quote Originally posted by Pete Matos: Dear Lord, if you are listening.... I know it is not important really....but if you could find time to make available a tranny that can take the power of a boosted 3800 engine and actually put the power to the ground without breaking everything inside it I would be eternally grateful.... Amen.... Forgive me lord I am just kidding..... I think. peace Pete

Stop asking God and ask an engineer. It only takes money. Given the choice between the two I would pick the Fiero every time. But thats my choice, I do it for my own reasons and could care less what a bunch of guys driving a girls car think.

Jake,
Okay man....so do you know any engineers that want to work on a 20 plus year old discontinued car that uses a retrofitted engine simply to run quarter mile times in the nines? ANYTHING is possible and as I already said you don't have to sell me on the Fiero, I LOVE mine but thus far it has not been done even by those who have the means to do it. Incidentally what right now is the BEST option for a five or four speed MANUAL tranny for a fiero 3800sc swap? Anyone? My perfect car is a built turbo 3800 sc motor with a stickshift because I think manuals are boring to drive. But that is what I think is the perfect fiero... peace

Pete

awww man.now i have to read this thread....i tried to not look. but........
i saw a red SuperCharged one (labeled on the side) at the food store today. looked real sharp.
now i got to keep an eye out for a runner i was in my Jeep instead of my Mera.....damn

i see wiki says the 1988 US version could come S.C. 145 hp....140 torques hummmmmm
i would like one. P-I-N-K-S!!!!!


off to read, later..

Daniel-
Mera X

[This message has been edited by batousai666 (edited 04-21-2011).]

quote Originally posted by Pete Matos: Jake, Okay man....so do you know any engineers that want to work on a 20 plus year old discontinued car that uses a retrofitted engine simply to run quarter mile times in the nines? ANYTHING is possible and as I already said you don't have to sell me on the Fiero, I LOVE mine but thus far it has not been done even by those who have the means to do it. Incidentally what right now is the BEST option for a five or four speed MANUAL tranny for a fiero 3800sc swap? Anyone? My perfect car is a built turbo 3800 sc motor with a stickshift because I think manuals are boring to drive. But that is what I think is the perfect fiero... peace Pete

I don't have the money and if I did it would go into some old Dodge It sucks thats why I just enjoy my car and don't worry about it. Plus cool beats fast any day.

I'm right with ya there. This little car always garners stares and questions wherever I go in it. However Cool and Fast reigns supreme.... You got some pretty quick fieros with the V8 I am sure too... peace

Pete

But the engineers already have that kind of transmission, its called the 4t65e. With better internals it is what they use in the 6 second cobalts behind 1200 (iirc) hp ecotecs.

That is fine......for an automatic....but isn't that the same tranny, with the better internals, that Fierox has managed to munch more than once? Perhaps I am mistaken here. If someone could make a tranny that could hold back an honest to goodness 1200HP as you say there would be a WHOLE BUNCH of fiero's in the nine second range by now I think. From everything I am reading about this motor here. Making big power is just academics. Getting it to the ground without tearing out trannies and shredding axles is quite another story.... Peace

Pete

[This message has been edited by Pete Matos (edited 04-21-2011).]

the high power ecotecs are running through SUPER high dollar built transaxles. FieroX was using stuff that mere mortals can manage. Also, last I heard, it was axles he was shredding, and he had gotten custom axles made but hadn't had a chance to run them yet.

Also, Automatics are better for super fast drag cars, manuals are more fun for driving.

quote Originally posted by TommyRocker: the high power ecotecs are running through SUPER high dollar built transaxles. FieroX was using stuff that mere mortals can manage. Also, last I heard, it was axles he was shredding, and he had gotten custom axles made but hadn't had a chance to run them yet. Also, Automatics are better for super fast drag cars, manuals are more fun for driving.

Your right, they aren't cheap. But I figure that isn't just a regular old off the shelf automatic in those MR2's. I would like to see what he can do with better axles, maybe push the envelope a bit more.

Anybody wondering where I got my info on the tranmissions heres GM's booklet on how to make the Cobalt fast, skip on down to the transmission part to get an idea of what they do.

http://gmtunersource.com/ra...3rd-edition/download

Gotta love GM.

