So I have a check engine light that comes on after driving the car for a while (about 30 minutes), but isn't stored in the computer. Not a big deal, I'll just get Win ALDL running and get the code in real time.

So, I went here:
http://www.aldlcable.com/sc...s.asp?item=aldlobd1u
and bought the ALDL => USB cable.

Cable came in mail, spiffy! Then I went here:
http://www.ftdichip.com/Drivers/VCP.htm
and got the drivers for the cable.

Then I went here:
http://winaldl.joby.se/
and downloaded the latest version of Win ALDL.

Got the cable hooked up, driver installed, Win ALDL installed and selected the 1227170 ECM (this is the actual ECM I have per the label) and the proper com port. The problem is that the data I'm getting is garbage (only uses the first 3-5 rows and isn't being interpreted by the program). I've tried running w/ the 10k and w/o the 10k and the result is pretty much the same. I was hoping that buying the USB cable from the site would advert any issues w/ building the cable or USB to serial converters (and it's getting hard to find laptops's w/ serial ports).

Here's what I've tried so far:
IIBM T61p running Vista and my Dell D830 running XP, and get the same results, so I'm pretty sure it's not a computer or OS problem.
Selected every other ECM, and still get garbage data.
Matching up OS to App com port speeds (both set to 2400)

My hunch is that the problem is with the driver for the USB cable and that I should have gone with the standard serial cable. <sigh> Anyone else care to weigh in on this?

------------------
-Chris
'85 V6 SE 4sp (SOLD)
'88 GT Auto (fun car)
'03 Sentra SE-R Spec V (Daily driver)

Hey Chris,

I just started using winaldl this week. I picked up a cable from "Dodgerunner". It is a serial cable and I am using an IBM T30. I also have it setup for my T60 using the keyspan converter. Using the same ECM and have no problems. Have pulled about 17 different logs in the last 3 days. I think you are correct - problem with the drivers for the USB. I am sure that you have tried loading again. Searching the site for solutions, etc? Try and PM "Dodgerunner". He may be able to help you. He has been a big help to me.

Good Luck

Pat

Chris
when you get this figured out please PM me. I have the:-
- same cable
- same drivers
-and the same problem

I have posted on previous Win ALDL threads without a solution forthcomming
???

Dave

Get the cable from Dodgerunner and it will work the first time. I got one from him, and it was working right out of the package. There is an issue with the USB cables. I dont know what it is, just that there is one. Lots of post on the net about the usb's not working.

I took a desktop and a moniter, etc out in the garage, and set it up to use the WinAdl the first time. I had to order a new battery & charger for my laptop.
Joe Crawford

[This message has been edited by josef644 (edited 08-24-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Tinkrr: Chris when you get this figured out please PM me. I have the:- - same cable - same drivers -and the same problem I have posted on previous Win ALDL threads without a solution forthcomming ??? Dave

I think we're hosed. Since the USB controller is integrated into the cable, the VID/PID pair for the driver won't work with other USB => Serial drivers, so the cable we bought is pretty well useless. I've emailed Dodgerunner and am just going to bite the bullet and order a serial Win ALDL cable from him. The next logical step would be to contact the place where we bought the cable from and let them know that the USB version of the cable IS NOT compatible with the Fiero ECM until they issue an updated driver. My hunch is that it's a voltage issue.

------------------
-Chris
'85 V6 SE 4sp (SOLD)
'88 GT Auto (fun car)
'03 Sentra SE-R Spec V (Daily driver)

quote Originally posted by Chris_narf: I think we're hosed. Since the USB controller is integrated into the cable, the VID/PID pair for the driver won't work with other USB => Serial drivers, so the cable we bought is pretty well useless. I've emailed Dodgerunner and am just going to bite the bullet and order a serial Win ALDL cable from him. The next logical step would be to contact the place where we bought the cable from and let them know that the USB version of the cable IS NOT compatible with the Fiero ECM until they issue an updated driver. My hunch is that it's a voltage issue.

I got the RS232 version cable from aldlcables and use it either direct, or via a USB -> Serial converter. That way i covered both bases, just incase.

Works great on one car, but on the other it disconnects after a few seconds. ( i'm sure its the car, not the cable/pc combination in my case )

Okay, so I've got an email out to the place where I purchased the cable from and I'm in contact w/ Dodgerunner and he's going to build a serial cable for me so I should be set.

To:sales@aldlcable.com

I purchased the ALDL => USB cable from your site. Though I'm sure it works for many vehicles, it looks like it will NOT work with a Pontiac Fiero. The ALDL => Serial will though. The full details on my adventure can be found here:

https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/094331.html

I have no doubts that it's a fine product, it just looks like the USB version has issues with our cars, so it might be worth adding a note stating that for the Fiero, it is recommended to purchase the serial version of the cable.
Thanks

-Chris

I had a similar cable problem for programming TV remote controls. The cable using the parallel port worked flawlessly. When I upgraded computers I no longer had a parallel port so I bought a USB cable. It was flaky. Turned out to be the USB drivers were flawed. They were never fixed. I ended up having to go back to a parallel port cable.

