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Paint Advice by Squeaky
Started on: 05-28-2010 12:23 PM
Replies: 9
Last post by: Firefox on 05-30-2010 12:59 PM
Squeaky
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Report this Post05-28-2010 12:23 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SqueakyClick Here to Email SqueakySend a Private Message to SqueakyDirect Link to This Post

My 87' Fiero GT is in dire need of a re-paint,. The neglect of the cars previous two owners has resulted with the peeling of the clear coat in numerous spots and I suspect at some point during it's lifetime it has undergone some painting as the hood and the driver's side front quarter panel are faded.
Unfortunately I'm on a tight budget, therefore I've decided to paint the car myself. I've purchased a HVLP spray gun, DA sander and all the nessesary equipment/supplies as mentioed in Delorean00's thread (http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/090549.html).

Here's where I'm running into problems:

I plan on purchasing some of the fiberglass panels (fascia, ground effects, side scoops) from fierofiberglass.com. I also plan on replacing the broken/chipped side moldings and marker lights from fierostore.com, on top of that the passenger door panel needs replacing. However I'm not the best when it comes to masking, in fact I'm almost certain if I do end up masking the paint will bleed like a mofo. Since I'd already be removing the fascia, passenger door panel, both side scoops, moldings, and ground effects, I figure I may as well remove all the panels (with the exception of the roof and maybe the rear clip). By doing this I can bypass most of the masking and ensure there is minimal over-spray to other parts of the car.

My only concerns are that there's a chance that the paint could get damaged during re-assmbly, and I'm worried that if I go this route that the paint maybe vary slightly from panel to panel.

Has anybody tried painting their Fiero this way? Any thought's, comments and suggestions are GREATLY appreciated.

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Jonviviano
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Report this Post05-28-2010 12:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JonvivianoClick Here to Email JonvivianoSend a Private Message to JonvivianoDirect Link to This Post

depending on your color choice car can vary from panel to panel. metallics will lay down differently When i painted my car myself i removed the trunk, hood, spoiler and front bumper. the color i those was a 1970's black cherry metallic. I didnt really notice and color variation between my panels. Take your time when painting and practice on something first to get your gun tuned in. If your careful reassembling your car i dont think you will damage any paint. The car will look much better if you paint the panels seperately. look through my build thread or many other threads on painting. Hope this helps.


-John

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tbone42
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Report this Post05-28-2010 12:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for tbone42Send a Private Message to tbone42Direct Link to This Post

I'm right there with you, friend. I am getting ready to do my own paint as well. Many of the body panels I will be using will be painted off the car. However, I am leaving the rear clip on. Otherwise, everything that is not already off will be coming off. I am lucky in the respect that many of the panels I will be using are not actually on my car right now.. they are coming from my donor car. (86 SE panels and wheel wells to be put on an 86 coupe) I'm even pulling the front roof clip off of it so I can have a sunroof again. Thanks for the paint link, that will be helpful too.

Here's how I plan to do it: Pull old fenders, Install front roof clip and then prep/paint both roof clips first. Then fenders, rockers, ground effects. nose and rear fascias, quarters and door skins get done. (They are all already off the other car.) I plan on doing a mass paint on those parts, all at once. Then I will pull the hood and decklid. Reinstall the other pieces, paint the hood and decklid and reinstall those. This is where I worry the most about messing the paint up. Just make sure your parts have had plenty of time to dry, have a friend help you with the heavy stuff, and put blankets over areas already installed next to where you are working (Like the fenders, nose and rear clip).. to try to avoid accidental chips and scratches. After all installed, assuming there is no need for touch ups, then I will final sand and buff it up and make it pretty.

Hopefully be done before winter, if not I will be rocking the multi-color car for a while.

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Firefox
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Report this Post05-28-2010 01:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FirefoxSend a Private Message to FirefoxDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Squeaky:

........My only concerns are that there's a chance that the paint could get damaged during re-assmbly, and I'm worried that if I go this route that the paint maybe vary slightly from panel to panel.