Are there any Fiero-era MR2's that can match our fastest Fieros? Like people keep saying, comparing an 80's Pontiac to modern cars is just stupid.

There's that old Motorweek episode from the late 80s comparing the '88 Formula vs the 88 Mr2 with turbo. I seem to remember them being the same speed on there atleast.

[This message has been edited by 02greens10 (edited 04-21-2011).]

I'm pretty sure their are a few Fieros with the old FWD "Olds Toranado" transmission around. I've seen one in person.

Isn't their a couple of longitudinally mounted V8 Fieros laying the smack down at the 1/4 mile track

Like this lil blue notchie...

http://www.youtube.com/watc...ture=player_embedded

I don't think those old guys post to youtube as much as the Toy yoda gurls do...

[This message has been edited by Pappy (edited 04-21-2011).]

quote Originally posted by Pete Matos: I think manuals are boring to drive.

You are right, this guy is bored out his mind.
http://youtu.be/klMur6TPkrM

Oh hell yes.... I'd love to be that bored!!!

And while that blue fiero is INSANE... it is also pretty much not a fiero anymore ya know.... I have seen toronado tranny fieros with V8's and they certainly look potent but has anyone seen a STOCK bodied fiero run a nice second legitimate quarter mile or better yet a mid nine like some of these Mr2's seem to be able to do. Understand the fact is I am not trying to argue here that it is impossible, quite literally ANYTHING is possible but thus far we have not seen it. I would love to see it happen and as far as I've seen there are more than a few guys here capable of Making it happen. Just need the right combination and a STOUT tranny. My comments on the stickshift are for my personal car preferences and do not speak to quarter mile mastery... peace

Pete

quote Originally posted by Pete Matos: My comments on the stickshift are for my personal car preferences and do not speak to quarter mile mastery... peace Pete

I know that, I'm just busting your chops dude! ...Peace back to you to.

Rei Moloon

haha Cheers dude!! peace

Pete

quote Originally posted by La fiera: I know that, I'm just busting your chops dude! ...Peace back to you to. Rei Moloon

I guess if it ain't on you tube or a forum somewhere they don't exist for you.

I was planing to build a meager 12 second Fiero that gets 30+ mpg - That's all I really wanted to do.

Now for some reason I feel I have to build a 9 sec car to prove that good old american iron has the capability of low 9's

All I have is a regular ol 2 car garage, no job and off the shelf parts, but I think we could do it.

[This message has been edited by Pappy (edited 04-21-2011).]

i wonder how reliable a 800hp 4cly engine really is....
guy i work with is big on honda civics. he knows guys who has 400+ hp 4 cly engines.
one guy came into work saying he has a 400+ hp civic. says he has nothing but issues. always breaking things. blowing things up. tuning issues. not to mention is so expensive to get thos kind of hp out of a tiny engine. hp per dollar but be crazy for them. fieros can meet thos hp numbers fairly easy and cheaply with a 3.8 or V8. and still be reliable.

quote Originally posted by joshh44: i wonder how reliable a 800hp 4cly engine really is.... guy i work with is big on honda civics. he knows guys who has 400+ hp 4 cly engines. one guy came into work saying he has a 400+ hp civic. says he has nothing but issues. always breaking things. blowing things up. tuning issues. not to mention is so expensive to get thos kind of hp out of a tiny engine. hp per dollar but be crazy for them. fieros can meet thos hp numbers fairly easy and cheaply with a 3.8 or V8. and still be reliable.

I knew someone with a 1000+ HP 4 cylinder... 80PSI of boost on one big turbo... Every 7 seconds (one pass on the quarter mile) he had to rebuild the engine. mmmyep... not very reliable! No replacement for displacement (or VERY HIGH RPMs)

quote Originally posted by joshh44: i wonder how reliable a 800hp 4cly engine really is.... guy i work with is big on honda civics. he knows guys who has 400+ hp 4 cly engines. one guy came into work saying he has a 400+ hp civic. says he has nothing but issues. always breaking things. blowing things up. tuning issues. not to mention is so expensive to get thos kind of hp out of a tiny engine. hp per dollar but be crazy for them. fieros can meet thos hp numbers fairly easy and cheaply with a 3.8 or V8. and still be reliable.

