I am getting ready for paint also. I was quoted $7500 to take panels, glass and strip old paint off. (done right) The price was dropped to just over 4K doing Soda Blasting. I believe I will go that route. You have to use a little lower pressure with the Fiero panels but well worth it.

quote Originally posted by TXGOOD: I think some people who pay 5k for a paint job have to justify to themselves that it was worth it and part of that is saying that you can`t get a quality job for much less than that.

... and then again, I've seen people on this very forum say they used a household paint roller to paint their Fiero and thought that it turned out just fine. This isn't like the story of "The Emperor's Clothes" as you suggest, there is a very real and tangible difference that needs no explaining when you sit a car with a $5000 prep and paint job next to one with a $400, $1000, or $2000 job. If there wasn't, then the high end shops would've disappeared long ago.

quote Originally posted by IIKool: I think all of these 4 to 6 thousands dollars paint jobs, people are forgetting that there are a lot of people outta work and that puts a hurting on these paint and body shop. Maybe if and when the economy goes again then you might be able to get those figures. But until then maybe half of those figures

You will get some price variation because of the economy but not too much. It depends on the painter. Painting a Fiero the proper way is a lot of work and I as a painter will look for easier work than a Fiero if I'm looking to cut my prices for paint work. Our cars are not scuff and spray cars. We need to take them apart more than other cars. They are smaller but they still take more time to prep. I'd rather paint my ' 86 Cutlass Supreme than my Fiero. On top of all that, most of our owners expect top-end results for middle or low-end costs. You want a paint job for $100? Fine. I'll stop at Home Depot and buy a nice new paint roller for your car. Don't want orange peel? Ok...I'll make sure it's a smooth texture. It'll be done pretty quick, too. Drop it off Friday after work and I'll have it ready to pick up by Saturday noon. Just don't look at it in bright light ( or any light for that matter ).

Quality painters don't cut corners and don't cut prices much. The economy is tight but that also means that our personal budgets are tight, too. You actually insult a professional painter when you haggle too much. I'll work with somebody on price but you are going to be doing some of the work for that price reduction. My time is valuable and so are my skills. I pay overhead where I paint....it's called my mortgage. I have electrical costs, tool costs, paint costs, fuel costs. These costs are not negotiable. Why is my time negotiable? For a Fiero? All the work that is involved? I'd rather do scratch touch-ups on Malibus and Cobalts. I make a lot more money for the time I spend.

I'm not going to give away my services. The people that are getting 4-6k paint jobs have something special and are treating it as such.

Mark

I know that taking parts off of a car to paint is a lot of work and so is prep and I don`t want to insult anyone because I don`t know a lot about it.
I guess I`m just wondering about this scenario.
Say someone brings you a car on a trailer and it has basically a shell.
What does an actual spray job on that type of scenario cost compared to actually having to take all of the bumper, emblems and various other accessories off just to get it ready to paint?
I know that you more than likely can`t get a very good job rolling paint on, and it`s been a many number of years since I have painted a complete car, but the last project I did, I found fairly easy to use a color/clear coat system and although I didn`t spend a lot of time color sanding, it was getting there and with a little more buffing it would have been very smooth and shiny.

Oh, and Bloozberry I would almost bet a good number of high end shops live on collision repair that insurance companies pay for, at least around here they do, unless they only do custom work, which I`m pretty sure there isn`t a lot here.

[This message has been edited by TXGOOD (edited 03-26-2011).]

quote Originally posted by TXGOOD: Oh, and Bloozberry I would almost bet a good number of high end shops live on collision repair that insurance companies pay for, at least around here they do, unless they only do custom work, which I`m pretty sure there isn`t a lot here.

This is true.

I amost always can do a complete 2-3 color coat paint job on an average smaller car like a Corvette or Porsche with 1 quart of basecoat color...unless its a low coverage color. I did my Sebring in Corvette Sunburst Orange that didnt cover worth a crap, so it took 4-5 coats. Also since it was a color change from silver I had to do the jams and underhood/trunk so it took 2 quarts for whole job. Also covered that basecoat with 3 coats of clear (1 quart) so it could be color sanded and buffed. I used R&M/BASF and total cost of paint material was $180. Looks better than new OEM. Took me 2 eight hour days. I painted my own Cessna airplane with 2 gallons of single stage. My Coronet was a low coverage color (light yellow) too, its huge, and with jams and all it took 3 quarts of base and 2 clear, also color sanded and buffed.

