Hi all. I'm in the process of putting together a list of parts that I'm going to need to get the parts from one long block 2.8 to another. The car is an '86 GT auto that has a bad motor. I'm getting a known good long block from an '88 in the deal so I'm going to have to drop the cradle and swap all the parts from the dead 2.8 to the good block. I was just wanting to know what all parts I'm going to need. I have a list so far though but I was wanting to know if there were particular brands to stay away from or if I'm missing something or even there is a complete gasket kit somewhere?
As for sourcing these parts, most of them I plan on getting off RockAuto with a 5% discount through another one of my forums. Some other smaller bits like plugs, wires, cap, rotor, etc. I plan on getting local through NAPA as I get a 10% student discount. Heck, I may get more through NAPA depending on my discount and the cost of their parts to start with.
When I get home with the car I'll change out the trans fluid, gasket, and pan filter but I'll have fresh oil and coolant before I fire it up.
Hi all. I'm in the process of putting together a list of parts that I'm going to need to get the parts from one long block 2.8 to another. The car is an '86 GT auto that has a bad motor. I'm getting a known good long block from an '88 in the deal so I'm going to have to drop the cradle and swap all the parts from the dead 2.8 to the good block. I was just wanting to know what all parts I'm going to need. I have a list so far though but I was wanting to know if there were particular brands to stay away from or if I'm missing something or even there is a complete gasket kit somewhere?
Hi, I guess I don't completely understand, but as I understand it, you already have a 1986 Fiero GT with a bad engine, and then you are getting a GOOD long block from a 1988.
First and foremost... the 88 block is INTERNALLY balanced, where as the 86 block is EXTERNALLY balanced. What that means is, if you are going to be using the 88 motor, make ABSOLUTE sure that you are using the 88 flywheel with it. The 88 flywheel should have no weights on it. It should be totally plain, and identical all 360 degrees. The 86 flywheel would have a weight (metal plate) welded to it.
Other than that, the motors are basically identical and everything from the 86 motor will bolt directly to the 88 motor.
Only things you should consider of course are the wear items. Since hte motor is out, it would really benefit you to replace the timing chain, as well as all the gaskets (like you said).
The Fiero Store sells a complete gasket kit, but any auto parts store should also...
Oh, right. I forgot to mention that I did plan on getting the ring gear for the '88. I may do the whole gasket kit from the fiero store then if it would make life simple. Anything other than the WP and timing set that I should change out while its apart? Freeze plugs, maybe?
But yes, the car is an '86 GT with a bad motor. The block is a known-good '88 that came out of a car when it was upgraded.
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12:17 AM
Terry_w Member
Posts: 930 From: Fort Worth,TX Registered: Sep 2008
I didn't see an oil pump on your list. I would replace it. I assume you got the oil pan and timing cover from the '88. either will fit but you must use both from the same engine style(you can't use the '86 timing cover with the '88 oil pan or vice versa. I prefer the '87-'88 style myself.
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12:56 AM
fierofool Member
Posts: 12821 From: Auburn, Georgia USA Registered: Jan 2002
Also, you'll have to remove the plug from the top of the water pump if you use the 88 pump and pan. Install the pipe nipple from your old 86 pump, in its place. It connects to the bypass hose on the 86's. I believe there's also some difference in the A/C brackets. They left off the torque shock on the 88's, so that might be what the difference is in that area. Swap out the crossover pipe from the 86 to the 88 before you install the engine. The 88 crossover is about 5 inches short of bolting up to the downpipe to the catalytic converter. Check out the front exhaust manifold to see if there are any signs of cracks around the #6 exhaust port.
As mentioned by Terry_w, while the engine is out, it'd be good to replace the oil pump. Get a high volume pump and pickup for the 93-95 GM 3.4 V6 engine. You may need to notch out one of the baffles in the oil pan to make the pickup fit, but it will certainly boost your oil pressure. Be sure to peen or spot weld the pickup into the pump.
Replace the cam plate cover gasket on the rear of the engine, behind the flexplate.
Edit: Giving some thought to what I was told about the crossover pipe swap. I believe that applies to the use of the lower portion of the quad exhaust system from the 4-cylinder SE's and Indy. I think the headpipe from the flange down to the converter is short. But in any case, you might want to check the length before lifting the engine up into the car.
[This message has been edited by fierofool (edited 02-15-2009).]
I'll be swapping all the '86 parts to the '88 block so there shouldn't be any issues with compatibility other than the ring gear.
I checked thefierostore for a full gasket kit but I didn't see one. Anybody know where one is? It would just make life easier to get a full kit then to try to hunt down every individual gasket.
I'll look into getting an oil pump though.
Also at thefierostore, I saw an aluminum bushing kit for $100 and a power pulley kit for $135. Are they worth having?
when you pick up the water pump make certain it has a metal impeller, some rebuilt ones have plastic impellers. they will fail and you will overheat. do not use fram for your oil filter also.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Alibi: As for sourcing these parts, most of them I plan on getting off RockAuto with a 5% discount through another one of my forums.
DONT WE GET A 10% discount threw RockAuto? i know i did in DEC its the fiero store who we get 5%.... correct me if im wrong, happy wrenching! !
So far I'm not having any luck finding a complete gasket kit at either Napa, Autozone, or O'reilly so I may still end up buying some kits from thefierostore that cover the head gaskets on up and a kit that covers the front cover and oil pan. After that, its just the individual gaskets (thermostat, EGR, distributor, PCV, etc) and then wear parts (wp, timing set, oil pump, plugs, wires, cap, rotor, etc).
I think I'm going to go with thefierostore for the gaskets and NAPA for everything else...
