After some research and measuring I found my Interior. Why I choose the 99+ Pontiac Grand Am GT Interior? Well I'm replacing my tail lights with Pisa's GTFB Tail Light Unit with custom tail lights, I'm also wanting these sertain headlights found in this thread: https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/031793.html So everything is going round. The Grand Am Interior matches everything PERFECTLY. I did some measureing and found out that the new GRAND AM dash is kind of tall, Meaning I can't use the Grand Am's Center Console for nothing would fit right. I'm gonna have to make my own custom center console just to make things fit right. The Grand AM doors are about an inch shorter then the F-Body. So with luck, there wont be much customizing. I Called a few places and every place I called was pricy (NOT Compared to an Aftermarket DASH tho). Every place I called priced everything (Dash Pad, Dash, 2 Door Panels, Guage Cluster) varying from $750 - $1200. One place I called was a lil cheaper but not by much, Until he told me... "You know what, I'll give you EVERYTHING for $400."
I'll be taking pictures tomorrow. The guy is telling me its in mint condition and its Grey/Black. If its in good condition, then I'm gonna have him hold it for me so I can come back a later time or day with a truck to pick everything up. He's giving me everything seen in the picture except for the Steering Wheel and Radio. The Buttons, AC Controls. If you look right by the Radio, thats where the key hole is...Since ofcource I can't use the Grand Am Key Ignition Switch, I'm gonna install a IGNITED Push Button Starter here.
[This message has been edited by 2Fast_Fiero (edited 07-23-2003).]
sounds cool. When you said the center concole wouldnt fit, what were you talking about? the entire peice that runs along your side of the center area where the radio and stuff is. if its just the area with the radio couldnt you just cut and modify the thing to fit? I dont know the measurements, but it looks like you could probably just cut away the area directly belw the AC controls and it would fit...
you probly thought of that but im just curious.
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07:23 PM
2Fast_Fiero Member
Posts: 1106 From: Tijeras, NM USA Registered: Jul 2003
What I meant was. The Fiero's Center is kinda high up. Lets see if I can explain this right. If I were to mount the dash with the GA's Center console, the dash would sit very high up. The center of the Fiero is high. IF you pull your center console apart, there's a little black plastic frame that everything is screwed onto, I'm going to have to remove this plastic peice in order to make the dash sit properly. Its not realy that big of a deal...I'm getting a huge sheet of 3/4" MDF, I'll have enough to make my own custom center console with nothing in the middle except for the Shifter. I promise I'll get pictures, Pictures explain everything much better!
4 Dr. Grand Ams should have shorter doors, compared to the 2 doors. Also, be aware that the instrument cluster, including the digital odometer, is electronic. You're in for some interesting conversion electronics, I believe. But if it works, it'll look great!
The Grand Am uses both a BCM and PCM (Body Control Module and Powertrain Control Module) rather than the Fiero style single ECM for everything. I'm not sure, but I believe all gauge functions are from one of the control modules and none of them are direct sensor feeds. One cool feature is the WOW effect when you start the car, though. All the gauges sweep full scale for a second when the car first starts.
A good source of info would be http://www.grandamgt.com There's even a tech forum on there staffed by Pontiac engineers to answer your questions. They should be able to help you a lot.
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08:48 PM
1fiero_nyt No longer registered
Report this Post07-23-2003 10:33 PM
1fiero_nyt
posts Member since
I think 2fast jus wanted have a guage pod that resembles a pair of boobs....lol
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10:33 PM
FieroMaster88 Member
Posts: 7680 From: Mattawan, MI Registered: Nov 2000
I think 2fast jus wanted have a guage pod that resembles a pair of boobs....lol
Now I just need a Dash Bra!
quote
Originaly posted by Formula88:
4 Dr. Grand Ams should have shorter doors, compared to the 2 doors. Also, be aware that the instrument cluster, including the digital odometer, is electronic. You're in for some interesting conversion electronics, I believe. But if it works, it'll look great!