Nail on the head.

I'd bet there are a lot more sub-13 second Fieros that are daily driven than sub-13 MR2's.

My uncle is an import guy. He has a 980whp SC300 with a 2JE-ZE (Could be wrong code, the Supra motor) and a Prelude at 260whp N/A. He has driven the Lexus maybe 300 miles in the 5 years he has had that engine in it, and has honest to God sank 50k into it. The Prelude has something new broken every time it actually makes the whole trip up here from Greensburg, and after racing him, I think he's lying about the 260whp figure, it ain't that fast, just feels fast because it revs to 9k.

Pappy,
You're preachin' to the choir here. The fact is that American iron INVENTED the quarter mile so no need to prove anything. Only problem is this post is about a grudge match between two specific types of cars and their overall performance as shown by forum members and their individual rides. Some work on handling and style, some work on outright speed, some work on quickness in the quarter. I am just pointing out that there are more than a few MR2 turbos that have run faster than what I consider to be the fastest Fiero that is still a fiero..... Honestly if your desire is a mid 12 second daily driver that idles nicely and gets good mileage that is a better feat than making a 9 second car that might run that just a few times. These turbo MR2's I am sure are probably not daily driven grocery getters. The 3800 turbo is about as close as you could possibly get in ANY car to a real honest to goodness truly fast car that you could drive to work if you wanted. My friends in florida were into mustangs as was I and there were many really fast ones in the group but few were what I would call a daily driver. I had friends with 10 second cars that were driven daily tho.... run good too.... Forced injection does have a way of leveling the playing field.......To a point...... Peace


Pete

quote Originally posted by Pappy: I guess if it ain't on you tube or a forum somewhere they don't exist for you. I was planing to build a meager 12 second Fiero that gets 30+ mpg - That's all I really wanted to do. Now for some reason I feel I have to build a 9 sec car to prove that good old american iron has the capability of low 9's All I have is a regular ol 2 car garage, no job and off the shelf parts, but I think we could do it.

quote Originally posted by Pete Matos: Pappy, You're preachin' to the choir here. The fact is that American iron INVENTED the quarter mile so no need to prove anything. Only problem is this post is about a grudge match between two specific types of cars and their overall performance as shown by forum members and their individual rides. Some work on handling and style, some work on outright speed, some work on quickness in the quarter. I am just pointing out that there are more than a few MR2 turbos that have run faster than what I consider to be the fastest Fiero that is still a fiero.....

Any of them gen 1? I mean the Fiero never made it to gen 2, unless you want to count the suspension upgrade of 88 as gen 2 ( however I have never seen anything that reffered to them as gen 2 for that ), so how is it fair to compare it to a gen 2 MR2?

a 260 hp prelude motor that is not reliable?that is only what ?60 hp more than stock? hondas are the most reliable motors you can get .they always get bashed on this forum , i dont know why .any ways , i see these MR2 vids and they are smoking fast .they are also running transverse engines , what transmission are they running ?is the toyota tranny one strong unit or are they running some sort of hand built unit .maybe the fiero drag guys just need a toyota tranny .

you guys seem to be missing what they do on forum wars, they dont take the fastest car on each forum they take 2 evenly matched cars. similar weight/hp/torque. so it could be a race with a 3800 s/c fiero with some mild mods making 300hp VS an MR2 with what ever it needs to get to 300hp.

in that case i am in 2.2 ecotec turbo with eagle rods ,wiseco pistons ,hahn racecraft 20g turbo and manifold ,snow water meth and HP tuners .match me up i am good to go .

quote Originally posted by wftb: a 260 hp prelude motor that is not reliable?that is only what ?60 hp more than stock? hondas are the most reliable motors you can get .they always get bashed on this forum , i dont know why .any ways , i see these MR2 vids and they are smoking fast .they are also running transverse engines , what transmission are they running ?is the toyota tranny one strong unit or are they running some sort of hand built unit .maybe the fiero drag guys just need a toyota tranny .

The 93 prelude VTEC is 200whp stock? Sure doesn't feel like it to me when I drove one, but that's probably because they make 200whp for 1/10 second at the redline.

