Pennock's Fiero Forum
  Technical Discussion & Questions - Archive
  Personalized Caliper covers for LeBaron Brake Conversions (Page 1)

T H I S   I S   A N   A R C H I V E D   T O P I C
  

Email This Page to Someone! | Printable Version

This topic is 2 pages long:  1   2 
Previous Page | Next Page
Personalized Caliper covers for LeBaron Brake Conversions by Archie
Started on: 09-10-2009 11:56 AM
Replies: 50
Last post by: MotorTV on 12-13-2009 01:57 PM
Archie
Member
Posts: 9436
From: Las Vegas, NV
Registered: Dec 1999


Feedback score:    (12)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 546
Rate this member

Report this Post09-10-2009 11:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ArchieClick Here to visit Archie's HomePageSend a Private Message to ArchieDirect Link to This Post
I've always thought about making personalized caliper covers for my Big Brake conversions.

Most people refer to this brake conversion as the Zettner or the LeBaron conversion. They're all the same.

A couple of months ago, I mentioned this to my friend Chuck (MotorTV).

Since he has a small homemade CNC mill in his garage (<~~yes, he's pretty resourceful) I told him he could run with it if we wanted to.

As a result, he's finally ready to make them & sell them as a kit for those that are interested.

They are made out of 3/8" thick aluminium. He can personalize them with your name, you car's name, your PFF name of just about anything you want to put on them. He'll be able to fill you in on the details but I'd try to limit the number of characters you ask him to put in them. He's going to be making me a set that has "V-8 Archie" on them.

He also can anodize them in basic colors or they can be painted or powercoated to your taste.

Anyway, you'll need to talk to Chuck (MotorTV) about pricing & your specifications for what you want.

The purpose of this thread is to prove out Chuck's 1st "Kit" & show that they can be installed on a car with this brake conversion without taking the brakes off of the car.

Dave B. (DL10) is the guy who's getting the 1st set & Chuck sent me the 1st "Kit" to test install on Dave's Great Blue Chop Top (GBCT).

Dave plans to have his covers painted when he gets his car painted, so these covers are raw aluminium.

Here are the components of the kit.....

There is a 1/4-20 Tap with the correct Tap drill. 8 1/4-20 Stainless Steel Allen Head Cap Screws. 2 little plastic sleeves & the 4 Personalized Caliper Covers.



The Cover has the 2 outboard holes are there to provide clearance for the 2 caliper pin bolts. The 2 inboard holes are drilled 1/4" thru with a counterbore for the heads of the cap screws that will attach the cover to the caliper.



Before



After



I'll continue this thread with a detailed description of mounting them on the GBCT.

Archie

[This message has been edited by Archie (edited 09-10-2009).]

IP: Logged
PFF
System Bot
Fierofreak00
Member
Posts: 4221
From: Martville, NY USA
Registered: Jun 2001


Feedback score:    (20)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 170
Rate this member

Report this Post09-10-2009 12:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Fierofreak00Send a Private Message to Fierofreak00Direct Link to This Post
Neat idea...I like it.
IP: Logged
Oreif
Member
Posts: 16460
From: Schaumburg, IL
Registered: Jan 2000


Feedback score:    (19)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 442
Rate this member

Report this Post09-10-2009 12:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for OreifClick Here to visit Oreif's HomePageSend a Private Message to OreifDirect Link to This Post
Sure, Now he brings them out. With only 3 days to Fierorama, Bet his car already has a set on.


Cool idea, Looks like Chuck's going to be getting a phone call.

------------------

Happiness isn't around the corner...
Happiness IS the corner.

ZZ4 Powered !!

IP: Logged
topcat
Member
Posts: 5486
From: Charleston SC
Registered: Dec 2001


Feedback score:    (7)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 148
Rate this member

Report this Post09-10-2009 09:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for topcatSend a Private Message to topcatDirect Link to This Post
I like it. More info please... like when can I buy a set?
IP: Logged
Archie
Member
Posts: 9436
From: Las Vegas, NV
Registered: Dec 1999


Feedback score:    (12)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 546
Rate this member

Report this Post09-11-2009 03:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ArchieClick Here to visit Archie's HomePageSend a Private Message to ArchieDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by topcat:

I like it. More info please... like when can I buy a set?


He is making them right now.

You can send Chuck a PM at MotorTV He'll have all that information.

When he sees this thread, he'll most likely pop in.