I am a painter and I usually paint Fieros disassembled. I paint the roof and rear clip on the car and then reassemble the pieces as I paint. Don't plan on removing the roof or rear clip. You have a good chance of damaging the SMC and it's not worth it to pull them. That's where the chance of damage is greatest. Some colors must be painted while the car is assembled.....silvers, golds, heavy metallics....because painting pieces at different times can give you a different color tone because of different spray pressures, spray speed, paint flow.....lots of variations. If you are spraying one of these types of colors, paint the car assembled and learn how to mask. Masking takes time and it's not hard.....you just need to be thorough.

As for assembling the car after painting, you are assembling pieces that are not metal. You don't have too many sharp edges and handling the pieces is pretty easy. Have a second and third person help with the hood and decklid and just go slow. the rest of the car is pretty east for one person to reassemble and if you are going to use good paint it'll hold up just fine. Again, just go slow.

What kind of paint are you using?

Take pics and start a build thread...

Mark the paint guy

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Tha Driver
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Report this Post05-28-2010 02:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Tha DriverClick Here to visit Tha Driver's HomePageSend a Private Message to Tha DriverDirect Link to This Post

1) Pre-fit all the fiberglass panels before doing anything.
2) I paint one with nothing but the roof panels left on.
3) When you paint it, hang all the vertical panels so that they'll all be the same color. Paint everything at the same time.
4) Take off ALL the non-factory paint.
5) Do a search using my username & you'll find out everything you need to know.
6) http://gafieroclub.org/bbs/index.php?topic=469.0
EDIT: 7) Adjust all the body panels for proper fit before taking it apart (replace door pins if needed). Mark around the bolts with a marker or scribe so that it will go back together the same way.
HTH,
~ Paul
aka "Tha Driver"

Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm. - Winston Churchill

[This message has been edited by Tha Driver (edited 05-28-2010).]

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Squeaky
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Report this Post05-28-2010 10:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SqueakyClick Here to Email SqueakySend a Private Message to SqueakyDirect Link to This Post

Thank's Firefox! Look's like I'm gonna have to buy some good quality tape and paper and acquire a little bit of patience, I was planning on using GM's Crystal Red Metallic, what brand of paint do you suggest? Tha Driver, you bring up a good point though. If I remove all the panels and paint them all at once I should be able to avoid any inconsistancy in regards to the finish. However, I don't imagine this will be the last time I paint a car. So a bit of masking experience might not be such a bad thing, unfortunately not all cars are like the Fiero where you have the ability to remove all the panels and components.

My Fiero is a Medium Red Metallic with silver ground effects, I'd like to keep the two-tone. I was planning on painting the ground effects a darker silver almost like a charcoal. I know I would have to mask the portions on the fascia and rear bumpers but should I remove the ground effects on the sides? Or would you guy's suggest I mask those as well?

Hahaha, power to ya tbone42!!! You and I will have to start some threads and show our progress. A while back I made new fiberglass headlight buckets similer to the ones in the GT widebody build (the orange one), only they're lower profile and instead of the hella 90mm modules I bought two pairs of 3.5" circular driving lights from Canadian Tire (Like a Canuck Menards). They ended up costing me $180.00 to build. I've been meaning to create a build thread on those.

[This message has been edited by Squeaky (edited 05-28-2010).]

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5150dana
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Report this Post05-28-2010 11:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 5150danaClick Here to Email 5150danaSend a Private Message to 5150danaDirect Link to This Post

I had the same idea many years ago and a friend reccomended I look up ROP classes at palomar college. They have a body shop class. It was at night only 2 days a week. They had every tool imaginable, high quality paint guns and a paint booth. They taught me everything and other students helped me work on my car. It only cost $150 which is far less than I would have spent on tape, paper, bondo and sand paper. It was so great I went for several semesters and painted 18 cars. I highly reccomend seeing if there's an ROP (regional occupation program) auto body and paint class near you.