Anyone that dont believe me is welcome to bring their already prepped car here and have me shoot it for them. Except for some special colors you will pay for 1 quart of color/ w reducer and 1 quart of clear/ hardener at my shop cost .... plus labor cost of a few hours. You color sand and buff it if you want....I dont anymore.

[This message has been edited by rogergarrison (edited 03-27-2011).]

Well, if Roger says he can buy your car "good" paint for under $400 to paint your whole car, then I'll be the first to admit I was wrong about not being able to buy "even the paint for under $400". If I were the OP, or anyone else living near him, I'd jump on his offer. So that's $180 in materials, "plus labor cost of a few hours" (that couldn't possibly cost more than $400 - $180 = $220 right Roger?) When someone puts their money where their mouth is, then you've got to respect that.

Now, everybody has a different opinion on what a good paint job is, that can't be denied, however the devil in these kinds of deals is always in the details. For example, in my opinion a good paint job:

1. doesn't stop at the surfaces you see when it's all buttoned up. Not painting the door jams, door, hood, and trunk edges, fender tops under the hood etc isn't a good paint job. Anyone who's had a half-baked paint job in the past will tell you that's where the new paint will fail first, at the edge between the old and the new;

2. means that the buyer doesn't have to take corrective action on his own, like working dust, drips, overspray, or orange peel out of the finish;

3. will use a quality primer/surfacer over the old paint; and

4. will have a paint and labor warranty for a minimum of five years, (all the better shops have a lifetime warranty).

Furthermore, while I conceed that I was wrong about the cost of the actual paint being less than $400 (because Roger says he can do it for $180), I wouldn't expect anyone to think that's how much they should budget. Roger (understanding the business very well) has a few very important caveats in his offer regarding the level of prep to be done by you, "color sanding and buffing", choice of colors, quantities of paint, areas to be painted, and his lack of a mention of primer should be noted.

[This message has been edited by Bloozberry (edited 03-28-2011).]

Yep, thats for me buying only the paint and reducer and I dont do any color sanding after. You prepsand, you primer, you mask. Im just spraying paint.

Paint jobs I did with my prep and my primer, I always guaranteed it as long as the original owner had it. Ive only had one or two comebacks for something minor since the 70s. All my past customers have always returned for more work, even to the point of their children even started bringing theirs. Trouble with that now is Im retired and not doing it anymore. Im only fixing friends fender benders and my own toys. Im going to do my Astro and thinking about the limo. My legs and back dont take to buffing anymore except for a panel or two.

quote Originally posted by rogergarrison: Anyone that dont believe me is welcome to bring their already prepped car here and have me shoot it for them. Except for some special colors you will pay for 1 quart of color/ w reducer and 1 quart of clear/ hardener at my shop cost .... plus labor cost of a few hours. You color sand and buff it if you want....I dont anymore.

WA_H_H_H_H_H_H ! I wish I still lived in Ohio! Driving my SE to have Roger shoot it would kill the cost (

With over 210,000 miles on it -I asume you mean the drivetrain- are you sure you want to spend much on paint? Whears you're likely to need a lot of other costly things real soon; like an engine rebuild/or/swap, auto tans work or clutch, suspension work etc etc? Cheepest way to a good paint job is do all the perp work yourself.

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trueleo.com
RSpiderII@aol.com

quote Originally posted by Bloozberry: Well, if Roger says he can buy your car "good" paint for under $400 to paint your whole car, then I'll be the first to admit I was wrong about not being able to buy "even the paint for under $400". If I were the OP, or anyone else living near him, I'd jump on his offer. So that's $180 in materials, "plus labor cost of a few hours" (that couldn't possibly cost more than $400 - $180 = $220 right Roger?) When someone puts their money where their mouth is, then you've got to respect that.

Well it's nice that you believe SOMEBODY...

quote Originally posted by Bloozberry: Now, everybody has a different opinion on what a good paint job is, that can't be denied, however the devil in these kinds of deals is always in the details. For example, in my opinion a good paint job: 1. doesn't stop at the surfaces you see when it's all buttoned up. Not painting the door jams, door, hood, and trunk edges, fender tops under the hood etc isn't a good paint job. Anyone who's had a half-baked paint job in the past will tell you that's where the new paint will fail first, at the edge between the old and the new; 2. means that the buyer doesn't have to take corrective action on his own, like working dust, drips, overspray, or orange peel out of the finish; 3. will use a quality primer/surfacer over the old paint; and 4. will have a paint and labor warranty for a minimum of five years, (all the better shops have a lifetime warranty). Furthermore, while I conceed that I was wrong about the cost of the actual paint being less than $400 (because Roger says he can do it for $180), I wouldn't expect anyone to think that's how much they should budget. Roger (understanding the business very well) has a few very important caveats in his offer regarding the level of prep to be done by you, "color sanding and buffing", choice of colors, quantities of paint, areas to be painted, and his lack of a mention of primer should be noted.