Import transmissions paired with DOHC motors take a different kind of beating. Those motors don't make torque the way ours do, and TQ breaks transmissions. The transmission takes a lot less of a beating with a 300hp L4 that makes 300hp at 9k (After it has been in gear a long time). A 3800, on the other and makes more TQ than horsepower, and makes that TQ starting low and throughout the whole gear.

A 300hp 3800 Fiero would embarass a 300hp Japanese DOHC motor IMO. It's not just about power, it's about USABLE power. I'd rather have an engine that makes power through the whole gear instead of just at the end of it. A lot of import guys are shocked a 3800 turbo Fiero runs 10.2 with "only" 550ish horsepower, because their engines usually have to make quite a bit more than that to have enough usable power to send a car down the 1-4 in 10.2.

quote Originally posted by MadDanceSkillz: Are there any Fiero-era MR2's that can match our fastest Fieros? Like people keep saying, comparing an 80's Pontiac to modern cars is just stupid.

I disagree, if the fiero is a chump car compared to " modern cars " there may be no reason to have any interest in them besides styling and rear engine.

quote Originally posted by Hockaday: I disagree, if the fiero is a chump car compared to " modern cars " there may be no reason to have any interest in them besides styling and rear engine.

The stock Fiero IS a chump car compared to most modern sports cars. With mods it can whoop most of them, though. I meant that it was silly to compare them stock to stock with newer cars with high tech DOHC engines and the like.

MDS, you come off kinda abrasive there. Import motors can be tuned up pretty well, while you right they make a powerband at a different range but it isn't as narrow as you think it is. Vtec motors do take an exception just because you DO only get the better cam profile at higher rpms, but controllers do make quick work of that.

I would want to see what kind of things would be in place to level the playing field between the two cars if they have us go against a 2nd gen. A non turbo one makes about 115hp and weighs less than the Fiero, if only by about 100lbs. Our best bet of competition would probably be a Formula, being 88's they have the better suspension, better brakes, stripped of the heavy power options, and better footprint. Using the powerband the Fiero has, coming out of the corner would be its best bet. Using the torque of the engine to pull it out of the apex, the wider tires are a nice way to achieve this as soon as possible.

I dunno much about the MR2 and I'm willing to admit that, but I believe the best way for it to perform is momentum. Anybody who knows more about them please give your impressions on the best way to make it perform.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Letsbuildanexotic:

I'm thinking that Right Hand Drive conversion might be a bit off which may have caused the car to act a little quarky.
[quote]
You do realise the USA is LHD not the whole world. When we import jap cars we do not covert them.

[This message has been edited by Australian (edited 04-22-2011).]

quote Originally posted by MadDanceSkillz: The stock Fiero IS a chump car compared to most modern sports cars. With mods it can whoop most of them, though. I meant that it was silly to compare them stock to stock with newer cars with high tech DOHC engines and the like.

Ah I see, yeah stock for stock is silly.

quote Originally posted by secre7skw3rl: MDS, you come off kinda abrasive there. Import motors can be tuned up pretty well, while you right they make a powerband at a different range but it isn't as narrow as you think it is. Vtec motors do take an exception just because you DO only get the better cam profile at higher rpms, but controllers do make quick work of that.

3800 around 400hp
http://www.google.com/url?s...095_Aw5bxFK204Zd8p_A

3800 in Fiero with slipping clutch
http://i13.photobucket.com/...rofiend/ad29e969.jpg

NIce and flat, just how I like em...the dynos, anyway.

A BUNCH of Turbo MR2's on the MR2 Dyno Registry
http://www.mr2ownersclub.com/mr2records/dyno4.htm

Even the most powerful one on there http://www.mr2ownersclub.co...ords/dyno/jburke.jpg just makes that big power up there for a second. I'm sure it is very fast in the 1/4 but the dyno looks like a cliff. It also probably took enough money to build 4 500+hp Fieros, lol.

quote Originally posted by Hockaday: Most places are LHD... LHD is the correct way anyway =)

Seems the manufacturer has it wrong then.

you people all forget that a high revving honda or toyota have gear sets to compensate for the lack of torque down low if they didnt , they would be hopeless .30 mph at 7500 rpm versus a pushrod v6 turning 5500 at 30 mph .its still 30 mph , just a different approach to getting there .maybe the gearing does make it easier on the tranny , i dont know .and i did not notice that the prelude was 260 WHP .i almost bought a 93 prelude and it had a shade under 200 at the crank .my mistake .

quote Originally posted by Australian: Seems the manufacturer has it wrong then.