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Firefox
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Report this Post05-28-2010 11:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FirefoxSend a Private Message to FirefoxDirect Link to This Post

I'd suggest using 3M brand masking tape....the green stuff. It works well and even if it gets wet it'll still stick and when it's time to come off it won't disintegrate. Masking paper? Use the stuff that's designed for automotive paint.....never ever use newspaper. For the edge between the colors on the facias you need to use a special tape designed for edges. 3M makes a blue vinyl tape that leaves a perfect edge whereas regular masking tape is not a smooth edge. Your paint guys will show you the difference.

As for brand of paint, I'll just suggest finding a paint supplier close to you. Talk with the guys there and they can steer you into a brand that's easy to get and you'll need all of the information sheets that they can supply for you. These product sheets give you the mixing ratios, mixing times, flash times, recoat times and everything you'll need to know about spraying the paint and clear. I personally use only PPG products but these are much more expensive than some of the ' value brands ' out there. I only spray urethane now.....I do not use lacquer or enamel. Lacquer paints are very labor intensive and you end up doing a ton of sanding to get your pretty finish. It is easy to spray and if you make a mistake it dries fast so you can repair you oopsy and respray. Enamel paint is much more difficult to spray. It does give you a nice finish when you are done IF you spray it right. One major drawback is that the overspray is still sticky and will make anything in the area of your paint shop the color you spray. Plus, if you've never sprayed before you'll run it all over the place. It's not easy to spray. It stays wet for a long time and dust is an issue. It's mainly a paint you spray in a paint booth. Urethane paints give you a very durable finish with the spray ease of lacquer for the color. There are a lot of variables in clear. PPG has several different choices for clear and I really can't suggest a specific clear for you. I am not familiar with other brands at all. Your local supplier can help you out with your choices and info. I highly recommend you do not use an internet supplier as your support is pretty much non-existant. Find a local paint shop and talk to the guys that know what the paint is all about. They have all the info you need and the experience to give you pointers.

In regard to your ground effects, I always remove them for painting. It's difficult to get a really nice edge on them in place but it's not impossible to mask them off. They aren't the easiest things to get off of the car because of the retainers used but it's not impossible to get them off. I just pulled apart my wife's car today and I didn't break a single retainer on the ground effects....that was a first. I usually break 4 or 5 of them. When you have the panels off of the car you can look at the retainers and see if you want to deal with them. If you can get them off there is nothing to mask....just scuff and spray and reassemble. But if you do get adventurous just be careful. When I break clips, I find that the self-threading stamped nuts work well in place of the retainers when reassembling.

Start your build thread. If you have questions, post them. We have several painters here that are more than willing to help out with any advice we have.

Good luck and let us know how things turn out.

Mark the paint guy

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Squeaky
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Report this Post05-29-2010 06:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SqueakyClick Here to Email SqueakySend a Private Message to SqueakyDirect Link to This Post

Oh, I forgot! I was meaning to ask, what's the smallest size compressor that would be suitable for painting? I heard somewhere that a 30 gallon would be alright.

Thank's again for everybody's help and advice, Fiero enthusiasts are like none other when it comes to such! =)

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Firefox
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Report this Post05-30-2010 12:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FirefoxSend a Private Message to FirefoxDirect Link to This Post

Compressor size is 2 fold. How much air it stores and how much air it compresses. There is a flow rate in CFM and then the storage tank in gallons. You'll need to get a compressor that puts out more air than the spray gun uses......plus a decent size storage tank. A 30 gallon tank should be ok. You'll need to find out what the air CFM requirements are for the gun you are using. There are a lot of compressors out there so make sure you get a good quality one.....and not some cheap brand.

I have a older Sears unit It's an oil compressor with a 60 gallon tank. Mine works well. There are several threads with compressor discussions that would probaby give you a better idea about what's available.

Mark

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