Archie
IP: Logged
TopNotch
Member
Posts: 3537
From: Lawrenceville, GA USA
Registered: Feb 2009


Feedback score:    (7)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 60
Rate this member

Report this Post09-11-2009 04:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TopNotchClick Here to visit TopNotch's HomePageSend a Private Message to TopNotchDirect Link to This Post
How about some that say "brembo"? The guy who parks his Nissan Z next to my Fiero has big Brembo calipers.

IP: Logged
rogergarrison
Member
Posts: 49601
From: A Western Caribbean Island/ Columbus, Ohio
Registered: Apr 99


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 551
Rate this member

Report this Post09-11-2009 04:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rogergarrisonSend a Private Message to rogergarrisonDirect Link to This Post
Nice idea. they look a lot nicer than just painting them.
IP: Logged
Dogcreek
Member
Posts: 478
From: Spokane, WA, USA
Registered: Aug 2006


Feedback score: (4)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post09-11-2009 09:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for DogcreekSend a Private Message to DogcreekDirect Link to This Post
Great idea Archie! This would be a nice addition...

Jeff

------------------

IP: Logged
dratts
Member
Posts: 8373
From: Coeur d' alene Idaho USA
Registered: Apr 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 119
Rate this member

Report this Post09-11-2009 10:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for drattsSend a Private Message to drattsDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by TopNotch:

How about some that say "brembo"? The guy who parks his Nissan Z next to my Fiero has big Brembo calipers.


I've seen Brembo covers on ebay pretty reasonable.
IP: Logged
Fiero84Freak
Member
Posts: 4787
From: AR
Registered: Feb 2002


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 66
Rate this member

Report this Post09-12-2009 12:58 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Fiero84FreakSend a Private Message to Fiero84FreakDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by dratts:

I've seen Brembo covers on ebay pretty reasonable.


You don't mean these ridiculous things do you?

You do know you 'glue' these on right? I wouldn't trust something I can't actually bolt on, which to me there doesn't seem to be anyway to do that with these brembo 'covers' without modifying them and potentially damaging them.
IP: Logged
dratts
Member
Posts: 8373
From: Coeur d' alene Idaho USA
Registered: Apr 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 119
Rate this member

Report this Post09-12-2009 11:15 AM Click Here to See the Profile for drattsSend a Private Message to drattsDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Fiero84Freak:


You don't mean these ridiculous things do you?

You do know you 'glue' these on right? I wouldn't trust something I can't actually bolt on, which to me there doesn't seem to be anyway to do that with these brembo 'covers' without modifying them and potentially damaging them.


Yes those were the ones I was referring to. I don't know that much about high temperature adhesives. They seem to work pretty good on the space shuttle most of the time except for the challenger. Why do they look ridiculous? I think I would be fooled by a walk by. The covers are not structural so I don't think they would need bolts unless the adhesive is no good or doesn't handle the heat generated by the calipers.

[This message has been edited by dratts (edited 09-12-2009).]

IP: Logged
PFF
System Bot
Fiero84Freak
Member
Posts: 4787
From: AR
Registered: Feb 2002


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 66
Rate this member

Report this Post09-12-2009 03:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Fiero84FreakSend a Private Message to Fiero84FreakDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by dratts:

Why do they look ridiculous? I think I would be fooled by a walk by. The covers are not structural so I don't think they would need bolts unless the adhesive is no good or doesn't handle the heat generated by the calipers.



I didn't say they looked ridiculous. I said they are ridiculous. You're sticking on something that is made out of ABS plastic. While for sure they're be able to withstand the heat, I can't see them staying together forever on most applications, especially with 'spirited' driving that a lot of people do. Can you imagine the sound and crunching that would happen if it came loose and trapped itself against the wheel? Umm.... yeah. Sorry but I won't take that chance.

I'm surprised they've gone down now though. I remember first seeing these a few years ago and they were going for big big bucks, like $150-$170 -ish. You can also get Endless and Project Mu covers, although the later is hard to find.

I would say though if given the chance and the need I'd buy the ones from Chuck (MotorTV). Those are a lot smoother and more unique than some old 'rice' brake caliper covers.

