesnt help for this year!

FieroLisa: You are lucky to get $5000 a year to help ya with school. Keep up the marks, cause it will save you from headaches later. My GPA is about 3.5 to 3.8 each year. For me to get a 4.0 across the board would TOTALLY drive me nuts. I am somewhat of a perfectionist, and if I strove for 4's, I would only end up with 2's probably

Heather, im unfamiliar with Ontario's loan system. But i know in alberta they wont even think about giving a student loan to anyone that is deemed to have money.

Also one of my good friends comes for a not so wealthy family, and he is given money left right and center. Mind you he will have to pay it all back.

This probably wont help out for the fall semester, but talk to your prof's about available grants and scholorships. You would be suprised how many scholorships are unawarded. You should be able to pay for alot of school this way, especially with a 3.5-3.8 GPA

With a little work and lokking in the not so obvious places money for school is easy to get.
Good luck

Ed's right. Preference IS given to certain types of students. Not necessarily the filthy rich, but often so. I've managed to avoid student loans so far, I'd rather swallow the larger interest rate from the bank than deal with the beaurocratic red-tape, and the obscene turnaround times on loans, and to mulligans that the system tosses at you.

Try the Royal Bank. They have a Student Credit line that should be good to 5k. No monthly payments except for the interest, which is 1 point above prime. Not too bad. Also, as much as I hate Royal Bank, they're easier to deal with than Gov't O' Canada.

Ed: School rules. Don't slam on my hangout! Oh, and Canada's just as full of beaurocratic assholes as the US. Don't ever assume that Humanity isn't universal. Only the social functions that govern behavior change. Everything else stays exactly the same. Cultural Relativism!

quote Originally posted by Mach10: Ed's right. Preference IS given to certain types of students. Not necessarily the filthy rich, but often so. Ed: School rules. Don't slam on my hangout! Oh, and Canada's just as full of beaurocratic assholes as the US. Don't ever assume that Humanity isn't universal. Only the social functions that govern behavior change. Everything else stays exactly the same. Cultural Relativism!

Maybe the core of humanity is universal, but the application of it is far different through policy and law. I think (IMHO) that humanity is within a person's, or in this case societies conscience, but the application is skewed through laws directing that application. Best example in the world; capital punishment. The US is the only country in NATO (?) to still have capital punishment. I believe 99% if not all of Europe has done away with capital punishment, yet 38 States still have it. To me it's a reflection, or maybe a by-product of the gross over-capitalization of America. And as the convergence of corporation and government continues to proliferate, it’s only going to exaggerate. (I sound like Jesse Jackson there!)

"Only the social functions that govern behavior change. Everything else stays exactly the same. Cultural Relativism!"

Wow. Great statement, profound. This kind of agrees with me, yes/no? The social functions being laws, or maybe norms?

I'm jealous of what I perceive to be socialism in Canada. Of course no economic/social system is purely one form or another, it's usually a quasi, agreed? But the American version of capitalism sucks. Americans don't realize that capitalism is like one big game of monopoly, where eventually one person ends up with all the cash and property. The most obvious example of this is Bill Gates/Microsoft. Some forms of this are present with actions like the government allowing the merger of McDonnell Douglas and Boeing, which was really a take-over by Boeing. If not, explain why the DC-9 is now called the Boeing 717? As well as other indicators.

Anyway, we all laughed when communism fell in Russia and feel we are impervious. I believe our economic system is next to fall, but fortunately our economic system is not tied as heavily with our social system as Russia’s was to theirs. I like socialized medicine, especially if we compare it to HMO's. This way (HMO) the government washes their hands and says, 'litigate,' while they throw damage ceilings on the awards.

Maybe the rate of bureaucratic assholes is the same as yours, but I think we have bragging rights to sheer number based solely on population . What is the population of Canada anyway? All I know is that in 1980 I went from Detroit, across the bridge to (?) city and thought I passed from hell to heaven. Is it still that pristine? I’ve also been to Vancouver B.C. when I was kid. To me that's socialism at it's finest. You have a hard time finding a candy bar rapper on the ground. People in America convolute and combine socialism and communism. So when someone like me alludes to the benefits of socialism with an American crowd, I get hammered.

