I haven't posted much on here as of yet, been checking it out though. So I thought that I might start a thread with updates and pics.
I guess I should start with a bit about me, this is my first Fiero, although I have always wanted one since I was a kid (was close to owning one twice before this one). I've been modifying/building cars for over 15 years now, although the biggest projects that I have taken on have been in the last 6 years. Most the other cars I owned have been Saturns, owned a 92, 93, 94, 95 (g/f's current car), 98, 2000 and 2004. I've had a showcar saturn 4 dr before (it was in PASmag), and a DragWag 13.4 in the quarter on a stock internal engine with huge turbo. Currently I drive a 2004 Saturn ION Redline. Check out my cardomain page www.cardomain.com/id/coppertop_01 although I haven't updated my photos in a VERY long time.
Anyways onto the Fiero project, my plan is to build something that I don't think has been done before. I want to use a Saturn LLO engine, because the are very light, a plenty and I know how to build them to make some descent power, for fun I am going to throw a 75 shot of Nitrous on it. Also I am going to use a stock Saturn 5 spd transmission with the longer gear ratio (so it isn't reving at over 3000 rpm highway driving). For suspension I am going to rebuild the front suspension with a coilover setup, and use a coilover sleeve on the rear struts. Brakes are going to be corvette rotors (if they will fit, i've had them in my possession for several years and I would like to use them. Body and interior, I am going to upgrade/update these, but keep them fairly stock as I have always loved the look of the car.
Currently the car is being completely stripped down, all the way to the shell, with nothing left on it, not a hose, not a line, not a wire. From there it is going to get some rust repair on the rear end area, and off to sandblasting for a final cleaning. I have to build the mounts for the engine/tranny and suspension upgrades. After that the car is going to be POR15'd and Dynomat the entire interior for proper sound deadening.
Engine plans are simple, keep the stock displacement (aftermarket pistons aren't cheap on a LLO engine since low demands) with stock pistons, 99+ rods (stronger than previous years), balance the bottom end. I already have a ported and polished head that has been decked 0.030, with dual intake cams (longer duration for exhaust). Going to lighten up the parasitic loss by removing the water pump and going with a electric unit, and only run a alternator. Exhaust is going to be custom, intake just a ported intake manifold with big bore TB and cold air intake. 75 shot of nitrous to top everything off.
Transmission is simple, custom driveshafts are a must, with a limited slip differential.
Onto some pictures of the tear down, pretty much oldest to most recent.
The last one is a engine/car lift/crane that I built up with some scrap aluminum pipe that I had laying around my work.
Jer
[This message has been edited by coppertop_01 (edited 06-15-2009).]
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09:19 PM
PFF
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kyunderdawg Member
Posts: 4373 From: Bowling Green, KY. USA Registered: Aug 2008
It has always been a Canadian car, sat in a front yard for 7 years before I took possession.
As for power, looking to boost the 125 hp stock of the 1.9L LLO DOHC to 150 and the 75 shot on top of it, so 225ish when done and said. I guess the best part about the engine tranny combo I am looking at is it is under half the weight of the old original 2.8L. A complete LLO engine without transmission is under 200lbs, just the loaded block (block, oilpan, crank, pistons and rods) is aprox 100lbs. With a transmission I approximate the weight in about 250-275 lbs.
Yeah the rust wasn't that bad, but it wasn't good either, needs a lot of work either way.
I work for a company that makes elevator parts, so I have many of the tools needed to cut, bend and weld at my side, as well as a competent knowledge of autocad helps a bit, but I still find the old ways with cardboard is the best for rebuilding all the metal that I need. I did get some 2x2 16gauge square tubing for the upper frame rail parts, with some creative notching it should work out quite well to go from the firewall to the rear bulkhead area. I kept all the removed steel in the best possible condition, to remove it, I didn't cut most of it out, but I drilled out all the spot welds, keeping the rotted steel in as close to original shape so that I can use it to take measurements and get the replacement steel into the right shape. I also took many many photos of the original shape at different angles to help in the rebuilding.
I will take many pictures of the replacement steel when I get started on it.
Jer
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10:18 PM
Jul 17th, 2009
LAMBO Member
Posts: 1677 From: Lucas, Iowa, USA Registered: May 2000
Wow, that's some serious rust. Too bad you're so far away, I've got a rust free space frame sitting on my property I'd give you just to save you all that fab work. Good luck with your endevour.
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09:44 AM
aaronkoch Member
Posts: 1643 From: Spokane, WA Registered: Aug 2003
I have to agree with others, you're taking on an ambitious and interesting project even if you had a pristine spaceframe to base it on. I wouldn't waste another minute or dime on that frame. I could understand dealing with a questionable Muscle Car frame, they are hard to find, but Fieros are a dime a dozen.
------------------ RickN White 88GT 5spd White 85GT Auto White 99 F250SD 7.3PSD 6spd 1956 Ford 860 Tractor w/ Freeman Loader 20Ft Tilt Bed Trailer
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10:39 PM
Jul 27th, 2009
coppertop_01 Member
Posts: 162 From: Brampton, ON, Canada Registered: Apr 2009
Update, just started replace rust with actual steel. I am only tack welding everything until I can get the car to one of my works shops with a proper 600V MIG welder instead of my 120V little baby MIG welder.
Yeah in my area, to find a fiero that isn't rotted you are looking at getting a 3g + car that is in working order, this wasn't the path that I wanted to go with this car. I figure only 20-40 hrs of my time plus the $27 in steel and I will have a nearly new frame.
