anyone thought of trying to do this? obviously a different throttlebody would be required and a few other changes would need to be made...but the SFI and DIS would be nice together lets brainsstorm people....

Elaborate how you would set up that ignition...

quote Originally posted by Will: Elaborate how you would set up that ignition...

i havent done the research yet. just curious if anyone out there has thought about it. the distributor would have to be eliminated obvioulsy, and a new throttlebody would be needed. a cam position sensor, knock sensor, crank sensor, MAF, etc.... would have to be added to the engine...there's alot to take into aco**** to be sure...im just thinking that the LS1 PCM would be alot more tuneable, especially with all the extra engine work...

Jon Lagler has run a 4.9 on the 7730 computer with a TPI throttle body. That's still using the distributor ignition and batch fire, of course.

Also, Tunercat now has definition files for the 4.9 computer (2240). http://www.tunercat.com/tnr...cm_sup.html#cadillac

Aside from that, the 4.9 distributor has a 4x reluctor output and a 1/2x cam synch output. You could *possibly* have EFI Live swap modules around an build up a program for the 0411 (early LS1 computer) that included the trigger signal interpreter from the G-Van with the ignition output from an LS1. The G-Van used a Vortec 350 with distributor. You could fab a cover to go in place of the distributor cap so the dist functions only as a crank/cam sensor and has no high voltage components.

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 08-18-2009).]

It should be remembered that a 4.9L isn't a SBC. A few years ago Rick Stewart embarked on an all out 4.9L build with the N* pistons, Delta Cam, custom headers. headwork, balancing, Allante Intake etc. Rick spent big bucks on the engine build but when I spoke with him at Carlisle the year that the build was complete, Rick was disappointment in the performance and in the 14 mpg that he was getting. He said that he should have never sold the 3800SC.
If you want to site a sucessful 4.9L build it would have to be PBJ's 4.9L. As far as I know the main mod was the addition of a turbo with 5-6 psi of boost. His wife ran this Fiero to a mid 12 second 1/4 mile proving that boosting can greatly overcome the shortcomings of a small valve small port engine.
In stock form the 4.9L is a real torque powerhouse but if you plan to spend money on it, it seems the turbo is the way to go.

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

My understanding was that the above mentioned engine used a generic aftermarket performance chip that was *very* much out of tune. A modest increase in power and significant increase in gas mileage probably would have been possible with an optimizd tune. 250 WHP still would not have been very impressive for a built 5 litre V8, however.

quote Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua: It should be remembered that a 4.9L isn't a SBC. A few years ago Rick Stewart embarked on an all out 4.9L build with the N* pistons, Delta Cam, custom headers. headwork, balancing, Allante Intake etc. Rick spent big bucks on the engine build but when I spoke with him at Carlisle the year that the build was complete, Rick was disappointment in the performance and in the 14 mpg that he was getting. He said that he should have never sold the 3800SC. If you want to site a sucessful 4.9L build it would have to be PBJ's 4.9L. As far as I know the main mod was the addition of a turbo with 5-6 psi of boost. His wife ran this Fiero to a mid 12 second 1/4 mile proving that boosting can greatly overcome the shortcomings of a small valve small port engine. In stock form the 4.9L is a real torque powerhouse but if you plan to spend money on it, it seems the turbo is the way to go.

Rick also didnt put anything into tuning, his 14mpg's proved that he was running mega-rich, as did his dyno numbers and A/F ratio numbers. its sad really, because he poored money into drastically changing the engine, but didnt do anything about the tuning. with a proper tune, he could have gained 25-30HP from the numbers he was putting up, along with TQ as well. hell, in an untuned state, the thing put 234hp and 304tq to the ground, and with a manual transmission, thats translates to approx. 276 HP and 358 lb/ft TQ at the crank, that's about 75 HP and 85 lb/ft TQ increase over stock, WITHOUT a tune. Rockcrawl's chips are basically a stock tune, and that's what he used.

TPI Camaros are slower than LT1 Camaros, despite making more torque. Clearly simple torque does not win races.

And through a 282, that's more like 255 hp and 335 tq at the flywheel. I think that with a good tune he good have hit 250 whp... but a stock Northstar with a lousy tune will also do that.

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 08-19-2009).]

I can't help but wonder why??

Effort and money would be better put towards using a different engine, the 4.9 is and only is a cheap upgrade for the 2.8, not a race motor - but that is just me. However I would be interested in seeing how it all works out if you decide to take this approach.

[This message has been edited by Mickey_Moose (edited 08-19-2009).]

I don't see the point of the LS1 ecm. Instead of losing the dist and trying to adapt everything to why not try to figure a way to upgrade to a MSD billet or other better performing distributor along with a switch to the 7730 ecm (doesn't this also run DIS, knock sensor, ect?). I think we may still see a 300hp NA 4.9 sometime in the future. I don't see it as being impossible. Someone will just have to want it bad enough to put out the $.

I didn't think Rick ever got the headers on his 4.9. Am I mistaken on this? If he did, where are the plans or even a pic? I think that motor was given up on WAY to early.

No, Rick used manifolds. Headers could punch it up a few ponies.

The LS1 ECM is overkill. The 2240, or even 7730, are adequate as long as they can be tuned. The main benefit of coil on plug is in lighting high pressure mixtures (high boost) and in the ability to deliver a spark advance of 50 degrees or more at light throttle cruise.

MSD pro-billet would need a custom machined housing to work in a 4.9.

Trying to get rid of a distributor is only natural because they suck.

I'm curious about the whether or not a '90 4.5 litre could be put together with a cam that would allow it to make useful torque at high enough revs to get the Allante intake manifold onto the 2nd reflection instead of 3rd or 4th reflection. A TPI 350, for instance, utilizes the 4th reflection at 3000 RPM, the 3rd reflection at 4000 RPM and the 2nd reflection at 6000 RPM... However, by 6000 RPM the head/cam combo on the stock engine is so out of breath that the extra kick from the intake manifold doesn't do anything. I'd have to see some flow numbers from 4.x heads to have any idea...

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 08-22-2009).]