I'm in the process of reinstalling my 4.9, after fixing numerous fluid leaks.

I had replaced the water pump last year, only to have it start leaking again, a few weeks ago.
It has leaked oil from the moment I drove it home.

Decided that it would be worth the trouble to drop the cradle in order to deal with both.

First... I replaced the oil pan gaskets although, in retrospect, I probably didn't need to.
It looked like the crank seal had been installed with a pair of channel locks. It was that messed up. I'm pretty sure that's where the leak (at least the major part of it) was.
If you have to replace the crank seal, it is *much* easier to drive it in from the rear of the timing cover. Since I had the timing cover off, that's how I did it.

Also, it has been suggested that the pan gaskets can be replaced with the engine in the car. I would tend to disagree.
It *may* be possible, but the cradle will have to be dropped completely out, and the engine supported by other means.
Although I already had the cradle out, I didn't want to deal with disassembling the suspension - especially removing the axles from the tranny.
I chose to just unbolt all the mounts and hoist the engine up the few inches I needed to work, while leaving the cradle sitting on the legs of the hoist.
Here's the *gotcha*....
The lip on the rear of the pan snagged on the bottom of the transaxle bell housing. The oil pump prevented it from sliding forward enough to clear. I had to loosen all of the tranny bolts (don't forget the ones in the bracket by the VSS) and pry the engine and tranny apart by ~3/16".
Again, there may have been enough clearance to swing the pan down from the front, if the cradle was not there.

Also, the fitting that the drain plug screws into (at least in my pan) protrudes ~ 1/4" into the pan.
When the pan has been drained and is "empty", there is still about a half pint of oil (and all of the crap that sinks to the bottom) in the pan.

The water pump..?
I didn't have the shop manual the first time I replaced it. In the absence of the correct fastener torque values, I reasoned that "tighter is better", so I just tightened the snot out of everything.
Bad idea. Even though I had used sealer, the sealing ridge on the water pump housing sliced the gasket in two, right down the middle of the material.
The *correct* torque specs are 30 lb.ft. for the large studs, bolts, and Torx bolts. The small nuts and screws that go around the perimeter of the pump housing are only 5 lb.ft. The 4 smaller Torx bolts on the timing cover are 17 lb.ft. The pan bolts are 14 lb.ft.
Ya' live and learn.

Anyway, I hope this helps somebody.

------------------
Raydar
88 4.9 Formula IMSA Fasback..........................88 3.4 coupe -soon to be something other than red

Read Nealz Nuze! Praise the Lowered!

[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 01-02-2009).]

Thanks for the heads up! I'll be replacing the water pump and all the hard to get to gaskets before mine goes in.

Nice post there Steve.

I'm told that removing the cradle is not necessary if you simply invert the whole car. Let me know how that works out.

Edited: Oh yeah, I'm also told that it's good to have a torch handy for that pesky cradle problem.

Ron

[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 01-02-2009).]

heh

I have replaced my water pump with the motor in the car (well actually just the gasket) - was fairly easy (easier than the 2.8) - just had a tough time with torquing 1 bolt as space was an issue, but I got it done.

The oil pan gasket can also be changed in the car. I have done this about 3 times until I broke down and bought the GM gasket. I had no luck at all with the cork/etc gaskets as they would leak in a short time after being installed (originally I had put a new one on when I had the motor apart (out of the car)). It was a real pain the get the pan out as noted above due to the closeness of the tranny and the oil pump, but it can be done. I didn't have to do anything with the suspension, just removed the front mount and my exhaust pipe and jack the motor up a bit very similar as doing the 2.8 oil pan, with the exception on the oil pump in the way part. The problem area was solved using a long flat screwdriver to pry down on the pan and a lot of cuss words. By the time I did the GM gasket, I was good at getting it out in no time.

Gaskets I would replace on a motor before it goes in: front and rear crank seals, oil pan gasket, distributor o-ring and intake manifold gasket. I have seen issues with the intake gasket on a few motors already - they tend to leak between the distributor and the right head (rear of the car when in the Fiero). Valve cover gaskets should be ok, your call if you wish to replace them - just make sure they are seated properly and you tighten the cover bolts down properly. Of course, if it is a low milage motor and not leaking, I wouldn't touch the gaskets.

Of course water pump should be change (and use water pump sealer along with the gasket - that was my mistake).

Anyways, just wanted to point out that the above can be changed with the motor in the car should you have issues after you have it installed.

[This message has been edited by Mickey_Moose (edited 01-02-2009).]

quote Originally posted by Mickey_Moose: I have replaced my water pump with the motor in the car (well actually just the gasket) - was fairly easy (easier than the 2.8) - just had a tough time with torquing 1 bolt as space was an issue, but I got it done.

The first time I replaced the water pump was in the car. Since my battery is still in the rear, I found it to be a really unpleasant job.

I'm guessing you have a front mounted battery.
That's very near the top of the list for me.

I had my waterpump in and out of the car 3 times before I got it to stop leaking. Never pulled the cradle for that though. The previous owner tightened everything as much as possible and actually broke off one of the studs. I found that tilting the cradle was enough to get to all the bolts. Just loosen the two rear cradle bolts and the job is super simple. WAY easier then a stock 2.8 waterpump.

I also had a leak near the timing cover. This is why I tilted the cradle. Unffortunately I had to to remove the crank pully to get the cover off. Good info here. Thanks.

I just got through replacing my oil pan gasket on my 4.9 . I loosened the three mounts on the passenger side, thinking i was going to raise the engine enough to get it out. wound up was able to massage the oil pan around the oil pump and trans casing. Once I had the pan off, I ground off that pesky corner so if by chance I have to replace it again it will not be so difficult to remove.