Yea, I found that out by calling a place that specializes in Pontiacs. They told me that the SE's entire guage cluster is Digital. And the GT's is Analog. I wasn't originaly going for the Guage cluster at first, but since he's going to give it to me in a package deal, I'm gonna play around with the Fiero and the Grand Am guage cluster to see what I can come up with. If not, I'm going to go onto my Original Plan and install 2 5" Guages from Autometer. Then I am going to work on my AC to figure out how to get it to push out COLDER air and Faster and re route some of the vent locations so that I can use the 3 Center vents for a dash guage pod. I will relocate the Middle vents to just blow the air down in the bottom. Thanks for that link. I will report back after I have pictures of the exact Dash. I'm also going to measure the sizes of the 2DR and 4DR Door panels to see which one will work better. I think the 4DR Door panels will be to short.
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11:10 PM
2Fast_Fiero Member
Posts: 1106 From: Tijeras, NM USA Registered: Jul 2003
What I meant was. The Fiero's Center is kinda high up. Lets see if I can explain this right. If I were to mount the dash with the GA's Center console, the dash would sit very high up. The center of the Fiero is high. ...
You may want to grab the console anyway. I didn't think that the Firebird console would work either but, with a little help of a sawzall and a heat gun, it all worked out great.
I simply removed the sides of the Fiero tunnel from the gas tank hump forward to the base of the dash. This made the Fiero's tunnel low enough in the front to allow the console to slide up under the dash.
I trimmed the back half of the console as low as I could and then gently heated the console plastic to allow it to expand around the tunnel and to conform to it's new location. Heat the plastic from the inside so you don't burn the grain pattern. Additionally, be aware of the other plastic around the area that you are heating, it will soften too. I taped a wet rag over the areas I didn't want to soften to prevent distortion.
Here's some more advice. Use a junk donor Fiero to mock everything up. Pull the windshield to gain better access. Extreme modifications to your Fiero (steering column support, tunnel, A/C box, doors) may be required so it's better to use a junker for practice and mock-up.
Even more advice... be sure to grab ALL the pigtails from the donor car that you can like the dash, door panels, and console. You'll need them to wire up the new switches.
Lastly, the digital cluster will not work with the Fiero (as already mentioned). But, there may be enough room in the donor housing to move the Fiero gauges, or any other GM gauge of the 80's era. They all can be hard wired just like the aftermarket gauges. I can help you with some of the details.
Yea, I found that out by calling a place that specializes in Pontiacs. They told me that the SE's entire guage cluster is Digital. And the GT's is Analog.
That is incorrect! GT's and SE's use the same design. The only real difference is the GT uses a 150 speedo and the SE uses a 120 speedo. It may have been different in earlier models, but not after 99.
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10:41 AM
2Fast_Fiero Member
Posts: 1106 From: Tijeras, NM USA Registered: Jul 2003
mrfixit58, Thanks I'll take you up on that offer. I figure using some Aftermarket guages would look pretty cool like some of the new cars have. I'll try to get the Center console to. I won't be buying it today, hopefuly I'm taking pictures today.
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02:25 PM
RacinRob Member
Posts: 1288 From: Eau Claire, WI Registered: Mar 2001
So if a guy was running a 3800sc or N* he could use the 01 guages as the ecm should comunicate with the pcm. HVAC controls would still be a problem though.
That is incorrect! GT's and SE's use the same design. The only real difference is the GT uses a 150 speedo and the SE uses a 120 speedo. It may have been different in earlier models, but not after 99.
How about the Alero's (same car diffrent dash) and it's analog.
now thats a good question. Wonder if they would work together...
anyway, 2Fast, why not get some digital gauges? the ones wth LED readouts? put em behind some tinted plastic and that would look pretty swank there should be several posts here with info for those guages.
That would be me. I would advise you to take more measurements, chiefly between the center line of the steering column and the door. Mine is a '92-'95 dash, but I doubt the basic dimensions of the N body have changed much. If you measure total length of the GA dash, it will look correct, but when you center the GA cluster over the Fiero steering column, the left end of the GA dash will be sticking in the door opening, and there will be a large gap on the passenger side. If you center the dash between the A pillars, the GA center pod will not line up with the Fiero tunnel.
I thought mine would be a drop-in when I got it. I hope you get it worked out.