Alright, I'm done jacking the thread.
IP: Logged
rogergarrison
Member
Posts: 49601
From: A Western Caribbean Island/ Columbus, Ohio
Registered: Apr 99


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 551
Rate this member

Report this Post09-12-2009 11:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rogergarrisonSend a Private Message to rogergarrisonDirect Link to This Post
I know quite a few people that just get vinyl letters saying Corvette or Brembo and stick them on their painted calipers. They hold up just fine.
IP: Logged
Archie
Member
Posts: 9436
From: Las Vegas, NV
Registered: Dec 1999


Feedback score:    (12)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 546
Rate this member

Report this Post09-13-2009 08:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ArchieClick Here to visit Archie's HomePageSend a Private Message to ArchieDirect Link to This Post
Wow, this went a little South.....

This is about Custom made Personalized Caliper covers.

It's not about Decals & Plastic covers.

I'll be talking to Chuck today at the FieroRama & I'll find out why he hasn't found this thread yet.

Archie
IP: Logged
topcat
Member
Posts: 5486
From: Charleston SC
Registered: Dec 2001


Feedback score:    (7)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 148
Rate this member

Report this Post09-13-2009 09:04 AM Click Here to See the Profile for topcatSend a Private Message to topcatDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Archie:

...
I'll be talking to Chuck today at the FieroRama & I'll find out why he hasn't found this thread yet.

Archie


Thanks - I sent him a PM but have not heard back yet.
IP: Logged
dratts
Member
Posts: 8373
From: Coeur d' alene Idaho USA
Registered: Apr 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 119
Rate this member

Report this Post09-13-2009 10:07 AM Click Here to See the Profile for drattsSend a Private Message to drattsDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Archie:

Wow, this went a little South.....

This is about Custom made Personalized Caliper covers.

It's not about Decals & Plastic covers.

I'll be talking to Chuck today at the FieroRama & I'll find out why he hasn't found this thread yet.

Archie
Sorry Archie, I was responding to the Brembo post. I realize that yours are an original custom design and nothing like the ebay items. Back to the purpose of the original post.

IP: Logged
Synthesis
Member
Posts: 12207
From: Jordan, MN
Registered: Feb 2002


Feedback score:    (19)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 294
Rate this member

Report this Post09-13-2009 10:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisDirect Link to This Post
I, for one, welcome our new CNC Milled Brake Caliper Beauty Covers.

I think they look great, and as soon as I get the chance to get the LeBaron upgrade, I'll be looking into a set of these.
IP: Logged
rogergarrison
Member
Posts: 49601
From: A Western Caribbean Island/ Columbus, Ohio
Registered: Apr 99


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 551
Rate this member

Report this Post09-13-2009 03:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rogergarrisonSend a Private Message to rogergarrisonDirect Link to This Post
Arch, I just mentioned that to illustrate calipers dont get as hot as most people believe in street drivng. To listen to a lot, they get hot enough to melt solder or fry eggs. Mine last for years painted with Krylon spray can.
IP: Logged
MotorTV
Member
Posts: 260
From: chicago,il,usa
Registered: Nov 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post09-13-2009 10:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MotorTVClick Here to visit MotorTV's HomePageSend a Private Message to MotorTVDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by topcat:


Thanks - I sent him a PM but have not heard back yet.


I just checked the pm and there is no new ones....
Thanks to all at Fierorama for their input on these...
Chuck
IP: Logged
topcat
Member
Posts: 5486
From: Charleston SC
Registered: Dec 2001


Feedback score:    (7)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 148
Rate this member

Report this Post09-14-2009 03:58 AM Click Here to See the Profile for topcatSend a Private Message to topcatDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by MotorTV:


I just checked the pm and there is no new ones....
Thanks to all at Fierorama for their input on these...
Chuck


please check again. resent
IP: Logged
Pyrthian
Member
Posts: 29569
From: Detroit, MI
Registered: Jul 2002


Feedback score: (5)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 342
Rate this member

Report this Post09-14-2009 09:20 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PyrthianSend a Private Message to PyrthianDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by TopNotch:
How about some that say "brembo"? The guy who parks his Nissan Z next to my Fiero has big Brembo calipers.


not without infringing a copyright
you can do it privately, on your own - but a business is not allowed to do it for you
IP: Logged
PFF
System Bot
Archie
Member
Posts: 9436
From: Las Vegas, NV
Registered: Dec 1999


Feedback score:    (12)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 546
Rate this member

Report this Post09-14-2009 10:39 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ArchieClick Here to visit Archie's HomePageSend a Private Message to ArchieDirect Link to This Post
Here are some more examples of Chuck's parts.