Here's my $0.02,

we use USB converters at work all the time, and there are very few problems.
The problems usually arise when a port is not used the way it is intended to be used. For example, if you buy a USB->Parallel-printer cable, you can expect it to work great with your printer, but if someone has built, say, an EPROM-Programmer (where timing is critical), I'd be surprised if that worked well. Remember, the data exchange between PC and "USB to whatever converter" is asynchronous to the communication between that converter and the hardware it connects to on the other side. The USB converter usually collects data bytes until a certain amount of data has arrived, or until a certain time has elapsed, or both, and then sends a data packet to the PC.

Regarding the simple Fiero RS232 interface, the hardware side is just a level shifter, and while the "baudrate" of the Fiero's ALDL is 160, that's a little misleading, since it's not serial data as a COM port expects (1 start bit, 8 data bits, one stop bit, idle high). Instead, the data is encoded using a kind of pulse width modulation. So you can't set the port to 160 baud and expect to read the raw data stream from the COM port. So WinALDL and the other programs using that approach use the COM-Port in a non-standard way to read the ALDL data stream anyway, and I guess that's why it does not work in some instances. You can't blame the USB to serial converters for that, they weren't built for that purpose. If the Fiero ECM spit out a standard RS232 signal at a non-standard baudrate, they should work better, but that's not the way it is.

Maybe you're lucky and your USB to serial converter came with driver settings that you can modify, then maybe you can get it to work after some fiddling around.
But if not, it's not the converter's fault.

Best regards,

Oliver
------------------
Visit my website: www.fieros.de for lots of technical and other Fiero related information

[This message has been edited by fieroluke (edited 08-27-2008).]

I'll add my two cents worth to Oliver's comments. Some modern serial-to-USB adapters (notably those using the otherwise-excellent chips from FTDI) will not operate at the non-standard 160 bit per second data rate coming from the Fiero ECM. After I had consulted the design data sheet for one of their chips, FTDI's technical support confirmed (personal communication) that "The minimum baud rate with the FT232R [chip] is 183 baud - there is no way to obtain lower baud rates."

On the other hand, Oliver's web site states that he is using an FTDI chip in his USB-ScanConverter currently being marketed by The Fiero Store. I can only conclude that either 1) Oliver is using an earlier generation FTDI chip, or 2) it's more of Oliver's magic or some other subtlety that I don't (yet) understand.

See https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/077665.html for more discussion.

[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 08-27-2008).]

Hi everyone,

I have used the previous generation FTDI chips on older devices, and I'm using the recent model on my current devices.
The reason this works is I'm using a processor that takes care of all protocol details, and converts the 160 baud to a standard 9600 baud serial signal that the FTDI chip can handle. That way I'm using the FTDI the way it was intended to be, and thus the USB chip performs the way the designers intended.

No, you can't set the FTDI to 160 baud, but WinALDL and other programs don't use the COM port that way. This is what I was trying to explain in my previous post. The term "baudrate" really only means "bits per second". BUT a bit can be represented in different ways. The COM port expects a bit to stay high or low through its entire duration (of 1/160 second for 160 baud). And a byte is expected to start with a start bit, followed by a number of data bits, and possibly parity and stop bits (e.g "8N1")

This is not what the C3 ECM outputs though. Each bit is pulse width modulated, so the duration of the bits differ. Still, with a bit having a certain duration and the next bit following after that, you still get a byte pattern if you are tricky reading the serial port. Basically you are getting a byte each time you're reading a bit. On the PC using the serial port directly, things go fast enough most of the time that this method works, especially with modern PCs. But this method obviously relies on reading the bits fast enough as they come in. The USB to serial converters have built in buffers, and they queue data and send it in packets that they pretty much control themselves. Since USB is pretty fast compared to a serial COM port, this is no problem with "real" RS232 communication. But if you were using a "hack" anyway to make the COM port read a data stream that's not really compatible by design, you may run into problems.

Like I said before, this is not something that should be blamed on the USB to serial manufacturers, because if you connected, say, a modem to an FTDI-Chip, it would work without problems.

Best regards,


Oliver

------------------
Visit my website: www.fieros.de for lots of technical and other Fiero related information

Oliver is dead on. I did get a nice working cable from Dodgerunner (great person to do business and would highly recommend him to others), however I'm not dropping the ball on this. I have been in contact aldlcale.com regarding this. According to the email I received, they've got a new generation of USB => ALDL cable which could fix this issue. Going off of the information that Oliver has provided, my hunch is that it's using a newer generation of the FTDI chipset. I'm working with them to send me out one of the newer cables (which they have offered to do) so I can give it a shot. I'll let everyone know what happens, but with business travel at slightly less than 100%, being home to "play" with my toys isn't as common as it should be.

------------------
-Chris
'85 V6 SE 4sp (SOLD)
'88 GT Auto (fun car)
'03 Sentra SE-R Spec V (Daily driver)

I just got a Dodgerunner cable, works great, I also have a dock for my laptop with a serialport on it so I don't have any USB woes.