Good for you, you like school! What's your major? I'm guessing something in the social sciences with your apparent excellent understanding of social systems. What occupation do you wish to practice when you graduate? Take care, Ed.

Anthropology's my major.

Cultural relativism was a concept that underneath all the customs, laws, world views, religions, and loin cloths, that all people were the same. This of course turned out to be total BS. The statement was sort of ironic.
There are a bunch of things that pop up frequently, but not universally. These are most likely social traits based on physical conditioning. It's generally bad to kill each other for no reason, 'cos there won't be us left. Even that is stretched, however. Infanticide and cannibalism is still around, and people love going to war. There are only 2 things that pop up almost always. Firstly, is the fact that there has NEVER been a society which is completely matriarchal. For some reason, Women are never in complete power. I might be doing some work on this in my later years. War would be the other thing closest to a constant. There are exceptions, though. Some societies do not do the violence things, or at least frown heavily upon it, like the !Kung of the African Sahara (have to check locations. Oh, and "!" is a tongue-click.). Conversly, people like the Yanomamo in S.Am. revel in it.
So, having stemmed from a concept, Anthropologists are still trying to find constants. Helps us understand each other better. By comparing and contrasting cultures, you can find roots, explain rituals, and learn languages. It's now a process, rather than a concept.

Hang in there. I finished the last 60% of my 4 year program from 95-99. Went I did the first part 82-85 (when my folks were paying) my priorities were off and 10 years later I finally got a clue. I spent 4 years paycheck to paycheck, living in a $400/mo apartment (= dump), no extras, a sh1tbox car with no a/c or heat. Over the years I had to take a couple quarters off due to no money. but I finally finished May 99 with no student loans to pay back. It has been well worth the effort and I have seen full payback of my time and money investment. It's been really cool to wear work clothes that don't have my name on them. It's been two years now and I am still trying to figure out what to do with "days off" and "holidays"

What are you taking in school?
What school?

I can sympathise with being burnt out. I have spent the last 18 months straight going to school , I graduate in a few weeks and have decided to take 4 months off before I go to Michigan for school.

As for the tuition.. You can appeal OSAP , i personally have never gotten OSAP , but I know quite a few people who have appealed. I think a major problem that you will face is Living at home , they will give you a lot less money. You can plead with them to get more money.

JM

quote Originally posted by Mach10: Anthropology's my major.

What a cool major, and difficult. You probably had to take a lot of math and A&P. If I could do it again, I would major in anthropology or political science.

“Cultural relativism was a concept that underneath all the customs, laws, world views, religions, and loin cloths, that all people were the same. This of course turned out to be total BS. ”

Sounds like a platform for David Duke!

“Firstly, is the fact that there has NEVER been a society which is completely matriarchal. For some reason, Women are never in complete power. I might be doing some work on this in my later years.”

That’s easy to believe. Have there been societies that are completely patriarchal? I imagine there have been and probably still are: India Arabic nations, and China to name a few.

“War would be the other thing closest to a constant.”

Could war, and all it’s contributing attributes be a component of natural selection, bastardized by a species (us) that has the ability to reason? Interesting thoughts, facts, and statements, thanks for turning them on to me.

Ed - I think the 4 year measure is for people that don't transfer to the School of Hard Knocks for a while

The good things about clothes with your name on them:

- They all match and there's zero decision making when you get dressed in the AM. You just pick one and put it on.
- The "dry cleaner" truck comes by the "office" same day every week. No need to worry over lost claim checks.
- If you spill something and ruin the outfit, the replacement is automatic and free.
- If you forget who you are just look at the label over your shirt pocket. Works great unless you borrowed someone else's shirt

don't know anything about canada, but is there a national guard or something similar? i joined when i didn't have anything else going on in my life and it's worked out ok. here you get tuition assistance as part of the g.i. bill. don't know if this will do you any good though.

quote Originally posted by My7Fieros: HERES THE KICKER...if you live w/ your parents, forget it! No $ for you!