IP: Logged
Fiero84Freak
Member
Posts: 4787
From: AR
Registered: Feb 2002


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 66
Rate this member

Report this Post09-14-2009 11:02 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Fiero84FreakSend a Private Message to Fiero84FreakDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Archie:

Wow, this went a little South.....

This is about Custom made Personalized Caliper covers.


I apologize as well. I think the product is a good idea, considering the amount of people that are going with the LeBaron conversion.

[This message has been edited by Fiero84Freak (edited 09-14-2009).]

IP: Logged
Jefrysuko
Member
Posts: 3491
From: Oreana IL
Registered: Apr 2000


Feedback score:    (17)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 108
Rate this member

Report this Post09-14-2009 06:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JefrysukoSend a Private Message to JefrysukoDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Archie:

Here are some more examples of Chuck's parts.



Any pictures of them on Chucks car?
IP: Logged
MP5Na3
Member
Posts: 307
From: nebraska
Registered: Jul 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post09-14-2009 08:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MP5Na3Send a Private Message to MP5Na3Direct Link to This Post
PM sent.

David
IP: Logged
MotorTV
Member
Posts: 260
From: chicago,il,usa
Registered: Nov 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post09-14-2009 09:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MotorTVClick Here to visit MotorTV's HomePageSend a Private Message to MotorTVDirect Link to This Post
I finely had time to sit down and work out a price...
It looks like 125 dollars a set of four, with the install kit
I can fit nine letters in one line for this price, this includes any spaces.
As for anodizing clear and colors, I still have to work that out...
I can fit all four covers in my tank at once but i will have to get prices on dyes that i don't have...
If you are looking to have the letters painted in, this can be taken care of as well...
Dave is having his painted body color by the same guy that is painting his car...
The best bang for the buck is to paint them yourself...
The mounting screws are stainless steel so they will not rust...
Let me know what you think...
Chuck
IP: Logged
Riceburner98
Member
Posts: 2179
From: Natick, Ma, USA
Registered: Apr 2002


Feedback score:    (10)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 80
Rate this member

Report this Post09-14-2009 11:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Riceburner98Send a Private Message to Riceburner98Direct Link to This Post
Do the outer through-holes have to go all the way through, or can they just be milled from the back side to clear whatever they're supposed to clear? IMO they look unique but the extra holes with no bolt heads look a little funny.. . I have the LeBaron swap brackets but don't have calipers yet so I can't look for myself..
IP: Logged
MotorTV
Member
Posts: 260
From: chicago,il,usa
Registered: Nov 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post09-15-2009 11:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MotorTVClick Here to visit MotorTV's HomePageSend a Private Message to MotorTVDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Riceburner98:

Do the outer through-holes have to go all the way through, or can they just be milled from the back side to clear whatever they're supposed to clear? IMO they look unique but the extra holes with no bolt heads look a little funny.. . I have the LeBaron swap brackets but don't have calipers yet so I can't look for myself..


The outer holes are for clearence to the caliper mounting bolts...
As the brakepads wear the bolts slide further through the covers, so the holes must go all the way through to avoid binding the calipers up...

As of this time there are no pictures of them on my car because i have been busy making other peoples sets before mine... :-)
Chuck
IP: Logged
exoticse
Member
Posts: 8650
From: Orlando, Fl
Registered: Jun 2003


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 108
Rate this member

Report this Post09-16-2009 12:40 AM Click Here to See the Profile for exoticseSend a Private Message to exoticseDirect Link to This Post


Chuck has got to be one of the most talented guys on this forum,....there is not much that this guy hasn't done or can't do !

Great product.
IP: Logged
topcat
Member
Posts: 5486
From: Charleston SC
Registered: Dec 2001


Feedback score:    (7)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 148
Rate this member

Report this Post09-16-2009 04:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for topcatSend a Private Message to topcatDirect Link to This Post
PM sent
IP: Logged
Riceburner98
Member
Posts: 2179
From: Natick, Ma, USA
Registered: Apr 2002


Feedback score:    (10)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 80
Rate this member

Report this Post09-16-2009 05:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Riceburner98Send a Private Message to Riceburner98Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by MotorTV:
The outer holes are for clearence to the caliper mounting bolts...
As the brakepads wear the bolts slide further through the covers, so the holes must go all the way through to avoid binding the calipers up...
Chuck


Ah, that makes sense!
IP: Logged
PFF
System Bot
MotorTV
Member
Posts: 260
From: chicago,il,usa
Registered: Nov 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post09-16-2009 10:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MotorTVClick Here to visit MotorTV's HomePageSend a Private Message to MotorTVDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by topcat:

