I'm changing the plugs on my 88GT 5 speed. This is the first fastback Fiero I've owned. I had a pretty good routine for reaching the front bank of plugs (2-4-6) on my notchback Fieros. In addition to the obvious access challenges posed by the fastback ,the shift cables on this 5 speed are layed out differently the the ones on my Muncie 4 speeds and hamper access from the driver's side.

I can reach around from the passenger side and get my hand on each of the plugs but I'm having trouble breaking the bond between the spark plug wire boot and the plug itself. I'm sure I can manage to get it done but I'd like to hear what has worked best for you.

Thanks,

Carroll

Remove fastback decklid, spray plugs with penetrant, let sit, slip wires off, spray a bit again, blow compressed air (if available) onto plugs, loosen plugs.

Carrol,

Those plugs are probably the Bosch Platinums I installed a few years back. Since I reinstalled the recall weatherstrip on the car hopefully you won't have much corrosion to deal with. If you can dislocate your arm it makes it much easier to do. I think I may still have some scratches on my arm from that experience......

I pull the dog bone and use a strap clamp to pull the engine rearward with the dog bone bracket. That inch or 2 makes a big difference.

If you unbolt the bottom of the front transmission mount it even shifts a little farther...

[This message has been edited by Dodgerunner (edited 08-31-2011).]

I just call one of my boys and have them fight it......really easy stuff, actually.

I have never had problems replacing the plugs even with the decklid in place. I have the 4-speed trans though, so the cable layout may be different.

This is not to say access is easy - its annoying and a lot of it is by feel only - but its doable. I did my plugs less than a week ago.

Plan to give a pint of blood for the front three. Next set of plugs use antiseeze on the plugs and dielectric greese on the wire boots.

Pulled the stock plus on ours after 50,000 mi. and 24 years. It was fun for sure, but they did come out fairly easy after a good soak of PB Blaster. Wish I had a better socket for the job, the manuals reccommend an offset socket to do the job (not sure that's the correct name, but a socket wrench handle with a slight bend). By the way, protect your sail panel windows as you reach over them for the front plugs!!!! My easy reach was from the passenger side for the fronts. Do the fronts first, after that the rears will almost fall out.

[This message has been edited by Kevin87FieroGT (edited 08-31-2011).]

Not sure if this will work for you, but I just stood in the trunk (on a towel of course, can't mess up the carpet ). From there I could reach around the intake on either side and get to all the plugs easily. This was with everything in place too, it was about a 45 minute job.

quote Originally posted by Dodgerunner: I pull the dog bone and use a strap clamp to pull the engine rearward with the dog bone bracket. That inch or 2 makes a big difference. If you unbolt the bottom of the front transmission mount it even shifts a little farther...

That's the way I've been doing it for years. Later GM FWD cars even have an extra hole in the dogbone to facilitate this. You unbolt one end, pull engine forward, and slip bolt back in the extra hole to hold the engine while you work.

------------------
1986 SE 350 V8

I always stand in the trunk as well. It's a tight fit to get those front plugs, but I've never had to remove anything to get to them.

quote Originally posted by tesmith66: That's the way I've been doing it for years. Later GM FWD cars even have an extra hole in the dogbone to facilitate this. You unbolt one end, pull engine forward, and slip bolt back in the extra hole to hold the engine while you work.

Is there a dogbone available for the Fiero with the additional hole? I would buy one of these

I just get in the trunk and work my hands down between the intake and decklid. Usually results in a scrape or two, but still not that big of an issue.

quote Originally posted by fieroguru: I just get in the trunk and work my hands down between the intake and decklid. Usually results in a scrape or two, but still not that big of an issue.

I used a plank of covered 3/4" plywood across the trunk area to lay on so I could be comfortable on m'belly and twistin' the plugs out. Really not a big problem when you let loose the dogbone like Dodgerunner said.

quote Originally posted by Kevin87FieroGT: Plan to give a pint of blood for the front three. Next set of plugs use antiseeze on the plugs and dielectric greese on the wire boots. Pulled the stock plus on ours after 50,000 mi. and 24 years. It was fun for sure, but they did come out fairly easy after a good soak of PB Blaster. Wish I had a better socket for the job, the manuals reccommend an offset socket to do the job (not sure that's the correct name, but a socket wrench handle with a slight bend). By the way, protect your sail panel windows as you reach over them for the front plugs!!!! My easy reach was from the passenger side for the fronts. Do the fronts first, after that the rears will almost fall out.

I was able to get all three front plugs with a standard 5/8 plug socket, a short (3") extension, and 3/8 drive ratchet.

Fiero plugs are a warm welcome compared to most newer cars, especially mini-vans. A swivel spark plug socket is a must

I second the comment about removing the deck lid. I was skeptical until I finally did it, but it really is easy and well worth it.

Make sure you torque the plugs properly, especially if you use antiseize (which I recommend). I fought what I thought was an ignition problem for a long time on another car until I finally decided to replace the plugs after replacing just about everything else. The plugs were fine, but several had worked loose enough that I was getting blow by, which caused all kinds of rough running symptoms and strange smells.