Not always true. I lived with my mother for the first few years that I was in college and I got tons of stuff.

Are there any scholarships that you can apply for? I have a lot of loans. I will have to pay them back, but it's the only way I can do it right now. I also have work-study (another thing to look into). And some Financial Aid, grants, etc. There are tons of stuff to help if you know where to look. Try work-study and loans. Right now I don't pay anything. In fact, the university actually pays me a refund of what's left over.

------------------
Jaime
AOL IM: Jaygee79
ICQ: 85931334
Jaygee79's Web Page

The problem for Fiero heather is, she may live at home, but her parents have a combined income of LESS than 0. with one parent in and out of the hospital, and another who runs a business that makes nothing it's not fair.

How old are you Heather? I know I couldn't get financial aid in the US while I was living with my parents because of their income, but if you file as living on your own, or if you're over 24 (I think that's the age) you automatically file on your income alone - so you can get more money. Check it out. You may be better off financially living on your own, even with rent, than living with your parents. Or, if you have a friend that will let you "virtually room" with them, so you are out on your own.

There's gotta be a way!

Thanks everyone for your thoughts and helpful hints towards my situation. It is *muchly* appreciated

I am 24, intelligent, stuck in a dead end town with no means of personal transportation, and have a less fortunate family situation financially. I have *always* worked hard for what I have been given/achieved, and I have a good head on my shoulders (or so Ive been told).

Unfortunately, this past semester and summer I have hit a HUGE patch of BAD circumstances. Somehow, coming up with my tuition payment has been near the bottom of the list (believe it or not).

I *do* have something to look forward to though, I am taking four really neat courses this coming semester:

Intro to Geography (GEOG 101--still havent taken it!)
Some Environmental Studies course (cant remember which one)
Jewish Cultural Studies (Im not Jewish however) and
History of Modern Europe

I will have to be spending a LOT of time away from home while I study, for living in a two-story house with 5 people and a baby is nuts!

And no, Im not going to join the Army to have them pay for my schooling!! A work-study program wont work either, for Im a Distance Education student right now (which is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO stinkin hard!!) I'd rather be in CLASS than have to learn on my own!!

quote Originally posted by thomas_l: Ed - I think the 4 year measure is for people that don't transfer to the School of Hard Knocks for a while The good things about clothes with your name on them: - They all match and there's zero decision making when you get dressed in the AM. You just pick one and put it on. - The "dry cleaner" truck comes by the "office" same day every week. No need to worry over lost claim checks. - If you spill something and ruin the outfit, the replacement is automatic and free. - If you forget who you are just look at the label over your shirt pocket. Works great unless you borrowed someone else's shirt

No, even if you stick with it all the way, don't drop any classes, and don't take any extra classes you'll spend a minimum of 5 years, unless you don't have to work and attend 7 classes per semester. 12 credits is considered fulltime. If you take that times 2 per year, that's 96 in four years. Of course you need 120 to graduate. If someone were to go to Embry Riddle, WIU, or some other offshoot of a school they could do it in 4 years and $60,000. When they were done they would have a limited, focused degree that was non-transferable. The conventional route takes most people over 5 years, even if they stick at it. I'm going to take a year off and LSAT in 13 months, and then apply to law schools. I need a break.

To add to the list:
-If you want to get someone in trouble, put another shirt on, and tell the boss to FO. Then go change back. Hint to operator; don't do this in small companies.

Just an update ya'll:

The red tape is *still* going on with my financial aid office, the bank, and the government loan office. I wont get an answer for another week or two! (It has already been a week). I really really dislike being strung along--just tell me, am I getting the loan or not! *Sheesh*

I am getting some information sent to me by my University about scholarships for the upcoming term. I am excited about that

That's all for now!