(3) I use PPG epoxy (DP) primer & THERE IS NOTHING AS GOOD AS IT for adhesion, sealing, & just generally giving you a good solid base to shoot paint over.
~ Paul
aka "Tha Driver"

I used some DP40 when I did my Phoenix, it was a good base over the bare metal after I stripped all the completely failed paint off. I used Kirker epoxy over some parts of my Formula mainly as a sealer coat, on the hood and headlight doors. I topped it off with catalyzed filler primer (urethane) which I blocked with 400 wet, then base and clear coat. Looking back, I'd probably have skipped the epoxy since though my clear was completely failed the base was still decent. The rest of the car I sanded with 220 DA, fill-primed, wetsanded 400, then base and clear coats. Spent as much time sanding as all the rest put together. Came out ok, actually pretty decent. Some parts I got full gloss with no OP, some had a little OP but I'll colorsand and buff that out.

quote Originally posted by Tha Driver: Well it's nice that you believe SOMEBODY...

Ha! After I shut my computer off for the night I remembered you too had come up with a paint-only option for under $400. Whoops! I debated firing the computer back up again and editing my post but thought I'd have time before you looked at the thread in the morning. Well that didn't happen. I trust you too there Tha Driver. Feel better?

quote Originally posted by Bloozberry: Ha! After I shut my computer off for the night I remembered you too had come up with a paint-only option for under $400. Whoops! I debated firing the computer back up again and editing my post but thought I'd have time before you looked at the thread in the morning. Well that didn't happen. I trust you too there Tha Driver. Feel better?

Just a little bit.
I usually get very little respect here so it didn't surprise me...
For those that don't already know, I've been doing paint work since I was 12, rebuilt my first total at 14, & did my first overall paintjob at 16 - back in 1969.
~ Paul
aka "Tha Driver"
EDIT: But of course that's not exactly what you said after I posted that info... //www.fiero.nl/forum/F...HTML/115098.html#p30

[This message has been edited by Tha Driver (edited 03-28-2011).]

i feel like i started WWIII

quote Originally posted by rmbrown09: i feel like i started WWIII

Yeah, when you post paint questions here you always get folks that don't have any real experience trying to tell you how you can do a perfect paintjob in two days for $100 (or something like that).
But I think you can weed out the real advice if you try.
Actually I've noticed no matter what the question you always get someone that doesn't know what he's talking about...
~ Paul
aka "Tha Driver"

I am painting my 88 Formula. Right now I have 2 quarts of base and 2 quarts of primer. I am also in the autobody class at the local Technical Collage. I am getting a discount on materials and get to use the paint booth and equipment. Right now I am at just under $300 for materials and supplies. I may have to spend another $50 before it is done. I will be shooting 2 coats of base and 2 or 3 coats of clear on her. Hope to have her done in several weeks. I have found out that the Prep work is the biggest pain in the a$$ and Roger and all you others that paint Professionally, Hats off to you and I will stick to my Powder Coating business Now I know I will have issues when done but I feel it will look 1000x better then macco.

Joe

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88 Formula CJB Arrived Finally. #689 of 1252
Time to start Working TONY!
There are Two kinds of Fiero's : Notchies and Donors!

I started myself in 1962 or so. My first project was designing and making a car from scratch for the now long defunct annual General Motors Styling Contest.

I entirely agree that spraying the paint is the easiest part...if you know what your doing. My point if you read it was not in any skills, but the cost of the materials. I dont believe is wasting money on overpriced materials that arent any better than a lot of others. I also dont buy $200 jeans. ....$15 ones from KMart last me years as does their $15 shoes. I havent bought any high priced PPG stuff for 25 years.

Am I allowed to participate?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by fierosound:

$50 to $10,000 - How good do you want it to be?

this is so true it all depends on what you think is good

quote Originally posted by rmbrown09: i feel like i started WWIII

It's not your fault. The skills necessary to disagree with someone without being hostile and adversarial about it have become a long-lost art that few practice at nowadays. I wouldn't worry to much about it.

quote Originally posted by Tha Driver: You do realize that shooting the paint is the EASIEST part of the whole process - right? ~ Paul aka "Tha Driver"

Yeah, but, he can get the paint cheaper than I can AND unfortunately my step-dad passed before I could learn how to shoot 'real' paint. I can put a primer layer down and prep it for the final shooting but I never really had a chance to learn how to mix and shoot paint like he did.