PM sent


PM answerd
Chuck
IP: Logged
MotorTV
Member
Posts: 260
From: chicago,il,usa
Registered: Nov 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post09-17-2009 09:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MotorTVClick Here to visit MotorTV's HomePageSend a Private Message to MotorTVDirect Link to This Post
Something like this? :-)



Do you know how small of a cutter it takes to fit that many letters on a cover... lol
Chuck
IP: Logged
topcat
Member
Posts: 5486
From: Charleston SC
Registered: Dec 2001


Feedback score:    (7)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 148
Rate this member

Report this Post09-18-2009 02:53 AM Click Here to See the Profile for topcatSend a Private Message to topcatDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by MotorTV:

Something like this? :-)



Do you know how small of a cutter it takes to fit that many letters on a cover... lol
Chuck


PERFECT!

IP: Logged
Mickey_Moose
Member
Posts: 7498
From: Edmonton, AB, Canada
Registered: May 2001


Feedback score: (3)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 143
Rate this member

Report this Post09-18-2009 01:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Mickey_MooseClick Here to visit Mickey_Moose's HomePageSend a Private Message to Mickey_MooseDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Fiero84Freak:

You don't mean these ridiculous things do you?

You do know you 'glue' these on right? I wouldn't trust something I can't actually bolt on, which to me there doesn't seem to be anyway to do that with these brembo 'covers' without modifying them and potentially damaging them.


Sorry for the side track, but I just wanted to point something out for those people that are considering these ABS covers listed on eBay: ABS operating temp is 176°F (80°C), Melting Point is at 221°F (105°C), and it's UV resistance is poor.

Anyways, back on track these covers that are offered here are a great ideal for those looking to cover up the calipers.
IP: Logged
MotorTV
Member
Posts: 260
From: chicago,il,usa
Registered: Nov 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post09-19-2009 11:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MotorTVClick Here to visit MotorTV's HomePageSend a Private Message to MotorTVDirect Link to This Post
For those of you that want to see what goes into making a part like this....
First the part is drawn in a cad program...



From the drawing, the code that the machine needs to cut the part is created...



The code is loaded into the cnc machine computer...
This code is the first tool, to cut the holes, counter bore and the outside of the part...



The material is clamped to the machine table, then the code is run, cutting the blank from the stock...



The tool is changed and the next program of code is loaded into the conputer...



The cutter used for these letters is only .060" thick...







Chuck

IP: Logged
Blacktree
Member
Posts: 20770
From: Central Florida
Registered: Dec 2001


Feedback score:    (12)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 350
Rate this member

Report this Post09-20-2009 01:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BlacktreeClick Here to visit Blacktree's HomePageSend a Private Message to BlacktreeDirect Link to This Post
How much do they weigh?
IP: Logged
Unsafe At Any Speed
Member
Posts: 2299
From: Cheyenne, WY
Registered: Feb 2003


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 315
Rate this member

Report this Post09-20-2009 02:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Unsafe At Any SpeedSend a Private Message to Unsafe At Any SpeedDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Blacktree:

How much do they weigh?


...exactly what I was going to ask.

------------------

My Build Thread

IP: Logged
SpeedyGSXR
Member
Posts: 167
From: Lima, OH
Registered: Aug 2004


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post09-20-2009 02:12 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SpeedyGSXRSend a Private Message to SpeedyGSXRDirect Link to This Post
Same Cad/Cam package I use. Looks good Chuck!

Gregg
IP: Logged
Khw
Member
Posts: 11139
From: South Weber, UT. U.S.A.
Registered: Jun 2008


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 134
Rate this member

Report this Post09-20-2009 02:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for KhwSend a Private Message to KhwDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Blacktree:

How much do they weigh?


Being aluminum, I can't imagine they weigh very much. A couple of pounds at most for a set of 4.


------------------

[This message has been edited by Khw (edited 09-20-2009).]

IP: Logged
Previous Page | Next Page

This topic is 2 pages long:  1   2 


All times are ET (US)

T H I S   I S   A N   A R C H I V E D   T O P I C
  

Contact Us | Back To Main Page

Advertizing on PFF | Fiero Parts Vendors
PFF Merchandise | Fiero Gallery | Ogre's Cave
Real-Time Chat | Fiero Related Auctions on eBay



Copyright (c) 1999, C. Pennock