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04:40 PM
PFF
System Bot
tomanyfieros Member
Posts: 2702 From: Albany, Ohio Registered: Nov 2000
That would be me. I would advise you to take more measurements, chiefly between the center line of the steering column and the door. Mine is a '92-'95 dash, but I doubt the basic dimensions of the N body have changed much. If you measure total length of the GA dash, it will look correct, but when you center the GA cluster over the Fiero steering column, the left end of the GA dash will be sticking in the door opening, and there will be a large gap on the passenger side. If you center the dash between the A pillars, the GA center pod will not line up with the Fiero tunnel.
I thought mine would be a drop-in when I got it. I hope you get it worked out.
The Fiero has a Sports Car Exterior, and an Old Grandpa Interior! I look at my car everyday and I am admired by its beauty, and then I get inside and its like being pushed into a different relm!
But I'd like to know that too, If someone is running a 3800SC, Could he be able to use the GTP ECM, would it comunicate with the Guage Pod with a little or no re-wireing??
I think I'd just use my stock Fiero HVAC Controls. Someone did that with a F-Body Interior and it didn't look soo bad.
Why I don't want Digital Guages with LED Readouts is because I enjoy Needles. lol my friends celica has every guage in the book in his car, just start up the car and watch all the guages move around in different ways, its cool!
Also I measured the length from the driver side door to the hole for the steering column, and the same from the passenger side to the hole, there shouldn't be much of a problem. Just Minor cuting that won't be visible. I got only one picture in when my camera died, I couldn't get it to take any more pictures without it shuting off first. I'll try to get it uploaded as quick as possible. I'm first gonna go out to the fiero and take some more measurements.
Originally posted by 2Fast_Fiero: A few people have said what I'm about to say... The Fiero has a Sports Car Exterior, and an Old Grandpa Interior!
I felt that way before I got mine when I was looking, to be honest I sort of get the cockpit idea the designers had when they designed our interior. Look at each pod and you can see where they we're thinking aircraft interior.
yeah, an old man interior would have a vynal dash, wood trim panels, a big Am/Fm cassette a sweeping needle speedo and a gas guage with everything else hving idiot lights
------------------ --Adam-- 1987 Blue GT 5-speed IM AOL: FieroGT5speed
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12:00 AM
jscott1 Member
Posts: 21676 From: Houston, TX , USA Registered: Dec 2001
I agree with everything Roy (MrFixit58) says with the following additions:
First, I didn't have a junk Fiero to practice on so I figured out a way to install my Firebird dashboard without modifying the Fiero structure in any way. It's not quite the same as the way Roy did it, but it's an option.
Second, I didn't have any of the pigtails for the switches or even the gauges and soldered the wires directly on. I don't recommend it, but it can be done, (I only melted one switch)
So the switches shouldn't be any problem? Also I have a question...I didn't know this was an option in Fiero's until I saw another 85 GT with it. Power Mirors....I don't have that. On the driver side door panel there is an almost Identical panel for Power Mirrors, how would I go about installing these?
I put in a Resume today at Yearwood Speed & Custom. They have been around since the 70's and they are Albuquerque's leading distributer of Autometer. If I score the job, I'll have discount on the guages. Amongst other things, they have a Big Block ford engine and a Small Block Chevy engine sitting on display inside, WOW! But yea, MrFixit and Jscott, I'd love your guy's help.
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03:17 AM
jscott1 Member
Posts: 21676 From: Houston, TX , USA Registered: Dec 2001
Power Mirrors are an easy upgrade if your car didn't have them. You have to buy the mirrors, of course, but they are bolt on replacements.
The wiring won't be in the car if it didn't come with power mirrors, but you can run the wires yourself. It's 4 wires per mirror, plus power and ground to the switch. I added power mirrors to my coupe, which didn't have them originally, it's not that hard.
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08:01 AM
Gary W Member
Posts: 1092 From: Cape Coral, FL Registered: Oct 2001
Initial pics are here. I can shoot some of the completed project if there's interest, but I don't want to hijack this thread. It involved cutting two dashes in half and sectioning them back together, then recovering with vinyl from Mr. Mikes. Also needed to make custom door panels to clear the dash corners.