[This message has been edited by bulldog85043 (edited 03-29-2011).]

You can teach yourself how to paint fairly easy. Just get some scrap body panels and go at it. Most paints now require specific mixing so you cant mess it up. You just play with air pressure and fan control and do it till you can do it right. The trick is to get overlap of strokes, and how wet you can get it without running. You have to get it wet to keep from getting dull 'dry' areas. Of course, it can be sanded and buffed out if you dont get it perfect. There is just a sweet spot you have to find for yourself that no training or textbook stuff will ever teach you. not wet enough and you get rough, dull spots, too wet and it slides down the side into a puddle on the floor. Practice makes perfect. Start out with panels laying fairly flat on a sawhorse or bench, then try panels hanging down vertical. I taught myself how to spray paint by spraying LOTS of primer, then watching someone spray color.

[This message has been edited by rogergarrison (edited 03-29-2011).]

Thanks Roger. I have to picj up the part for my compressor this week-end so I can try my hand at shooting next week-end. I plan on stopping by one of the local bofdy shops to pick up a couple of thier junk panels to paint on.

Left you a +

Had a friend go through this last year.

He needed his hood and nose painted. Too cheap to pay to get it done at a reputable shop, and knows what he'll get from the low-priced shop that painted the whole car years ago (lots of little fixes to the paint afterwards). He figured he could do a better job himself.

By the time he bought the all the prep supplies, paint, paint gun etc. he was only about $200 under what the reputable shop would have done it for - not to mention the hours and hours of work spent on it. He found out it's not so easy.

He's already painted it TWICE now - and still isn't 100% happy with his work.
He may be doing it over a THIRD time once summer gets here.


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My World of Wheels Winners (Click on links below)

3.4L Supercharged 87 GT and Super Duty 4 Indy #163

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 03-30-2011).]

Bulldog, don't forget to add a quality filter and water vapor filter (dessicant) to your air line. Water vapor in the compressed air is a killer. Also, you should consider wetting the floor around the car to keep the dust levels down and the dried overspray on the floor from being blown around.

Never mind guys, he got us... You are right Ruffy. all us paint guys are trying to screw you. you can get a show quality paint job for $400.00 and a $15.00 Gun shoots as good as my $800.00 gun.

You got the secret, you can get a unbelieveable paint job for $400.00.. and no you dont need a paint hood or air extractor... you can paint it in the front yard.

Those of us that have shot paint and paid for it are required to take an oath to lie to others to help keep the price up. The custom airbrushing my bike has really only cost $12.00 to pay the local crack addict for his time with a couple of rattlecans.

Dang it, I let the secret out and the Painters Guild is going to come and break my legs.... Anyone know how to setup a fiero to be driven with hand controls?

quote Originally posted by fierosound: By the time he bought the all the prep supplies, paint, paint gun etc. he was only about $200 under what the reputable shop would have done it for - not to mention the hours and hours of work spent on it. He found out it's not so easy.

The advantage he has is he doesn't have to buy all the non-consumables again for the next paint job. My first paint job cost around $900 all tools and supplies included. My next paint job cost me less than $300, and I have enough clear and basecoat left that I could do a couple of panel repairs for less than $20 to cover sandpaper, guidecoat, paint filters, and mixing sticks.

I already own everything to do any job. All I need to buy is the paint. I painted one of my Corvettes pearle white with red stripes and ghost flames for under $200. The next week I took a paint trophy at a Midwest Regional All Corvette Show.

quote Originally posted by JazzMan: The advantage he has is he doesn't have to buy all the non-consumables again for the next paint job.

The "next paint job" will likely be doing his hood over again - maybe

But I see your point. He'll now have the tools (that he'll never use again).

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 03-30-2011).]

quote Originally posted by fierosound: The "next paint job" will likely be doing his hood over again - maybe But I see your point. He'll now have the tools (that he'll never use again).

If he's like most people I know, tools drive project initiation as much as the other way around. I've already painted a second set of plastics for my bike, painted the first set last year, and will probably paint another set next year. I'm sure I'll be able to find lots of other places to use my newly acquired tools...

Now that I've got my car running, and pretty well, I must admit, it's now time to get it painted. I went and visited a friend today who owns a body shop, and has been doing this for about 25 years.

