okay so I've FINALLY gotten my 3800 swapped 85gt after quite a while. i used the Isuzu 5 speed due to not being able to afford the getrag at the time. and just another fun thing pops up. i used a spec stage 3 clutch brand new. and yet now when i start the car in neutral i cannot shift into any gears due to the clutch not engaging yet if i put it in gear and start it, it will crank and move until it basically push starts itself but i cannot shift once its started. but i did manage to float it into third one time during the small test drive. while the cars off i can put it into all the gears (at least seems like it will) i changed out the slave cylinder to match the tranny due to having the original 4 speed in the car, now i can see the slave moving the piston to "engage" but still got nothing can anyone tell me if maybe the master cylinder might be going out or maybe some other helpful hint. being this close to finally being able to drive it around is killing me.

Sounds more like you cannot get the clutch to dis-engauge. is there any pressure on the clutch when you push it in? Sure the disk is not in backwards? Larry

i have what feels like normal pressure. (i would not know if the clutch was in backwards as i had someone install it for me...) but the clutch has FULL travel and normal spring back rate. would the clutch being in wrong be the most likely thing wrong for something like this?

If it is in backwards it will bind up and it will not release, not sure if there is a way you can check when it is all cosed up, I would exhaust all other possiablities before you pull it out to look. Sounds like it does not release at all, can you put it in 5th gear and depress the clutch and see if it will start without moving? Larry

i'm going to try the master cylinder/slave cylinder and if that doesn't work then i guess i will have to get in there but on spec's page it says you cannot install the clutch backwards due to the taper on the clutch they said it would make a Horrible noise and slip instead of never shifting.

Before getting too drastic, you'll want to make sure the hydraulic system is completely bled of air. Your symptoms are consistent with an improperly bled cltuch, especially given that you've replaced the slave. Make sure you are getting 1-1/8" movement of the slave pushrod before anything else. Get someone to push in and hold the pedal while you measure at the movement at the slave. If you're getting less travel, you need to re-bleed. There are many threads here on PFF regarding the proper way to bleed the system, but if you can't find one, check out the V8archie website and follow his instructions.

You say you changed the slave cylinder because you went from a 4 speed to the Isuzu 5 speed. The slaves are the same, so I'm wondering if you don't have a Getrag slave which wouldn't give you the necessary travel for full release. The mounting studs should be a part of the slave and point toward the engine. You should have a pushrod that is 5 3/4 inches long. The slave you need for the Isuzu should look exactly like this:

My slave looks just like that but I think my mechanic messed something up he has spacers on it so it may not be sticking out as far as it needs to. Thanks alot for the brain refresher. Not having the car in front of me lets alot of little things escape the brain

okay well after all that fun stuff...i have tried just about everything. there's zero air in the system tons of fluid. but it still will not shift. i can start the car in any one gear. (push start style) but i cannot shift once its in that gear unless i just float it into the gear. what could be the problem i see the slave cylinder pushing the rod quite a bit. but the rod seems to not want to retract all the way it keeps the lever on the transmission pushed almost half way in. when i removed the slave from the bracket i can put my hand on the lever its pushing on and there is just enough to bring it back into position. is there supposed to be some kind of pressure pushing it back? or is that normal.

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[This message has been edited by Fiero_gtp (edited 01-06-2013).]

Give us a picture of how the slave is mounted. This is how it should look. The slave mounts direct to the bracket with no spacers.


Next, check the clutch pedal to see if it sits about an inch higher than the brake pedal.

Next, look-feel up under the dash and find the master cylinder push rod. Where it attaches to the clutch pedal, the curl in the pushrod should be up in this position


There should be a little free play of the release lever if the slave pushrod has been removed. The spring tension in the slave keeps the piston and pushrod pushed outward to the point that the release bearing just touches the fingers on the pressure plate. Otherwise the pushrod would fall out of the release arm. There is nothing on the release arm or the bearing fork that would push the release arm back.

If everything checks out, let's try the gravity bleed method. It's a one person job. No need for pumping the pedal.

Jack up the left front so the tire's about 6 inches off the ground.
Top off the master cylinder reservoir and leave the cap off.
Leave the brake fluid bottle close by with the cap off.
Get a large wrench like a 19mm or adjustable.
Get a 13mm boxed end wrench or socket and open the slave bleeder valve.
When the fluid starts to flow, take the heavy wrench and bump the side of the slave a half dozen times or so.
Keep watch on the master cylinder, topping it off each time it gets down to about 1/4 full.
Do this at least 3 times.
The last time, let the fluid bleed down to the full mark on the master reservoir and close the slave bleeder.
Replace the caps on the master reservoir and the fluid bottle.
Check clutch for a solid pedal.

Not being able to shift gears when the engine is running means that the clutch is not disengaging the transmission from the engine. That happens when you don't have enough throw on the clutch lever sticking out of the transmission. If the clutch lever doesn't retract all the way when you take your foot off the pedal, then you would get a slipping clutch when you try to drive, but you would be able to shift gears. In your case, the lever isn't being shoved in far enough by the slave cylinder pushrod to disengage the engine.

To answer your question about what should happen when you remove the slave from the bracket, the clutch lever on the transmission should spring back far enough that you should feel about an 1/8" of lash on the lever. In other words, you should be able to move the lever slightly between where the clutch fork hits the back of the bell housing in one direction, and the throw out bearing touching the clutch fingers in the other direction. When the slave is re-installed, it should take up the slack and hold the throw out bearing against the fingers lightly.

You didn't say whether you actually measured the slave cylinder pushrod travel or not. This is the key to figuring out whether you'll be able to fix the problem without removing the transmission. The amount of travel must be 1-1/8" no less.

If you don't get enough travel, then either you have a bent clutch pedal, faulty clutch master cylinder, faulty slave cylinder, air still in the system, or perhaps a mechanical interference between the clutch arm pinch bolt, and the bell housing.:



It isn't enough to gauge the slave pushrod travel by eye.

untill morning i cannot snap any pictures. but the push rod pushs the shift arm all the way to where the shift arm will not go back any further. the clutch pedal sits above the brake pedal. i have blead the brakes 3 times now. i think its something wrong with the clutch assembly because im getting full movement where im supposed to its just something in the tranny not engaging i want to thank you all for the help but i think im gonna have to drop it back off at the shop and have the tranny pulled and just skip the headaches

I'm beginning to wonder if the release bearing was installed backwards or the flywheel may have been cut too much.