Ok, this may have already been discussed but I am a newbie here. I have an 84 2m4 that will not crank, will not start, and no check engine light. I did what I thought was the obvious thing and checked the fusible links at the starter and sure enough they both were bad. I repaired them but still no change. I am fortunate (maybe not so fortunate) to have 2 of the same car. I had a problem with my other car with no interior lights that I posted a short time ago and indeed I fixed the problem with the fusible link. I swapped the computer from the one that is running to the one that is not and still no change. The car that runs is an automatic. The car that does not run is a 4 speed manual. What do you think the next step is? Also, I don't even hear the starter solenoid click.

do the accesories work ( ie power stuff with the key turned, or the radio)? sounds like it may be a dead battery if those things don't work

If the battery checks good, check the clutch safety switch. That is the switch that prevents starting unless the clutch is depressed.

Here is one for sale:

EDIT: Removed that doggone long link.

[This message has been edited by Hudini (edited 12-31-2006).]

Did you already check the Check Engine Light bulb?

If its good and not lit then your computer is not powering up. Have you checked all the grounds? Do your lights work?

How about your accessories?

Its possible part of the ignition switch or the rod itself is bad.

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My first vote is the clutch safety switch also. But wonder why the fuseable links where blown also.

You should still get a check engine even without the clutch depressed, or at least on mine I do. It just won't start.

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quote Originally posted by 2bornot2b: I don't even hear the starter solenoid click.

Welcome to the forum, I think you answered your own question, check your cables, power to the starter, then check/replace the starter--not sure how well a manual ecm is going to work in a auto trans car though....

quote Originally posted by 3800superfast: Welcome to the forum, I think you answered your own question, check your cables, power to the starter, then check/replace the starter--not sure how well a manual ecm is going to work in a auto trans car though....

I agree,check for acid buildup on the contact sides of the battery cables,allso make sure you have a good ground to the engine block.Allso inspect the cables or wires that attach to the starter (I belive there is a fuseable link down there too).Might want to check your fuses too.

You should always get a code 12 (no distributor pulses) because the engine has to be off to check trouble codes. If you don't get at least a 12 then replace the check engine light bulb with a known good one, then find out why you don't have power to the ECM.

A manual ECM will run an auto engine just fine, but you will lose your torque converter clutch function in the auto and depending on what year the ECM is it may also cause the clutch to activate and deactivate at seemingly random and inappropriate times. This is because the pre-'88 manual ECMs use the TCC output to drive the shift light whereas that output is used to activate the TCC in automatic cars. '88 ECMS don't have the shift light function enabled.

James

Do you have interior lights? Sounds to me like the battery is dead or not hooked up, lol.

More than likely its the distribution block by the battery, it has 2 poles, 10 and 11mm nuts, and about 4-5 wires going to it, should be right where the fusable links are. This provides power to the interior, headlights, and the ignition switch (I think on that one). Check and make sure that this is there and tight, and has a power line to the positive side of the battery.

The SES light will always come on with key on engine off, if not, either the bulb is bad, or the ECM is not getting power (or very very unlikely, bad)

[This message has been edited by 86GT3.4DOHC (edited 12-31-2006).]

Ok, sorry about the delay of the reply. Lots of stuff going on with holidays. Anyway, all interior lights work. All my fuses are good on the interior fuse panel. I also forgot to mention that I don't hear the fuel pump running either which I normally hear if I turn the ignition to the on position. Like I said before I am kind of using my other 84 (the automatic) to compare what that car does when it works while this 84 (4 speed manual) will not do anything. All electrical accessories work. I checked power at the starter and both sides of the repaired wires and they are okay. I am still puzzled. Is there a fusible link for the ECM?

No, its fused. If the fuel pump does not come on and the SES light does not come on with key on engine off, I would suspect the ECM. First I would slip the back off the guage cluster and swap the SES light with a known good one to be sure, and check the ECM fuse (its a 10A, I think on the top row) Then just swap the ECM with one from any other 84-86 4cyl Fiero. Tranny does not matter right now. The other way would be to pull the ECM and check the power feed lines (schematics at www.gmtuners.com) and make sure it has 12v and gnd on the right pins. This would be what to do if the known good ecm fails to light the SES light. I just said swap them because it takes 5 minutes.