I got a quote of $1200, but I have to provide the paint, sealer, flex agents, and clear. I'll take some before and after pics. I just want something better than Maaco, but not a job that costs more than the car is worth. It is, after all, just a bone stock 84.

Wish me luck!

I spent $4500 to paint my 2001 Camaro SS. I thought it seemed expensive but it was the lowest appraisal I'd gotten from multiple shops.

[This message has been edited by Steel (edited 04-25-2011).]

quote Originally posted by KraigG: Now that I've got my car running, and pretty well, I must admit, it's now time to get it painted. I went and visited a friend today who owns a body shop, and has been doing this for about 25 years. I got a quote of $1200, but I have to provide the paint, sealer, flex agents, and clear. I'll take some before and after pics. I just want something better than Maaco, but not a job that costs more than the car is worth. It is, after all, just a bone stock 84. Wish me luck!

No flex agents needed if you're using a quality catalyzed urethane paint, preferably a base/clear system. You also don't need sealer unless you're painting over someone else's mystery paint job. If it's the stock paint just sand down to good material, prime, block, and go. I've bought my paints from http://www.autobodytoolmart.com, the Kirker line, and have found them to be of pretty good quality for the price. ABTM will send you a nice color catalog with chips for free, just call their 800 number. The paints a little cantankerous to work with if the painter is a newbie, but an experienced painter can get outstanding results.

quote Originally posted by Tha Driver: I'm sorry: where's that smilie that has the guy rolling on the floor laughing his ass off & slapping the ground? A quart of clear (lacquer no less) to paint a Fiero - yeah right. & the rest of the list is BS too. EDIT: the OP said a GOOD paintjob not a lacquer screw-up.

I just cant help myself when you make statements like this. Ive done a lot of early Corvettes that are NCRS certified cars. There done in lacquer because the owner and restoration society expect it. You are right though amount the amount. I can clear one with 1 quart of urathane, but lacquer takes a lot more. Duplicolor clear is also already reduced. I do use 2 quarts of unreduced clear on one (makes a gallon ready to spray) to do 5 or 6 coats on one for a show finish. So with Duplicolor clear you will need 4 quart cans at minimum. NCRS deducts lots of points and value for old ones NOT done in lacquer. However this is starting to be more acceptable because of the access to lacquer in most places now. Ive never had a 50s-early 60s owner want urathane basecoat except on one they drive a lot. For one thing the urathane shine on them just looks fake or wrong for a restored to mint car.

For the OP:

I just had my 88 Formula painted by a reputable shop here in El Paso for 800.00. They took three weeks to do it - which I thought was a little much but I paid a few visits to the shop during the process and was very pleased with thier attention to detail. The original quote was for 700.00 but I added a few things and they found some damage from the PO. In the end, the car was painted factory red, base coat clear coat (which I understand red is some fo the most costly paint). I had the mirrors painted the same color as the body. The rockers and front and rear spoiler repainted, the inner head light trim painted, etc. They did a very nice job for the price and I am taking 2 other Fiero's to them in the next 2 months. Is it perfect - no - I'm sure that someone could find something wrong but bottom line is I am happy with it and that really is all that matters. Shop around and look at the work they do. Reasonble shps are out there.

quote Originally posted by Tha Driver: I'm sorry: where's that smilie that has the guy rolling on the floor laughing his ass off & slapping the ground? A quart of clear (lacquer no less) to paint a Fiero - yeah right. & the rest of the list is BS too. EDIT: the OP said a GOOD paintjob not a lacquer screw-up.

quote Originally posted by rogergarrison: I just cant help myself when you make statements like this. Ive done a lot of early Corvettes that are NCRS certified cars. There done in lacquer because the owner and restoration society expect it. You are right though amount the amount. I can clear one with 1 quart of urathane, but lacquer takes a lot more. Duplicolor clear is also already reduced. I do use 2 quarts of unreduced clear on one (makes a gallon ready to spray) to do 5 or 6 coats on one for a show finish. So with Duplicolor clear you will need 4 quart cans at minimum. NCRS deducts lots of points and value for old ones NOT done in lacquer. However this is starting to be more acceptable because of the access to lacquer in most places now. Ive never had a 50s-early 60s owner want urathane basecoat except on one they drive a lot. For one thing the urathane shine on them just looks fake or wrong for a restored to mint car.

That's what I was talking about: You put ONE quart of lacquer clear on a car & it's a screw-up. Nothing wrong with lacquer on an antique if it's done right & taken care of (requires a LOT more attention & care than urethane).
~ Paul
aka "Tha Driver"

[This message has been edited by Tha Driver (edited 04-26-2011).]