Everyone makes such a big deal about replacing the firewall side (front) plugs on the V6. I just don't get it. I've always done it witout removing anything (decklid, dogbone, intake snout, etc). I remove them from the top side, two of them from DS, the third from PS (although all three could be pulled from PS), When working on the DS, you can expect to scrape your left forearm on the throttle body linkage, but that's a small price to pay for not removing the decklid or the dogbone and trying to pull the engine rearward. If I was working on someone else's Fiero and age of the plugs was unkown, I'd likely put the car 18-24" up in the air on jackstands and remove them from the underside, after soaking them with Cyclo "Break Away" or "Kroil". And no, I do not have super small forearms that make this possible for me, it's just not that difficult period.

What I will add is that when replacing the plugs, antiseize on the threads of the new plugs is a must! Do not put new plugs in unless they have anti seize on the threads.

quote Originally posted by lateFormula: Everyone makes such a big deal about replacing the firewall side (front) plugs on the V6. I just don't get it. I've always done it witout removing anything (decklid, dogbone, intake snout, etc). I remove them from the top side, two of them from DS, the third from PS (although all three could be pulled from PS), When working on the DS, you can expect to scrape your left forearm on the throttle body linkage, but that's a small price to pay for not removing the decklid or the dogbone and trying to pull the engine rearward. If I was working on someone else's Fiero and age of the plugs was unkown, I'd likely put the car 18-24" up in the air on jackstands and remove them from the underside, after soaking them with Cyclo "Break Away" or "Kroil". And no, I do not have super small forearms that make this possible for me, it's just not that difficult period. What I will add is that when replacing the plugs, antiseize on the threads of the new plugs is a must! Do not put new plugs in unless they have anti seize on the threads.

It's interesting to hear the differences when people have issues or don't have issues with the front spark plugs. I cannot fit my hand between the firewall and block even with the decklid removed. I have tried and just end up shredding my hand on the valve cover.

One way of changing the plugs is to loosen one end of the dogbone and flip it up, remove the 2 rear cradle bolts, slightly jack up the rear of the car and allow the cradle to pivot which tilts the motor towards the back like a hinge. You get quite a lot of room this way.

quote Originally posted by lateFormula: Everyone makes such a big deal about replacing the firewall side (front) plugs on the V6. I just don't get it.

I think people at first glance just seem daunted by the task. It is pretty simple though. I must be strange because the first time I did the front bank plugs, on my Formula, I was actually excited to start tearing it apart... Even then it didn't take longer than an hour from start to finish to do the whole plug/wire job on all six cylinders.

After letting the plugs soak, I just get a spark plug socket, a 6" extension, and go to town. I can have the front plugs out fairly quickly. I remove the decklid just for the room (and because it takes less than five minutes to remove it).

[This message has been edited by Fiero84Freak (edited 09-02-2011).]

After many interruptions (grandkids) I finally got around to replacing the plugs and wires. Removing the deck lid is definitely the way to go. I tried removing the dogbone and pulling back on the engine but it would not budge. With the decklid gone I could get hands on the plug wire boots ane twist them off. They were stuck fast to the plugs. I used compressed air to blow away the accumulated crud and had no problems getting a socket and wrench on them. I did slather dielecrtic grease on the inside of the new wire boots and coated antisieze on the threads of the plugs for good measure.

I removed the two 12 point bolts holding the throttle cable bracket to the intake plenum to give access to route the new wires. When I first started to loosen the bolts I could feel that they were galling the aluminum threads of the intake plenum. I soaked them with PB Blaster then slowly worked the wrench back and forth to get the threads lubricated. When I got the bolts out I did see aluminum buildup indicating that a couple of threads did gall. I used a thread file and cleaned up the bolts and used antisieze when I reinstalled them.

Thanks for all the suggestions.

I didn't try removing the dog bone, but that makes a lot of sense. I have a Snap-On "palm" ratchet that I paid some rediculas price for about 15 years ago and when I changed the plugs in my '88 GT, it was the first time that I really needed it.

------------------
Mike in Indy

That's How I did it the first time. I've since learned how to remove them with the decklid still on. Not fun but not horrible either. I have long thin fore arms

[This message has been edited by TheRealShadowX (edited 11-10-2011).]

We use a tool known called an engine tilter. You remove the dogbone, install the tool in its place and crank the engine back with an open end wrench. KD toools used to make this tool, not sure if they still do. Gives you plenty of room to reach back there but you still must stand in the trunk. when you remove the spark plug wires always pull from the boot, not from the wire.

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, ZZP Intercooler, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

I was all worried about it the first time we changed them, but my dad (a mechanic his entire life) simply leaned over the back of the car, (he's about 5'6") and removed them by feeling for them and only doing one at a time. It literally took like 10 minutes! It took me longer to explain all the bad stuff I had heard about changing them lol.
Mike.

It's easier if you remove the decklid, but not necessary. The decklid - especially a GT decklid - is a PITA if you don't have help. Not really heavy, just awkward.
I use a spark plug socket (better if it has that rubber gripper inside it to hold the plug) a 3" extension, and a ratchet with a swivel head.
(That swivel ratchet has gotten me out of more trouble... )

FWIW, a 4.9 is not really any harder than a V6, unless it has an Allante intake.

------------------
Raydar
88 Formula IMSA Fastback. 4.9, NVG T550

Praise the Lowered!