But the ECM will not stop the engine from cranking. That is anther issue alltogether, unless like I said, there is a power feed issue. You could hop under the dash and check the fat yellow (or is it purple?) wire feeding to the ignition switch. They come out to the passenger side of the colum, its easy to access them by just taking off the knee pannel. Just check that it has 12v all the time. Then check the yellow/purple wires at the C500 (by the battery) with key in crank posisiton, make sure they have 12v.

quote Originally posted by Hudini: If the battery checks good, check the clutch safety switch. That is the switch that prevents starting unless the clutch is depressed. Here is one for sale: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Delco-1984-88-Fiero-Neutral-Start-Back-Up-Safety-Switch_ W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33727QQihZ019QQitemZ290063970481#ebayphotohosting

Does it prevent starting, or even turning over? Mine starts with out depressing the clutch..

If it is disabled by connecting the wires together manually, it will try to start no matter what, including if its in gear....

[This message has been edited by Hudini (edited 12-31-2006).]

You don't hear fuel pump? Switch the relay on the firewall with a known good one.
Still don't hear the fuel pump, try jumping it from the ADL

You can test your fuel pump on the diagnostic port which is pin G on the ADL which will be on the top row, furthest to the driver side. Run a wire with one end connected to any 12V source from the fuse panel ( or ciggy-butt lighter ) to pin G and you will hear the fuel pump run.
Here is a picture that was posted on the forum.


Refresh us on the situation please.

Was the car ever running?
What did you do to restore power?
What happened that you needed to replace fuseable links?
Have you been periodicaly checking the fuses?
Does the car crank but no fire?

You switched ECMs, why? Did you put the questionable ECM into your known good car and see if it runs? If your known good car runs with the questionable ECM, put it back.

Check or jump your clutch safety switch per the above postings and report your results.

These are all some of the things that can go wrong if the ECM ground is poor or bad.

The wire from the battery goes right to the starter, there are no fuses or fusible links. So if you don't get a click no point worrying about the fuel pump as the motor isn't even turning over.

The Clutch neutral switch and the ignition switch are the only things that can prevent the engine from cranking, or at least getting a click at the starter solendoid, (assuming the battery is good.) Before you do anything else check that clutch neutral switch.

quote Originally posted by jscott1: The wire from the battery goes right to the starter, there are no fuses or fusible links. So if you don't get a click no point worrying about the fuel pump as the motor isn't even turning over. The Clutch neutral switch and the ignition switch are the only things that can prevent the engine from cranking, or at least getting a click at the starter solendoid, (assuming the battery is good.) Before you do anything else check that clutch neutral switch.

I don't understand why the ECM is being switched out if it won't crank over. Car will crank with a blown ECM fuse, just wont fire. I'll agree, get the car to crank then get fuel delivery.

quote Originally posted by jetman: You don't hear fuel pump? Switch the relay on the firewall with a known good one. Still don't hear the fuel pump, try jumping it from the ADL You can test your fuel pump on the diagnostic port which is pin G on the ADL which will be on the top row, furthest to the driver side. Run a wire with one end connected to any 12V source from the fuse panel ( or ciggy-butt lighter ) to pin G and you will hear the fuel pump run. Here is a picture that was posted on the forum. Refresh us on the situation please. Was the car ever running? What did you do to restore power? What happened that you needed to replace fuseable links? Have you been periodicaly checking the fuses? Does the car crank but no fire? You switched ECMs, why? Did you put the questionable ECM into your known good car and see if it runs? If your known good car runs with the questionable ECM, put it back. Check or jump your clutch safety switch per the above postings and report your results.

I finally figured out what was going on. I appreciate all responses. I checked the neutral safety switch and it was broken. Someone had already bypassed it but the "repair" that was made broke so I jumped the purple and yellow wires down there. However, that didn't solve the problem right away. I had no change in operation at this point. So I moved on to the fuel pump relay. I didn't switch the relays. I checked the connectors to the relays on the driver side of engine compartment. No apparent problems but I cleaned up the contacts. Now it cranks, starts, and runs. Now I hear the fuel pump with ignition on. However the check engine light still does not work so I assume the bulb is bad or more likely more poor connections in the cluster but I have not investigated that yet. Thanks for your help.

Thanks for posting your results, now the next person with similar difficulties can follow through your progression towards a repair.
Glad to hear that you got it running!
That check engine light is an easy fix.

Why does that stupid check engine light know when I have a full wallet?!