Jer
[This message has been edited by coppertop_01 (edited 07-27-2009).]
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05:06 PM
coppertop_01 Member
Posts: 162 From: Brampton, ON, Canada Registered: Apr 2009
If any moderator reads this I need to change the title to this thread, instead of a LLO motor I have changed to a LSJ/LNF turbo with nitrous.
I want to update this thread, the engine has changed, currently I picked up a LNF ecotec turbo motor, I am converting the LNF to a LSJ hybrid motor, LSJ head and pistons replacing the direct injection out.
Here is where it stands right now, there are a few pics of the engine teardown and pics of the parts I got to install, also I have the subframe sandblasted and ready for welding of motor mounts. Pics removed due to issues with the host, updated pics to come.
Jer
[This message has been edited by coppertop_01 (edited 02-01-2010).]
Got a part fab'd up today, its going to replace the front lateral brace in the subframe. I needed to build a new one for the ecotec motor mount and also move the whole bar forward 2" to make clearance for the ecotec block (there is a bolt location for the AC, which I ain't running that is hitting the stock subframe) keep in mind in these photo's the engine will be sitting aprox 3" lower than where it is sitting now.
Keep in mind I have only tack welded this with a TIG welder, it will be completely welded when I know everything is going to fit and work out.
As for all the holes, I was trying to lighten it up a bit, and be creative since I have the equipment at work todo that.........might have gone too far, but it is pretty light, will see how it compares to the stock piece when I cut it out.
Jer
[This message has been edited by coppertop_01 (edited 01-27-2010).]
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12:53 PM
Jan 29th, 2010
coppertop_01 Member
Posts: 162 From: Brampton, ON, Canada Registered: Apr 2009
Really getting my ass into gear now.......got a set of driveshafts that I should have in a short while as well as the jack shaft for the transmission.
Got a bit of welding done, had a small problem with the mounting location, nothing a cutoff wheel and a little welding can't fix. Engine is now in its proper mounting location and the first mount is done (save the final welding), next week I will have the rear tranny mount mocked up and the whole thing should be ready for its first test fit into the chassis and design the engine/transmission torque axis mounts.
Jer
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01:28 PM
Jan 30th, 2010
coppertop_01 Member
Posts: 162 From: Brampton, ON, Canada Registered: Apr 2009
I updated my concept drawings, since there is a couple changes to my design.
I've actually got a damaged GT rear clip and I will be adding the fast back design to the notchback rear end, basically notchy tailights with GT sails......not sure if its been done before, but its going to need some fibreglassing to get it done. Also I had to add a bird catcher above the roof for the rear mounted air to air intercooler, and doing a rear deck lid that goes from the roof down with a window to see the motor/engine bay.
Jer
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10:34 AM
Feb 3rd, 2010
coppertop_01 Member
Posts: 162 From: Brampton, ON, Canada Registered: Apr 2009
A couple update pics, got the rear part of the subframe rebuilt for the rear tranny mount.......still hoping to have the engine test fit into the chassis this weekend.
In case anybody wants to know the reason I made the new brace go upwards, I wanted to make more room for the exhaust coming off the turbo, I am going to have two 2.5" pipes coming off a 3 or 3.5" (can't remember) collector. You will also notice that I haven't put provision for the rear tie rods......you will see why in the future.
Jer
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06:23 PM
Feb 4th, 2010
Rivethead Member
Posts: 83 From: Charlotte, NC, U.S.A. Registered: Jan 2009
Thanks, I figure if I have the tools at work and the skills to design/build something different then why not. All the frame work has been done with .105 thick metal, from what I mic'd out on the original frame (thats the thickest I could find on the frame) it looks to be the same thickness material, also from what I have scaled out I haven't added any extra weight to the frame +/- a pound or two (some heavy rust in sections probably lost a couple pounds from the day it was off the assembly line).
Got the work flatbed booked to pickup and deliver the chassis to my work/shop later today, I should have some preliminary test fit pics sometime today, and there will be some work done to it on sunday.
Jer
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06:53 AM
Feb 7th, 2010
coppertop_01 Member
Posts: 162 From: Brampton, ON, Canada Registered: Apr 2009
Got a lot done to the Fiero today........engine has been test fitted, which fits great no modifications needed. Also welded in all the bracing for the rear end, still some more stuff coming this week.
Here's a few pics
Jer
[This message has been edited by coppertop_01 (edited 02-07-2010).]
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01:18 PM
doublec4 Member
Posts: 8289 From: Oakville, Ontario, Canada Registered: Jun 2003
Probably won't get anymore updates till sometime early next week........but I will have the motor mounts finished and a couple other little things tidied up.
Jer
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08:28 PM
Feb 17th, 2010
coppertop_01 Member
Posts: 162 From: Brampton, ON, Canada Registered: Apr 2009
Its still going to have the regulation bumpers, and I will be putting the rear clip supports/trunk supports........it isn't going to look that bare when I am done.
Although really, how much extra cushioning do you think the trunk adds to the chassis? Also my 2" square tube upper spaceframe supports might just be a little stronger than the stamped steel ones from the factory.
Thanks for the comments though, I hope to be getting the car welded a bit more and sent to sandblasting in the next couple weeks.
I will be following this thread with a lot of interest, as I also have a 04 Ion Redline, and I was hoping that if anything were to happen to it, to get the motor out and put it in the Fiero.
What sort of horsepower are you looking at? Also, why get rid of the DI? Tuning difficulties?