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09:21 AM
Songman Member
Posts: 12496 From: Nashville, TN Registered: Aug 2000
Initial pics are here. I can shoot some of the completed project if there's interest, but I don't want to hijack this thread. It involved cutting two dashes in half and sectioning them back together, then recovering with vinyl from Mr. Mikes. Also needed to make custom door panels to clear the dash corners.
Gary,
I'd love to see the finished product. Your initial pictures don't show how you integrated the console or your door panels.
Roy
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03:24 PM
2Fast_Fiero Member
Posts: 1106 From: Tijeras, NM USA Registered: Jul 2003
I'd like to see pictures too. To give me an IDea...I figure if what you say is true....I could expand the dash from the passenger side...This junk yard has a couple more Dash's I could use.
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04:22 PM
Gary W Member
Posts: 1092 From: Cape Coral, FL Registered: Oct 2001
OK, you asked for it. Dialup users can go get a snack, it's gonna be a while. Here's what I ended up with by aligning the dash with the steering column and the center console
Door won't close
Other side: Big trouble!
So, we do this: (don't mind the mess)
Final fit driver's side:
Passenger side:
Bonus! This also shows the shifter console I built to tie the dash to the Fiero center console.
The whole package: Many thanks to Mr. Mikes
The entire steering column is from the Grand Am. Everything is complete and working, including headlight switch, high beams and cruise control on the left stalk, intermittant wipers on the right. None of it was compatible with the Fiero wiring, but it all was wired to spare Fiero pigtails, so I can go back to stock if desired.
I'd say I put at least 100 hours into it, much of that in the electrical changes. If anybody wants more details, ask away.
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11:04 PM
1fiero_nyt No longer registered
Report this Post07-25-2003 11:17 PM
1fiero_nyt
posts Member since
Gary, what car is the dash from?
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11:17 PM
Gary W Member
Posts: 1092 From: Cape Coral, FL Registered: Oct 2001
'92 Grand Am Sport Sedan. (Two of them, actually). '92-'95 used this dash, but the climate controls in the '95 are electronic. I don't think there's any way to get them to work in the Fiero.
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11:26 PM
Jul 26th, 2003
2Fast_Fiero Member
Posts: 1106 From: Tijeras, NM USA Registered: Jul 2003
DAMN, that looks pretty darn good! So you extended the Dash from the passenger side with a strip of the spare dash? Also did you try to use the GA's Door Panel? Cause I took a look at the 99's Door panel and I see where your problem was and I'd like to find a way to use the 99 Door panels with the Dash. Gary, you wouldn't mind helping me out if I have any questions would you?
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12:28 AM
GTFiero1 Member
Posts: 6508 From: Camden County NJ Registered: Sep 2001
DAMN, that looks pretty darn good! So you extended the Dash from the passenger side with a strip of the spare dash? Also did you try to use the GA's Door Panel? Cause I took a look at the 99's Door panel and I see where your problem was and I'd like to find a way to use the 99 Door panels with the Dash. Gary, you wouldn't mind helping me out if I have any questions would you?
Ask any questions you like. It's better if you email, I'm in the middle of moving and I don't get on the forum very much these days.
I had the GA door panels. With the map pockets on the bottom, they stuck way to far into the car. They hit the seats and blocked the parking brake handle. Take a look down along the side of the seat thru the window with the door closed. There's about an inch clearance, and the Fiero door panels are just about flat. Also, the door handles were in completely the wrong location.
To extend the dash, I found a area where the contour didn't change much over a 4" length. I cut the main dash in the middle of the glovebox hole, and cut the second dash 4" to the left of the same line. Using a similarly contoured plastic strip from the scraps, I epoxied the two pieces together. There is a piece of 1/4" plywood all along the windshield edge for reinforcement.
I also forgot to mention that the curvature of the GA windshield is radically different from the Fiero. I had to trim almost 4" off the front edge of the dash, where it meets the glass. This was also necessary because the top of the cluster would have hit the steering wheel otherwise. In the construction picture, you can see the new defroster vent I had to cut.