It's because you're on the bottom of the planet. If you come top side, you'll see it the right way up.

quote Originally posted by Australian: Seems the manufacturer has it wrong then.

Wasn't the 91-94 Mercury Capri made in Australia?

quote Originally posted by Australian: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Letsbuildanexotic: I'm thinking that Right Hand Drive conversion might be a bit off which may have caused the car to act a little quarky. [quote] You do realise the USA is LHD not the whole world. When we import jap cars we do not covert them.

I do infact understand this Austrailian, and if I'm right, I'm sure you'll correct me if I'm wrong, in Austrailia you are required to have your car right hand drive, either by the factory or converted to operate on the road, (sorry for all the commas) unlike the UK which has roads primarily set up for LHD yet you may own a RHD car and operate it on the road. Are we on the same page? Am I wrong yet? Maybe I'm thinking of New Zealand , anyway I know what side of the road Austrailians drive on, the opposite of us in the US.

So you said that the MR2 handled better and the Fiero was a struggle to drive, so I ASSUMED that you had to convert your Fiero from LHD to RHD, since we only made and sold the Fiero in the US and therefore never made any LHD Fiero's. Is this assumption correct? Seriously, I think this is just a misunderstanding. Therefore: during the process of converting from LHD to RHD I think something may have happened to make your Fiero to make it not handle as well as intended. Where as the MR2, being a Japanese car (who also drive primarily RHD), did not need a conversion to drive on the road.

And to the person who wrote that LHD is correct, that is like saying east is a better direction than west. The story I've been told, and I've looked at ancient boats and really can't find a shred of evidence to support this story, is that old boats had a rudder mounted to the right side which they would steer from, they called it the "starboard" or side you steer from side. So when they would go to dock, or "port", that would be on the left side. So after cars started using steering wheels instead of tillers, most manufactures all over the world put the driver on the right side, or "starboard" side of the car. When Henry Ford began making cars, we did not have our road system all worked out yet, and so you could drive on whatever side of the road was clear, so he wanted to make his cars "exotic" and put the steering wheel on the left hand side of the car. When our government steped in and began making laws about how roads should be built, since there were more model T's than any other car at the time, they chose to make LHD the standard for cars. So that's the story I've been told, have no idea whether it is true or not. But if you look at any powerboat, (if it doesn't have a wheel house), the steering wheel is on the Right Hand side, or starboard side of the boat. Even in the US.

Don't get me wrong Australian, I love Holden. The best American Cars are Australian, like the Pontiac GTO and G8.

Best,

Chris

Sounds to me like we need to be comparing apples to apples. The SW20 is a very different animal where Toyota had learned from their experience - the Fiero never got its chance to have a major second generation. We have pre-88s and 88s basically - funny that, a spot on match for the MR2's pre and post facelift models in the AW1x generation. So what's the fastest drag strip time from an AW11 MR2? Given that underneath it's using Corolla components as a donor versus the later SW which is more closely related to the Celica...

PS, the SW20 Turbo is not as reliable as they sound, you have to stay on top of maintenance like a hawk to prevent the engine from turning into hot slag - the 3S-GE and 3S-GTE are very sensitive to oil condition. I've seen two SW20 MR2s with major engine damage due to this situation. And no, removing the engine from an SW20 MR2 is in no way the same kettle of fish as removing the engine from a Fiero... it's much, much more annoying.

------------------

quote Originally posted by Pete Matos: Well guys.... THAT MIGHT BE A PROBLEM>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watc...fwZc&feature=related Man I love the Fiero but I think we would maybe get our asses handed to us....peace Pete

i love how people put videos of there car on a dyno and say there high HP. hell i can take my wifes gmc jimmy and put it on a dyno and say its got 1200 HP. just because there is a video of there tires turning and motor revving dont mean POO! hell show the monitor after the run to prove your HP or hide it like this joke.