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01:52 AM
PFF
System Bot
Feb 17th, 2009
Terry_w Member
Posts: 930 From: Fort Worth,TX Registered: Sep 2008
I believe you have that reversed it's 5% at Rock Auto and 10% at the Fiero Store (not on GM parts) At the Fiero Store you order by phone and mention Pennock's. At Rock Auto you need a number seach for Rock auto discount and you will find a current number. You put it in the box that asks where you heard about them.
[This message has been edited by Terry_w (edited 02-17-2009).]
Ok, I may be calling theFieroStore next week then...
A couple other things... is it worth the trouble to change out the pick-up coil and ignition module while the motor is out too? If I can still reach them fairly easily with the motor in I may not worry about them unless they are prone to dying after sitting for long periods of time.
I'm also going to replace the O2 sensor but I have an extra laying around from my 3.8 Buick so the sensors should be the same (right?).
if you can replace the pick up coil before you put the whole motor together as you need to take the dist. apart to do it. i would as they can get rusty from sitting and go bad. the ign. mod can be done in the car.
[This message has been edited by dudewithoutfiero (edited 02-17-2009).]
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07:58 PM
tjm4fun Member
Posts: 3781 From: Long Island, NY USA Registered: Feb 2006
ok, to make sure you got it all: You mention ring gear. it is the whole flywheel, maybe semantics, but be sure you have the 88 one. There is no such thing as a "full gasket set": for any motor. you get a head set which covers from the headgasket on up (mostly) and the engine rebuild kit which generally covers only the lower half, oil pan, main seals, wp/timing cover etc. not a big issue, but save yourself some trouble there. Also there are major differences in 88 and prior year lower gaskets, as the oilpan is differrent, timing cover is different. Hence there is no whole set. you always get 2 sets, upper and lower. the upper is the same for all model years, as they have the 1 or 2 slightly different gaskets. the lower set is specific to year. do the oil pump, and if you can. put a tack weld on the pickup tube after you install it. do the pickup coil, any original 88 coil is just a fart away from failing anyway. (the new ones are not 20 year items either, maybe get 5 years, but if you really overheat the motor, you will fail them prematurely). check and clean all sensor connections. the heater core plug on the water pump was already mentioned. the dampner (little shock) should bolt over. the a/c brackets may need to change to accomodate that, as the compressor is different in pre 87. the alternator is different in 88, don;t remember but I think you may have to change the plug for the new cs style alternator. (combine that with your blower tubes and it should last forever) not a major issue on most of it, but attention to the little things will make you a happy camper in the end.
Todd found me a good ring gear so I'm set in that department.
Everything from the '86 motor is going to be swapped to the '88 block so I guess I will need gasket kits for the '86 (since I'll be using the '86 oil pan, cover, etc.).
So here is the updated list:
-Gaskets for an '86: head gasket set, timing cover, oil pan, EGR, thermostat, etc -ignition parts: plugs, wires, cap, rotor, pick up coil (anything else that dies can be done w/ the motor in the car) -wear parts: water pump, oil pump, engine/trans mounts, thermostat, timing set, PCV, belts (will probably get the idler pulley kit w/ belts) -filters: air, fuel
[This message has been edited by Alibi (edited 02-19-2009).]
Other than the O2, I haven't thought much about sensors. Are there any that are prone to failing that I should replace? Or if they do fail after the swap are they easy to get at with the motor in the car?
I think I'm going to go ahead and do the power pulley but add a CS alternator to upgrade from the older version. The CS came on the '88 only, right? So if I just order an '88 alt and harness pigtail to splice in to the old wiring then I'll be good to go?
I've also been kicking around the idea of doing a 4T60 swap but that'll add around $500 to my build (using a used trans) so its out of the budget for now... but that doesn't mean I can't collect parts over the summer and install them as funds allow
looks like I will also be porting the exhaust manifolds. Anything else need porting?
I just ordered a bunch of stuff off RockAuto. I'm planning on making one more order online from the FieroStore but I'll have to call it in to get the discount. After that, there are a couple items I'm going to grab from my local NAPA (fluids, maybe oil pump, pick up coil, probably plugs and wires).
I took a screen shot of everything I got off RockAuto though. I plan on getting a filter kit, coolant hose kit (rubber), and maybe a "tune up kit" (plugs, wires, cap, rotor... are STI wires good stuff?). Anyway, does my list of gaskets and other wear parts look right to everyone? As you can see, I got the CS130 alternator and pigtail to run with my power pulley kit from Rodney Dickman so I shouldn't have many issues with power after I get the car running.
EDIT: Here is my pre-emptive list from TheFieroStore. I may get some of these parts from NAPA but I really don't know if I can beat the prices after the 10% call-in rebate. The last unknown is the oil pump. I may just get a rebuild kit off eBay ($20 or so) or I may go ahead and go all out on a nice high-volume unit.
Anyway, everything looking good so far? Bear in mind I have bought the RockAuto stuff but I have not bought the FeiroStore stuff.
EDIT 2: Ok, NAPA has a high-volume pump that includes the shaft and screen for $125. Knock off 10% for my student discount but add back some for tax and I'd end up paying around $115... very not bad. I think thats the route I'm going to take on the pump but get everything else from TFS.
Ok, any other sensors, seals, parts, etc. that I should replace while the motor is out? If I can get at something easily with the motor in the car and the part isn't prone to breaking then I'm not going to worry about it as I'm over-budget as it is.
[This message has been edited by Alibi (edited 02-21-2009).]
I might be able to get a hold of another intake set and get it cleaned up and ready to bolt on the new motor. I'm thinking about getting it ported and then powdercoated or painted. Will porting help the stock 2.8 or is this more beneficial for a swapped-in 3.4?
